Accepting faults

[movingonandon]

Cleaning is a relationship issue. It's about how you set up your house together, what kind of home you want to run together, etc. I'm kind of stunned that you don't see cleaning as a relationship issue. Relationships are about feelings, sure, but once you know you love each other, they become about how you manage everyday chores, budgets, etc, together.

 

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Yes, yes, and yes! And YES! Spread the word! It is amasing how many people do not understand this basic fact

[lexi29]

I feel like sometimes my boyfriend can't accept my faults. It's almost like he loves me, but if I deviate from this perfect perspective he has of a mate, he tries to show me how to do it better or want me to do something that I don't usually and/or like to do(like cook). His parents never fought (or so he says) so he has this perfect view of a relationship with no conflict and both partners acting a certain way to keep things happy.

 

Overall we are happy, we don't fight like cats and dogs or anything but we do have arguments here and there. We always make up and have a great time doing it, but he'll always say "let's not fight like that anymore." I have tried to tell him that fights happen, you can't prevent conflict from happening. We will always apologize and he will say he is sorry for acting like a jerk and tell me he loves me, but it's like well the damage is already done, and you can't take it back.

 

So what does everyone think about this? Any feelings, opinions, or insight?

 

 

OMG I swear you are dating my ex (not really but you know what I mean...) He too had a perfect view of a relationship in which there was NO conflict. Any time we fought- yes we made up but he'd always say we just can't fight anymore, I don't want to argue. He thought that a great relationship was one in which there was zero conflict. I told him he was living in a fantasy world but he swore up and down that one of his exes and he dated more than a year and NEVER had a single fight (sorry, not buying it unless she could have cared less about him and wasn't even slightly invested emotionally) Also I HATE to cook, I'll do it but it isn't fun and I can't eat anything that I cook. My ex would always try to show me how to do things better. He would do the dishes a certain way (they had to be set in the dish drainer in a certain direction and order) and if I was doing the dishes myself and he was there he would walk past and then start arranging the dishes the way HE liked them. Used to drive me crazy.

 

These things you mention these aren't faults. Being messy, not likeing to cook, the way you drive- these are just habits and they are different from yours. Now if you had major differences with big issues like money or sex then I could see trouble for your relationship. But just because you dont' cook that shouldn't be a deal breaker. The comment your boyfriend made to you has me furious for you though!! That was such a low blow considering he knows how important marriage is to you. He must have been really upset about something (and that still doesn't excuse it) to have insulted you in a way he had to KNOW would hurt you deeply.

 

My ex did say the same thing to me about he was worried about marrying me and the house being a mess (I keep everything clean as in not dirty but I can be messy, as in leave things laying on the floor etc) and it would bother him. I woudn't change who you are for him to marry you. There are plenty of guys who would be thrilled to be with someone like you 'faults' and all. I think you could show him you are making an effort by occassionally picking up your stuff or making him a meal once a month or so but thats it. Don't change everything because you could totally change yourself to fit his ideal woman and he could just find something else he doesn't like and you'll feel horrible. Good luck!

[Trialbyfire]

Having to prove oneself in a relationship, isn't the most healthy of scenarios. You'll find that the bar will keep moving around.

[Tomcat33]

Having to prove oneself in a relationship, isn't the most healthy of scenarios.

 

That's intersting because you are always going on about how men need to prove themselves to you? Your whole dating experience is pretty much built around men having to prove themselves to you?!?!?

 

So it's not healthy as long as it is the woman having to prove herself, if it is the guy then all bets are off?

[Trialbyfire]

That's intersting because you are always going on about how men need to prove themselves to you? Your whole dating experience is pretty much built around men having to prove themselves to you?!?!?

 

So it's not healthy as long as it is the woman having to prove herself, if it is the guy then all bets are off?

That's where you fail to understand me. It's not that they need to prove themselves to me. What they need to do is to be themselves and if it works, it works. If it doesn't, it doesn't.

 

Just like I don't need to be right. I just have a right to my opinion.

 

Subtle differences Tomcat.

[Lauriebell82]

To tell you guys the truth, he may still find that I still deviate from that perfect woman of his. A few years ago when he used to give me a hard time that I couldn't pay for anything we fought. When I started my job and began treating him to things (because I wanted to) we stopped arguing about it. Now it's cleaning and cooking. We haven't fought over this issue very much over the past 8 months, but I know it does bother him that I can't cook and keep the apartment as clean as he wants it.

