What do women want in a "challenge"?

[Mako482]

I'm not asking who likes a challenge, I'm asking for those who do what attracts you? How does it work? How can a guy play hard to get without games?

 

I'm asking because I met a woman I have really connected with and we seem to be moving toward a serious relationship. She volunteered to me that she likes a challenge, kind of hard to get type play because it keeps things "exciting". So not talking about the "don't call before 3 days" stuff, we're beyond that.

 

Thanks for any tips;)

[Star Gazer]

She doesn't want you to be at her beck and call. She wants you to be occasionally unavailable - for real, not play. She doesn't want it to be easy to win you over.

 

Here's the thing though... If you enter into a relationship with her, she'll likely lose interest once she knows she has you. Why? Because in asking this question you're telling us you inherently aren't a game player, it doesn't come naturally...and thus, your true colors will eventually show. She'll bore of you quickly.

 

She's not relationship material, IMO.

[nicki]

I'll second that. She wants a challenge, not a relationship.

 

When guys tell me they like a challenge, I turn and run. Let them go find another form of entertainment.

[Mako482]

I understand what you are saying, but I'm not sure that is the way she meant it. The way she explained it it sounded more to me like in the relationship she did not want a man who would give her everything she asked for, a yes man or a pushover. At the same time she said it is important to maintain some excitement, unpredictability in a relationship. Listening to her history she seems relationship oriented, it is what she wants.

 

I don't know, but I'm sure I don't want to hear what you guys are telling me!

[Star Gazer]

If she wants unpredictability in a relationship, she wants INSTABILITY in a relationship. If she wants to be kept on her toes when in a relationship, she will bore quickly as soon as she knows you even have feelings for her.

 

Seriously.

 

I'd run in the other direction.

[Jilly Bean]

The ladies are correct, Mako.

 

If she were healthy and interested, she would be content with your interest and pursuit level.

 

Since she had told you that she WANTS you to play games with her to keep things exciting, she is telling you a few things:

 

1-she does not currently find your dynamic "exciting"

2-she wants to be mistreated and is looking for a "bad boy" type

 

Mako - you sound like a NICE GUY. And I suspect you both are in your 20's. For many young women, they do want the games, the drama, the bad boy mistreatment.

 

You need to find a more mature and emotionally healthy woman who isn't asking to be played with...

[Suiyobi]

@ Mako: Well, I mean, you kinda answered your question, right...?

 

To be a "challenge" means...

 

- Not to be a yes man

- Not to be a pushover

- Not to give everything the girl asks for

- To provide excitement

- To be unpredictable

 

I guess if anything you're more curious as to how to go about being exciting and unpredictable. That's really up to you but definitely don't go all psycho on her unless she's freaky like that. If anything, you can do something as simple as calling her up out of blue asking her out, or complimenting her, or giving her a surprise gift acknowledging that she's a great girl and that you enjoy being with her. Or if you guys have already gone into the whole physical intimacy phase then maybe one day you can sneak up behind her when she least expects it... Just hope she's not some karate master or anything lol.

[Mako482]

Ouch. But thanks lol.

 

You know of course I won't listen! If you are right I'm going to have to find out the hard way. We are really connecting right now and even if it is a risk I could not imagine turning tail now and thinking "what if they were wrong about her". You understand I'm sure. You can always say I told ya so to me later;) But damn I hope not.

[Mako482]

The ladies are correct, Mako.

 

If she were healthy and interested, she would be content with your interest and pursuit level.

 

Since she had told you that she WANTS you to play games with her to keep things exciting, she is telling you a few things:

 

1-she does not currently find your dynamic "exciting"

2-she wants to be mistreated and is looking for a "bad boy" type

 

Mako - you sound like a NICE GUY. And I suspect you both are in your 20's. For many young women, they do want the games, the drama, the bad boy mistreatment.

 

You need to find a more mature and emotionally healthy woman who isn't asking to be played with...

 

Wow, you guys are really making sense. You're scaring me!

 

Actually I'm 37 and she's 35. I spent 10 years married and the past 3 just getting by so I'm a rookie at this whole 2008 era dating thing.

[Mako482]

@ Mako: Well, I mean, you kinda answered your question, right...?

 

To be a "challenge" means...

 

- Not to be a yes man

- Not to be a pushover

- Not to give everything the girl asks for

- To provide excitement

- To be unpredictable

 

I guess if anything you're more curious as to how to go about being exciting and unpredictable. That's really up to you but definitely don't go all psycho on her unless she's freaky like that. If anything, you can do something as simple as calling her up out of blue asking her out, or complimenting her, or giving her a surprise gift acknowledging that she's a great girl and that you enjoy being with her. Or if you guys have already gone into the whole physical intimacy phase then maybe one day you can sneak up behind her when she least expects it... Just hope she's not some karate master or anything lol.

 

This sounds more like what she was talking about in the context of the discussion, but like I said the ladies are making a lot of sense.

[Jilly Bean]

Wow, you guys are really making sense. You're scaring me!

 

Actually I'm 37 and she's 35. I spent 10 years married and the past 3 just getting by so I'm a rookie at this whole 2008 era dating thing.

