Doomed to a Solitary Life

[purgatori]

is that you in the avatar, you're a cool looking sharp guy, and by the way doll house is worth watching in my opinion its entertaining. Anyways please cheer up while your writing is very thoughtful and even your pain is entertaining I think you've misjudged the situation and will find a women who you are into and that is into you. I would never want to be a woman over being a man but I myself am not your typical sports watching beer drinking man. For a long time I was really horible with women I mean a girl could have literaly jumped on me naked screaming take me now and I would have ran away and then later told the story to my friends and said I wonder if she liked me or something maybe she thought it was funny... any ways my point is I had low self esteem I would literaly freeze up and could barely move or speak... any ways one day I got the feeling a girl liked me so I just built up the courage to ask her on a date... well I wasn't even sure it was a date I kept gettin worried the girl would show up to dinner with her mother or something... well I had never really drank in my life but at this point I was getting pretty old and had zero experience with women so after the dinner i suggested we go to a bar and I started drinking alcohol which I never used to do and I started acting stupid and my date said I was mean and after she said I was mean I just kissed her and it was like my first real kiss and then we started making out and it got physical... and a few weeks later and a few drinks later I was sleeping with that girl. Now I don't really drink much alcohol any more but it was like after I got past that physical barrier with that one girl and realised hey I am a guy who can kiss girls and be romantic with girls I gained alot of confidence and I was heart broken when things didn't work out with that girl but I got a new gf and when that gf and i ended I got a new gf and I'm currently in a relationship heck I even got to date a girl who reminded me alot of SMG so my point is just break that physical barrier with a girl that you are into and you'll gain so much confidence. remember you have to risk being rejected and girls date guys of all types

 

Thanks for the words of encouragement -- And yes, that is me in my avatar. Sometimes I do wonder if I have misjudged my situation, particularly when I reflect on earlier heterosocial situations -- and other times, the odds seem truly insurmountable. Without "putting [myself] out there", as so many people have urged me to do, I guess I won't really no for sure... it's just difficult to conquer both the certainty that I will be rejected, and the fear of rejection itself.

 

You are a man, trapped in a woman's body~ interested in women, but not interested in a sex change. You're happy with your penis~ You feel like a woman with a penis..?

 

So.... You're not a lesbian nor are you trans-gendered troubled... You're simply a guy who feels a lot like a woman but happens to have a penis that you like and want to keep.

 

If anything, I am a woman trapped in a man's body. I'm not particularly attached to that wretched thing between my legs, but going to the pain and trouble of removing it doesn't seem worth the trouble, since doing so will not make me a woman.

 

Are you concerned that you feel you don't fit into a catagory or something?

 

Yes, but only because it would make it easier to access information, support groups, or whatever. I have done a bit of research, but the closest groups I found were the self-described "involuntarily celibate", and "love-shys", but since the first group mainly seems upset about not having lost their virginity (something I couldn't care less about), and the second group are by-and-large angry at women, and seem to think that they are obligated to sleep with them/become romantically involved with them, I don't really relate to either.

 

Just make sure you are not gay before embarking on the journey of living this life. I mean this sincerely. You don't want to hurt others while you figure this out.

 

Not even an issue.

 

What is your friend support network like?

 

Not good

 

Honestly, if you were my friend and you told me this- I wouldn't bat an eye... I wouldn't care. Surround yourself with people that support you, and learn to love being somewhat unique.

 

I do love being somewhat unique I mean, I would rather be a woman, but I wouldn't choose to be another type of man. The only problem is that being who I am means that the majority of women simply aren't interested, and thus, I am alone.

[ianandris]

This, bro:

 

"Am I even trying...? No, not really, I have to admit. "

 

Not trying to be crass, but if you've got **** on your hands and you don't really make an effort to wipe it off, does it make a lot of sense to be moaning that your hands are dirty?

 

Until you change that, reason your way into being okay with it (you can if you choose to.), you're never going to have what you're looking for.

 

With relationships, you can only learn by doing.

[Green]

This, bro:

 

"Am I even trying...? No, not really, I have to admit. "

 

Not trying to be crass, but if you've got **** on your hands and you don't really make an effort to wipe it off, does it make a lot of sense to be moaning that your hands are dirty?

