I told you he's always honest with me....

[2sunny]

 

No matter what I may seem, I probably do it to myself.

I'm actually OK with all this, but then, that's a bit my fault as well isn't it?

 

I tell him , sure, whatever, I don't care if you don't love me, I just care about you like I'd care about any friend, whatever.

 

Huh? What did I do now? I just said I was going to try talking to him to tell him Im sick of all of this.....that's good, isnt it? Before I couldnt even fathom saying that to him for fear he'd run off, and now Im almost pushing myself to just tell him what I hate about the situation and tell him I cant do it anymore.

 

disrespecting self and then saying you should be ok with him doing it to? pffffftttt

 

and i never read where you said you were going to talk to him. talk to him about WHAT?

 

to give him the green light to continue treating you like dirt?

 

or to actually grow some huevos and tell him to take a flying leap?

 

it's too frustrating KG. i don't think you'll end it when that is the thing you need to do most.

 

all these posts and you haven't taken action on being in a healthier state of mind at all.

[Die Hard]

And I know you think I'm being mean but I'm not. I wish I could snap my fingers and make this go away for you and I DO NOT enjoy reading this stuff and seeing what it's doing to you. Then again, I've been there and I know all too well that you are going to do what you are going to do.

 

Just remember one thing: This worrying about this MM is a luxury of life that comes when not much else is wrong in ones life. God forbid you still have this going on when REAL stuff happens in your life like a loved one getting a disease or someone close dying. There are SO many issues in life, love affairs seem SO ...petty to me now. Worrying about this affair will not ALWAYS be a luxury you will have. PLEASE remember that as well and try and get your head together before it's too late.

[KismetGirl]

Yeah go have another talk Kismet. That will fix things.

 

He could flat out tell you he doesn't love you and you'll convince yourself he does. What's another talk going to do to help you? I know it will boost his ego yet again, but what's it going to do for you? I'll answer: nothing.

 

Not trying to be mean but I don't believe you when I read post #147.

 

Well it doesnt make sense to not believe me now does it. When I don't say positive things, you tell me Im a lost cause. When I finally say something positive after months of agonizing, you tell me I'm lying, when I have no reason to lie to people I don't even know and have no idea who I am.

 

Does that make any sense to you?

 

And yes, I am the kind of person that needs to talk. I can't just sit here and hope he never calls again, and then if he calls again, just tell him to f**k off without saying anything else. I've tried and it doesnt work for me. I need to get everything off my chest, that's the kind of person I am. I hope by letting him know everything he realizes what he's doing. Otherwise, I just sit here going crazy thinking I left so many things unsaid. And he won't tell me he loves me if he doesn't. He hasn't said it yet to appease me, has he? I think in a small way, if I ended things, he'd almost be relieved that I made the decision for him.

[KismetGirl]

disrespecting self and then saying you should be ok with him doing it to? pffffftttt

 

and i never read where you said you were going to talk to him. talk to him about WHAT?

 

to give him the green light to continue treating you like dirt?

 

or to actually grow some huevos and tell him to take a flying leap?

 

it's too frustrating KG. i don't think you'll end it when that is the thing you need to do most.

 

all these posts and you haven't taken action on being in a healthier state of mind at all.

 

You took part of that quote out of context....I said " Granted, he may be deluding himself by believing I'm actually OK with all this, but then, that's a bit my fault as well isn't it? I tell him , sure, whatever, I don't care if you don't love me, I just care about you like I'd care about any friend, whatever. I brush it off, try to keep things light. He may use what I say as an excuse, I guess, though he should probably know better by now that whatever a woman says is the opposite of what she means"

 

Meaning, Im NOT totally honest with him in how I feel. I let him think Im OK with how this is all going and I think he lets himself believe that I am OK with it, when he's smart enough to know that this all bothers me.

 

So basically, I wanted to finally tell him I'm NOT ok with all this. That it hurts me. That I don't want to be in this position anymore. That I lied when I said the part when I said I loved him was trivial and he should just brush it off. That if his marriage is so great then he should focus on that instead of me. I can't comb through all the posts to find where I said it, but it's been recently said....

