Why I belive best friends shouldn't date.

[carhill]

Question:

 

In looking back, and IMO this is critical, did you feel she was genuinely supportive of and interested in your life, passions, interests, etc, as a true friend should be?

 

I've had both experiences, some like I questioned above and others where the woman spoon-fed me enough attention, sharing and interest to keep the friendship going but was not proactively a good friend. It's a very fine line and some of it has to do with how men and women communicate differently and perceive each other's communication. Anyway, I thought it worth noting...

[lammie]

Question:

 

In looking back, and IMO this is critical, did you feel she was genuinely supportive of and interested in your life, passions, interests, etc, as a true friend should be?

 

I've had both experiences, some like I questioned above and others where the woman spoon-fed me enough attention, sharing and interest to keep the friendship going but was not proactively a good friend. It's a very fine line and some of it has to do with how men and women communicate differently and perceive each other's communication. Anyway, I thought it worth noting...

 

What if the situation with the gender is reversed, it's the guy in question? How does it communicate different?

[somedude81]

Question:

 

In looking back, and IMO this is critical, did you feel she was genuinely supportive of and interested in your life, passions, interests, etc, as a true friend should be?

 

I've had both experiences, some like I questioned above and others where the woman spoon-fed me enough attention, sharing and interest to keep the friendship going but was not proactively a good friend. It's a very fine line and some of it has to do with how men and women communicate differently and perceive each other's communication. Anyway, I thought it worth noting...

I don't really know. The only thing I do know is that she liked to spend time with me. If I wanted to go anywhere and I asked her to come, she would. I could always talk to her when I wanted. She never did ask me what my interests and passions were. Maybe I was just something to entertain her when she was bored? I don't want to look at the past, in a bitter manner.

 

I know she enjoyed my company and she trusted me and wanted my support.

[Stockalone]

Ah, I understand. I've felt the same way. This is an important area that MC helped me with. Acceptance. Relationships have value. They are healthy. Just because they end doesn't negate those realities. Accepting their value and the positive energy they bring to one's life is incredibly freeing. Value your place and position in that dynamic. Trust that you have importance.

 

I guess that works if you are okay with the saying "The journey is the reward".

 

Probably not the worst way to live your life, but it's not for everyone.

[carhill]

What if the situation with the gender is reversed, it's the guy in question? How does it communicate different?

IMO, there is little difference in the dynamic. I think each person should examine their true feelings and motivations. A possible difference might be in the intrinsic difference in the way men and women are wired for sexuality, reinforced by socialization and societal norms. If a mans desire for sex/intimacy is balanced by the woman's, then the dynamic should be equal. IME, though, there is rarely such equality.

 

somedude81, when I was younger, I thought and felt much as you do. As an older man, I can now delineate those friendships for what they truly were, but accept them as part of my life. The critical thing is how you feel about your contribution. That's what you'll carry forward

 

Some women just don't like being "alone", so spending time with you might have been such a pursuit. Only you and she know that dynamic. It is worth learning from, though. That's what life is about.

[Awesome84]

Me and my guy friend just had a conversation about this the other day. Can men and women be 'just friends'? It only works if they are not attracted to eachother 'Physically'.

 

The craziest thing happened tho... we are both attracted to eachother (which we both expressed to one another). But we sorted out all the reasons why it wasn't a good idea to take things there. His # 1 reason... We work together... My #1 reason... he's already with someone.

 

We had to go over those things with eachother the other night to keep things from happening between us. The opportunity was there... but we didn't act upon it. Which I think was kinda a really great accomplishment for us because we were able to get past the attraction and realize what the consequences were.

 

In the long run tho... my question is that... since we are attracted to eachother.... how can we keep that lion in it's den???

[messiah]

I just told my girl mate that i like her too much to be her mate. And that her telling me about her past hook ups and ex bf just kills me and i dont wana hear it. So i said i cant be her friend. She got really upset getting all teary eyed and what not acting as if i just dumped her. Saying it feels worse then being dumped by a bf? the logic escapes me on that one and i dont want to begin to comprehend what she means by that.

[vanilla87]

I just told my girl mate that i like her too much to be her mate. And that her telling me about her past hook ups and ex bf just kills me and i dont wana hear it. So i said i cant be her friend. She got really upset getting all teary eyed and what not acting as if i just dumped her. Saying it feels worse then being dumped by a bf? the logic escapes me on that one and i dont want to begin to comprehend what she means by that.

 

Well from a females perspective, maybe she isn't telling you everything about why it feels just as bad or even worse then a break up. Maybe your like a brother to her or maybe she considers you a best friend and that you not wanting to be friends anymore, feels like a part of her world just feel apart.

 

Maybe I'm wrong and maybe she has feelings for you, you never know till you ask her why it hurts so much...