 

Until you change that, reason your way into being okay with it (you can if you choose to.), you're never going to have what you're looking for.

 

With relationships, you can only learn by doing.

 

and I think the fact that he doesn't try is his problem and he will learn if he puts himself out there and gets rejected. The fact that he is so unique is the excuse he uses not to try and it is a valid excuse to brace himself for rejection but he will find a girl or atleast girls who will be his friend and that is a start.

[ianandris]

Amen, Green. That's basically what I was trying to say.

[yongyong]

theattractionforums.com

they will give you advice on your style, confidence, social anxiety etc.

no date till 27? you seem like a guy with nothing to lose. try anything

[Els]

This, bro:

 

"Am I even trying...? No, not really, I have to admit. "

 

Not trying to be crass, but if you've got **** on your hands and you don't really make an effort to wipe it off, does it make a lot of sense to be moaning that your hands are dirty?

 

Until you change that, reason your way into being okay with it (you can if you choose to.), you're never going to have what you're looking for.

 

With relationships, you can only learn by doing.

 

You don't get it. He does not have shyt on his hands. He is different, doesn't fit into the typical male stereotype, and wants to find someone who accepts him for who he is instead of needing to change his most basic identity and personality just so he can get a girl. It's not the same as moaning about shyt on your hands.

[purgatori]

theattractionforums.com

they will give you advice on your style, confidence, social anxiety etc.

no date till 27? you seem like a guy with nothing to lose. try anything

 

No. The idea of me, as a guy, using all these tricks/techniques/whatever to attract women sickens me. I tried maintaining a positive attitude, and to look past my dislike of the male sex, but I can't keep it up. Even going through heterosexual scenarios as a mental exercise turns my stomach, so it's just pointless... Increasingly, I don't even like straight women, so to hell with it all.

[Adele.]

I cannot stand men, or even the quality of 'masculinity', it repulses me, and the fact that women are attracted to them and to it is hard enough for me to stomach, let-alone comprehend...

 

This is the nature of procreation. You know why pea cocks have bright blue feathers and are required to perform flashy displays during mating season? That is because the deftly camouflaged, mouse-brown pea hens will only mate with the brightest, flashiest male out there, thus perpetuating the desired physical traits.

 

Women like manly-men because of subliminal biological messages. We are not that far removed from when we were a civilization of hunters and gatherers. The evolution of technology is much more rapid then the evolution of the human species.

[purgatori]

This is the nature of procreation. You know why pea cocks have bright blue feathers and are required to perform flashy displays during mating season? That is because the deftly camouflaged, mouse-brown pea hens will only mate with the brightest, flashiest male out there, thus perpetuating the desired physical traits.

 

Women like manly-men because of subliminal biological messages. We are not that far removed from when we were a civilization of hunters and gatherers. The evolution of technology is much more rapid then the evolution of the human species.

 

Oh yes, I understand it on a biological/evolutionary level, certainly. To reduce, though, any human behavior exclusively to this level and to ignore the influence of the environment always leads to an impoverished, or even misleading picture of the behavior in question. The behavior that would make the most sense for men to engage in, in terms of strictly following a genetic imperative, for example, would be to donate sperm to an IVF clinic, and thus propagating their genetic material at a much better ratio of time and energy expenditure/offspring than could be achieved by sleeping with individual women. Nonetheless, most men when offered a choice between donating sperm and sleeping with a woman, even if doing so meant that they had to wear some form of protection which would eliminate any chance of fertilization during intercourse, would still choose to sleep with the woman.

 

Not that any of this actually contradicts your point; I merely wish to establish that there are additional layers/influences which intervene in various ways during the performance of any complex (pattern of) behavior, and point out that the sum of these influences can prove to be quite complex and difficult to "unpack" in any given instance, and that many of them might actually be in conflict such that the outcome might not be what one expects when operating from a rigidly deterministic viewpoint. Even if one could determine the precise cluster of factors which lead to a given attitude, preference, inclination, behavior, etc. etc. this would in no way guarantee that, on an experiential level, one would still have no idea of what it was actually like. It is this level of the female attraction to men that I am at a loss to comprehend. In my world, women (at least some women), are "fair", and men are "foul", so although I possess the fact of female attraction to men as a unit of knowledge, I cannot imagine what that would be like; and the reverse of this, the lack of attraction to women, probably makes even less sense to me, and upsets me just as much, if not more.

