Close close friend

[Rudeger]

Hi all. I've been friends with a really wonderful girl for a few years. I had never really viewed her as a potential partner because she was deeply in a committed relationship. However around the time she and her bf broke up at the start of this year me and her became really close. She's my next door neighbour so we'd always travel to school together, we worked together on school projects etc.

 

It was around this time that I fell hopelessly in love with her. I asked her out to a date around March but she turned me down, she said it was too soon after she and her boyfriend had officially broken up. I was heartbroken of course but I picked myself up and carried on.

 

Strangely, her rejecting me caused us to become closer than ever. We always set next to each other in class, always texted each other. I would even go so far as to say she was the best friend that I had that was a girl. Anyway throughout the year I was interested in other girls and she even gave me advice on them, but all those relationships went to **** and I realised that I had never quite gotten over her.

 

So what I'm really asking is, should I attempt to try something with her? I really do want her, but I don't want to ruin our friendship, which is very important to me. We are extremely close, but I don't know if our friendship could survive another rejection from her (what normal one could?) I'm always thinking about her, and it kind of pains me that I'm not with her in a romantic way, especially considering how much contact we have every day

 

Girls, would you date a guy who you were really close friends with?

[superd]

Normally, I wouldn't recommend the "girl next door" fantasy but it worked for Fred Savage.

[carhill]

OP, sure you're closer, since she now knows you're attracted to her (she might have surmised it before, but she's sure now) and she doesn't share the attraction, but likes the fact that you feel that way. It's perfect for her. Because she can't or won't return those feelings, she has only her sense of values to rely upon to treat you, her friend, in a empathetic and caring way.

 

IMO, and you won't like to hear this, is you need to increase your value by ending the friendship and being honest about why. You have romantic feelings for her and she does not have similar interest in you. The relationship is unbalanced. Perhaps, once you "get over" those feelings, you can resume the friendship. Also, your absence will perhaps compel her to re-examine the nature of your friendship and her feelings for you.

 

The healthy path is not always the easiest or most pain-free path

[superd]

carhill, no offense your letting your own feelings and personal issues get in the way of giivng good, solid advice.

[Ronni_W]

Girls, would you date a guy who you were really close friends with?

My b/f and I knew each other for 20 years, and then became really close in the 5 months before we started dating...10 years ago.

 

What kinda vibes are you getting from her? Is she actively dating or looking to date others? If you're unsure, you can just start a general conversation about people who are really good friends and then end up connecting romantically ~ maybe you read a magazine article about it, or saw it was a sub-head on the main page of some news-like website? (It's perfectly okay and appropriate to get a bit creative with how you introduce certain topics for further discussion and learning.)

[carhill]

carhill, no offense your letting your own feelings and personal issues get in the way of giivng good, solid advice.

Prove it

 

Adding, I'm using the same sound psychological principles learned in both psychology (which I'm educated in) and psychotherapy (MC for me). Is the status-quo healthy for the OP? It's really as simple as that.

[carhill]

 

Girls, would you date a guy who you were really close friends with?

Since I didn't answer this directly, and have had many platonic female friends in my 49 years on this earth, I can say without reservation that no woman I've ever been true friends with has ever "taken it to the next level", regardless of how I might have felt, at any time.

 

Of course, YMMV

[Ronni_W]

using the same sound psychological principles learned in both psychology (which I'm educated in) and psychotherapy

Hey Carhill. How's it going?

I wouldn't say that you confused your own feelings and issues with the OP's situation. But you did take an awful long leap into assuming things about what may or may not be going on for the OP's lady-friend, which you based solely on what the OP (not even the lady-friend) posted, and for which there really isn't any real evidence at this point.

 

That isn't sound relationship principle, and isn't what psychologists or psychotherapists practice -- they would be waiting to hear from the lady, herself, before arriving at conclusions about her intentions, motivations and/or state of mind.

 

Not that your intuition may not prove to be accurate...just that, at the moment, the problem could be more with OP's perceptions and thought processes...and nothing at all to do with a woman who is as scheming and conniving and manipulative as your post suggested.

 

If that makes any sense?

[carhill]

Here's what I said:

 

Because she can't or won't return those feelings, she has only her sense of values to rely upon to treat you, her friend, in a empathetic and caring way.

What about that indicates anything negative? Or even inaccurate? What criteria do you use to treat a person? I know I use my values system balanced against my own health and needs. Sure, no one is perfect, and I'm allowing for that. NC allows for a time of reflection by both parties. It's not mean, manipulative or anything even remotely negative. People do it all the time, though they might not so precisely define it or the timeline.

