If you could get away with cheating, would you do it?

[OpenBook]

Are you kidding? A LOT of people on LS have cheated but still say they never did.. because they always said they would NEVER EVER cheat.. and/or some have a reputation on LS and don't want to ruin it.. simple as that..

 

And I believe people are this way IRL as well. It's the law of the jungle - hide your flaws, or get killed.

[marlena]

Personally, I regret not cheating on my ex-husband. He richly deserved it.

[soserious1]

I was faithful, all it got me is ordered to write a hefty alimony check each month.

 

He's moved onto a busty, lusty gal 20 yrs his junior, I got all the bills, a couple of cats and I spend my Sat nights at home tweezing whiskers off my ugly,post menopausal face.

 

He's happy,thriving,looking forward to a bright future, I look forward literally to

struggling to support myself in my golden years and praying to die earlier rather than later.

 

Fidelity and honor , being the "good wife" got me nothing but pain and a decline in lifestyle that I will not be able to recover from in this current fiscal climate.

[soserious1]

So do you consider dignity, honor, respect and integrity nothing? Those are all things you displayed by not cheating. Are they worth more than dollars(even though I do know what the dollars mean. Lord knows I need a pedicure like Joan Rivers needs to age gracefully and not look like the Joker's mother)

 

I'm a results based person.. he's moved on and is living well. As for me, when I lie down each night I pray to God to simply not wake up in the morning.

[SpanksTheMonkey]

No cause if you have to cheat whats the point in being with that person in the 1st place?

[blondesmiler]

No I wouldn't because I believe in fidelity. And if you are not happy with someone or something is missing you discuss, work on and if nothing works, leave. Anything else is just wrong IMO.

 

It's called "cheating" for a reason! Cheating is wrong in all forms.

[Bobby NoBrains]

I've read the whole thread so far, some arguments more attentively than others. I think JamesM has put forth some very valid and real arguments about this hypothetical question. I've gone through a lot of things in life, and I've seen a lot of things in my life. Based on the life I've led, on the experiences I've had, I have come to the conclusion that things are not as black and white as they should be.

 

I'm sure many others have also been through or seen terrible things in their life. And they would say that there is no excuse to not have strong personal beliefs, strong principles, ethics, morals, courage, conviction, et al. It is very easy to say that one would not steal, or would not lie, or would not cheat, or cross some such line which has been set either by ourselves or by social mores. However, I can definitely imagine certain circumstances, where it would be very, very difficult (and in fact I would go so far as to use the word impossible) to convincingly say that one would never possibly cross that line, and that, in such circumstances, those same strong personal beliefs, strong principles, ethics, morals, courage, conviction, et al, would matter nothing in the face of the human need, physical and/or emotional, to do what would need to be done to cross that so-called line.

 

Please note that I do not use the word "want". I use the word "need". No doubt, if there is a conscious choice to be made when such choice is within one's control, there are many people who would be able to resist any, and perhaps all, temptation. However, need is something that works on a different principle than want. And, in those situations and circumstances, there is no guarantee that a person would be able to resist the situation or circumstances, or that they would be in control of themselves to be able to make an informed and reasoned choice, but would be driven by something much more basic and primeval inside themselves, which sometimes is unfortunately not within one's control. I do not see this as a contest between how evolved one is versus how animal-like one's nature is. It is much more fundamental and is related to how each person's inner animal responds to particular situations or circumstances. This response is affected by so many things, including your childhood experiences, your parents' relationship, your relationships with your friends and family, prolly so many other things I can't think of right now, your relationship with your SO, and all the same things from your SO's side also. Basically I'm saying that you may think everyone knows themselves, but they are not God, they are human, therefore not perfect, and while they won't *necessarily* fail, they *might*.

 

Therefore, I wholeheartedly agree with what JamesM has said in his posts, that the best way is to avoid putting yourself in a situation where there would be opportuinity and desire, but I would also like to add that one should also be wary of allowing ourselves to get into circumstances where one's self-control would waver, or where the situation could get out of hand. Like he says, it's better to be prepared, than to be sorry.

 

 

Just my two bits ..

 

Bobby

[Dexter Morgan]

Personally, I regret not cheating on my ex-husband. He richly deserved it.

 

Why, did he cheat on you?

