Author giotto Posted February 19, 2009 Author Share Posted February 19, 2009 anyway... I "served my notice" today... I just wrote a letter telling her I want to separate permanently and that I will move out... It's on her bed... she'll find it when she wakes up. Link to post Share on other sites
Geishawhelk Posted February 19, 2009 Share Posted February 19, 2009 Good for you. Well done, I know it's a very weird feeling, but I truly believe you are doing the right thing.. Just asking - why did you not tell her to her face? Don't you think it would have been better? I'm merely putting it forward. This has been a nightmare for you as it is. Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted February 19, 2009 Author Share Posted February 19, 2009 Just asking - why did you not tell her to her face? I already told her once to her face... and I ended up staying... I just get overwhelmed by the emotions. It's easier this way... I can put all my thoughts together and be straight to the point. There's also my sister in law here and I know it will be 2 or 3 days until we could talk. I had to lift this weight off my chest. Link to post Share on other sites
jasminetea Posted February 19, 2009 Share Posted February 19, 2009 As you've said you're going to leave in the past but not actioned it, it would be easy for your wife to not take you seriously now. Do you sincerely want to move out and move on from the relationship, or is the letter a way of telling her how strongly you feel about the situation and how much its effecting you? Will you use these next couple of days to find a place to move to? Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted February 19, 2009 Author Share Posted February 19, 2009 I can see it could be interpreted that way. The first time I told her I was living, she said she woulg go to counselling. That's 3 weeks ago and nothing's happened. She is clearly not serious about it. As I said before, I'm turning into some kind of butler. I'm still being a dad and do my share of house chores (cooking included), but she doesn't have to deal with the side of the relationship she doesn't like. She has no reason to do anything about it. It's the perfect situation for her. Also, we haven't told the children yet and I work from home, so I'll have to move my entire office to the new place. It's not just matter of packing a couple of bags and disappear, unfortunately... Link to post Share on other sites
jasminetea Posted February 19, 2009 Share Posted February 19, 2009 What about asking her to leave? Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted February 19, 2009 Author Share Posted February 19, 2009 What about asking her to leave? I know for sure that the children would prefer staying with the mother. Also, I know that she doesn't want to have sex with me, but I decided at the end that our relationship was over... Link to post Share on other sites
carhill Posted February 19, 2009 Share Posted February 19, 2009 Before you leave, especially before establishing a recognizable alternative domicile, get legal advice regarding your actions. The critical thing is making sure the family is taken care of properly. You're talking about "separation" but a true legal separation is far more complex, especially with children. My sympathies Link to post Share on other sites
jasminetea Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 Also, I know that she doesn't want to have sex with me, but I decided at the end that our relationship was over... You sure about that? Seriously, it would seem to me that she made the decision the marriage was over when she stopped wanting physical affection with you. The frustrating thing is that if you ask for a separation/divorce and therefore bring the relationship demise into the open, you can look (and feel?) the bad guy. Going back to moving out and separating - I know there will be lots of umming and awwing, toing and froing between now and then (if there is a then), but do try to see when you're making excuses for not moving out. I think now is the time to recognise that you can do nothing to change the relationship you now have with your wife and only you are responsible for your happiness. Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted February 20, 2009 Author Share Posted February 20, 2009 news... after reading my "letter of resignantion", my wife approached me and said she was prepared to have sex with me on a regular basis in order to salvage our marriage and our family. Ah, and that she loved me... Well, obviously my letter has brought her back "from the dead" , but now I don't know if I want to do that. I still have strong feelings for her, but I've been hurt too much... difficult one. Link to post Share on other sites
carhill Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 Accept her words and approach her with affection outside the bedroom. Her response and your interpretation of it will be telling. Rome wasn't built in a day Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted February 20, 2009 Author Share Posted February 20, 2009 obviously, it would be ideal for the children. I don't want to hurt them, if possible. My fear is that, if I agree, we will revert to the usual pattern - me putting pressure and her hating it. I don't know whether she can change, but she will be going to counselling. She said she didn't want to have sex with me because of what I became. Grumpy, quiet, isolated, doing my own thing. But I was doing that because I didn't feel loved anymore. I felt rejected. The classic catch-22, I suppose. Well, I'm very tempted to agree. We'll see how it goes... I can always write another letter if it doesn't work out... Link to post Share on other sites