 

Contemplating the biological underpinnings of female attraction to men has been something I have frequently engaged in in an effort to rationalize away my distress, but it simply has not worked for any length of time. When confronted by the phenomena itself, whatever cognitive infrastructure I attempt to put in place in order to make myself "ok" with it, simply crumbles and I end up back at square one, more bitter and defeated than before -- as demonstrated by my last post.

[jasminetea]

People in general would probably like you more if you were not such an unhinged bigot. Women tend not to like people with incredibly prejudicial worldviews. They see how irrationally and irresponsibly you judge the members of your sex and wonder about how harshly you judge them in secret. They know that you hold a simmering contempt for their hardwired attraction to men. As smart as you obviously are, you must know that, you just haven't accepted it.

 

It is interesting to look at you, across the gulf that separates our personalities. You would feel an incandescent hatred toward me if I was in your life, but because when you judge men you get hung up in ideological last-stands in your mind. Cute. I think you just feel the natural resentment of the evolutionarily unfit towards their biological superiors. That is the saddest situation of all- to hate someone so intensely, when they barely even care that you exist.

 

In short, you will never solve your myriad problems with women if you don't solve your problems with men. So swallow your pride, or be OK with dying alone and unremembered. Cheers!

 

I agree with this post.

 

OP - you don't just have sexist views, you also have a pretension that is pretty repellent too. Maybe if you lost your current attitude towards other men and yourself, you'd become that much more appealing to the women you'd like to attract.

[purgatori]

I agree with this post.

 

OP - you don't just have sexist views, you also have a pretension that is pretty repellent too. Maybe if you lost your current attitude towards other men and yourself, you'd become that much more appealing to the women you'd like to attract.

 

If you assent to all of the items in the post you quoted, then you would have to believe that modifying my attitude would not make a bit of difference in relation to attracting women, given that the fundamental problem is that I am outclassed by my "biological superiors"; which apparently also accounts for my "resentment", in that said resentment is a natural and unavoidable consequence of being "unfit." On top of that I'm now also pretentious to a "repellent" degree, so things really do look grim. But if I work at it really hard, and learn to grovel at the feet of the patriarchy, and accept all their male chauvinistic precepts, and cheer the "studs" on from the sidelines during their various "conquests", then perhaps... perhaps, I just might be able to earn the occasional pat on the head from some lovely creature, to whom I will entreat "Thankyou kind lady, but do not let me detain you for you must rush home to your rippling Adonis and tend to the preparation of his meal, and the sating of his loins; for by now he grows impatient and restless with the yearning to plow your weak, womanly frame and put you in your place."

 

As wonderful as all of that sounds, I think I'll pass.

[jasminetea]

If you assent to all of the items in the post you quoted, then you would have to believe that modifying my attitude would not make a bit of difference in relation to attracting women, given that the fundamental problem is that I am outclassed by my "biological superiors";

Only in attitude.

which apparently also accounts for my "resentment", in that said resentment is a natural and unavoidable consequence of being "unfit."

Unfit mentally and emotionally.

On top of that I'm now also pretentious to a "repellent" degree, so things really do look grim.

Not to worry you've stated you're going off straight women too, so you're not missing much by your standards.

But if I work at it really hard, and learn to grovel at the feet of the patriarchy, and accept all their male chauvinistic precepts, and cheer the "studs" on from the sidelines during their various "conquests", then perhaps... perhaps, I just might be able to earn the occasional pat on the head from some lovely creature, to whom I will entreat "Thankyou kind lady, but do not let me detain you for you must rush home to your rippling Adonis and tend to the preparation of his meal, and the sating of his loins; for by now he grows impatient and restless with the yearning to plow your weak, womanly frame and put you in your place."

 

As wonderful as all of that sounds, I think I'll pass.

 

You just don't have a clue about relationships, and not only that, you are convinced you are superior.