 

If the OP comes back and shows me a different dynamic, I'll be happy to retract my opinion and join you in a more theraputic approach On edit, I realize I forgot to recommend NC and will do so now...

[Ronni_W]

No, the negative assumption is more conveyed through: "she doesn't share the attraction, but likes the fact that you feel that way. It's perfect for her."

 

And another assumption is: "since she now knows you're attracted to her" -- because he asked her out way back in March, and they became closer since. She can as easily have decided, a day, week or month after being asked, that OP's feelings had returned to prior (non-romantic) levels.

 

It's the assumption that her current-day thoughts and actions are unquestionably related to having being asked out once, way back in March, that may not be accurate. (They MAY be, but they as equally may not be, I mean.)

 

But then that assumption leads to the next one: that there is a RELATIONSHIP imbalance...at this point, seeming "imbalances" may just be the result of OP not yet having his own answers. At this point, we cannot say for sure if or if not she is consciously contributing and/or deliberately maintaining any seeming imbalances, is all I'm saying.

 

And without knowing that FOR SURE, 'no contact' seems...unnecessary and self-defeating and highly over-reactive. At this point. At some later point, yes, NC might become an appropriate response, depending on the answer that OP ultimately gets, when he asks her how she feels about long-time, close friends becoming romantic partners.

 

and join you in a more theraputic approach

 

I thought you said that YOU had that approach covered .

 

PS: Thanks for being willing to engage ...not enough of that goes on, quite frankly.

[carhill]

OK, I'll rewind

 

So what I'm really asking is, should I attempt to try something with her?

 

Yes.

 

I really do want her, but I don't want to ruin our friendship, which is very important to me. We are extremely close, but I don't know if our friendship could survive another rejection from her (what normal one could?)

 

That's a risk. If my experience is any guide, your friendship can survive that, if you really have a connection.

 

I'm always thinking about her, and it kind of pains me that I'm not with her in a romantic way, especially considering how much contact we have every day

 

Do you want to live that way for the rest of your life?

 

OK, no assumptions, just succinct advice. OP, thoughts?

[Ronni_W]

OP, thoughts?

What? I'm cut-off now?? What'd I do???

 

Rudeger, sorry I ended up talking about you in the 3rd person back there! I realized that I was doing it, and decided to take the easier 'OP' way out. In any event, hope there was something useful for you, in the exchange.

[carhill]

What? I'm cut-off now?? What'd I do???

 

LOL...now you know how my wife feels :D

 

The beauty of LS....challenge and support

 

Hope the OP returns and gains insight from the readings...

[Rudeger]

Thanks for the replies everyone! Sorry I took a while to get back, it was the middle of the night when I posted, so had to sleep.

 

Carhill, I appreciate your advice. It's just that I think cutting off all contact might come off as just being rude? Especially considering we do see each other and hang out pretty much every day.

 

We are close friends, although we have not mentioned the time when I asked her out since it happened. We only discussed my feelings briefly the next time we spoke, and then that was it, and life moved on.

 

To be honest, I'm not sure what her feelings towards me are right now. I am a little green in the dating department, as well as at picking up signals that someone is interested in you. She seemed really worried when she streaked her hair that I might not like it, and we do discuss some really personal stuff between us. But then, I don't like to interpret these signals much, cause I usually tend to get them wrong.

 

As I said before there had been other girls since then, and she was well aware of that. Based on this she probably thinks that my current attraction to her is purely platonic and non sexual. But she doesn't know that deep down I never quite got over her.

 

Its interesting also how you said that she's probably close friends with me now because she knows I like her, and while she doesn't feel that way back toward me, she likes that I dig her. Did you mean to suggest that she's can now use me because she knows I like her? (sorry that comment sounds like I'm taking a jibe at you, but I assure you I'm not, I'm just curious)

[Yamaha]

Depends on the girl.

Has she offered to go dutch or pay if you guys go out to dinner or some other activity?

[D-Lish]

I can give you a girls point of view and a similar situation.

 

I agree that asking her out again could be risky.

I developed a friendship with a guy who asked me out rigth away- I told him no, I didn't feel the same and only wanted to be friends. He pursued for a while and almost drove me away... but he eventually settled into acceptance and we hung out as friends- did things together, and I liked him as a close friend.

 

He eventually got a gf, and I thought the crush was done.