[Billie63]

I don't think he entered into his marriage with the sole intent of staying here, I just think that situation caused him to rush into a marriage faster than he might have. He does love her, for all intensive purposes, it's not like she's just a baby=making, green-card vessel. I just think , ya know, that that love is geared more towards "love of mother of my child and a good friend" than love of a true romantic and life partner. .

 

Kismet please try and wise up about this man - stop being so naive. In one breath you say he told you/his friend told you that he married her because she was comfortable and in the next breath you say you don't believe he married her for convenience purposes.

 

Look, the man was no spring chicken when he married, he'd been around a bit - he knew the difference between being knocked off your feet by someone and caring about someone. You can't have it both ways.

 

He was not in love with her when he married her. Young men with looks, intelligence, good jobs, wit etc as he had, do not marry the first woman that comes along because they think it's time to marry. Not in this day and age.

 

Maybe you don't want to face up to that side of him - the cold side of him that basically used her for his own self interest. I can assure you that's what he did.

[Die Hard]

Well it doesnt make sense to not believe me now does it. When I don't say positive things, you tell me Im a lost cause. When I finally say something positive after months of agonizing, you tell me I'm lying, when I have no reason to lie to people I don't even know and have no idea who I am.

 

Does that make any sense to you?

 

And yes, I am the kind of person that needs to talk. I can't just sit here and hope he never calls again, and then if he calls again, just tell him to f**k off without saying anything else. I've tried and it doesnt work for me. I need to get everything off my chest, that's the kind of person I am. I hope by letting him know everything he realizes what he's doing. Otherwise, I just sit here going crazy thinking I left so many things unsaid. And he won't tell me he loves me if he doesn't. He hasn't said it yet to appease me, has he? I think in a small way, if I ended things, he'd almost be relieved that I made the decision for him.

Oh it makes perfect sense. I'm the same way. Have to talk it all out, get all the answers because the questions roll around and around in my head until I get so stressed that I have to know the answers/facts.

 

Kismet, ALL people are this way! No one likes to NOT get things off their chest! No one likes being in the dark regarding feelings and the future with someone they love!

 

It's just all rationalizations Kis. You can keep telling yourself that you're different, and that you must interact with this man, but I know it's not true.

[KismetGirl]

Kismet please try and wise up about this man - stop being so naive. In one breath you say he told you/his friend told you that he married her because she was comfortable and in the next breath you say you don't believe he married her for convenience purposes.

 

Look, the man was no spring chicken when he married, he'd been around a bit - he knew the difference between being knocked off your feet by someone and caring about someone. You can't have it both ways.

 

He was not in love with her when he married her. Young men with looks, intelligence, good jobs, wit etc as he had, do not marry the first woman that comes along because they think it's time to marry. Not in this day and age.

 

Maybe you don't want to face up to that side of him - the cold side of him that basically used her for his own self interest. I can assure you that's what he did.

 

Well I guess that is hard to think about him. Makes my head swirl, really. He just never seemed very....calculating, I guess? Its so hard to believe that someone gets married and has kids with someone they dont love, but I guess it's true. It's just sad. I think he was 26 when he got married, which seems young to me to rush into a marriage yes, that is true, especially for a guy....guess I was trying to chalk it up to sheer idiocy on his part for rushing things and making himself think that "comfortable"=marriage material.

[Die Hard]

And just for the record, I was a doormat, and pathetic little man when I was with the MW I was seeing. I'm no better than you(worse in some ways).

 

I just have the experience to know what it is you're doing and am saying so. Not to hurt you but to be straight with you. These are the types of posts that helped me so I make them here now when I can.

 

Believe me, I'd rather snap my fingers and make this go away for you instead of making these posts but these posts are the only way I can even try and help you, or rather give back for the help I got. Hopefully someday that's why you'll be here.

[2sunny]

You took part of that quote out of context....I said " Granted, he may be deluding himself by believing I'm actually OK with all this, but then, that's a bit my fault as well isn't it? I tell him , sure, whatever, I don't care if you don't love me, I just care about you like I'd care about any friend, whatever. I brush it off, try to keep things light. He may use what I say as an excuse, I guess, though he should probably know better by now that whatever a woman says is the opposite of what she means"

 

Meaning, Im NOT totally honest with him in how I feel. I let him think Im OK with how this is all going and I think he lets himself believe that I am OK with it, when he's smart enough to know that this all bothers me.

