Third Side of the Story

[vnqsh2001]

V, you have just sat and told us what you want from us and I think you are in the wrong place.

Yeah, maybe so. I don't think helpful people spend their time typing on forums.

 

You are saying this and that and then expecting everyone to just say "uhuh, oh yeah and poor you" we are real people with real emotions and our own real issues we are not robots.

I've actually found some of the negative or disagreeable comments just as helpful in sorting out my own thoughts as the positive and encouraging ones.

 

I see a million things I could say to you, but I wont as anytime someone hits home you throw your toys out of the pram and threaten to kill yourself!! WTF

Yeah, that's a problem I have. When I get depressed, I wake up every day trying to think of excuses NOT to pull the trigger on my own skull. It lasted about 5-7 years after my first divorce; it came back again after my second wife's affair. What can I say? Life is a choice. I guess most people have this "will to survive," but for some reason I have this "will to die" that I have to constantly fight.

 

Yes you have issues but this passive/aggressive thing has to stop! Grow up, man up and realise you made a mistake, your wife made a mistake, you love each other and dont want to split up - Just forgive each other already and get on with being happy and not a spoiled brat!

Depression is not something you can just "get over." It's something that sticks with you; day in and day out. It's not a matter of growing up or manning up. It's just something that happens and you can't control it very well at all. Seriously, have you ever had experience with people who are clinically depressed or suicidal? If you had you would know that it's not just something you can simply smack out of a person. In fact, that sort of behavior can just egg them on to more and more self-destructive things.

[serial muse]

If I omitted anything, it was because I had more important issues to address and much less desire to satisfy everyone's curiosity on every little detail.

 

Look, whether I tell the whole story now or later, what difference does it make? Everyone's still getting sidetracked on these points that don't even need to be discussed!

 

I didn't tell the whole story? No duh! You want to know the reason? Jack Nicholson said it best when he said something like, "You want the truth? You can't handle the truth!" The truth is that I knew people would get confused by the whole story and I thought the issues I wanted to deal with were confusing enough. This is an anonymous board and I wanted to keep things as simple as possible. There. OK? Make sense to you now?

 

Sigh. One moment it's all "I didn't lie!" and the next "I lied because you can't handle the truth!" Yeah.

 

That does make sense to me, because IMO the truth isn't really all that deep. Here's the truth: You knew that telling people your actual story wasn't going to garner sympathy, because you did some stuff that is just not sympathetic. And you came here for sympathy, not advice. Therefore, you omitted the things that people wouldn't agree with.

 

That's not too complicated to understand, vanquish. I just think that it's rude to dismiss people with half-truths when they've invested time and energy to want to think about your story and offer their advice. Apparently, you see it not as rude but as simply a way to get what you want out of a situation.

 

I'm not sure why you don't see how manipulative that is, nor do you see how manipulative it is to constantly say things like "I'm going to shoot myself" or "I'm going to drink myself to death." What exactly do you hope peoples' responses to that will be? How is this different from the stuff your wife says to you? On what planet is any of that acceptable?

[Kasan]

Depression is not something you can just "get over." It's something that sticks with you; day in and day out. It's not a matter of growing up or manning up. It's just something that happens and you can't control it very well at all. Seriously, have you ever had experience with people who are clinically depressed or suicidal? If you had you would know that it's not just something you can simply smack out of a person. In fact, that sort of behavior can just egg them on to more and more self-destructive things.

 

You're right about this.

 

So what are you doing to combat your depression? Besides drinking........

.

And....if this has been a problem before, what worked for you? Did you see a counselor?

 

Are you able to go to work?

[vnqsh2001]

You call sleeping with other women during your marriage a "little detail?" Uhm, ok. And you didn't "omit" even, you flat out LIED about it on your other thread. I can go look and quote you if you wish.

In fact, I never said I slept with other women, but yes .... it is a moot point in THIS relationship due to the nature of THIS relationship. In THIS relationship, whether I slept with, fooled around with, or flirted with anyone was not supposed to be an issue due to the agreement my wife and I had made at the beginning. I don't expect you to understand that, so I didn't talk about this to begin with.

[vnqsh2001]

You're right about this.

 

So what are you doing to combat your depression? Besides drinking........

.

And....if this has been a problem before, what worked for you? Did you see a counselor?

 

Are you able to go to work?

Yes, I've seen counselors and doctors in the past. I didn't feel it helped all that much. I don't know what's going to help me right this moment. In the past, I just had to wait it out, but it did help to lighten my mood now and then and keep myself from thinking the truly dark thoughts. Nothing makes it go away completely.

[Owl]

Why is it everyone thinks I'm here to ask for advice on my marriage? That is not why I'm here.