He has even since moved in with this girl and seems to be happy for the most part. However- he started crossing the line with me, making sexual innuendos, sending me drunk emails that he would leave his gf for me... telling me he "knew I had feelings for him but the timing had been off". I did not have those kinds of feelings for him... And knowing how he felt, and the pressure drove me away. 2 weeks ago he sent me a picture of his penis on my phone... and that was the last straw. He has called, texted, sought me out repeatedly saying he didn't knwo what he did wrong.

 

I know your situation is different- you're actually being a friend to her- and not being tactless or disrespectful. I only think you ought to be prepared that it might be a risk to bring up how you feel again.

 

What kind of singals are you getting from her?

Do you catch her staring at you? Does she light up and smile when you walk into thr room? Does she talk about other guys she is interested, or still talk of her ex? These are all things to think about before making the decision to try again.

 

Just be aware, that this may be an important friendship to her- but not a romantic possibility. If you're going to put yourself out there- just know that you might not get the response you want.

 

Tell us some of the signals you get from her.

That might help in making a decision if it's the right time to go after her.

 

It ultimately does come down to the fact that if you don't act- you'll never know. And it's better knowing than not knowing!

[carhill]

Its interesting also how you said that she's probably close friends with me now because she knows I like her, and while she doesn't feel that way back toward me, she likes that I dig her. Did you mean to suggest that she's can now use me because she knows I like her? (sorry that comment sounds like I'm taking a jibe at you, but I assure you I'm not, I'm just curious)

No worries... I get the cattle prod here all the time

 

As I said, she has her values system to guide her. Only she (and perhaps you) know what that is. I have no doubt she knows you're attracted to her in a romantic way. She has likely known this for a long time, even prior to you asking her out. Women know

 

Some of your comments, especially the hair one and her listening and being interested in your dates, indicate to me girlfriend with penis (that's you) syndrome. That means she feels close to you in a non-romantic way. Actually, that's a really cool thing to have; a close female friend. They can really add volume to a guy's life. The caveat is that the guy can't have any romantic feelings, or else the whole situation becomes unbalanced and tense.

 

Lastly, my experience has also been that a woman can see you having potential, and can have attraction, but she knows you're incompatible romantically (or assumes she knows, which is all that matters) and she "shuts off" any thoughts of that possibility. Women are so much better at this than men are, as we tend to think with our penises. If this has happened in your case, I doubt she'll change her mind, but, if you've shown fundamental personality changes over time, or she has, perhaps bringing them more into synch, the potential remains.

 

You have a question to ask yourself...can you survive two rejections and still remain HER friend? If she has no romantic feelings for you, she should have no problem; it's just another day for her. The implications for you, however, are far-reaching. Think long and hard about that.

 

As far as no contact, unless you're conjoined or work together in the same space, you can do NC. People here on LS do it all the time; doesn't matter if you have the same job, are married, live together, whatever. There's a way. It's not cruel. It's a way to heal your psyche and gain perspective on the relationship. It does work. If you do ask her out again (or otherwise project your romantic feelings into reality) and she rejects you, I suggest you avail yourself of it, or IMO you'll never heal. You're repressing right now. I did this for a couple decades; it's unhealthy. I'm telling you that. It just is.

 

Hope we've been helpful..

[Rudeger]

Thanks Carhill you're a champ. I like that "girlfriend with penis" analogy. Sigh, it appears that is what I tend to become in a lot of my relationships with women. Something I need to work on I think.

 

In response to what you said, I don't know if i could handle another rejection from her at this stage. A relationship with her would be the greatest thing in the world to me, but a second rejection would definetly bump me down a few notches in the self esteem department. I guess what I'm most scared of is her getting pissed off at me, sort of like "can't this guy take a hint? Why must he ask me out over and over?"

 

We only have a few more weeks of school left before we finish forever, but good chances we're gonna cross paths later on cause we do the same subjects... and lets not forget that she is my next door neighbour lol.

 

D-Lish thanks for that story, I'd really like to believe I'm not like that guy! But like I said I don't want her to feel like I'm clingy to her, and that I have a "fantasy" that we're together when really we're not...

 

Signs? Well she was the only one of my school friends to buy me a present for my birthday a few days ago, which probably doesn't mean anything except that she cares about me as a friend. She actually chooses to sit next to me in every class, even if there's other spare seats. She gives me hugs a lot of the time. We spend a lot of our spare classes walking around together and just talking. She never discusses ex boyfriends and other guys in front of me. She only really mentioned why she and her boyfriend broke up because I asked her.

 

Again thanks for the advice peoples!

[Rudeger]

Any other responses/ opinions would be great here.