Reviving The old "she wants kids and he doesn't" thing

[hueserobrian]

Hello,

First post. So this situation came up recently in our life. I googled and came up with this link http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t142721/. It was too old to revive so I started this.

Before we got married we discussed this and I said I wasn't sure/really interested. And she was the same. Fast forward 7 years (children not discussed once in 7 years. My wife went to her GP and he says she has to have kids right now for medical reasons (a whole other story) She freaked out and in one day she went from never discussed to "we have to start right now". I told her that after 7 years of never talking about it that I didn't think we were going to do that and that I didn't want kids.

So now she is basically trying to decide whether to stay with me and not have kids or leave and find somebody to have a family with. Also, now 1 month after the Dr. visit, she is confused and not even sure if she wants to have kids.

On the above thread, there were a couple women who had been in similar situations and decided that the positives of staying married far outweighed leaving and starting over again.

So my question is for women out there who have been in similar situations and stayed. How did it go? How is it going? Do you regret anything? I don't want her to resent me and told her it has to be her decision.

So any feedback from similar situations would be appreciated. I am 47 she is 36. First marriage for both of us

Thanks

[eclipseIDE]

Hello,

First post. So this situation came up recently in our life. I googled and came up with this link http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t142721/. It was too old to revive so I started this.

Before we got married we discussed this and I said I wasn't sure/really interested. And she was the same. Fast forward 7 years (children not discussed once in 7 years. My wife went to her GP and he says she has to have kids right now for medical reasons (a whole other story) She freaked out and in one day she went from never discussed to "we have to start right now". I told her that after 7 years of never talking about it that I didn't think we were going to do that and that I didn't want kids.

So now she is basically trying to decide whether to stay with me and not have kids or leave and find somebody to have a family with. Also, now 1 month after the Dr. visit, she is confused and not even sure if she wants to have kids.

On the above thread, there were a couple women who had been in similar situations and decided that the positives of staying married far outweighed leaving and starting over again.

So my question is for women out there who have been in similar situations and stayed. How did it go? How is it going? Do you regret anything? I don't want her to resent me and told her it has to be her decision.

So any feedback from similar situations would be appreciated. I am 47 she is 36. First marriage for both of us

Thanks

 

 

It doesnt matter what you think if its what she wants. Your opinion no longer matters. If you are dead set against having kids and she wants them no if's and's or but's you are out of there. Sounds cruel I know but men are secondary when a woman wants something. So be prepared for her to start blaming you and to look for excuses to leave the marraige

[serial muse]

Hello,

First post. So this situation came up recently in our life. I googled and came up with this link http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t142721/. It was too old to revive so I started this.

Before we got married we discussed this and I said I wasn't sure/really interested. And she was the same. Fast forward 7 years (children not discussed once in 7 years. My wife went to her GP and he says she has to have kids right now for medical reasons (a whole other story) She freaked out and in one day she went from never discussed to "we have to start right now". I told her that after 7 years of never talking about it that I didn't think we were going to do that and that I didn't want kids.

So now she is basically trying to decide whether to stay with me and not have kids or leave and find somebody to have a family with. Also, now 1 month after the Dr. visit, she is confused and not even sure if she wants to have kids.

On the above thread, there were a couple women who had been in similar situations and decided that the positives of staying married far outweighed leaving and starting over again.

So my question is for women out there who have been in similar situations and stayed. How did it go? How is it going? Do you regret anything? I don't want her to resent me and told her it has to be her decision.

So any feedback from similar situations would be appreciated. I am 47 she is 36. First marriage for both of us

Thanks

 

 

Yeah. Here's another perspective. It's not just she who has changed her mind; you have too. You both were noncommittal and you both made up your minds without informing the other person that your stance on this big issue had changed. Do you see that?

 

Second thing: she was just dealt a really powerful blow, so it's worth giving her a LITTLE leeway, don't you think?? Even people who say they aren't sure about kids are going to reel in distress when told they have to decide NOW or never. How awful is that for her? And your response was to put your own foot down and tell her that by the way, it's been off the table for a while as far as you were concerned, full stop. Seriously - OUCH. It's funny that the above poster saw this situation as being about how your opinion doesn't matter. No - you two are in the same boat here - because you also refuse to budge. Do you see that?