[Nikki Sahagin]

I understand the comments about avoiding certain situations and scenarios i.e. personally I don't think it's respectful for partners to visit stripclubs and I wouldn't tolerate it BUT there are certain scenarios that are unavoidable and furthermore, certain scenarios you shouldn't HAVE to give up. Take clubbing for one instance. In a club you usually drink and are surrounded by women and men, at least 1 of which, would probably go home and sleep with you (it's what a lot of people go to clubs to do), but if you enjoyed clubbing, would you stop simply because there might come a night where you drink a lot and a model comes onto you and you end up giving in? I don't think it's necessarily about avoiding those kinds of situations...but about learning self-control. I've been in situations where i've thought 'I could do this', 'I could do that' whether it be to kiss someone or take a number - but i've recognised the feeling and rejected it, but I feel avoidance is a way of not testing your true character. If, smashed out of your face on 20 bottles of wine, you can look at a man you'd rate 10 out of 10, and say NO, then you know you can pass the test...if you always avoid those situations, how will you know? You're avoiding the 'tests' so to speak...

 

This is probably more of a teenage scenario than a marriage scenario, i'm not sure.

[Trialbyfire]

Nikki, the question is then, if you're uncertain of your alcohol tolerance/control over self, why would you push the envelope? In essence, why would you need to test yourself for something that's dysfunctional, like cheating?

 

Facing your fears is a great for things like overcoming phobias which restrict quality of life. I don't see fear of cheating as a valid phobia to overcome...

[Nikki Sahagin]

Nikki, the question is then, if you're uncertain of your alcohol tolerance/control over self, why would you push the envelope? In essence, why would you need to test yourself for something that's dysfunctional, like cheating?

 

Facing your fears is a great for things like overcoming phobias which restrict quality of life. I don't see fear of cheating as a valid phobia to overcome...

 

It's different if you know you're 'that kind of drunk'. Personally i'm the kind of drunk who says 'no' even more than when i'm sober. So I think if you know you can't control alcohol then yes that's a dangerous situation you'd probably need to give up...but otherwise why should you? I just mean if you never enter the lions den once in a while, if you literally avoided EVERY scenario where something could happen, then how do you know what you're truly capable of?

[Trialbyfire]

It's different if you know you're 'that kind of drunk'. Personally i'm the kind of drunk who says 'no' even more than when i'm sober. So I think if you know you can't control alcohol then yes that's a dangerous situation you'd probably need to give up...but otherwise why should you? I just mean if you never enter the lions den once in a while, if you literally avoided EVERY scenario where something could happen, then how do you know what you're truly capable of?

But that's like saying, "I don't know my tolerance to cocaine, so I'm going to keep testing myself by trying it". Sooner or later, you're going to get addicted to a substance that you know isn't good for you.

 

To change that to a scenario of cheating, it's like someone continuously sexually flirting with the opposite gender. Sooner or later, you're going to find someone who you do find attractive enough to consider cheating. Why do this? Instead, don't sexual flirt. Keep it a low level of flirting without intent or if you know you lack willpower for other things, don't flirt.

[jwi71]

It's different if you know you're 'that kind of drunk'. Personally i'm the kind of drunk who says 'no' even more than when i'm sober. So I think if you know you can't control alcohol then yes that's a dangerous situation you'd probably need to give up...but otherwise why should you? I just mean if you never enter the lions den once in a while, if you literally avoided EVERY scenario where something could happen, then how do you know what you're truly capable of?

 

This makes zero sense to me.

 

Why on Earth would you expose yourself to a situation where cheating is more likely than not? You get drunk and cavort with men just to see if you can say no? And the one time you cannot?

 

Its like the old joke where a kid asked how they know the weight limits of a bridge. His father responded, they keep driving heavier trucks over it until it breaks...and the last one was the limit. Of course to learn the limit you must break the bridge.

 

Seems more like Russian Roulette than personal growth.

[JamesM]

Why on Earth would you expose yourself to a situation where cheating is more likely than not? You get drunk and cavort with men just to see if you can say no? And the one time you cannot?

 

 

Ironically, many justify their going to places which puts the temptation of cheating in front of them by saying that they would never cheat, so they need not worry. And when they do, they are surprised it happened...and claim victim hood.

 

As a married man, I would find it hard to justify "clubbing" if I know that it is a way mainly for hooking up. My wife would probably trust that I would be okay yet a part of her would wonder why I would be there. I find that not a lot different than if I went to a strip club and said it was a way to bond with my male friends. We would just look, not touch, drink and go home.

 

Is it not better to stay as far away from a situation that can lead to cheating rather than see how close one can get before being burned?

[grogster]

Ironically, many justify their going to places which puts the temptation of cheating in front of them by saying that they would never cheat, so they need not worry. And when they do, they are surprised it happened...and claim victim hood.