 

So basically, I wanted to finally tell him I'm NOT ok with all this. That it hurts me. That I don't want to be in this position anymore. That I lied when I said the part when I said I loved him was trivial and he should just brush it off. That if his marriage is so great then he should focus on that instead of me. I can't comb through all the posts to find where I said it, but it's been recently said....

 

and this is why i'm out!!!!!!

 

all of your posts read just like this BLAH BLAH BLAH, here's my excuses - blah blah blah, i did not, blah blah blah, maybe i should, blah blah blah, let me defend him, blah blah blah.

 

do it and be happy - or don't and stay in your own misery. the choice SHOULD BE YOURS!!!! but you continue to give HIM all your power!!! grrrrrr

 

now, i'm out.

[Die Hard]

and this is why i'm out!!!!!!

 

all of your posts read just like this BLAH BLAH BLAH, here's my excuses - blah blah blah, i did not, blah blah blah, maybe i should, blah blah blah, let me defend him, blah blah blah.

 

do it and be happy - or don't and stay in your own misery. the choice SHOULD BE YOURS!!!! but you continue to give HIM all your power!!! grrrrrr

 

now, i'm out.

Okay this gets the award for best post of thread. See, the best posts come from just rolling off the tongue, rather than thinking it out. Love it!

[Billie63]

Well I guess that is hard to think about him. Makes my head swirl, really. He just never seemed very....calculating, I guess? Its so hard to believe that someone gets married and has kids with someone they dont love, but I guess it's true. It's just sad. I think he was 26 when he got married, which seems young to me to rush into a marriage yes, that is true, especially for a guy....guess I was trying to chalk it up to sheer idiocy on his part for rushing things and making himself think that "comfortable"=marriage material.

 

There's no reason why you should have seen his calculating side. Yes you've known him for 4 years but that's not day in, day out. YOu have a strong bond yes, but it's not like you've been privvy to his day to day thoughts is it? You are only a very small part of his life.

 

Yes 26 was young to get married, but it's not uncommon, he wasn't a 19 year old virgin. The fact he got married so young when he had all these attractive attributes confirms to me his reasons for marrying her.

 

It makes him more attractive to think of him as a Hugh Grant type who fell into his marriage due to idiocy. Come on, really think about it.

 

Many marriages around the world are based on respect (ie arranged marriages) and they are successful because the love comes after the marriage. Maybe your MM thought this would happen, maybe he put his all in the early days to make the marriage work. But it takes two people to do this and maybe she started to work out what happened or maybe she has her faults as well.

 

And maybe because she wasn't looking at him with stars in her eyes and jumping all over his bones, he thought he was entitled to something with you - not just sex but excitement.

[NoIDidn't]

I've been where she's at and know what she's doing. She can't be with this guy, and this forum and this thread are a fix for the addiction. People in her life(even if she wont admit it) are tired of hearing about this guy. Her family is tired. Her friends are tired. Nobody wants to hear it anymore so she(as did I) comes here and goes on and on and on with the same posts over and over and over. Well I never posted during mine but I read it all the time obsessively.

 

Hell I was only in mine a year and my family and friends were tired of hearing about my angst, it I can only imagine what her friends and family think.

 

Unless this thing ends against her will, she's screwed for life. She's not going to do it no-matter what people here post. Like I said, this thread is for feeding her addiction, not getting out of the affair and getting her life back.

 

Notice how she keeps writing novels for posts that say the same thing over and over? Addiction. Obsession.

 

You make a good point about this thread feeding her obsession and the addiction.

 

The longer we listen to her going on and on about the whys and whatnots of him and what is going on in his marriage, the longer WE ALLOW her to continue in this state.

 

EVERYONE STOP POSTING!

 

That should do it.

[Billie63]

You make a good point about this thread feeding her obsession and the addiction.

 

The longer we listen to her going on and on about the whys and whatnots of him and what is going on in his marriage, the longer WE ALLOW her to continue in this state.

 

EVERYONE STOP POSTING!

 

That should do it.

 

Well I won't stop posting and I won't be told when and who to post to. If you are frustrated by kismet then simply back off. But pack mentality doesn't go down too well here. I think I'm quite capable of making my own mind up about who I post to.