 

I have a friend who is in a similar situation to yourself. His feminine side is far stronger than his male side and, like you, feels absolutely no connection or familiarity with other men.

 

Also, like you, his perceptions of what women are and what he would like them to be, have very little in common with reality. Fortunately though, unlike you, he's able to see that not only is he living a fantasy, but that there is no 'wrong' or 'right' in either the way he is or in the way the rest of society is. He doesn't have the sense of entitlement that you have portrayed.

[purgatori]

Only in attitude.

 

The post, which you claimed to agree with, used the term "superior" in a specifically biological/evolutionary context.

 

Unfit mentally and emotionally.

 

Once again, the context was evolutionary fitness.

 

You just don't have a clue about relationships, and not only that, you are convinced you are superior.

 

Ok, so before I had a bad attitude regarding other males and myself, but now I believe that I'm superior. At least keep try to maintain some consistency in your character assassination.

 

Not to worry you've stated you're going off straight women too, so you're not missing much by your standards.

 

And by your standards to an even greater extent.

 

Also, like you, his perceptions of what women are and what he would like them to be, have very little in common with reality. Fortunately though, unlike you, he's able to see that not only is he living a fantasy, but that there is no 'wrong' or 'right' in either the way he is or in the way the rest of society is. He doesn't have the sense of entitlement that you have portrayed.

 

What one would like women to be is almost implies engaging in fantasy, and I freely admit that I do that, all the time. In my fantasies, women are not the chew-toys of brutes, but rather, strong, emancipated, and exclusively sapphophilic. Such fantasies are a refuge from contemplating what (straight) women are, or at least that masochistic part of them that drives them into the arms of some debasing nimrod. The difference between real women and the ones of my fantasies, is the difference between the vision of a whale swimming in the sea, as opposed to one that beaches itself on the shore. What is it though, that you think I have displayed a sense of entitlement towards?

[jasminetea]

Ok, so before I had a bad attitude regarding other males and myself, but now I believe that I'm superior. At least keep try to maintain some consistency in your character assassination.

I'll do what I like, actually. However, I have been consistent, what do you think pretension is?

 

And by your standards to an even greater extent.

You're assuming. I don't presume to put my standards onto anyone else.

 

What one would like women to be is almost implies engaging in fantasy, and I freely admit that I do that, all the time. In my fantasies, women are not the chew-toys of brutes, but rather, strong, emancipated, and exclusively sapphophilic. Such fantasies are a refuge from contemplating what (straight) women are, or at least that masochistic part of them that drives them into the arms of some debasing nimrod. The difference between real women and the ones of my fantasies, is the difference between the vision of a whale swimming in the sea, as opposed to one that beaches itself on the shore. What is it though, that you think I have displayed a sense of entitlement towards?

Unfortunately for you, your generalisations are not only completely inaccurate, as are most sweeping statements, but they are also another example of your complete lack of understanding of both men and women.

 

You don't adore women, as you asserted in your original post. At best you adore a fantasy, at worst you have secondary narcissism. You certainly have no concept of what a woman really is, never mind adore it.

 

You give the very strong impression that you feel you are far better than any other male who is more masculine than you, and you use very disparaging terms when describing any woman who prefers a male like that. You seem to be saying you are not being appreciated as you feel you deserve - hence your entitlement issue.

 

I can't be arsed reading any more of your what seem to be major delusions so don't bother asking me anything else. Cheers mate.

[purgatori]

I'll do what I like, actually. However, I have been consistent, what do you think pretension is?

 

No, you have not been consistent. I pointed out where you contradicted yourself.

 

You don't adore women, as you asserted in your original post. At best you adore a fantasy, at worst you have secondary narcissism. You certainly have no concept of what a woman really is, never mind adore it.

 

This makes no sense, secondary narcissism refers to the tendency to put one's personal gratification ahead of attainments in the social sphere. And I grew up in a household which, for the majority of my upbringing, consisted only of women -- apart from myself. For that reason alone, I think I have a fairly good understanding of women.

 

You give the very strong impression that you feel you are far better than any other male who is more masculine than you, and you use very disparaging terms when describing any woman who prefers a male like that. You seem to be saying you are not being appreciated as you feel you deserve - hence your entitlement issue.

