Abject misery

[Nicky]

What can I say? I still have my same problem. Me-31, BF-46 seeing each other for 14 months.

 

I am feeling so down. I don't know how much longer I can go on feeling this hurt. I just want to cry and cry. My Bf has never been very affectionate. This has been discussed numerous times. Communication between us is very good, so I know he's got the message. I have looked at this problem from all angles. I have changed myself. I have even been to counselling as I thought it was me. Not so, it appears. I have even NOT looked at this problem, and tried just going with the flow.

 

But things just get worse. He shows affection to his kids, but doesn't recall being like that with Ex's (admittedly though this isn't unconditional feelings, as with kids). What does that say!!! He has his moments with me, but they are few and far between. I have never had such an unaffectionate BF. I have told him this.

 

People can't change and you shouldn't try to get them to, I believe. He too feels there's a problem on his side, but my crystal ball is clouded at the moment so God knows what it is!

 

I have never met anybody in my life, with whom I felt I could spend the rest of my life. It's so difficult to give up on this, and walk away, but I spend so much time being close to tears now. I finished with him in mid-february, but he begged me to stay blah blah blah. Things were fantatstic for a while. Then I got uncharacteristically jealous one day (early March), deeply upset him, and ever since then it's been business as usual.

 

I just think that all the love in the world won't bridge our different needs. I am so unhappy. Part of me is loathe to give up on such a good thing. We have so much going for us. I am at my wits end. I feel I have tried all avenues.

 

Anybody know any new roads???

 

and thanks for listening.

[Tony T]

Well, I had some very clear answers for you until you got to the part where things got fantastic for a while, you had a jealous episode, and it went back to the way it was. So you screwed it up...oh my!!!

 

This man is 46. He has been through a lot in life...a lot of pain, I'm quite sure. Over a period of time when life puts us through many hurtful romantic ordeals, I think our heart can freeze up in fear. We don't show affection because when we got close to someone before, we got hurt or something else happened.

 

You reinforced this when he finally did open up a bit and then you pulled the jealous routine.

 

He is NOT old, but at age 46, you just don't want any more crap. You feel you have paid your dues, you have gone through all the ruff stuff the universe had in store for you and you just want love and peace.

 

The problem with your man is simply that his heart has been torn and worn through the years and he simply doesn't want to go through anymore torture. I think over a period of time, once he sees some very very stable behavior from you and a high degree of stability in the relationship...to the point where he doesn't see a risk to his acquired homeostasis, he could be very affectionate. (That means no more jealous episodes, no more crap of any kind...unless, of course, it is clearly justified.)

 

I know you wouldn't be with someone unless they were pretty special so I know you've got a good man here. Good men, historically, take a lot of crap in love affairs in their young days because they are so nice. If you really get into his heart, I am sure you would dredge up some really awful situations where he gave his love freely and got stomped in return.

 

That's my take on this situation. It's your call. This could take some time but I think he could gradually come around. If the communication is so good, you might want to very carefully address what I have said and work on it together.

 

Men, being what they are, are not normally inclined to discuss in detail how they have been hurt in the past (men, in my opinion, take love-related pain much worse than women and take much, much longer to spring back than do women...though it may not appear that way on the outside.) So don't press him hard on this if it makes him uncomfortable.

 

There are times in everyones life when they have been through so much their heart just shuts down. Maybe his has. It can be resuscitated but it takes lots of love and patience to do that. Are you willing to do the work...and do you have the patience???

 

One more thought. There is always the possibility that he is thinking that he cannot make you happy for an extended period of time because of his age. Men often feel when they hit 50, things start breaking down, they move into by-pass territory, and they are less desireable to women. He may not want to be too close now for fear in years ahead he will not be equal to making you happy and he will once again be abandoned. Check it out.

[Nicky]

Well, I had some very clear answers for you until you got to the part where things got fantastic for a while, you had a jealous episode, and it went back to the way it was. So you screwed it up...oh my!!! This man is 46. He has been through a lot in life...a lot of pain, I'm quite sure. Over a period of time when life puts us through many hurtful romantic ordeals, I think our heart can freeze up in fear. We don't show affection because when we got close to someone before, we got hurt or something else happened. You reinforced this when he finally did open up a bit and then you pulled the jealous routine.

 

He is NOT old, but at age 46, you just don't want any more crap. You feel you have paid your dues, you have gone through all the ruff stuff the universe had in store for you and you just want love and peace. The problem with your man is simply that his heart has been torn and worn through the years and he simply doesn't want to go through anymore torture. I think over a period of time, once he sees some very very stable behavior from you and a high degree of stability in the relationship...to the point where he doesn't see a risk to his acquired homeostasis, he could be very affectionate. (That means no more jealous episodes, no more crap of any kind...unless, of course, it is clearly justified.)