[Die Hard]

Well I won't stop posting and I won't be told when and who to post to. If you are frustrated by kismet then simply back off. But pack mentality doesn't go down too well here. I think I'm quite capable of making my own mind up about who I post to.

Lighten up Francis...

[Billie63]

I'm very relaxed thank you.

[Die Hard]

I'm very relaxed thank you.

If you were relaxed you would have known noididnt was kidding. As if anyone here ever shuts up or stops posting.:+)

[KismetGirl]

You make a good point about this thread feeding her obsession and the addiction.

 

The longer we listen to her going on and on about the whys and whatnots of him and what is going on in his marriage, the longer WE ALLOW her to continue in this state.

 

EVERYONE STOP POSTING!

 

That should do it.

 

You know....that isn't very fair. I've only been here a few months and people are acting like just because people say alot to me I should have just figured it all out by now and magically done everything I'm supposed to do. Four years is a long time to be embedded in something. The fact that Im even contemplating telling him I can't do this anymore should be some indication this board has been helping me. Several months ago I couldn't even think about doing that. Several months ago I was afraid to ask him about his marriage for fear I'd hear things I didn't want to hear. I'm hearing them now, and I need to talk about it to process it. Just because I argue and look at all sides of things, doesn't mean youre "feeding my addiction". Is it so bad that I want to believe that he cares about me? That doesn't mean I don't know this situation is bad for me, or that I reasonably believe he would ever leave his marriage. He doesn't sit and tell me he's going to get a D, he doesn't tell me he's madly in love with me. I don't threaten to leave him and he starts making up lies to keep me around. I have alot of other stress in my life that I don't put up on this board. My "love affair" as Die Hard put it, is not the only thing in my life that stresses me. One of my best friends died late last year in a car accident. I struggle to pay for things because I've been on medical leave from work for reasons I don't feel like discussing and it's severely reduced my income. Im the eldest "child" in my whole family, cousins included, and Im constantly expected to help everyone and everything and it's tiring. I wake up at the crack of dawn to go to work on days that I don't feel too sick to get out of bed, and do all this and still have to try to fathom mental energy to memorize mass amounts of info for the MCAT. Give me a freaking break if I'm unable to so easily snap my fingers and jump out of this relationship after four years. OF COURSE I argue and try to find positive things in it. What person wants to think they wasted four years loving someone who could care less if they existed? I'm an intelligent person and I look at every side of everything. And to correct someone previously, no, my friends and family are not sick of hearing about it. In fact, I try not to talk about it to them because I figure they would be sick of it, and THEY bring it up because they know me and they know if I just sit and fester in my own head it sucks. When people love you, they'll listen to you as long as you need them to. I do it for other people all the time.

 

So if you don't want to post to me anymore, fine. Your help so far is otherwise appreciated, and Im sorry for wasting your time. But this DOES help me. It helps me maintain some semblence of sanity when I otherwise feel like I might have just lost it. When I wanted so badly to call him on friday when he left me a message to say he missed me, I came on here and spent hours "arguing" and talking to people, because it helped me to not call him back because I don't want to talk to him until I get my head straight, because if I try to do it without preparing myself I'll get lost in my affections for him like i always do and I am TRYING to hold onto some strength, because when it comes to him, I've had trouble being strong. Im sorry if I dont move forward at the pace you want me to, but Im slowly getting there. To even acknowledge that I have problems with this, and that I want to tell him I can't do this anymore is an amazing step for me, Im sorry if it doesnt seem like much to you. Like I said, I probably won't be able to talk to him this week, but when I see him next time I do want to finally tell him I can't take this anymore.

 

So please, to tell everyone else to just ignore me now, because I don't just roll over when someone scolds me for not moving as fast as as they want me to is just not nice and not fair at all. It really isn't. it's bordering on cruel. This wasn't some three month love affair where I was some silly 22 year old girl with a daddy-complex who is being manipulated by some 50 year old man who wanted some kicks and was bored. It's a legitimate, emotional situation, one that has confused me tremendously, and I am trying my damndest after four years to make the effort to do the right thing. It doesnt happen over night....you act like I've been posting here for two years and have made no progress..... :-(

[KismetGirl]

If you were relaxed you would have known noididnt was kidding. As if anyone here ever shuts up or stops posting.:+)

 

Didn't sound like kidding to me. Humour doesn't transmit well over the internet....people shoudl watch what they say sometimes. That really upset me.

