why did you not take the option of divorce?

[jwi71]

It's never divorce by ambush.

 

Usually by the time a marriage reaches the divorce state, both spouses are well aware of its deterioration.

 

Even in the case of affairs. Affairs don't happen in happy marriages. Usually SOMETHING is out of kilter and both spouses are aware, whether they want to admit it or not.

 

Oops. More room for disagreement.

 

Should one partner cheat then file, it is very possible the BS is receiving a "divorce by ambush". And do not presume that all BS are aware that the other partner has unfulfilled needs ( I had no idea. In retrospect, she left clues but never really said it)

 

And, while we are cross-posting , I think you're correct in avoiding talks about divorce when trying to reconcile. But that is a new wrinkle you just now added. If a couple is deciding what to do next, then talking of divorce is well warranted. So is deciding on MC. Talks about each should be held. If the decision is to divorce, so be it. If they decide to go to MC, then talking of divorce should be avoided.

 

Our MC asked each of us what we wanted. I initially said "I don't know".

Now I say "Work on building a better marriage".

[jwi71]

JWI, if you can discuss custody, division of assets, and spousal support in a calm, cordial manner at the dinner table, I give you alot of credit. Good for you.

 

Its easy with your lawyer there! He won't let you speak! And for 500.00/hr...I'm not paying him to sit there quietly!

 

In all seriousness, I have been there. I signed it, my W signed it. We did discuss it as civilly as possible. My attorney then made the statement along the lines of "Its done. I can have this filed tomorrow".

 

That's how close we came. Then, looking at her face, I finally saw it. So I asked Tom to wait. That was how many months ago?

[taylor]

Agreed...and when you tie this back to the original gist of this thread, I'm assuming that YOU didn't feel that the affair had the same effect/meaning...while you were in it at least. Correct?

 

What about now? Do you feel the affair sends that same message?

 

 

 

When I was IN the affair, I did not feel committed to my marriage. I had already checked out...way before the OM was on the scene. Because I had psychologically/emotionally checked out, I did not FEEL the contradiction.

 

I started to feel the contradiction when the OM and I tried to take the affair outside the workplace because that is when we would have had to have started sneaking around and lying to keep it going. The EA never got that far. The boundaries that were crossed the most severely were in my heart...I let him in and I shouldn't have.

 

At this point in time I have re-committed to my marriage and in doing so, the affair appears glaringly contradictory.

[taylor]

I would add "generally" to the beginning of the above quote. Serial cheaters can be quite happy in their marriages and still "spread the ha*penis* (per Marlon Brando) around".

 

I concede on this one, carhill. You are right. lol

[taylor]

Hey, gotta go.... Have an MC session in an hour. Nice talking with y'all here. Will check back later.

[Owl]

At this point in time I have re-committed to my marriage and in doing so, the affair appears glaringly contradictory.

 

Thanks...this is good to hear. Its a sign that you "get it"...

 

Unfortunately, others don't.

[carhill]

I concede on this one, carhill. You are right. lol

While my statement should have been completely gender neutral, I couldn't resist that play on words from "Last Tango in Paris"

 

For myself, being the ever-present planner, the machinations for a win-win divorce started long ago. Fortunately, the real estate market cooperated Seriously, I didn't mention the word until well into the later stages of MC and after I had my plan and legal advice all worked out. I believe in "hope for the best but plan for the worst" in nearly everything in life. That comes as no ambush or surprise to my wife. She's had ample opportunity to provide me with the simple dignities in life I deserve and which I continue to give her even at this late date.

[stampdaddy]

Thanks...this is good to hear. Its a sign that you "get it"...

 

Unfortunately, others don't.

 

get what.........?

[Owl]

get what.........?

 

q.e.d.

 

[Reggie]

So if you used the phrase for this current election of "democratic presidential candidate" without saying the name "Obama" are you not still talking about him?

 

Quit with the straw grasping.

 

I don't understand how someone could not understand a spouse coming to her, broaching the subject of the marriage being in deep trouble and wanting to do what it takes to stave off divorcing as not being a discussion about the possible end of the marriage.

[OWoman]

It's never divorce by ambush.

 

Usually by the time a marriage reaches the divorce state, both spouses are well aware of its deterioration.

 

Even in the case of affairs. Affairs don't happen in happy marriages. Usually SOMETHING is out of kilter and both spouses are aware, whether they want to admit it or not.

 

That may be true in the case of two mature, socially aware adults. Not all marriages have two, and some don't even have one. But in a case where (at least) one of the parties is damaged in some way, they can be seriously out of touch.

 

My MM's BW had no idea their M was not idyllic. She still claims - despite all the evidence to the contrary, and the counter-assertions from everyone she makes the claim to - that their M was perfect, that their family life was ideal and that everyone was happy as larry. How she explains 30-odd years worth of miserable photos, including of kids so hunched and folded in on themselves they're almost inside out, is beyond me, but she's really convinced that nothing at all was wrong. I guess she needs to believe that, to keep going as she is, and so she'll keep feeding that myth until the costs of doing so outweigh - even to her - the costs of not doing so.

 

But even in less extreme cases, I've heard one party say "our M was fine; sure it had it's ups and downs, but all Ms do", in response to being blindsided by a divorce petition arriving "out of the blue"... while the rest of us had lived through years of hearing from BOTH of them how awful everything was! I guess some people are just invested in seeing the glass half full - even when there's barely a drop left.