 

And THIS is the disconnect.

 

Because you need to understand...pretty much everyone else who comes here, comes exactly for that...advice on how to fix the problem.

 

You don't WANT advice on how to fix the problem.

 

You just want to vent.

 

That's ok...and there is a simple fix to this.

 

Put everyone else on ignore. Make it so that you can only see your own posts.

 

For that matter, you don't need a forum. Just type your feelings out on a wordpad document, or journal them into a spiral notebook.

 

If you only want to vent, but don't want responses to your vents, or advice...then vent in some fashion that won't get your those responses or advice.

 

Just write it down someplace. Go for a walk, and talk to yourself.

 

See...here's the problem.

 

You're wanting to vent...in a PUBLIC FORUM. If you do it in a PUBLIC FORUM...you're ASKING for responses, and by extension will always get advice.

 

See the mistake here? And as I said...the solution is also equally simple and elegant...

[vnqsh2001]

Sigh. One moment it's all "I didn't lie!" and the next "I lied because you can't handle the truth!" Yeah.

Excuse me? When did I say I lied? Do me a favor, don't put that in quotes unless that is what I actually said.

 

Now go back and read the part where I said I just didn't tell the whole story. Yes, it shouldn't be hard to understand why I didn't tell the whole story, but apparently it is because it wasn't so that I could garner more sympathy, as you said. It was because I didn't want to deal with all the confusion and negativity it would provoke. I didn't want to get side-tracked by the issues it would raise with some people.

 

I am not here simply to get sympathy anyway. If I were, I tell you, I would just be ignoring comments from certain people and only responding to the ones that I liked.

[serial muse]

Excuse me? When did I say I lied?

 

I didn't tell the whole story? No duh!

 

Dude, you're totally hostile and I'm sure you're using the posts you don't "like" as a punching bag. Hence your reason for replying to them. It's certainly not to listen and take in any of what they have to say.

 

And yes, I think you are here to get sympathy and you've said as much. You want a place to vent. You don't want advice. You "didn't tell the whole story" because you "didn't want to deal with all the confusion and negativity it would provoke." Hope those quotes are okay with you.

 

It's all very close-minded but it makes sense in the context of simply not wanting advice, as Owl said. Unfortunately, as Owl also said, you're on a public message board. If you want to carefully control the knowledge stream, I guess you will have to start over elsewhere where people don't know your story. If you want to talk about your actual story, then that's different. But you don't.

[vnqsh2001]

And THIS is the disconnect.

 

Because you need to understand...pretty much everyone else who comes here, comes exactly for that...advice on how to fix the problem.

 

You don't WANT advice on how to fix the problem.

 

You just want to vent.

 

That's ok...and there is a simple fix to this.

 

Put everyone else on ignore. Make it so that you can only see your own posts.

 

For that matter, you don't need a forum. Just type your feelings out on a wordpad document, or journal them into a spiral notebook.

 

If you only want to vent, but don't want responses to your vents, or advice...then vent in some fashion that won't get your those responses or advice.

 

Just write it down someplace. Go for a walk, and talk to yourself.

 

See...here's the problem.

 

You're wanting to vent...in a PUBLIC FORUM. If you do it in a PUBLIC FORUM...you're ASKING for responses, and by extension will always get advice.

 

See the mistake here? And as I said...the solution is also equally simple and elegant...

No, that wasn't the mistake. I'm doing exactly what I wanted. The problem is that some people are trying to cut me off and invalidate my feelings and I'm being a bit defensive about it. They are trying to simply call me a liar or getting side-tracked with issues I'm really not so concerned about. I'm here to vent, so why not just let me vent? Why do you have to jump on my case like frakking Judge Judy before you've even heard what I have to say? Why do you have to make conjectures that don't even have any truth to them at all?

 

Hey, you all want to say stuff. Fine. I'm all for that. That's why I'm typing it here. But if you want to get on my case, what do you expect in return? Don't you think I'm going to be defensive? I think it wouldn't hurt if we could all just calm down and try to be a little more understanding of one another; and if you can't do that, then just move on. Find something else to do.

[serial muse]

No, that wasn't the mistake. I'm doing exactly what I wanted. The problem is that some people are trying to cut me off and invalidate my feelings and I'm being a bit defensive about it. They are trying to simply call me a liar or getting side-tracked with issues I'm really not so concerned about. I'm here to vent, so why not just let me vent? Why do you have to jump on my case like frakking Judge Judy before you've even heard what I have to say? Why do you have to make conjectures that don't even have any truth to them at all?