[NoIDidn't]

"pack mentality"

 

Surely you jest, Billie.

 

I am well aware of the fact that I can't tell anyone what to do on this forum or any others.

 

It wasn't a joke, though.

 

If it would help, I will do it. I care very much about what happens to Kismet, more than she seems to, in fact. So....

 

Sorry if you disagree.

[Billie63]

If you were relaxed you would have known noididnt was kidding. As if anyone here ever shuts up or stops posting.:+)

 

Nowhere in noididn't's post is there any sign he/she was kidding. Use of smilies etc usually denote this. I'm not a mind reader and I take what people write here literally unless they use signs to denote sarcasm etc.

 

As I said before, I'm perfectly relaxed, I just don't like being encouraged to ignore someone when I have no intention of doing so.

 

As kismet says, it's unnecessarily cruel.

[Billie63]

"pack mentality"

 

Surely you jest, Billie.

 

I am well aware of the fact that I can't tell anyone what to do on this forum or any others.

 

It wasn't a joke, though.

 

If it would help, I will do it. I care very much about what happens to Kismet, more than she seems to, in fact. So....

 

Sorry if you disagree.

 

Telling posters to ignore kismet because you believe we are enabling her is, in my opinion Pack Mentality - No I do not jest.

 

You may certainly mean well but just because you believe we're enabling her, doesn't believe the rest of us agree with you.

 

As Kismet says, the months she's been on the site has helped her start to see things a bit more realistically - yes I wish it had been sooner but it's not my life, is it?

[Die Hard]

Well if that was not a joke it's about the most naive thing I've seen written here. And that's saying something.

 

Jesus you had to know people would post just to discuss your telling them not to post!

 

I don't agree with your premise then. People should still try, but I think they should be brutally honest. Simply asking that folks ignore her isn't going to help.

[boldjack]

KG, many of the posters here don't appreciate the damage that this has done to you. Believe me, I do, I've seen it in women I've dated in the past. Without being with you and seeing what you deal with, they are trying (mostly) in good faith to help. That's the limitations of forums. I wish deeply that I could be of more help.

[norajane]

KG, many of the posters here don't appreciate the damage that this has done to you. Believe me, I do, I've seen it in women I've dated in the past. Without being with you and seeing what you deal with, they are trying (mostly) in good faith to help. That's the limitations of forums. I wish deeply that I could be of more help.

 

Actually, a lot of the posters DO know the damage, first hand and up close, because they've been there. And they're trying to tell her it only gets worse the longer you go on, because the longer you stay in it, the deeper you feel for him, the greater your loss of self, and the greater your loss of self-esteem which contributes to the feeling of helplessness and impotence and inability to act.

 

4 years ago, I'll bet she felt a hell of a lot better about herself and her life than she does now. 4 years ago, I'll bet she had a hell of a lot more hope for her future and the love she'd find. 4 years ago, I'll bet her dreams for her life were a hell of a lot more exciting and fulfilling, and she was looking forward to working toward them rather than slogging toward them the way she is now. And 4 years ago, I'll bet she slept a lot better, ate better, and felt healthier and more at peace.

 

If she does nothing, she just mires herself deeper in the mud. Like quicksand.

 

So that's why we are so adamant that she take control of her life NOW and of herself NOW and get out of the mud NOW so she can eventually heal and feel a passion for LIVING again, rather than this half-life she's got now.

[jj33]

??? Shes been in this for 4 years. Id be either hospitalised (mental unit) or in jail (having killed him) if I was in the A for 4 years. Half kidding.

 

Its not surprising that after 4 years of being the OW that there hasnt been an epiphany oh right must get out now. Some people have an epiphany, for others it takes time to process.

 

So what if she is venting? Isnt that one of the purposes of the board? And for many people, isnt that part of the process? You vent until you get bored of hearing yourself say the same thing and hit rock bottom with the misery of the roller coaster.

 

Hopefully being supportive (tough love or otherwise) helps KG and those lurking on the boards.