 

As a married man, I would find it hard to justify "clubbing" if I know that it is a way mainly for hooking up. My wife would probably trust that I would be okay yet a part of her would wonder why I would be there. I find that not a lot different than if I went to a strip club and said it was a way to bond with my male friends. We would just look, not touch, drink and go home.

 

Is it not better to stay as far away from a situation that can lead to cheating rather than see how close one can get before being burned?

 

Of all the infidelity posters, JamesM is the wisest. James understands that for the overwhelminhg majority of cheaters it is not about character alone. James prefers to wield a scapel rather than a hammer in attempting to undertand the whys and wherefores of adultery.

 

Setting matters more than most people recognize. People don't cheat in the abstract unmoored from particular time, circumstance and place.

 

If you don't want temptation, avoid "temptation" settings. Don't go clubbing, don't befriend an an opposite sex co-worker, don't become a non-spouse's close friend and confidante--whether IRL or online.

 

I understand that most Shackers hold absolute rules against cheating. But life is not lived in the Absolute. It is lived in the here and now.

[Nikki Sahagin]

This makes zero sense to me.

 

Why on Earth would you expose yourself to a situation where cheating is more likely than not? You get drunk and cavort with men just to see if you can say no? And the one time you cannot?

 

Its like the old joke where a kid asked how they know the weight limits of a bridge. His father responded, they keep driving heavier trucks over it until it breaks...and the last one was the limit. Of course to learn the limit you must break the bridge.

 

Seems more like Russian Roulette than personal growth.

 

Well okay. In my case I am 19...clubbing is a massive teenage thing and you're going to go for one reason or another; for a night out, a birthday etc. Because a club is a place of temptation, should you avoid going BECAUSE it is a place of temptation? Or should you still go and just be aware of that temptation? I've been clubbing, been drunk and NEVER cheated, never done anything, so I KNOW I could go and not 'give in' whereas someone who purposely avoids it, doesn't know that for sure.

[JamesM]

Thanks, grogster.

 

Well said....the world is not absolutes. And when someone says, "I will never"....then I wonder if they really know from experience or is this what they feel inside...and then why . When they say, "Based on my past experiences, I know I won't," then at least the person realizes who they are and does have a good chance of avoiding adultery or cheating.

 

 

Because a club is a place of temptation, should you avoid going BECAUSE it is a place of temptation?

 

I think it depends on the relationship you are in. Do the two of you feel that it will be fine, or does one feel a little leery about putting oneself into such a situation.

 

Or should you still go and just be aware of that temptation?

 

Being aware is very good. And if your partner has no problem with you being there, then it is fine.

 

But you are not married either, correct?

 

I've been clubbing, been drunk and NEVER cheated, never done anything, so I KNOW I could go and not 'give in' whereas someone who purposely avoids it, doesn't know that for sure.

 

The fallacy here is that until one has put him or herself into the fire, he or she cannot know if he or she will be able to get as close as possible without being burned.

 

Is it wiser to test your limits or is it wiser to stay away knowing that the danger is there?

 

And while I respect that you know your strength, I say with kindness...thus far, you have not given into temptation. This far, you have not been burned.

 

It is easy to say no to temptation when our relationship is strong and healthy. It is when we are at odds with our partner that getting too close to the fire is even more dangerous.

 

I don't have the correct answer for you, but if I was in your shoes (as I can only go by my experiences), then if I desired to keep my relationship strong I would do everything in my power to stay as far away as possible from anything that could weaken it.

 

Having said that, if the two of you are mutually relaxed with the other going out to clubs with friends, then there should be no concern from either one of you.

 

The question becomes...which is more important...the clubs or the relationship?

[Nikki Sahagin]

I am far beyond 19, but my gal friends and I (and sometimes our guys) go out dancing, karaoke, playing pool, drinking, etc. I've been approached by very good looking guys. I've never been tempted to cheat on my man. I couldn't bear the thought of what it would do to him were he to find out if I strayed, and I wouldn't want to possibly ruin the best relationship I've ever been involved in.

 

I agree but this is what I meant, should you avoid clubs etc where temptation is quite likely for many people, just because there MAY be temptation there? By some peoples logic, they are saying you should.

[Nikki Sahagin]

Thanks, grogster.

 

Well said....the world is not absolutes. And when someone says, "I will never"....then I wonder if they really know from experience or is this what they feel inside...and then why . When they say, "Based on my past experiences, I know I won't," then at least the person realizes who they are and does have a good chance of avoiding adultery or cheating.

 

 

 

 

I think it depends on the relationship you are in. Do the two of you feel that it will be fine, or does one feel a little leery about putting oneself into such a situation.