 

I'm not saying that she should/shouldn't decide whether she wants to remain in the marriage vs. ever having kids; as you say, it's her call. But that's a tough choice she now has suddenly discovered that she has to make, since you've now made your feelings clear on the matter. Is it any wonder she'd be reeling? Yes, she should have discussed it with you years ago; then again, you should have discussed it with her. You didn't, and now you're at this crossroads, for which you are BOTH equally responsible.

 

Listen, I can understand how terribly hurt you'd be that she might be thinking of choosing to have kids over staying with you - but that might not be fair to her; she's suddenly having to make a decision that she wasn't prepared to make, and she probably didn't know you'd already made up your mind on the issue. She's probably in a distressed state of mind; that doesn't mean you should sugar-coat your feelings, but at least give her a chance to get used to this new state of affairs.

 

It sounds like you two need to have a long, calm discussion about this, without assigning blame for the lack of communication. You've obviously been thinking for some time that you don't really want kids, but never said so explicitly, and she may have been thinking for some time that she does, but never said so. So now, you need to get these things out on the table, together.

[Geishawhelk]

I don't know if this is an issue, but - Why would a Doctor tell a woman she absolutely HAS to have children?

What possible medical condition could there be for this to be a stipulation?

Something stinks here.

Either the doctor is an old-fashioned fuddy-duddy who believes it essential that every couple have children, because it's the norm, and he is coercing her unethically and unprofessionally by hiding behind a "bona-fide" medical reason (Ha ha, I don't think)....

 

OR -

 

She's making it up as she goes along, but realises she may have shot herself in the foot, because actually, she's unsure.

 

Consider the old saying:

 

If it feels good, do it.

When in doubt, don't.

 

if there is even a miniscule, microscopic element of doubt in either of your heads, about having children - it's neither fair nor right to have them.

This is a 100% decision, because you can't change your minds half-way, or give it to the Canine rescue league a year down the line because it's not such a great idea after all, to have one.....

 

eclipseIDE, your bitterness is showning again.....

[michelangelo]

Maybe it is a good thing to revisit just about every part of one's marriage relationship from time to time. Even those things that seemed like they were already hashed out years ago.

 

There are ways of thinking and processing information that are unique to a particular age or mindset that can change as one ages. That rate of evolving is not necessarily the same for each gender too.

 

I've heard it said that the reason babies take nine months to form is that it takes that long for the father to get his head around having the child.

 

Think of this: your wife wants your baby. This is not just that she wants to be a breeder. She is telling you though that if you don't want to make her happy and fulfilled as a person, then she will find someone who will.

 

Life would be great if we could lock in feelings and emotions and thoughts about a relationship on the day the "deal" was clinched. Unfortunately, for some who seek that comfort zone, life is not that way.

[hueserobrian]

Hello Serial Muse,

Thanks for your reply

Trying to keep my original post from being way too long, I left a lot out.

Yes, I fully agree this is something that should have been discussed better, more often.

And yes, she was and still is upset from the Dr's visit and I am being very supportive of that. It was terrible for her. But I didn't want to tell her something when I wasn't sincere. And yes, I see the aspect of me not budging.

And yes, this has been devastating for both of us. To get that news and then this has been a lot for her.

And yes, we are now discussing these things a lot calmer now. Do you think counseling would help?

Thanks

[theBrokenMuse]

It doesnt matter what you think if its what she wants. Your opinion no longer matters. If you are dead set against having kids and she wants them no if's and's or but's you are out of there. Sounds cruel I know but men are secondary when a woman wants something. So be prepared for her to start blaming you and to look for excuses to leave the marraige

 

Having a family or not is one of the most major decisions couples have to face. They certainly would be better off splitting up if they can't get on the same page when it comes to the really big stuff like this otherwise chances are that someone will end up with a whole lot of resentment and the relationship will fall apart regardless. Oh and I know that you aren't exactly enchanted with the opposite sex right now but the vitriol in your post is a little over the top.

[eclipseIDE]

Having a family or not is one of the most major decisions couples have to face. They certainly would be better off splitting up if they can't get on the same page when it comes to the really big stuff like this otherwise chances are that someone will end up with a whole lot of resentment and the relationship will fall apart regardless. Oh and I know that you aren't exactly enchanted with the opposite sex right now but the vitriol in your post is a little over the top.

