Author complicatedlife Posted November 3, 2008 Author Share Posted November 3, 2008 Seems like your heart is riding on this woman's decisions - not his and not yours. Seems that way doesn't it? And I'm not sure I fully understand why - I mean, I do understand his wanting to make sure that she's ok, but, to what extent does it have to go to? Link to post Share on other sites
Author complicatedlife Posted November 3, 2008 Author Share Posted November 3, 2008 Why is it you cannot accept this? Why must it be in the open for you? Why must he leave her again? Obviously, I do accept it for now. I want it to be in the open because it is the right thing for EVERYONE. Link to post Share on other sites
Author complicatedlife Posted November 3, 2008 Author Share Posted November 3, 2008 I think him telling you she knows does help to keep you in the relationship. It helps to ease your guilt and make you more comfortable with the whole homewrecking other woman role. Basically she knows so I'm not doing anything wrong. Maybe I'm turning into an evil person, but this time around, I feel no guilt, nor do I feel like a homewrecker. To me, her knowing makes it worse because it makes it easier for HIM. But, I will say that I do understand why you think I'd feel that way. Guess I'm just abnormal. Link to post Share on other sites
whichwayisup Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 Obviously, I do accept it for now. I want it to be in the open because it is the right thing for EVERYONE. But it isn't for her. She's the BS, the one who probably can't deal with other people's reactions. Remember, she's mentally ill, so chances are, he is also protecting her too. It may be better for you, that way there's no more sneaking around. It may be better for him, but not for his kids nor for her. Besides, I have a feeling he's going to try to keep things under wrap for a while because of the kids. They don't need to deal with meeting someone else, especially so soon after the D. Please explain what you mean by this - I'm a little lost, especially because I mentioned that I have proof that she knows but I can't say it here publicly - you're welcome to PM me if you like and I'll share that way. She may know, but he has NOT diclosed alot of information (he loves you, wants to start a life with you) if anything, he's probably told her he's just met someone and kept it very non detail - FOR her sake, since she probably can't take knowing in more detail. Last thing he needs to deal with is her being set off..... Link to post Share on other sites
Author complicatedlife Posted November 3, 2008 Author Share Posted November 3, 2008 But it isn't for her. She's the BS, the one who probably can't deal with other people's reactions. Remember, she's mentally ill, so chances are, he is also protecting her too. It may be better for you, that way there's no more sneaking around. It may be better for him, but not for his kids nor for her. Besides, I have a feeling he's going to try to keep things under wrap for a while because of the kids. They don't need to deal with meeting someone else, especially so soon after the D. She may know, but he has NOT diclosed alot of information (he loves you, wants to start a life with you) if anything, he's probably told her he's just met someone and kept it very non detail - FOR her sake, since she probably can't take knowing in more detail. Last thing he needs to deal with is her being set off..... WWIS - I have no debate for what you have written here, I think most is true, especially the lfirst paragraph (dead-on) and the last sentence. Link to post Share on other sites
whichwayisup Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 So, that means the ball is in your court. How long and how much are you willing to settle and wait for this man? I mean, as we talked about before, you don't want marriage.. He knows this and maybe that's why the D is at a standstill and the MC is happening. In all honesty, he is NOT going to turn his wife's world upside IF you aren't going to marry him. That's alot of giving up (kids, house, wife, friends, family etc) for someone who may or may not be around in the next few years. He probably needs and wants to hear that you DO want to be with him for a very long time, so cutting out marriage, well, it's made him take a step back. You deserve more than what you're getting from him, but this is all he has to offer now. On his terms..Again, can you be OK with that? Keeping things quiet, not being able to go wherever you choose in public.. And, hate to say it, but I think there are things he's just not telling you. Not lying, but omitting. Better for him, better for you, kind of what she doesn't know won't hurt her.. Link to post Share on other sites
Owl Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 What are his reasons for divorcing? What is it about his marriage that is broken beyond repair? Why does he want out of it? Why SHOULD he leave that situation...if its not for you, then what about it is bad enough that he would be considering leaving if you weren't in the picture? Link to post Share on other sites
Author complicatedlife Posted November 3, 2008 Author Share Posted November 3, 2008 And, hate to say it, but I think there are things he's just not telling you. Not lying, but omitting. Better for him, better for you, kind of what she doesn't know won't hurt her.. Wholeheartedly agree with this - I don't think he outright lies, and he always answers anything I ask - but I don't ask much because I assume a lot! Lol. But I do believe there are some things that are omitted. I suppose you are right - he'd be giving up a lot. I still think he needs to do it for himself. I don't think about marriage with him anymore because you know why? He is NOT FREE to do that, so what's the point? Even if I were to say I'd consider it (which I would because it is what he would want), I can't allow myself to think that way because it's not a reality. Link to post Share on other sites