 

I guess you are right that they aren't faults, they are habits. He has bad habits too, but I don't try to change them.

 

I don't know what to do. I doubt we will be engaged by May when our lease ends so I'm contemplating about what to do. I don't want to have to PROVE myself worthy of being his wife, that's stupid. I think he should love me and want me and cooking and cleaning would just be an added bonus to how wonderful I am. Is that unrealistic? I mean I'm willing to cook, it's not a big deal. But after his a-hole comment that I know he meant, I think that he's still going to be hesitant until his "fears" go away.

 

It's sad, but in my gut I just dont think I am the one for him. *tear*

[BareGoddess]

Awww, LB. Hugs, dear. You'll figure this out one way or the other. And if he's really not for you, you'll find a guy who IS. Someone who you're on the same page with almost all the time.

[Cabernet34]

Don't guess I follow the "no cooking" deal.

 

I mean..... we all have to eat right? When my ex and I were going strong, we loved to cook together. It was something that we could plan for together, we could do together, then we could eat together, listen to good music together, drink red wine together.

 

Hell.......now that I think about it, some of our best and most genuine companionship occured in the kitchen cooking, sitting across the table from one another to share the meal which we just prepared together. Or maybe it was just the Cabernet?

 

Just an opinion here, why not the two of you both clean and both cook, sometimes by yourselves, sometimes together? Might take care of more than food and laundry if you think about it.

[blind_otter]

LB, it has been my personal experience that it is usually a bad situation when your partner has this "ideal" person in their head. Because you know, no human being can be the "ideal" person/partner.

 

My exH was like that. He had this image inside his head of this perfect woman, which he convinced himself was me - but whenever I deviated from that image (which was often, being that I am FAR from perfect) he would get upset, we would fight. Blah. Obviously things didn't work out. He, also, had parents who never, ever fought. They also slept in separate bedrooms - so you do the math. But to him, the perfect marriage did not involve any arguments. I will say, though, that arguing all the time isn't a good thing.

 

I also agree with the above posted, that cooking and cleaning together can be fun and bring you together.

 

Also, RE: the suggestions. I was a messy person before I had my son, comparatively. My S/O was always neater. He always had suggestions, how to sweep properly, how to clean this or that. I just listened and always tried it his way. I mean, it's no big deal to me as I am not committed to my way of doing things and I'm always open to suggestions. Most of the time, his suggestions are actually more efficient than my habits - probably because he's had almost 10 years longer to figure things out than I have

[melodymatters]

I have been following your threads since you joined LB. certain posters just capture our interest sometimes ; perhaps because we've " been there done that " ?!?

 

I am STILL upset about the time he wanted you to meet his parents for a holiday, but if you wouldn't pitch in and pay half the gas and tolls, he didn't want you to come.

 

Thats not RIGHT LB, It's not kind or loving.

 

And the more I hear, the more I get that sinking feeling. I don't want to burden you with even MORE issues, but I too have been with someone like this and IT DOESN"T GET ANY BETTER !

 

If you can not have a frank and honest discussion about each others boundries, and RESPECTING ONES PARTNER, then I think you might be better off at least taking a break.

 

DON"T move in with him in may. He'll either relaize he's being a testing, control freak, jack ass, or he'll realize what he's on the brink of losing.

 

Just think : you won't raise his CHILDREN right either, will you ?!?

 

You do NOT need to live this way !

[Tomcat33]

To tell you guys the truth, he may still find that I still deviate from that perfect woman of his. A few years ago when he used to give me a hard time that I couldn't pay for anything we fought. When I started my job and began treating him to things (because I wanted to) we stopped arguing about it. Now it's cleaning and cooking. We haven't fought over this issue very much over the past 8 months, but I know it does bother him that I can't cook and keep the apartment as clean as he wants it.

 

I guess you are right that they aren't faults, they are habits. He has bad habits too, but I don't try to change them.

 

I don't know what to do. I doubt we will be engaged by May when our lease ends so I'm contemplating about what to do. I don't want to have to PROVE myself worthy of being his wife, that's stupid. I think he should love me and want me and cooking and cleaning would just be an added bonus to how wonderful I am. Is that unrealistic? I mean I'm willing to cook, it's not a big deal. But after his a-hole comment that I know he meant, I think that he's still going to be hesitant until his "fears" go away.