 

The first part is true to some degree, but I still regard myself as being ****, and undeserving of a woman's attention, much less love. I made that rather clear in several of my previous posts, when I pointed out that I'm not even present in my own fantasies. I get about as much appreciation as I deserve, and sometimes I have received far more than I deserve; however, I would argue that those unfeeling testosterone addled lumps deserve even less. Instead, though, they enjoy an over-abundance of female company/companionship/love/ and are not even capable of appreciating it; that is what raises my ire, but it is far from a sense of entitlement.

 

I can't be arsed reading any more of your what seem to be major delusions so don't bother asking me anything else. Cheers mate.

 

Better luck next time -- try picking an easier target.

[salmagundi]

Wow, I don't know where to begin and in any case its really late here and I really need to sleep.

 

I guess I could start by congratulating you on introducing words like 'heteronormative' and 'atavistic' alongside cogent discussion of "the masculine gaze" to the ol' LS. Seriously you're obviously intelligent to a degree that...well...would make it difficult to fit in with...uhh...to paraphrase...the knuckle dragging brutes red in tooth in claw that frequent the bars and bush parties where you're from.

 

So much the better because if you speak the way you write...uhhh...I dont think you gonna find your dream woman there. I honestly don't want to knock you, in any case, I'm just a lowly epsilon, but your tendentious style makes me think of one of those evil scientists living in some grotto 50 million miles below the sea plotting total destruction to all those who laughed at them and failed to heed their warnings...

 

That sounded flippant, I didnt mean it that way but its late and I'm calling it as I see it.

 

You do an awful lot of projecting. I think thats your principle problem. This dream girl you're looking for, sorry thats not a product of advanced intellect thats a conceit of adolescence. Its a projection you've constructed yourself and now you impose it on women in the real world and wonder why you don't find a match? We all learn to grow out of this. You should too.

 

And I wish I could cite what you said regarding male sexuality but I'm not writing a thesis and I'm not wading back into the last five pages but you said something to the effect of locus of male sexuality being domination of the female or some such thing. Maybe its true but maybe you're projecting again because here, you're passing judgement on a sexual/romantic act of which you, by you're own admission, HAVE NEVER PARTAKEN!

 

Borges wrote a collection of stories called Labyrinths. You've probably already read it. No problem, go find the storie called "The Library at....(**** i dont remember, i did say its late here." Then re-read your writing and reflect on how sterile this logical ordered and well argumented world you've constructed for yourself is a poor guide to life when compared to real experience.

 

You cannot reduce people to abstractions to be condemned as 'brutish' 'domineering' etc. simply because so doing properly aligns the structures of this narcisstic ideology of yours in a way that is self gratifying, or at the very least will permit you to continue living at 37 like you are now.

 

Again, I do not want to be harsh, I'm merely trying to offer my perspective, however truncated it is because you seem to me to be headed towards a kind of herman hesse like existence as a cloistered ascetic cut off from human life by the force of your own projections

 

Okay, tear into me now, I bet you'll kick my ass...: )

[purgatori]

So much the better because if you speak the way you write...uhhh...I dont think you gonna find your dream woman there.

 

I'm afraid so, but this is the least of my flaws as far as women are concerned.

 

I honestly don't want to knock you, in any case, I'm just a lowly epsilon, but your tendentious style makes me think of one of those evil scientists living in some grotto 50 million miles below the sea plotting total destruction to all those who laughed at them and failed to heed their warnings...

 

If only! Then I'd be engineering my robotic army, or breeding a super-virus that would wipe out anything with a Y chromosome.

 

You do an awful lot of projecting. I think thats your principle problem. This dream girl you're looking for, sorry thats not a product of advanced intellect thats a conceit of adolescence. Its a projection you've constructed yourself and now you impose it on women in the real world and wonder why you don't find a match? We all learn to grow out of this. You should too.