 

I know you wouldn't be with someone unless they were pretty special so I know you've got a good man here. Good men, historically, take a lot of crap in love affairs in their young days because they are so nice. If you really get into his heart, I am sure you would dredge up some really awful situations where he gave his love freely and got stomped in return. That's my take on this situation. It's your call. This could take some time but I think he could gradually come around. If the communication is so good, you might want to very carefully address what I have said and work on it together. Men, being what they are, are not normally inclined to discuss in detail how they have been hurt in the past (men, in my opinion, take love-related pain much worse than women and take much, much longer to spring back than do women...though it may not appear that way on the outside.) So don't press him hard on this if it makes him uncomfortable.

 

There are times in everyones life when they have been through so much their heart just shuts down. Maybe his has. It can be resuscitated but it takes lots of love and patience to do that. Are you willing to do the work...and do you have the patience??? One more thought. There is always the possibility that he is thinking that he cannot make you happy for an extended period of time because of his age. Men often feel when they hit 50, things start breaking down, they move into by-pass territory, and they are less desireable to women. He may not want to be too close now for fear in years ahead he will not be equal to making you happy and he will once again be abandoned. Check it out. Hi Tony

 

I hope you're well, thanks for replying. Many valid points- as ever!

 

He had a marriage to a neurotic headcase, and his mother was a cold spiteful woman. Great background! The marriage was over 17yrs ago, and they have never exchanged a word since. However, he seems to have accepted all of the above.

 

He is more than happy to discuss things, so it's nothing we can't discuss. He hasn't dated many women since then. Just not interested unless it's someone special. He has never loved a woman in his life, except me. I believe him when he says this. He didn't love his wife-the marriage was a mistake- she fell pregnant, and being a good Catholic boy he married her.

 

I have often wondered that maybe things are not as resolved as he thinks. Is it ever possible to resolve things that completely?

 

I think you're point about stability could well be true. I But I'm not sure how much more misery I can bear! Also, he doesn't seem to be that bothered half the time. Why is it so difficult to hold my hand, return my affectionate emails, call me when he says, give me a cuddle. It's not like he's withdrawing, it's more like dating a statue. I kiss/cuddle/squeeze him: no/little response. It's quite hurtful, to put it mildly.

 

Oh and forget sex! He's like a fine Swiss watch. Everything has to be just so, or it doesn't happen, which is invariably the case. And spontaneous has never entered his vocabulary!

 

I do wonder too, whether he has any insecurities regarding me and the future. It would only be natural. Oh, I just don't know what to do. My head is spinning, and I have a strong urge to leave work now, and head for the pub! If only I could!!

 

Well, many thanks for your thoughts, I really do appreciate your insights.

 

Nicky

[Tony T]

Affection and intimacy are very significant ingredients of a fulfilling relationship for most people. If you aren't getting these here and now, you aren't likely to get them in the near future.

 

You are 31 and not getting younger. Based on the new data you have furnished, you may want to consider moving on. It will take a while for you to get over this...and then it will take a bit of time to find the REAL Mr. Right.

 

You are one smart cookie...you know what to do from here!!!

[Nicky]

Affection and intimacy are very significant ingredients of a fulfilling relationship for most people. If you aren't getting these here and now, you aren't likely to get them in the near future.

 

You are 31 and not getting younger. Based on the new data you have furnished, you may want to consider moving on. It will take a while for you to get over this...and then it will take a bit of time to find the REAL Mr. Right. You are one smart cookie...you know what to do from here!!!

Hi Tony,

 

Yep, I think we're on the same page! We had a very long chat last night. He doesn't want to split, and wants to give it another go. So we'll see. Time will tell, eh?

 

And thanks again for your advice.

 

Nicky

[Tony T]

I knew he didn't want to leave. So did you. You didn't have to have a chat to determine that. He's a fine guy. You don't want to leave either because you love him.

 

Ban you talk a Zebra out of his stripes?

 

I do solemnly hope this talk works for you but historically you can see some change for a while. If all it takes for him to go back to his old ways is some sort of jealously or mistake on your part, I mean you will be walking on egg shells forever. You essentially gave up your right to free expression in this relationship for the sake of getting him to "act" like you want him to.

 

There is nothing I want more than for you to be happy. But one talk won't do it and you can't nag either. You will have to engage in an ongoing exchange of information, desires, behaviour reinforcement, etc. for him to continue to give you what obviously does not come naturally for him. A person cannot eternally keep up a behaviour that is not innate unless it is constantly and strongly reinforced in some way.

 

There is a lot of hope for your relationship here but I just had to let you know it's going to take some VERY SERIOUS WORK ON THE PART OF BOTH OF YOU for you to remain fulfilled over the long term.