 

It's sad, but in my gut I just dont think I am the one for him. *tear*

 

 

Sorry to see you this upset.

 

It sounds like you guys have basic compatibility issues, his ideal of what a relationship or huband and wife relationship should be like is what he saw in his upbringing and yours is what you experienced. Cultural differences in terms of upbringing is very hard to mesh as a adults, I had a relationship like that and all we did was fight all the time about everything we even did couples councelling and boiled down to our very different upbringings and perceptions of what is a good relationship, in his house his parents never fought never had a meaningful discussion that evolved around emotions, sitting at dinner was a big production that was ceremonious but cold and stern almost like what you would picture the royals being like when they sit down to eat. At my house it was somewhat frantic at times we talked about everything and laughed loudly and talk loudly and at the dinner table we had very open dialogue of whatever was on the go, it could be something that was bothering us or it could be something good that happend to one of us or it could be the hot topic of current events. I am sure to him we must have seemed crazy in comparisson. VERY different upbringings not necessarily right or wrong just differnt.

 

My relationship with my parents was very open and we could talk about anything where his was not. He learned to be more affectionate with his parents and to enjoy family more thanks to what he learned from my household and how I conducted myself with my family.

 

In the end it wouldn't work out, though there was a lot of passion and attraction on both ends we were too funadentally different. He was a latch key kid who did everything for himseld I was a stay home mom cared for kid. So we had very differen experiences of the male and female roles.

 

Maybe you should consider that you are not as compatible as you could be and you haven't really found the right tools to overcome those differences so the fighting won't go away on its own no matter how much each of you try. Sometimes there are fundamental differences that cannot be overcome.

 

I know it's sad and hard to accepted and it will hurt so much to think of not being with him but unless you can really come to terms with how to turn a page and turn a new leaf this is only going to get worse for both of you. Some relationships are just not meant to be, you can try your damnest to be compatible but it just isn't meant to be. I know that because I have been in other relationships where we were more compatible and it felt totally different.

[trubella]

It's sad, but in my gut I just dont think I am the one for him. *tear*

 

i've read alot of your threads and notice on his end he was hesitating and this could very well be the reason why, among other comments he made stalling for time, the five years comment he backtracked once you said you werent waiting that long, not to mention the comment he made that you wouldnt be a good wife here.

 

i usually dont post to your threads but ive been rooting for you to get your proposal soon even though the situation in what youve posted in other threads is looking bleak, imo i think at this point it just isnt going to happen.

[Lauriebell82]

i've read alot of your threads and notice on his end he was hesitating and this could very well be the reason why, among other comments he made stalling for time, the five years comment he backtracked once you said you werent waiting that long, not to mention the comment he made that you wouldnt be a good wife here.

 

i usually dont post to your threads but ive been rooting for you to get your proposal soon even though the situation in what youve posted in other threads is looking bleak, imo i think at this point it just isnt going to happen.

 

Yeah, I really don't even know anymore. When he was "voicing his concerns" about me being messy he kept saying "if we get married" and "if we have kids." It shouldn't be "if" after 2 1/2 years.

[BareGoddess]

Yeah, I really don't even know anymore. When he was "voicing his concerns" about me being messy he kept saying "if we get married" and "if we have kids." It shouldn't be "if" after 2 1/2 years.

 

I have to agree with you. And what about this:

 

It's sad, but in my gut I just dont think I am the one for him.

 

LB, you should be saying "It's sad but in my gut I just don't think HE'S the one for ME." See the difference?

 

I, like Mel, was never crazy about the way he's treated you either.

[BareGoddess]

Yeah, I really don't even know anymore. When he was "voicing his concerns" about me being messy he kept saying "if we get married" and "if we have kids." It shouldn't be "if" after 2 1/2 years.

 

Oh and regarding the above, yeah, my H used to say "are you going to be this messy when we're married?" GRRRR, but yes he said WHEN we're married..not IF.

[Lauriebell82]

LB, you should be saying "It's sad but in my gut I just don't think HE'S the one for ME." See the difference?

 

I, like Mel, was never crazy about the way he's treated you either.