 

To quote myself several pages back:

 

My "requirements", if you interpret them as such, might seem rather strict, but in actual fact they are merely a list of qualities that I envisage in an ideal conception of a potential partner. Someone might differ from what I have outlined, perhaps even to a considerable degree, and yet there might be something about them that just knocks me off my feet; in that case, I'm not going to turn them down simply because they do not satisfy a couple of the items on my checklist. Given that I am not interested in "flings", short-term, or casual relationships and the like, though, I really could not be involved with someone I wasn't completely besotted with. As both an aesthete and a product of evolutionary conditioning, I cannot deny that a woman's physical appearance often plays a powerful part in determining my attraction to her.

 

But whether or not I can find a "match" is largely irrelevant, because I am not so constituted as to win the affection of women to begin with.

 

And I wish I could cite what you said regarding male sexuality but I'm not writing a thesis and I'm not wading back into the last five pages but you said something to the effect of locus of male sexuality being domination of the female or some such thing. Maybe its true but maybe you're projecting again because here, you're passing judgement on a sexual/romantic act of which you, by you're own admission, HAVE NEVER PARTAKEN!

 

You are conflating two different claims -- one about male sexuality, and one about heterosexual intercourse. The latter I have no experience of as you correctly state, but I do have experience of the former, and it is certainly reasonable to deduce that it would be actioned during intercourse. Asserting that I must be "projecting" with regard to male sexuality because I lack first-hand experience of sexual intercourse is, on the other hand, unreasonable.

 

Borges wrote a collection of stories called Labyrinths. You've probably already read it. No problem, go find the storie called "The Library at....(**** i dont remember, i did say its late here." Then re-read your writing and reflect on how sterile this logical ordered and well argumented world you've constructed for yourself is a poor guide to life when compared to real experience.

 

The Library of Babel. Yes, I am familiar with it. Although direct experience is an invaluable teacher in many situations, it can just as often be limited and misleading. One's own experiences may lead one to certain conclusions about various phenomena that, upon repeated examination and testing under various conditions and utilizing different participants, may be shown to have been based on mere coincidence or personal bias, etc.

 

You cannot reduce people to abstractions to be condemned as 'brutish' 'domineering' etc. simply because so doing properly aligns the structures of this narcisstic ideology of yours in a way that is self gratifying, or at the very least will permit you to continue living at 37 like you are now.

 

It is a strange form of "narcissistic" ideology that contains so much self-loathing.

 

Again, I do not want to be harsh, I'm merely trying to offer my perspective, however truncated it is because you seem to me to be headed towards a kind of herman hesse like existence as a cloistered ascetic cut off from human life by the force of your own projections

 

I thank you for sharing your perspective; some features of it certainly resonate with me. Although I obviously don't regard my reading of heterosocial relations as consisting of little more than "projections", it is nevertheless true that it contributes greatly to my reluctance to enter the fray, so to speak. It's ridiculously ****ing complicated but the whole thing is just so aversive to me that the various attempts I have made to modify my cognition and emotional reaction to heterosexual interactions have all failed dismally... in part because no matter how much I try to "prepare" myself beforehand, the weight of scientific evidence, media portrayals, and direct observation do not favor a positive interpretation... at least not for someone like me, who thinks that it is the woman who should be extolled. But it runs much deeper than merely the conscious contents of my mind, because my reaction has always been one of mystification and repulsion.... for the longest time, I couldn't even bring myself to believe that women actually found men attractive in any kind of an active way.

 

But whatever, it's useless discussing any of this further because my situation is what it is.

[ianandris]

You don't get it. He does not have shyt on his hands. He is different, doesn't fit into the typical male stereotype, and wants to find someone who accepts him for who he is instead of needing to change his most basic identity and personality just so he can get a girl. It's not the same as moaning about shyt on your hands.

 

Oh, I get it, Elswyth. It's just that I'm not completely sold that the problem is as intractable as it sounds, is all.

 

It's really easy to reason your way into a cave, and I get the sense that's exactly what purg is doing here. I'm not trying to discount his conflict in any degree, I'm just saying that he's more likely to make progress toward a resolution if he sets aside his intellectualization for a while, forgets himself, and starts trying to spark something up.

 

Tip: if your thoughts are inhibiting you from getting what you want, perhaps you're on the wrong track.