 

Even in the very best of relationships, the expression level of affection and intimacy naturally declines over time. You are taking a man who is not so inclined from the beginning and trying to get it to increase over time.

 

You can do it, and you are up to the task, but you have to know to keep your expectations in check.

 

We all want this to work for you!!!

[Nicky]

I knew he didn't want to leave. So did you. You didn't have to have a chat to determine that. He's a fine guy. You don't want to leave either because you love him. Ban you talk a Zebra out of his stripes?

 

I do solemnly hope this talk works for you but historically you can see some change for a while. If all it takes for him to go back to his old ways is some sort of jealously or mistake on your part, I mean you will be walking on egg shells forever. You essentially gave up your right to free expression in this relationship for the sake of getting him to "act" like you want him to. There is nothing I want more than for you to be happy. But one talk won't do it and you can't nag either. You will have to engage in an ongoing exchange of information, desires, behaviour reinforcement, etc. for him to continue to give you what obviously does not come naturally for him. A person cannot eternally keep up a behaviour that is not innate unless it is constantly and strongly reinforced in some way. There is a lot of hope for your relationship here but I just had to let you know it's going to take some VERY SERIOUS WORK ON THE PART OF BOTH OF YOU for you to remain fulfilled over the long term. Even in the very best of relationships, the expression level of affection and intimacy naturally declines over time. You are taking a man who is not so inclined from the beginning and trying to get it to increase over time. You can do it, and you are up to the task, but you have to know to keep your expectations in check. We all want this to work for you!!!

Thanks I know what you're saying and agree. He knows that there won't be any more chances- I simply cannot continue in a relationship the way it was.

 

It'll be tough, but we're willing to give it a go. Si it's a case of wathc this space! Thx

[Totally Confused]

I agree with Tony 100% on the being 46 and having been through a lot of pain and maybe he's put up walls. I don't doubt for a second, he's a good man. You say he's wonderful, but can't give you the affection you want and need, but will give it to his children. Obviously this man does have hang-ups, but it seems to be with women he is romantically involved with. This is probably, again, due to everything Tony had said.

 

Now it's up to you what you want to put up with. Maybe this man has always been this way, you won't know for certain, cause you weren't there when he was 21. All I know is you are hurting. Whether this man is good person or not, he may not be good for you. It all depends on what you want to go through and it's you you've got to take care of. This man is not going to change. He is who he is, whether it's through negative experiences or not. Even if you stick it out with him you're going to go through H*ll trying to change him, as I can see you already are. It's only been 1 year and 4 months and you're the one seeing the psychiatrist. WHY? Maybe after 5 - 10 years of being with someone, but 1 year and 4 months and there's this much pain? It's not you. He's the one who needs to talk to someone. You were talking about trying to change yourself hoping to understand him better or maybe to change him. In any relationship with someone who is good for you, you don't have to change anything about yourself. They'll accept you for what you are. Maybe you should realize and accept that this man isn't the one for you, even if you're sometimes happy. If you really and truly love him, then you're just going to have to accept what and who he is, or realize that he has a lot of the qualities of someone you want to be with, but not all of them, and now it's time to move on and find someone with alot of his qualities, plus is capable of giving affection. If this man really feels he has a problem with affection, then HE'LL do something about it, especially if he's really scared of losing you. You're crying all the time. How is that good? If he was good for you, you wouldn't be crying or wanting him to change in any way. That in itself should be the big red flag that this isn't good for you or going well. Don't try to form somebody into something you'll love, love the person for who they already are. There are some women and men out there who don't want an extremely affectionate person...you're obviously not one of them.

 

Now, I'm sorry for any grief that this man may have gone through, if he is the way he is, because of his negative experiences. But it still remains, that who he's become is not healthy for you and it's not fully what you want and need. Unless you are willing to compromise your needs, you will not find yourself happy with him. You are going to go through a lot of pain, anguish and tears, until you finally realize it for yourself. I know you love him and I know you want it to work, and I know he's trying hard at certain times, but you're trying to squeeze water from a spounge. If he really finds a problem with who he is, he will seek help, all on his own.

 

Now a question that you have to really and truly ask yourself - and be totally honest with yourself. What is the real reason why you want to stay with this man and put up with all of your tears? Don't say it's because you love him, cause now you have to get deeper and ask yourself why do you love someone that makes you so unhappy? That's maybe what you should be talking to your psychiatrist about. Why are you so determined to make it work with this man? Do you feel that if it doesn't work with this man, you'll end up alone and you're sick of being alone? Are you afraid you won't meet anyone else? Are you afraid that you'll never find anyone better than this man? When it all comes down to it, it's all about you.

 

Good Luck I hope you figure things out and I hope you're able to work things out with this man. Just remember, if you don't take care of your own wants and needs, they'll never be taken care of, cause you're the only one that really knows what you need.