 

 

 

 

Well it appeared they were in agreement regarding kids until she spoke to the doctor. Then she told her husband she was thinking about leaving him to start a family. This isnt a decision this an ultimatum.

 

Regarding to not being enchanted with women. I'm not with the ones who give ultimatums. Like all the women crying on this forum about how their boyfriends wont marry them. Quit whining, why are you with them so long. If you want to be married in 2 years tell them. Dont spring it on them. Make your choices known from the very beginning regarding children,marriage but stick to them( not like the scenario above).

[Enema]

I don't know how to articulate myself properly on this topic.

 

But, I agree with eclipseIDE. They voiced their opinions on children before they got married, that opinion held strong for 7 long years until she changed her mind.

 

How dare she spring this on an innocent loving husband? The choice to have a child is not a gift, it's a f'n burden and she's thrown that burden at him wrapped in an ultimatum.

 

If i was the OP, I would leave now. Clearly my wife and I aren't on the same page anymore and this is going to end one way or another. Rip this marriage apart fast like a band-aid.

[theBrokenMuse]

Well it appeared they were in agreement regarding kids until she spoke to the doctor. Then she told her husband she was thinking about leaving him to start a family. This isnt a decision this an ultimatum.

 

Regarding to not being enchanted with women. I'm not with the ones who give ultimatums. Like all the women crying on this forum about how their boyfriends wont marry them. Quit whining, why are you with them so long. If you want to be married in 2 years tell them. Dont spring it on them. Make your choices known from the very beginning regarding children,marriage but stick to them( not like the scenario above).

 

They were in agreement about 'don't know' not 'don't want them'. When push came to shove her biological clock has ether started ticking or she's panicked now that having children is going to no longer be an option. Not taking the time to be introspective enough to figure out what we want out out of life is all fine and good until the choice is about to be taken off the table for good then people's real feelings on the subject come out.

 

It's a pity that they didn't discuss this earlier but as it stands they are at opposite sides of the spectrum now and one of them is going to end up hurt by this in a way that will never be swept under the rug because their will be daily reminders for both scenarios regardless of what direction is taken.

[theBrokenMuse]

How dare she spring this on an innocent loving husband? The choice to have a child is not a gift, it's a f'n burden and she's thrown that burden at him wrapped in an ultimatum.

 

Once again, they both agreed that they didn't know what they wanted, not that they didn't want a child and not everyone thinks that having children is a burden. I happen to actually like my kids, fancy that.

[Enema]

Once again, they both agreed that they didn't know what they wanted, not that they didn't want a child and not everyone thinks that having children is a burden. I happen to actually like my kids, fancy that.

 

I bow to your superior comprehension, you are correct.

 

Side note: Just because you like your kids doesn't mean they're not a burden.

[Geishawhelk]

Well it appeared they were in agreement regarding kids until she spoke to the doctor. Then she told her husband she was thinking about leaving him to start a family. This isnt a decision this an ultimatum.

 

I have to agree with this.

I'm sorry, but I would just love to know what exactly this medical condition is that means a woman MUST have a baby, or else.

I've googled and researched and I can't come up with anything.

I'm not saying anyone is lying, but I'd just be interested.....

I'm not trying to pry or upset anyone either.

But it all sounds fishy to me.

 

And I am completely sympathetic to the OP's position. Completely.

Because I, at a time when I had a severe hormonal imbalance (requiring medical attention to rectify - though at the time we were unaware) gave my H. a similar ultimatum.

It was despicable and really below the belt, and I am thoroughly ashamed of it.

 

......Like all the women crying on this forum about how their boyfriends wont marry them. Quit whining, why are you with them so long. If you want to be married in 2 years tell them. Dont spring it on them. Make your choices known from the very beginning regarding children,marriage but stick to them( not like the scenario above).

 

Allowing for the fact that feelings, views opinions and emotions are built on shifting sands - I can see your point here too.

people do change their minds. It happens.

But communication is a big thing of mine - as many know - and it's far from effective in most cases.

[theBrokenMuse]

I'm sorry, but I would just love to know what exactly this medical condition is that means a woman MUST have a baby, or else.