 

 

 

Being aware is very good. And if your partner has no problem with you being there, then it is fine.

 

But you are not married either, correct?

 

 

 

The fallacy here is that until one has put him or herself into the fire, he or she cannot know if he or she will be able to get as close as possible without being burned.

 

Is it wiser to test your limits or is it wiser to stay away knowing that the danger is there?

 

And while I respect that you know your strength, I say with kindness...thus far, you have not given into temptation. This far, you have not been burned.

 

It is easy to say no to temptation when our relationship is strong and healthy. It is when we are at odds with our partner that getting too close to the fire is even more dangerous.

 

I don't have the correct answer for you, but if I was in your shoes (as I can only go by my experiences), then if I desired to keep my relationship strong I would do everything in my power to stay as far away as possible from anything that could weaken it.

 

Having said that, if the two of you are mutually relaxed with the other going out to clubs with friends, then there should be no concern from either one of you.

 

The question becomes...which is more important...the clubs or the relationship?

 

Well for me and my relationship at least, i've been clubbing when my relationship hasn't been strong. I've actually been to MALIA when my relationship was not strong. But did I do anything? No. I just couldn't. For me at least being faithful is something I am proud of. To think of myself as a faithful person makes me feel good about myself. To know I am capable and responsible in part for a persons care, well-being, happiness and have been honoured to be given their trust with no guarantees, makes me feel really important - so I could not dash what someone has entrusted with me. He could cheat on me and it would hurt me like hell, but I would feel happy at least to know that *I* CAN be faithful and trustworthy. If I cheated I think that would hurt me more than if I was cheated on, because it means i've not only failed that person, but i've failed myself, because that's not the person that I want to be and not the person I believe I am. Though i've not cheated, i've hurt my partner in the past, and the guilt of that alone is too much.

 

I do understand about staying away from things that can weaken relationships...but I think it's quite difficult. I could stay away from clubs for long periods at a time. My boyfriend at the moment quite enjoys it. Of course, I give him my trust...I don't know if he's abusing it. But so long as I am being trustworthy, then whatever he does can't hurt me all that much. I wouldn't tolerate being cheated on...but i'd sooner take that than be the 'bad guy'. For instance in my group of friends many of them have boyfriends/girlfriends and go away on holidays to places like Zante and Malia. That for them is part of living there life. It may be improper if you are in a relationship and who knows what they will really do once they are out there but it's a hard balance between loving someone, and allowing them to do what they want WHILST trusting them.

 

Supposedly if you have trust, you could send that person into a room with 100 naked men./women and trust they would do nothing! But is it that easy?

[jwi71]

Well okay. In my case I am 19...clubbing is a massive teenage thing and you're going to go for one reason or another; for a night out, a birthday etc. Because a club is a place of temptation, should you avoid going BECAUSE it is a place of temptation? Or should you still go and just be aware of that temptation? I've been clubbing, been drunk and NEVER cheated, never done anything, so I KNOW I could go and not 'give in' whereas someone who purposely avoids it, doesn't know that for sure.

 

I would highly recommend avoiding places of temptation. For example, I love cheesecake. However, I would end up looking like Fat Albert if ate cheesecake often. As a result I do NOT hang out at the cheesecake factory. No need to test my limits...because all the victories are meaningless once you fail.

 

What do YOU gain? What is the positive (upside) versus what could be lost (downside). It seems that this self-exploration carries more downside risk (pregnancy, disease, lost bf, bad reputation) than any potential gains.

 

And what are you doing drunk at 19?

Oh yeah, the same thing I was doing at 19. Nevermind.

[Nikki Sahagin]

And I agreed that should not be the case; that you should never go certain places because of the fear of cheating.

 

I was saying that my friends and I go to those places wherein temptation lies, and the offers come in, but I don't cheat. One doesn't have to remove all possibility of temptation in order to turn down the offers.

 

Thankyou Donna

[Nikki Sahagin]

I would highly recommend avoiding places of temptation. For example, I love cheesecake. However, I would end up looking like Fat Albert if ate cheesecake often. As a result I do NOT hang out at the cheesecake factory. No need to test my limits...because all the victories are meaningless once you fail.

 

What do YOU gain? What is the positive (upside) versus what could be lost (downside). It seems that this self-exploration carries more downside risk (pregnancy, disease, lost bf, bad reputation) than any potential gains.

 

And what are you doing drunk at 19?

Oh yeah, the same thing I was doing at 19. Nevermind.

 

Oh I don't really get drunk that often. I do it all occassionally. I always have felt older than my years. I don't really enjoy 'teenagery things'. But I accept that my boyfriend does (he is 20).