Dexter Morgan Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 I’ll try and be brief... married 18 years, together 23, 4 kids (16, 13, 10 and 8). Mostly happy for the first 10 years, after the birth of the second child we start having problems, mainly about sex. She's off it and I find it very difficult to deal with it. Put pressure on her and make things worse. After another 10 years of feeling rejected, I start withdrawing and participate very little to family life... I feel I cannot be part of a family without the emotional connection and intimacy with my wife. After being rejected in my marriage, i found comfort in spending more time with my children. We talk about it, but she refuses to do anything about our sex life. I’m very present as father (I work from home) and help a lot around the house (cook meals everyday and look after the kids when she is at work... she works shifts). About six months ago she tells me she’s fed up with my isolation So let me get this straight...she rejects you, pushes you away...and now SHE is fed up? Oh, thats rich. She isolates YOU, but is fed up with that isolation. and proposes to go to counselling together. We go, but it makes things worse. I think we come to the conclusion that our differences are too big. Our sex life becomes even worse. At the end of last December, she dumps me. We are together again for a few days and then we decide to separate temporarily. I move upstairs into my office. We talk again and she agrees to go to counselling on her own, both for the sex issue and her own past issues regarding her upbringing. She’s also been on antidepressants for many years due to her anxiety. Unfortunately, I’m getting really fed up with it. I would be too. She rejects you, and you withdraw. Hey, you could be like alot of people on this forum that would justify the actions and you could have gone out and got sex elsewhere. But you didn't(I assume). So she dumps you?? My life’s been hell for a very long time and I don’t know if I’m prepared to wait another 6 months/1 year in the hope that she will be able to solve these issues. I’m at the end of my tether. I really used to love her a lot, but my feelings for her are dissolving, day after day. I don’t really want to hurt my children, but I feel that I’ve got to a stage where I believe I should put my happiness first. If you are thinking of divorce, I can tell you that children are the wrong reason to stay in a marriage. If I knew one of my parents lived a miserable life just for the sake of keeping us all in the same house, it would break my heart later on down the road if I ever found out. But if you are miserable, your children WILL know it in some way. I also re-connected with this old friend online and we get on very well... nothing’s has happened, but it makes me realize what I’m missing in a relationship. Well I think you need to think about divorce before you think about making a connection with another woman. its just plain wrong. I honestly don’t know what to do. I want to be loved again, but I feel that it will never happen with my wife again. Is it too late? Thank you for any advice... I think you need to see if you can make an appointment to go to counseling with your wife on the very next visit and tell the therapist exactly what you told us that you don't think you can wait to find out if things are going to improve. See what the therapist has to say. What do you have to lose? If your wife doesn't respond as a wife concerned that her husband is about ready to leave.....then thats what you should do. Leave the marriage. Link to post Share on other sites
Geishawhelk Posted February 20, 2009 Share Posted February 20, 2009 after reading my "letter of resignantion", my wife approached me and said she was prepared to have sex with me on a regular basis in order to salvage our marriage and our family. Ah, and that she loved me... Well, obviously my letter has brought her back "from the dead" , but now I don't know if I want to do that. I still have strong feelings for her, but I've been hurt too much... difficult one. No. Don't accept this. Listen, what she's doing is actually compromising her own wishes in order to try to pacify you and keep you around. Understand - she won't be having sex with you because she loves and desires you. She will be having sex with you as a bargaining tool. When she realises that it works, she'll go off sex again. After all, she willl have accomplished what she set out to do. Keep you close. I'm sure she does love you. But she will have to consider more concrete, long-lasting and deeper ways to prove that, other than to just say - "I'll have sex with you if you don't leave." Link to post Share on other sites
carhill Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 Geisha....help him set some conditions and boundaries. One step at a time FWIW, my wife would've given me the finger had I wrote her such a letter. Link to post Share on other sites
lostsunsets Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 Giotto, You are not just concerned with sex. This is a frustrating myth. Men want sex because that is how they judge the health of the relationship. Women judge it by communication. One is not more important then the other. It is just because men have been trashed about it for so long. That is why men want to have sex after a fight and its the last thing on a woman's mind. To say that the woman's view of relationships is superior to that of man's is ridiculous. Unless of course you do not incorporate men in the relationship. Link to post Share on other sites