 

Hey, you all want to say stuff. Fine. I'm all for that. That's why I'm typing it here. But if you want to get on my case, what do you expect in return? Don't you think I'm going to be defensive? I think it wouldn't hurt if we could all just calm down and try to be a little more understanding of one another; and if you can't do that, then just move on. Find something else to do.

 

To be honest, I was offended enough at your posts that the reason I posted on your threads was, frankly, to let other people know what's going on. I'd have been helpful to you if you wanted it, but I simply don't agree that your agreement with your wife is separate from her cheating on you. That seems completely unrealistic and compartmentalizing to me.

 

But since you don't want to hear it or talk about it in that context, which to me is the baseline for mutual understanding, I at least think the people trying to offer you advice ought to know where you're coming from. Sorry, but I really do believe that you've done people a disservice, and people have a right to know.

[vnqsh2001]

I guess you will have to start over elsewhere where people don't know your story. If you want to talk about your actual story, then that's different. But you don't.

I guess I will, because look what happens when people think theyknow the story. They get hostile, ask a million question, and get judgmental on me, which is exactly what I don't need.

 

What I was talking about to begin with WAS the actual story. Even now, do you honestly think I've told every little detail about what happened? Do you think my wife has? It's extremely complex to give the whole story. In fact, I could type several chapters and probably still miss some details. The whole point of making an initial post was just to relate the main points, which is all anybody does.

[Owl]

I think that Vnq has it right. He's made it clear that he only wants to vent, and doesn't need/want input. If we don't like that we can move on.

 

Fair enough...best bet for all would be to "move on".

 

Taking my own advice...peace out!

[serial muse]

I guess I will, because look what happens when people think theyknow the story. They get hostile, ask a million question, and get judgmental on me, which is exactly what I don't need.

 

What I was talking about to begin with WAS the actual story. Even now, do you honestly think I've told every little detail about what happened? Do you think my wife has? It's extremely complex to give the whole story. In fact, I could type several chapters and probably still miss some details. The whole point of making an initial post was just to relate the main points, which is all anybody does.

 

We clearly disagree on what those main points are.

 

Whatever. I know you hate my posts, I don't particularly enjoy being abused and anyway, I've said what I had to say. If you don't get it now, you just don't want to. I'm done caring, one way or another.

[BareGoddess]

Uhm, no. We don't need ALL the details. I think we got the main gist of the story, V. Enough to see that you take no real responsibility for your part in any of this. None of the rest matters. And you lie (by omission or otherwise) to try to manipulate the responses here. We're smarter than that.

 

And I really don't see how being defensive is going to help you.

 

Anyway, I'm with Owl. This is a waste of time. I wish you the best.

[vnqsh2001]

To be honest, I was offended enough at your posts that the reason I posted on your threads was, frankly, to let other people know what's going on. I'd have been helpful to you if you wanted it, but I simply don't agree that your agreement with your wife is separate from her cheating on you. That seems completely unrealistic and compartmentalizing to me.

 

But since you don't want to hear it or talk about it in that context, which to me is the baseline for mutual understanding, I at least think the people trying to offer you advice ought to know where you're coming from. Sorry, but I really do believe that you've done people a disservice, and people have a right to know.

 

Oh really? Funny. I thought I was the one posting to deal with problems and get some help, but you seem intent on denying me that. Why?

 

Is it really harming other people if you just leave me and my thread alone? What the hell does it matter that you think a "disservice" is being done? Are you out to warn the world that some b@st@rd is misleading people so that he can deal with his depression? Why that cad! How dare he do that just so he can feel a little better and a little less like killing himself. He should plunge that knife directly into his chest.

[Lishy]

V, I am glad that you have hit on the fact that you are depressed and feel suicidle. This is a very important part of who you are

 

Yes, I have dealt with a person like this, my sons father. He would cut himself and take overdoses when things did not go his way or when the pressures got too much. He was diagnosed with a Borderline Personality Disorder and it is a very serious diagnoses.

 

I can empathise with you totally on this and do not mean to ridicule you for feeling this way. I know it is not something you can just 'snap out of' and I am sorry for being so rude in saying so it is just that I had not read you saying that was how you felt.

 

In my opinion you do not need a councellor you need intense psychotherapy and a need within yourself to get better. I am no one to tell you how to feel or think, you need to work this out within yourself. Your marriage difficulties are not helping but are probably not the cause of how you feel, it probably goes much deeper!

 

Would you consider going to a psychotherapist and being evaluated if you have not already?

[vnqsh2001]

I think that Vnq has it right. He's made it clear that he only wants to vent, and doesn't need/want input. If we don't like that we can move on.

 

Fair enough...best bet for all would be to "move on".

 

Taking my own advice...peace out!

Thank you. You really are the wise one, Owl.

 

I'm not saying I'm not here to listen to people, obviously I am. But if all you want to do is insult me, what is the point?