 

I don't know maybe he is not. I was chatting with someone and she said that I might be merging my love for him with my desire to get married. I guess I just don't want to go through all the pain of losing him and moving out. I remember the horrible pain I went through getting over my ex bf. I don't know if I'm up for it again. I tried several times to break it off with my ex and couldn't so I just did it over the phone becuase I knew he couldn't look at me and convince me to stay. I don't know how I could possibly look at him and tell him Im not renewing the lease.

[Lauriebell82]

Oh and regarding the above, yeah, my H used to say "are you going to be this messy when we're married?" GRRRR, but yes he said WHEN we're married..not IF.

 

Yeah he was all passive-aggresive too, he started out saying "when" and then said "I mean if we get married..."

[BareGoddess]

I agree with what the friend you were chatting said. I thought of that too.

 

But LB, you say you don't know how you'll do it. What's the alternative? This type of thing doesn't usually get better. I mean unless you can sit down and NEGOTIATE like I was saying earlier. But I'm not getting the vibe that you want to do that.

 

And I agree with everyone who said if it's a change you'd make just for him it won't work. It has to be something YOU want to do for the greater good of the relationship and to please him specifically.

 

But I also agree with whoever said you have to watch that sort of thing as with certain guys, it's never enough. They'll want to control you...give an inch and they'll take a yard kind of thing.

 

Yeah, that whole "when" "if" thing is game-playing and not what he should be doing. It's manipulative and yes, PA. These types are very, very hard to stay married too unless you're a real doormat, which I never got the sense that you were.

[Trialbyfire]

To not play the PA thing, why not come right at it but in a reasonable fashion?

 

"It always feels like I'm trying to prove myself to you, so I fit your mold of the perfect wife and mother. Guess what? I'm not perfect. Can you accept that?"

[Isolde]

I disagree STRONGLY that to be compatible with someone you have to have similar family backgrounds. My mom and dad's backgrounds were nearly POLAR OPPOSITES. Only thing in common was they were loved by their parents and not treated badly. And they've been married for thirty years.

 

Lauriebell, I'm not saying I don't see red flags here, but I don't see this as a relationship that needs to end NOW, you know?

[Lauriebell82]

To not play the PA thing, why not come right at it but in a reasonable fashion?

 

"It always feels like I'm trying to prove myself to you, so I fit your mold of the perfect wife and mother. Guess what? I'm not perfect. Can you accept that?"

 

Yeah, saying something outright like that may be good. I did tell him that I felt like I would need to prove to him by cleaning and cooking that I would make a good wife. He said that isn't the case that he just prefers it. He also said something else weird now that I think about it. I don't believe in spanking my children (no offense to those who do). I was not spanked and he was. I have told him I don't wish to spank my children and he agreed. So he used that as an example that he is agreeable to not spanking children bc he knows it's important to me, so he wants me to try to compromise to be cleaner and cook becuase it's important to him. What does everyone think about that?

[Lauriebell82]

I disagree STRONGLY that to be compatible with someone you have to have similar family backgrounds. My mom and dad's backgrounds were nearly POLAR OPPOSITES. Only thing in common was they were loved by their parents and not treated badly. And they've been married for thirty years.

 

Lauriebell, I'm not saying I don't see red flags here, but I don't see this as a relationship that needs to end NOW, you know?

 

No, it doesn't need to end now. Unfortunately we are not on the same page about a lot of things, and our lease ends in 4 months. So I'm thinking about things now in order to decide what to do.

[Geishawhelk]

If you're already planning that far ahead, it strikes me as if you are already distancing yourself emotionally.

 

And that's actually not a bad thing, necessarily.....

[Isolde]

No, it doesn't need to end now. Unfortunately we are not on the same page about a lot of things, and our lease ends in 4 months. So I'm thinking about things now in order to decide what to do.

 

Makes sense. I'm sure you'll make the right decision for you.

[Lauriebell82]

If you're already planning that far ahead, it strikes me as if you are already distancing yourself emotionally.

 

And that's actually not a bad thing, necessarily.....

 

Well, the more and more he does this kind of thing (nitpicks then apologizes and tells me how much he loves me) the more uncertain I become. When we are together and having fun I DO feel connected to him, in love ect. But after fights like that, it's just sometimes "I'm sorry" isn't good enough anymore, ya know?