whichwayisup Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 So, then you're at stand still. Nothing is going to change until you do something to change it. A year, 2 years? Can you see yourself still being the OW like this in his life? Is that enough for you? Link to post Share on other sites
Author complicatedlife Posted November 3, 2008 Author Share Posted November 3, 2008 What are his reasons for divorcing? What is it about his marriage that is broken beyond repair? Why does he want out of it? Why SHOULD he leave that situation...if its not for you, then what about it is bad enough that he would be considering leaving if you weren't in the picture? I will tell you some of the reasons, which I suppose could be general and apply to anyone, as they were told to me (I will bold what he feels is most important): 1. He doesn't love her anymore 2. Financial irresponsibility 3. Career goals are not supported 4. Sexual problems 5. The inability to communicate, even with MC 6. Compatibility issues - nothing in common anymore but the children That is some of what he has told me - there's more, and of course, more detailed. Link to post Share on other sites
Owl Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 These are his reasons for leaving...yet despite all that, there is something there that still makes him want to stay. And make no mistake...it IS "want to stay". No one is holding a gun to his head. Its his CHOICE to be where he's at. The question really just boils down to this... Is he were YOU want him to be at the moment? Link to post Share on other sites
Lizzie60 Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 But don't you think that he should be more assertive with her about that very important conversation? This is hard to say.. he knows his W more than anyone so maybe he knows that he needs to be careful how he approaches the subject with her.. Link to post Share on other sites
Owl Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 This is hard to say.. he knows his W more than anyone so maybe he knows that he needs to be careful how he approaches the subject with her.. What does he have to "be careful" about??? She's gonna beat him? Refuse to cook dinner anymore? None of this sounds like he's physically afraid of her...so beyond that, why does he HAVE to be careful about how he approaches the subject with her? Link to post Share on other sites
Lizzie60 Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 I have now read the whole thread and I tend to agree with 2sure.. your man needs to stand up for himself.. and put his foot down.. If he wants to divorce.. then he needs to bring it to the table.. and deal with her. But, like I said, the W might have issues that he needs to be careful about. We don't know the whole story so it's hard to say. Link to post Share on other sites
Mino Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 This is not good. I read the whole thread and went back to your previous posts. Clearly you love this man and I'm sure he cares for you too. Either he is a cake eater and really wants no change or he doesnt have the back bone to either leave or speak up to his wife. As you said yourself, children, finances, assets are things that can be settled. But this isn't even an issue yet. His wife found texts from August/September. You state you were not in the affair for most of that, so it is quite possible he was truthful and told her you were at that point you were just friends. While this would be an acknowledgement and upsetting - it isnt saying she knows. If it is possible that she knows about you and has decided to stay with the M anyway...why would he change anything?? If MC is making it easier to communicate, and improving life for his kids...why would he make a change?? He says he wants to leave the marriage, but it is difficult to tell his wife. Actually, he says that he is unable to tell his wife because she gets mad...please. And he can't bring it up in MC because the counselor doesn't talk about Divorce either? So, he would like to leave his W but since she wont let him discuss it, his hands are tied. Its not his fault, he isnt the bad guy here. He would like to make a change...but they wont let him. At what point do you think his wife will let him? The part I am getting lost on is the mc part. So the two dont talk at home, comunication problem, just like my mm and his w. But that is the reason also for the mc... right? So obviously they discuss things in therapy. Ok... so my question is why do they not discuss Divorce? i mean if one is unhappy and clearly no solutions are found the next step would be to at least discuss Divorce... To wierd that the mc won't talk about D. I understand that they will try evrything they know how to keep the m together, but somewhere you have to draw the line. Somewhere you have to say enough is enough. A couple cannot expect to go to mc for the rest of their lives to "just make it work". Marriage should and is not a jail sentence for life. No one is a hostage, or own by the other. I have a hard time understanding a mental health professional treating a couple as such. Something is wrong wth this story here....sorry:( Link to post Share on other sites
Author complicatedlife Posted November 3, 2008 Author Share Posted November 3, 2008 What does he have to "be careful" about??? She's gonna beat him? Refuse to cook dinner anymore? None of this sounds like he's physically afraid of her...so beyond that, why does he HAVE to be careful about how he approaches the subject with her? I PM'd you about this Link to post Share on other sites
Author complicatedlife Posted November 3, 2008 Author Share Posted November 3, 2008 Something is wrong wth this story here....sorry:( I PM'd you about this Link to post Share on other sites