 

And if you disagree with me, can't we just agree to disagree? Surely you must realize that I'm going to reply to your arguments. You don't need to get upset about it just because I do.

[vnqsh2001]

V, I am glad that you have hit on the fact that you are depressed and feel suicidle. This is a very important part of who you are

 

Yes, I have dealt with a person like this, my sons father. He would cut himself and take overdoses when things did not go his way or when the pressures got too much. He was diagnosed with a Borderline Personality Disorder and it is a very serious diagnoses.

 

I can empathise with you totally on this and do not mean to ridicule you for feeling this way. I know it is not something you can just 'snap out of' and I am sorry for being so rude in saying so it is just that I had not read you saying that was how you felt.

 

In my opinion you do not need a councellor you need intense psychotherapy and a need within yourself to get better. I am no one to tell you how to feel or think, you need to work this out within yourself. Your marriage difficulties are not helping but are probably not the cause of how you feel, it probably goes much deeper!

 

Would you consider going to a psychotherapist and being evaluated if you have not already?

Ah, now you see? This is the sort of thing I was hoping to discuss. The fact that I'm hurt and depressed. You're right. It goes much deeper than my marital problems.

 

Yes, I've considered seeing a doctor, but I haven't had any luck finding one I am really comfortable with at the moment.

[vnqsh2001]

Uhm, no. We don't need ALL the details. I think we got the main gist of the story, V. Enough to see that you take no real responsibility for your part in any of this. None of the rest matters. And you lie (by omission or otherwise) to try to manipulate the responses here. We're smarter than that.

 

And I really don't see how being defensive is going to help you.

 

Anyway, I'm with Owl. This is a waste of time. I wish you the best.

Umm, no you don't. Sorry, but that's just how it is. My life and its problems are just too complex to share in all its entirety. Not to mention that I just don't feel comfortable talking about everything. And who the hell is going to read a hundred page initial post?? I certainly wouldn't. I'd rather it be short and to the point.

 

I have tried to take responsibility in this matter, but as I've tried to practically beat over you people's heads ...... I'm not here to talk about who is responsible for what. That's what YOU want to talk about. I'm here to vent and deal with my depression after something terrible happened in my life. So if you're not here to help me with that, I will kindly ask you to leave. Very kindly, in fact.

[Lishy]

That is the important thing, to find a doctor you can feel at ease with and be completely honest with.

 

I wish you all the best V, and in defense of the good people at LS i want to let you know that you have recieved the critisism youhave because of the stuff you left out - People feel cheated when they have given advise and then learn that you have left very important stuff out. Dont take it personal

 

Oh and one more thing, maybe you could join a forum for people who feel suicidal and a harm to themselves? I think you will get a better response and far more understanding

 

Good luck anyway x

[whichwayisup]

YOGA! Seriously, it'll help with your depression and stuff..

[Lishy]

I just read that you got depressed after something terrible happened in your life, that too happened to my ex after his dad killed his mum

 

Please get some proper help!! Please!

[whichwayisup]

I've suffered from anxiety and doing yoga has helped me. Along with doing CBT therapy to help me gain control back and not let the anxiety disorder get me.

 

Depression is dangerous because it warps your mind and can make you worse if you don't deal with it, get help and/or get on meds.

 

If you want to talk about that stuff, then start a new thread in the health section, self improvement. This way that is focus.

[Lishy]

I agree with WWIU that a new thread dealing with your depression and reasons behind it could help you far more than the bickering on this thread. All this is doing is making it worse for you constantly defending yourself.

[vnqsh2001]

Of course you don't:rolleyes:

 

 

 

 

Hmmm, what part of you having the freedom to do as you wish, but with rules, with other women didn't you understand?

 

I think you conveniently forget what you have written here.

 

 

 

The only way, it seems, that you will be able to deal with your "issues" is for people to tell you EXACTLY what you want to hear. For people to tell you to stay in the marriage.

 

I understand the hurt of finding out someone betrayed you. But I also know that I didn't go out and get me some strange and then still act like I had the moral high ground.

 

 

what you need is a good shrink. And I'm not talking counseling for you two, I'm talking about seeing someone for YOUR issues.

 

and bottom line, she is ALWAYS going to want different men to sleep with. That isn't going to change not only because once a cheater always a cheater, but as evidenced by her responses in this thread.

 

But if you are ok with that and you are still agreeing to the open marriage she wants, then more power to ya!!!

And let me point out that just because you disagree with me, doesn't mean I don't appreciate your comments, because I do. I want to make a special note to all those people who are just being judgmental and insulting that this is the way to disagree with someone. You can disagree without being mean and spiteful.