[SpanksTheMonkey]

Your a thinker that I can tell you will always be that way its just your nature if you went questioning this it would be something else and so on.

 

You can either except that side of yourself and learn to put it into proper perspective or let it drive you mad in the end... IMO Theres nothing really wrong with how you are..

[purgatori]

Oh, I get it, Elswyth. It's just that I'm not completely sold that the problem is as intractable as it sounds, is all.

 

It's really easy to reason your way into a cave, and I get the sense that's exactly what purg is doing here. I'm not trying to discount his conflict in any degree, I'm just saying that he's more likely to make progress toward a resolution if he sets aside his intellectualization for a while, forgets himself, and starts trying to spark something up.

 

Tip: if your thoughts are inhibiting you from getting what you want, perhaps you're on the wrong track.

 

You may well be right, to the extent that if I were able to _experience_ love and acceptance from a woman, just the way that I am, I would probably be a far less tortured individual. It is extremely difficult for me to even envision such a scenario... I can say (or in this case, write) the words but I cannot picture such a thing in my head. As stated a number of times previously, when I do fantasize or dream about romantic involvement with a woman, it's no longer me in the fantasy but another woman. However, when I imagine gaining even a little bit of acceptance or fondness from a woman, (one woman in particular), I know that in that moment, in the fantasy, all my preoccupations recede into the background.

 

And yet, I am not so optimistic as to imagine that it is only my thoughts that stand in the way of getting what I want. Rather, it is reality itself which is the chief impediment. It must be clear to anyone who has seen this thread that I am a very deeply flawed person, with very few positive attributes, and really no attributes that appeal to straight or gay women -- I'm not man enough for the one, and I'm not woman enough for the other, I'm nothing. Sure, if my "standards" were not very high then I could probably find someone regardless, but the thing is they are, and the type of woman that I would be interested in would have her pick of men and/or women so why on earth would she be at all interested in an unsightly neurotic sissy like me, except as an object of pity?

 

Now just to be clear, there are things that I like about myself, and I appreciate that you don't think there's anything really wrong with me, SpanksTheMonkey, but I don't think many other people would agree, especially when it comes to eligibility for a relationship.

[griffy]

While you probably do think about things too much and while you may have emotional issues that require the help of a professional, I think a lot of your problems stem from your lack of self-esteem and self-confidence.

 

Do you love yourself, the way you are? Can you make a list of 20 things that are special about you? Can you honestly say, hey, I'm a great person just the way I am? I suspect not, partly because of your hatred for most men. We tend to not hate others when we love ourselves.

 

Do you believe someone else will love you for who you are? They won't until you do. You must embrace who you are. You have to be comfortable with yourself, femininity and all.

 

My advice, which might just be a band aid, is online dating. You need to meet new people. You need to go out on dates. Most of them, maybe all of them, will be unsuccessful, but at least you will get practice dating and talking to different types of women in social situations. Then you won't be able to say you've never been on an actual date!

 

Also, get rid of that "dreamgirl" idea you have right now. SHE DOES NOT EXIST. YOU WILL NEVER MEET HER. But you might meet someone awesome in ways you never fantasized about.

 

Remember, having a fulfilling life is not about finding someone to date. It's about doing things you truly enjoy. It's about being the best person you can be for yourself. Do you have hobbies? Have you ever thought about volunteering? There's so much you could (and should) be doing, and if you were you wouldn't be thinking about how weird and undateable you were!

[purgatori]

Do you believe someone else will love you for who you are? They won't until you do. You must embrace who you are. You have to be comfortable with yourself, femininity and all.

 

No, I don't. But as for my femininity, that is something that I am comfortable with; it is other people who regard it as an undesirable trait.

 

My advice, which might just be a band aid, is online dating. You need to meet new people. You need to go out on dates. Most of them, maybe all of them, will be unsuccessful, but at least you will get practice dating and talking to different types of women in social situations. Then you won't be able to say you've never been on an actual date!

 

Gave it a shot, didn't work. Whether they be on- or off-line, women have about the same amount of interest in me, namely none. Even just attempting to make friends with different women resulted in failure time and again, with only one of the women I contacted ever bothering to reply. When I consulted the OKCupid community regarding what might be wrong with me or my profile, I was told that I looked like I was "about 15" in my pic(s). So yeah, I think my zero date record remains secure there, chief.