I've googled and researched and I can't come up with anything.

I'm not saying anyone is lying, but I'd just be interested.....

I'm not trying to pry or upset anyone either.

But it all sounds fishy to me.

 

 

He means that she has to have one now IF she is planning on having one because she will not be able to conceive in the near future.

[Geishawhelk]

Oh good grief.

That's it?

 

Horrendous how she was just so sure before, but suddenly now it's all teminal and do-or-die.

 

Women have had children into their mid-40's..... And there's always fostering or adoption.

I wish there was an agency that lets you borrow a colicky kid for a week....

 

Right.

Gotcha.

[theBrokenMuse]

Oh good grief.

That's it?

 

Horrendous how she was just so sure before, but suddenly now it's all teminal and do-or-die.

 

Women have had children into their mid-40's..... And there's always fostering or adoption.

I wish there was an agency that lets you borrow a colicky kid for a week....

 

Right.

Gotcha.

 

But that's just it Geisha nether of them laid it out on the table beforehand they both just told one another they didn't know/weren't sure they wanted kids or not. Now that it's soon to no longer be an option, it's forced them both to examine the issue in more detail.

[Geishawhelk]

Yes, I see that now.

My bad.....

 

And I think this is one of the major deal-breakers.

because it's so huge.

I have also seen the same situation when the man changed his mind, and he decided he wanted kids after all....

That's a little harder to deal with......

[serial muse]

Hello Serial Muse,

Thanks for your reply

Trying to keep my original post from being way too long, I left a lot out.

Yes, I fully agree this is something that should have been discussed better, more often.

And yes, she was and still is upset from the Dr's visit and I am being very supportive of that. It was terrible for her. But I didn't want to tell her something when I wasn't sincere. And yes, I see the aspect of me not budging.

And yes, this has been devastating for both of us. To get that news and then this has been a lot for her.

And yes, we are now discussing these things a lot calmer now. Do you think counseling would help?

Thanks

 

Hi brian,

 

I do think that counseling will help; it's going to be difficult to really have this long-delayed discussion but a neutral third party may be able to help you both be honest and more clear-sighted about your needs/wants and what having or not having children really mean to you and your relationship.

 

I wish you luck, I really do.

 

That said...to the other posters, I think it's interesting that so many people leapt to the assumption that his wife was at fault here, leaving him in the lurch. It says a lot about peoples' assumptions about who's ultimately responsible for the kid issue and who tends to do an about-face, and it's really unfortunate, not to mention inaccurate.

 

To be honest, I think what's happened in brian's relationship is the most common situation - very often, I think, people do have their preferences about having kids, but they know they may not align with their partners' preference. So they don't voice what they really feel or they avoid the honest, possibly dealbreaking discussion for as long as possible. And then something happens to make them deal with it. It's human nature, and it's painful, and I feel for this couple. But that doesn't make it all her fault, nor does it make it all his. They're just in a tough spot, and going all vitriolic on one gender or the other doesn't help at all.

 

I should add to the OP - I think it's good that you're being honest with her about your feelings now...unfortunately, the timing is pretty bad, because given the ultimatum she was given, she may be interpreting your current stance on the issue as you not valuing her feelings. Which would be untrue, of course, but emotions are so high right now...I really do think that a counselor might be able to help you both work through this.

[redfathom]

I am kind of in the same situation. When I married my hubby we both talked about having kids, but I was 18 and am now 26 can I have changed my mind (well, not 100%, but I won't play with his emotions by flip flopping). As far as he knows I don't want kids, I feel bad about it. The reason we discussed kids before (and really only names) was because it seemed like the thing to do.

 

-you get married

-get a pet together

-buy a house

-have a baby

-etc...

 

But that's what convention tells everyone to do. When people find out how young I was when I got married they almost always ask if we have kids, because that's what you do. When we tell people we have been married eight years they ask us when we are having kids, it's akward.

 

I like kids, I think they're fun...but only part-time. I like being an aunt, but I don't want to be a mother. I like my life the way it is, yep, I'm selfish.

 

I told hubby how I felt and we talked about it and I gave him the option of ending the marriage. He decided to stay, he married a wife, not a mother.