 

Wow.

 

Honestly Mako, I assumed she was young by her desire for the mistreatment.

 

The fact that she is much more of a grown-up and is requesting this, makes me want to revise my advice to be that you need to remove her from your life.

 

As Stargazer said, she is not relationship material.

 

YOU, on the other hand, appear to be VERY stable, solid and healthy. Go find your counterpart elsewhere.

[yongyong]

keep going out with your friends (girs or guys)

 

don't be honest with her ('I missed you', BS)

 

keep flirting with other woman.

 

She will eventually complain that you don't care about her.

This is **** TEST. If you give in and say' sorry all I wanted to do was to get your attention', everything you did would be over and you are in her hand.

 

bottom line? treat her like shxt.

there are woman who want to be treated like that or they will dump you (sad but true)

[Lovelybird]

Just being yourself. Not because she asked you to be a challenge, then suddenly you will do whatever to be one

 

Being yourself, don't sacrifice your integrity, don't be a chameleon, if you are strongly sure of yourself, then no necessary sacrifice the good part of you in order to please her

 

I feel like she is asking you to be a bad boy

[Bells]

She doesn't want you to be at her beck and call. She wants you to be occasionally unavailable - for real, not play. She doesn't want it to be easy to win you over.

 

Here's the thing though... If you enter into a relationship with her, she'll likely lose interest once she knows she has you. Why? Because in asking this question you're telling us you inherently aren't a game player, it doesn't come naturally...and thus, your true colors will eventually show. She'll bore of you quickly.

 

She's not relationship material, IMO.

 

Yes, and thus making her NOT marriage material nor even relationship material....just good for a fling.

[Mako482]

Tough advice, wow! Not what I expected. Not sure where to go from here, I've been getting to know her over a month now and I did not pick up on anything like this. The challenge thing just came up as we were exchanging things we felt we wanted to thrive in a relationship. Even if you guys are off, it still seems like I would have my work cut out for me trying to keep her interested.

[Lizzie60]

For me a challenge would be a guy:

 

that is not a doormat.. who is assertive

who do not give up his guy friends for me

who is independant, no need to be with me 24/7

who is confident...no need to ask me if what he wears is nice, if he looks OK.. etc..

who has a few female friends (platonic of course)..

[Trialbyfire]

Have another talk with her Mako. Make certain she's not looking to be intellectually challenged v. emotionally challenged.

 

Or is it possible she doesn't want a doormat?

 

Clarify before drawing any conclusions or taking any actions.

[Angel1111]

I'm not sure that she means that she wants you to be a challenge. I think maybe she wants events or things to be a challenge. If she wants you to be a challenge, then she's probably highly competitive and will end up competing with you. Not a good sign. But if she just enjoys things that are challenging, then do things that stimulate her in that sense (and, no, I'm not talking about sex when I use the word 'stimulate').

 

Maybe she likes sports - like tennis or raquetball. Or maybe she would like a nice dinner by the fire playing a nice game of chess...?

[Angel1111]

I understand what you are saying, but I'm not sure that is the way she meant it. The way she explained it it sounded more to me like in the relationship she did not want a man who would give her everything she asked for, a yes man or a pushover. At the same time she said it is important to maintain some excitement, unpredictability in a relationship. Listening to her history she seems relationship oriented, it is what she wants.

 

I don't know, but I'm sure I don't want to hear what you guys are telling me!

 

Sorry, didn't read this before. Maybe what she means is that she doesn't like a guy who doesn't know his own mind. And for a strong woman with intelligence, wimpy men are true crazy-makers for them.

 

For instance, I dated a guy once who followed me everywhere I went in my apartment. When he followed me to the restroom one day, we had a talk. Then whenever we talked about eating out for dinner, he always insisted that I make the decision. I can't tell you how much I hated this and how much it started to grate on me. Sometimes I was tired and just wanted him to take the lead. In a lot of ways he was a great guy and we had a lot of common interests but his inability to make a decision caused me to lose a lot of respect for him.

 

On the flip side of that, I dated a guy who was very self-confident and if I'd sit around and become wishy-washy about making a decision, he'd cut to the chase, make a decision and pretty much left no room for argument. Not that he was ever rude or anything like that, he was just decisive and had no problem making a decision. And he had very firm boundaries - he was very kind and sweet but if someone stepped on his toes, they knew about it. This man took my breath away and it would've never occurred to me to get bored with him or lose respect for him. Things didn't work out between us but it had more to do with outside circumstances than issues between us. Pretty sad.

 

I think this is what your gf is talking about - for her, I think she needs a man who knows how to be kind, sweet, generous, and treat her wonderfully, while balancing on that fine wire of being decisive, self-confident with strong boundaries....a 'don't even think about walking all over me' attitude.

[underpants]

Have another talk with her Mako. Make certain she's not looking to be intellectually challenged v. emotionally challenged.

 

Or is it possible she doesn't want a doormat?

 

Clarify before drawing any conclusions or taking any actions.

 

Good advice. There is a difference.

 

However, me thinks Mako may just be a little too invested a little too soon, to be objective about the path upon which he is about to stroll/trip/have his guts lay in front of him on a rock.