Author complicatedlife Posted November 3, 2008 Author Share Posted November 3, 2008 I have now read the whole thread and I tend to agree with 2sure.. your man needs to stand up for himself.. and put his foot down.. If he wants to divorce.. then he needs to bring it to the table.. and deal with her. But, like I said, the W might have issues that he needs to be careful about. We don't know the whole story so it's hard to say. I agree with all of this and please, everyone helping me out today (and thank you all!) pay attention to the last paragraph that Lizzie wrote. Link to post Share on other sites
whichwayisup Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 deleted for now.. Link to post Share on other sites
jj33 Posted November 3, 2008 Share Posted November 3, 2008 I have seen with my own two eyes, women who, for a variety of reasons, choose to stay with husbands who occassionally have "indiscretions. " Or at least, it has been my impression that they know. I say impression because the affairs are not discussed in anyway and the H continues to keep the girlfriend fairly under the radar. Why they stay with these men....who knows? Apparently they have some comfort level with the status quo that for one reason or another they dont feel it behoves them to change. BUT: Appearences are #1!! They dont want to find evidence of the affair, don't want it brought to light within their homes - but even moreso: Will make life a living H for husband should the neighbors or other wives find out. She may even feel relieved on some level that he is able to focus on just one OW who has already proved reliable regarding discretion. Possibly you are the lesser evil, since he is once again, living at home. Then of course, if she is the type - possibly she holds winning the competition for her husband higher than her family value, in which case she is keeping him out of spite. That is EXACTLY the situation I was in. She knew and so long as it was as per the above it was fine. I was discreet, never interfered in their lives or took him away from family or social obligations, and most of all I was discreet and when we were in the same place we were both charm personified. She knew I would never gossip about them, never sell the story to a trashy newspaper, etc etc. So basically her life was able to go on seamlessly. And she didnt have to worry. But now, oh now she must be worried... she knows we are not together anymore, noted it the last time we spoke in the most delightful way... and while I dont believe he is with anyone new, he could be in the future and she will have to worry all over again. Link to post Share on other sites
2sure Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 Yep. Distasteful , uncomfortable, but not uncommon and often accepted. The OP states the W has other issues keeping H with her . That may add to the fact that she is meanwhile coming to terms with the fact that her husband is unfaithful. No doubt, any wife, regardless of why she chooses to stay, would be more comfortable with a known enemy. She may feel her marriage is not threatened by this known enemy. She may feel comfortable enough knowing he isnt going to actually leave the marriage for this particular OW. And your right, if the known enemy is out of the picture...the predictably unfaithful H is up for grabs and she has to deal with a whole new bag of tricks. So, I can see why a wife in this situation would turn a blind eye to an affair with a woman she doenst feel is a threat. Link to post Share on other sites
Author complicatedlife Posted November 4, 2008 Author Share Posted November 4, 2008 Yep. Distasteful , uncomfortable, but not uncommon and often accepted. The OP states the W has other issues keeping H with her . That may add to the fact that she is meanwhile coming to terms with the fact that her husband is unfaithful. No doubt, any wife, regardless of why she chooses to stay, would be more comfortable with a known enemy. She may feel her marriage is not threatened by this known enemy. She may feel comfortable enough knowing he isnt going to actually leave the marriage for this particular OW. And your right, if the known enemy is out of the picture...the predictably unfaithful H is up for grabs and she has to deal with a whole new bag of tricks. So, I can see why a wife in this situation would turn a blind eye to an affair with a woman she doenst feel is a threat. I really hope that this is not the case here - just makes it easier to take the easy road - for him. Link to post Share on other sites
2sure Posted November 4, 2008 Share Posted November 4, 2008 I know. I dont know what theie finance situation is but it seems to me I see it more in higher income brackets. Possibly a comfortable life and social recognition is harder to replace/easier to take as compensation. Also I would say more in people over 40 but I've seen it with one younger couple too. To a degree, it is probably what most unfaithful husbands hope and wish for. To be able to eat their cake without indigestion as long as they use a napkin and fork. Link to post Share on other sites
pelicanpreacher Posted November 6, 2008 Share Posted November 6, 2008 I doubt that he was completely forthright by divulging the fact that he is, has been, and would be continuing to have an affair with you throughout their therapy and that one of his goals to accomplish in these sessions was figuring out how best to juggle his time, energy, and emotional alignments to best suit this situation. If he had, I'm sure the counselor would have laughed him right out the door and adviced his wife to immediately pursue divorce. Your MM is the type of guy that needs to be raked over the burning coals back and forth and back and forth and back and forth until he gets it and gets off the dime! It is why torture is such an effective tool of the state to acquire the truth with maximum expediency. Link to post Share on other sites
Author complicatedlife Posted November 10, 2008 Author Share Posted November 10, 2008 Thank you to everyone who posted to try and offer their opinions and suggestions. CL Link to post Share on other sites
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