Geishawhelk Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 Geisha....help him set some conditions and boundaries. One step at a time FWIW, my wife would've given me the finger had I wrote her such a letter. Ok, fair enough..... My opinion is that he should still move out, but then recommence re-building the relationship from an independent standpoint. IE, once he's out of there, it will be easier to gauge exactly how determined and committed she is to meeting him towards rebuilding the marriage. Actions always speak louder than words. He should follow through his words with actions, and then, she should back up her words equally. How's that? Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted February 21, 2009 Author Share Posted February 21, 2009 I have an "easy" solution... I will agree, see how it goes and if it ends up being the same old stuff, I'll leave for good... I think I owe it to my family and my children. She is still saying she will go to counselling, and that should help her even more. I know it's the easy option and I'm sure many of you disagree, but the fact she said she loves me means a lot to me. I thought she didn't... then, on the other hand, she could be lying... Link to post Share on other sites
signedin2008 Posted February 21, 2009 Share Posted February 21, 2009 So, that letter solved the problem and things are going great, at least for now? Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted February 25, 2009 Author Share Posted February 25, 2009 a little update... after agreeing, she said she wants me to give up alcohol completely. I sometimes go out with friends and have a few drinks or might have a couple of drinks at home. I DO NOT get drunk. I am not an alcoholic. I don't like getting drunk and I only drink wine, because I enjoy nice wine. She used to drink, but gave up about 5 years ago because she hated being controlled by it (like smoking, chocolate and, obviously, sex). The thing is, I work from home and going out occasionally is my only distraction. We all drink nice (expensive) wine and we go to tastings (ok, I know I sound like a snob twat). Now, this would completely destroy my social life. So, I said 'no'... She said, 'ok, maybe it was a bit unfair of me', but now apparently I have to wait until she feels like having sex with me again... no compromise... back to square one... Link to post Share on other sites
carhill Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 Remember, the only person you can control is you. Virgin Mary's and club soda isn't that bad. Let me ask you....if you quit drinking and she still doesn't have sex with you, does she "win"? This is a critical part of therapy, IME. Letting go of winning and losing. Tell me, do you think her asking you to give up alcohol completely is manipulation? In the moment, was that your first thought? If it was, I'm sorry to say that this is likely unrecoverable. That response is a sign of a fundamental disconnect. I know because I've felt it and recognized it and talked about it in MC. Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted February 25, 2009 Author Share Posted February 25, 2009 I don't know what to think anymore... if she said it was unfair of her to ask me such a thing, why is she not sticking to the agreement? Another excuse? I think she said that because she knew I wouldn't accept it... She has a control issue. She doesn't smoke (she used to), she doesn't drink, she doesn't eat chocolate anymore, she always has the same thing for dinner... she has no sex. She hardly goes out... she could be a nun as far as I'm concerned. I'm losing my patience... Link to post Share on other sites
carhill Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 Absent the business aspects of divorce, what would happen if, tomorrow, you and she parted ways? That's a hard question. Take a look at your children's faces tonight and think about that. The answer isn't obvious, IMO. Link to post Share on other sites
Mr. Lucky Posted February 25, 2009 Share Posted February 25, 2009 if she said it was unfair of her to ask me such a thing, why is she not sticking to the agreement? Let me guess, no sex yet? As has been pointed out previously, this latest set of conditions simply allows her to buy time. And wastes yours. Geisha has given you good advice - I'd try and address the issues in your marriage from the position of a legal separation. Right now, your wife has no incentive to change... Mr. lucky Link to post Share on other sites
Author giotto Posted February 26, 2009 Author Share Posted February 26, 2009 I'm sure I have my faults, but whilst I'm prepared to talk, she just buries her head in the sand, trying to avoid what she cannot control 100%... me! Actually, she controls me with sex... the thing is she hasn't recovered emotionally from years of arguing about sex... she can't have sex yet... she doesn't know when she can have sex again... but that's why I didn't like the "agreement". I don't want to have sex with her just because of an agreement. I want her to want to have sex with me... if that's not possible... be it! And, no, no sex... Link to post Share on other sites
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