 

Also, get rid of that "dreamgirl" idea you have right now. SHE DOES NOT EXIST. YOU WILL NEVER MEET HER. But you might meet someone awesome in ways you never fantasized about.

 

I have addressed this twice now already, so please give it a rest.

 

Remember, having a fulfilling life is not about finding someone to date. It's about doing things you truly enjoy. It's about being the best person you can be for yourself. Do you have hobbies? Have you ever thought about volunteering? There's so much you could (and should) be doing, and if you were you wouldn't be thinking about how weird and undateable you were!

 

Yes, I have hobbies and a variety of other activities and commitments to keep me occupied, and I've thought about volunteering as a telephone counselor for Lifeline or some similar organization, but at the moment I'm a more suitable client for such a service than I am a counselor. The problem is that, (a) I really like women and I don't belief in an afterlife or reincarnation or any of that stuff, so the thought of never experiencing what it is like to hold a woman that I love in my arms, etc. during my time here is unbearably painful, and (b) all the experiences, achievements, and events that occur in my life feel increasingly empty the longer I go through life having nobody to share them with... nobody to care what I think or feel or do. Everyone has different psychoemotional needs, but I have a lot of love and affection to give that is all just going to waste and being contaminated by bitterness, sorrow, and hatred. Having someone special to bond with is, for me, essential, and life just isn't worth living without at least the prospect of that happening at some point in the future. At this point, I'm really not sure whether it's cowardice or some small trace of hope that stands in my way.

[vesper16]

your tendentious style makes me think of one of those evil scientists living in some grotto 50 million miles below the sea plotting total destruction to all those who laughed at them and failed to heed their warnings...

 

You mean... like...

 

To the OP: please don't be offended, it's just a bit of fun, plus I thought the song was apt. I hope you take it in the spirit it was intended

 

Anyway here are my thoughts from reading through the thread:

 

Firstly, I can empathise to the extent that I'm a little bit like you in that I am not the typical alpha-male type (and, incidentally, am more than comfortable with that) and would be the first to admit that I think way too much especially when it comes to girls that I like but I'm at the point where, well, if I don't want to be alone anymore I'm going to have to work on the things that make me more attractive to women... I haven't found anyone YET, but it's a gradual thing.

 

I'm not saying you have to change the way you are, far from it...put it this way, you can still be a sensitive, kind, caring, loving man in a relationship but not if you aren't prepared to at least put your best foot forward and present your best possible self.

 

Anyway, I wouldn't go for things like online dating straight away as it (dating) can be a little intimidating if you aren't used to it, but might I suggest an activity like social dancing? You don't need a partner, but what it does (IMO) is it can help a lot with breaking the physical barrier, as a guy they'll teach you how to lead, if you're not comfortable with the masculine role it at least provides a non-threatening environment in which you can give it a go without feeling the pressure of finding a potential mate, no-one ever expects change will happen over night.

 

Just my 2 cents. Good luck!

[salmagundi]

You mean... like... THIS?

 

uhh...yeah, that was basically spot on...

[purgatori]

I'm not saying you have to change the way you are, far from it...put it this way, you can still be a sensitive, kind, caring, loving man in a relationship but not if you aren't prepared to at least put your best foot forward and present your best possible self.

 

The problem here is that what I regard as my "best possible self" isn't necessarily what women might consider to be attractive

 

Anyway, I wouldn't go for things like online dating straight away as it (dating) can be a little intimidating if you aren't used to it, but might I suggest an activity like social dancing? You don't need a partner, but what it does (IMO) is it can help a lot with breaking the physical barrier, as a guy they'll teach you how to lead, if you're not comfortable with the masculine role it at least provides a non-threatening environment in which you can give it a go without feeling the pressure of finding a potential mate, no-one ever expects change will happen over night.

 

Dancing has been something suggested to me on more than occasion by different people, and I did actually give it a shot, once; the woman lead, though, and I was fine with that but I wouldn't be comfortable with it the other way around, at all -- safe environment or not.