 

If I was told I couldn't have kids I would be devestated even though I don't want them. I also know I will have some regrets about not having kids...

 

Now that I was DXed with a hereditary condition I am even more thankful that I don't want kids and that just adds one more reason.

 

At 26 I am still a "baby"...

 

So like I said I am not 100% sold on the descision, it's a tough one...maybe when I'm 32 I will want kids...but I had to make a descision now and this is what I have made.

 

But hubby and I have had this conversation several times, because he makes comments about knowing I will change my mind and I don't want him to be disappointed 10 years from now when I don't.

 

Good luck...

[Neutrino]

I may have skipped a few posts, but I read the first one : none of them changed their minds - the premarital discussion stated only that they had not yet formed an opinion on the subject - nothing more.

 

Anyway - I can understand her response - she may not necessarily really want a child - I think it is most likely a panic-response. This is probably a relatively young woman, someone who is nowhere near menopause and having to make the final decision on this subject - she thought she had all the time in the universe and now suddenly she's faced with a now-or-never situation.

 

What was her view before the GP visit ? You two must have talked about it ? or things just came up in conversations with friends or family ?

 

You want to check for sure ? "borrow" a child from friends or relatives for 2 weeks, see what it's like - don't be naiive enough to think kids are pure joy - it is a lot of hard work and sacrifice (and I don't even have any !!)

 

The test of reality will tell all. IMO if the parental instinct is there - it is a strong feeling, but if it is not - don't have kids only because in the future you may not be able to. Nothing is worse than having a child and regretting it later - and I have seen those cases too....

 

Best of luck

[Neutrino]

I am kind of in the same situation. When I married my hubby we both talked about having kids, but I was 18 and am now 26 can I have changed my mind (well, not 100%, but I won't play with his emotions by flip flopping). As far as he knows I don't want kids, I feel bad about it. The reason we discussed kids before (and really only names) was because it seemed like the thing to do.

 

-you get married

-get a pet together

-buy a house

-have a baby

-etc...

 

But that's what convention tells everyone to do. When people find out how young I was when I got married they almost always ask if we have kids, because that's what you do. When we tell people we have been married eight years they ask us when we are having kids, it's akward.

 

I like kids, I think they're fun...but only part-time. I like being an aunt, but I don't want to be a mother. I like my life the way it is, yep, I'm selfish.

 

I told hubby how I felt and we talked about it and I gave him the option of ending the marriage. He decided to stay, he married a wife, not a mother.

 

If I was told I couldn't have kids I would be devestated even though I don't want them. I also know I will have some regrets about not having kids...

 

Now that I was DXed with a hereditary condition I am even more thankful that I don't want kids and that just adds one more reason.

 

At 26 I am still a "baby"...

 

So like I said I am not 100% sold on the descision, it's a tough one...maybe when I'm 32 I will want kids...but I had to make a descision now and this is what I have made.

 

But hubby and I have had this conversation several times, because he makes comments about knowing I will change my mind and I don't want him to be disappointed 10 years from now when I don't.

 

Good luck...

 

 

You are exactly describing my thoughts on the subject - and I'm 10 years older - 36. I have thought this through long and hard, and my conclusion is - the problem is not having, or not having a child, but it is no longer having the choice !

 

Whatever you do in your life - you may face some regrets, but having a child for the wrong reasons was something that scared the hell out of me. When I look at my life - a child would not fit in : my career, the international travel, the long hours, being self-centered and loving my freedom, not even to mention I find the thought of pregnancy and birth horrifying - like it is not supposed to happen to me... I do not hate kids, but the parental instinct was simply never there !

 

Most people live by stereotypes - they do things without thinking - because this is what is expected of them. They will naturally expect you to do the same - they can not possibly imagine any other options - well, let them talk, they will not have to live with the consequences - you will.

 

** Some people insist on thinking that "everybody wants to have kids" and individual character or choices are meaningless - this is obviously crap, otherwise contraceptions would simply not exist. We are individual people, we have our preferences and we make our choices... (besides - it's not exactly like people are an endangered species...)

 

Being a family of 2 is also not bad at all and being an aunt sounds fantastic

[hueserobrian]

Hello Everybody,

Wow, thanks for all the responses. I appreciate the input and insights. I will try to answer some questions that came up.