 

The "challenge".

 

Treat her like crap on your shoe. Call her bad names, forget intentionally to call her and question her weight/looks about once or twice a week. Ignore her for at least 3-4 days out of the week then show up as if nothing bad has happened. Be real cocky and playfully hurt her in a myriad of ways.

 

Can you do that? Is it worth the cost to yourself to pander to someone else's insecurity? Yes, she will bore of you once you give up the a'hole persona. Or, she will just cycle from you to that doormat nice guy in her own cycle of dysfunction. Yes, she prefers men who treat her like poop. It happens. It is rather boring though.

 

Of course the short cut in all of this is to simply say. 'I've been considering your requirement of a partner that is a challenge and that makes me unsure about what you may have to offer me'. This will (if she has it) appeal to her intellectual side and then maybe you have a footing to work off of.

 

Since I have been posting too much in the political area. I will say that you should "vet" your candidates. No matter how hot they are.

[KinAZ]

I don't necessarily like a challenge but I will say that in SOME cases a "challenge" can be intriguing to me. For the challenge to be intriguing (or even a challenge at all), I have to first consider him a "challenge" meaning he ALREADY has my attention. There has to be something different about a guy for me to take that sort of interest. And in most cases, I've found that the "challenge" just had a GF or wife.

 

What makes you interested are his great qualities, and obvious interest. But what makes him a "challenge" from that point would be a lack of motion. So, you start to wonder... thereby giving him a little more of your attention "Is he attracted but not interested?" "Is he spoken for?" "Is he just shy?" "Does he think that I'm taken?" It's the mystery of it all I would say.

 

Otherwise, I wouldn't consider the average guy who happened to be inattentive or something to be a challenge. It's necessary that I want him, in some manner, first... A rarity...

 

As far as a challenge meaning relationship difficulties, I'm not even interested.

[lazlow99]

Forget that!!! Most of my friends who are 'ladies men' already treat girls and their gfs like crap without even realising it. Thats because they're that sort of person... selfish, arrogant and don't care about others.

 

It's not worth trying to be someone you're not for a girl who would dump you for calling her or actually considering her feelings. And how long could you keep this front up? She would probably end up getting bored and dumping you later rather than sooner anyway.

 

Life has enough drama in it without bringing that drama into relationships. People who thrive off drama can't have much going on in their lives.

[Mako482]

Forget that!!! Most of my friends who are 'ladies men' already treat girls and their gfs like crap without even realising it. Thats because they're that sort of person... selfish, arrogant and don't care about others.

 

It's not worth trying to be someone you're not for a girl who would dump you for calling her or actually considering her feelings. And how long could you keep this front up? She would probably end up getting bored and dumping you later rather than sooner anyway.

 

Life has enough drama in it without bringing that drama into relationships. People who thrive off drama can't have much going on in their lives.

 

I got ya, but if you read my first post I was not looking to put up a front or be fake. I was just looking for opinions on this whole thing, which I got a lot of!

[Mako482]

For me a challenge would be a guy:

 

that is not a doormat.. who is assertive

who do not give up his guy friends for me

who is independant, no need to be with me 24/7

who is confident...no need to ask me if what he wears is nice, if he looks OK.. etc..

who has a few female friends (platonic of course)..

 

This is what I took from it......along with she told me not to give her everything she asks for, at least not the way she asked for it or at the time she asked for it.

[Mako482]

Sorry, didn't read this before. Maybe what she means is that she doesn't like a guy who doesn't know his own mind. And for a strong woman with intelligence, wimpy men are true crazy-makers for them.

 

For instance, I dated a guy once who followed me everywhere I went in my apartment. When he followed me to the restroom one day, we had a talk. Then whenever we talked about eating out for dinner, he always insisted that I make the decision. I can't tell you how much I hated this and how much it started to grate on me. Sometimes I was tired and just wanted him to take the lead. In a lot of ways he was a great guy and we had a lot of common interests but his inability to make a decision caused me to lose a lot of respect for him.

 

On the flip side of that, I dated a guy who was very self-confident and if I'd sit around and become wishy-washy about making a decision, he'd cut to the chase, make a decision and pretty much left no room for argument. Not that he was ever rude or anything like that, he was just decisive and had no problem making a decision. And he had very firm boundaries - he was very kind and sweet but if someone stepped on his toes, they knew about it. This man took my breath away and it would've never occurred to me to get bored with him or lose respect for him. Things didn't work out between us but it had more to do with outside circumstances than issues between us. Pretty sad.

 

I think this is what your gf is talking about - for her, I think she needs a man who knows how to be kind, sweet, generous, and treat her wonderfully, while balancing on that fine wire of being decisive, self-confident with strong boundaries....a 'don't even think about walking all over me' attitude.

 

YES! This is what I thought, how to be a challenge without playing games. I AM this guy so I was very happy to see you write this. We might all still be wrong but either way I think it is worth pursuing. I would describe myself as an intelligent nice guy with balls of steel;) Hell, the reason I am divorced is because my wife wanting a doormat and since I wasn't we argued too much.