Geishawalk asked if this might be an old fuddydudy doc that believes every one should have children and yes that is right.

My wife is from Mexico originally and since she has dual citizenship she goes to see this guy every year. Why, I don't know. But he totally freaked her out this year by saying, and I quote, "utereses do 2 things only, they have babies and get cancer and if you had had babies by now I would be taking yours out next week! Can you believe that? So yes, her head went into a tail spin. I wasn't even there but at the airport on my way there and she calls me and says that we have to start trying as soon as we get home. Whoa! He says she has a certain virus that I won't name but with research I have forund there are 150 types of this virus, 98% of which do nothing and the other 2 are very suspect as well. But we are following up on this here.

Neutrino, you said "the problem is not having, or not having a child, but it is no longer having the choice !" and "I can understand her response - she may not necessarily really want a child - I think it is most likely a panic-response." I think is acurate. We have had 2 good talks since I originally posted and she is not sure herself but the above seems to acurately reflect what she is feeling.

Geishawalk, you also said "Because I, at a time when I had a severe hormonal imbalance (requiring medical attention to rectify - though at the time we were unaware) gave my H. a similar ultimatum." That got my interest because she says and I agree that she is in a pretty good depression since the Dr. visit and says she is so confused about many things so I am wondering if this is contributing to the problems. I would love to hear more about how that turned out if you want.

So, now we are talking calmer but both quite depressed about the situation. She initally was reluctant about counseling but now has agreed so we are setting that up.

Sorry no real change to report but I wanted to follow-up a little bit and thank you all for your comments.

Have a great day

[mark982]

pushing you to quickly make her pregnant.is it possible she already is, and tring to make it seem like the babies yours?

[Geishawhelk]

Geishawalk, you also said "Because I, at a time when I had a severe hormonal imbalance (requiring medical attention to rectify - though at the time we were unaware) gave my H. a similar ultimatum." That got my interest because she says and I agree that she is in a pretty good depression since the Dr. visit and says she is so confused about many things so I am wondering if this is contributing to the problems. I would love to hear more about how that turned out if you want.

 

When I had my first daughter, I had minor complications that needed a speedy blood transfusion.

What nobody realised at the time, was that such a faster-than-normal transfusion tipped my hormones out of kilter.

I spent the next 7 years insisting to doc's that there was a problem, because i couldn't take the pill - whereas before the pregnancy, I could - and my mood swings were dramatic to say the least. (I also went off sex completely. but that's another story!)

I kept getting fobbed off as being a typical latin-temperamental woman (I'm half-Italian).

In the end, I began developping worrying physical symptoms (lumps in my breasts...) and because if something like that happens, I have a tendency to get it seen to immediately, rather than sweep it under the carpet, the specialist decided pretty quickly that although completely harmless, they were as a result of producing too much oestrogen.

I was admitted to hospital for an internal examination (via laparoscopy) and they discovered that whilst one ovary was going great guns and could win prizes, the other resembled a shriveled prune and was going haywire.

I had to undergo HRT and in less than 2 months, I was fine.

 

I would however, suggest to your wife that she go to another doctor and get a second opinion.

This is a pretty dramatic and life-changing bit of advice form her doctor, and I think his interference is playing with her emotions in a very unprofessional way. He is very unethical to try to persuade her in this manner. He is scaremongering, and this talk about cancer and viruses is just a ruse.

I'd smack him to back and beyond. Do some research. find out about incidence of cancer amongst women who have not had children.

I'll bet the figures are negligible.

I would alsmost say he is overstepping his medical authority and his manner is questionable.

[serial muse]

I would however, suggest to your wife that she go to another doctor and get a second opinion.

 

I think this is absolutely on-target and I'm ashamed I didn't think to suggest it myself. But quite right - different doctors will have different stances on this issue, and removing the ACT NOW!!! panic from the situation may help you both move forward.

 

Of course, that won't solve the underlying issue of kids, but it could at least help you both to feel calmer and think more carefully about what's next.

 

pushing you to quickly make her pregnant.is it possible she already is, and tring to make it seem like the babies yours?

 

Wow. Is this really all that you took away from the OP's story? This, to me, is a case of one poster's paranoia infecting other people. Yuck.