[vanilla87]

In the long run tho... my question is that... since we are attracted to eachother.... how can we keep that lion in it's den???

 

Sooner or later you'll reach one of the four outcomes that'll either work for the two of you:

 

1)You'll both end up with other people, happily in love and you'll both be happy for one another for this.

 

2)One of you will end up happy with someone and the other won't and feel resentment about it and wonder "what if..." down the road.

 

3)You'll end up getting together one night and it cold either work perfectly and end up happily together or you two could end up breaking each others hearts and what not.

 

4)You'll hook-up with each other, then pretend it won't be a big deal the next day which results in either uncomfortable silence and the friendship could end or you both could laugh it off and be good friends still.

 

If there is no sexual attraction from the start from both the friends then there will never be a hook-up or someone wanting to date the other person. Thats the only way it'll work, because if there is attraction, but nothing happens, it'll always be there even if you try to cover it up and what not and talk about why you two shouldn't be together, the only thing I can say is that you'll have to start viewing each other in a non-sexual way so that the friendship can last. But if you can't you need to ask yourself why, because maybe there is a reason why the two of you are so attracted to one another. If its just for the physical factors that make you two wanna be together, then don't hook up, it'll just make things weird later on, but if its more then that, then maybe you two when your both single and feel its okay, take a chance, if your willing to risk your friendship...

[Awesome84]

But if you can't you need to ask yourself why, because maybe there is a reason why the two of you are so attracted to one another.

 

Well I know MY attraction to him is beyond physical. That would be something that I would need to find out from him though. That would be a very good question and conversation to pose. But if it is just 'physical' attraction on his part... how many guys are willing to admit that???

 

UHHH.... This is why it is just easier to be friends! LOL!

[somedude81]

I just told my girl mate that i like her too much to be her mate. And that her telling me about her past hook ups and ex bf just kills me and i dont wana hear it. So i said i cant be her friend. She got really upset getting all teary eyed and what not acting as if i just dumped her. Saying it feels worse then being dumped by a bf? the logic escapes me on that one and i dont want to begin to comprehend what she means by that.

Well from a females perspective, maybe she isn't telling you everything about why it feels just as bad or even worse then a break up. Maybe your like a brother to her or maybe she considers you a best friend and that you not wanting to be friends anymore, feels like a part of her world just feel apart.

 

Maybe I'm wrong and maybe she has feelings for you, you never know till you ask her why it hurts so much...

 

The exact same thing happened to me.

 

How the hell can a girl be so attached to a guy and still not be attracted to him?! It just doesn't make sense.

 

How come girls don't think, "I know this guy really likes me. And I really like spending time with him. We're so close. Why don't we have sex and then see what happens?"

 

If my friend had thought of something like that then our friendship would most likely still be fine or we might be even closer. Or maybe she would realize that sex didn't change how she thought of me but at least she knows that she at least tried to save the friendship.

 

I really believe that her giving in to have sex with me would been a much easier thing to do than for me to stop loving her. But because she was so stubborn it was the end of the friendship. I got too mad and put the nail in the coffin. Six months of a close friendship down the toilet over something as stupid as sex. If I could have turned off all my interest and desire for her, I would do it in an instant to save the friendship.

 

Hell I wish I never fell for her in the first place. I wish I was able to make sure I never got feelings for her. I really miss her

 

Wow, I haven't cried over her in a week. Damn these thoughts are painful.

 

I would have done anything within my power to make sure we stayed friends, and it hurts that she didn't even try. But I know I can't be mad at her for not going against her values/morals.

[vanilla87]

I think that most of the time if you don't go into a friendship with the opposite sex with romantic intentions, most likely you'll end up keeping that friendship as a friendship.

 

But when you are attracted to this person, I think its 10x's harder to really draw a line down the middle and keep boundaries, especially after a certain point in time, because sooner or later one of you will end up trying to make some sort of advance or just never do anything ever, which causes frustration and then the friendship most likely ends because you can't handle not being with this person as more then a friend.

 

I believe in trying to do something. I've already done so with one guy friend whom I've had romantic interest in on and off for the past 7 years. After having slept together twice in a span of 4 years, even after he has told me why he can't be more then friends, we still have managed to stay friends after all this. We are actually closer now because of this, but we also took the route of being two mature 20-somethings and not let it get in the way of destroying our friendship.

 

We both know we have feelings and desire one another, but we don't cross it because we're both afraid of the bad out come that could end up happening, mostly due to past experiences with other people and that we both know it would end up us having to never be friends again.

 

On the other hand, my best friend who is also his best friend, I know weird little tripod friendship we got going on, she has said it once and to me should would only say it once, that one day, when he is finally healed from the damage, that he and I would make a great match together, plus she knows there is something going on he isn't telling her about me and I think she is picking up on the vibes I've been picking up on since february of '08.

 

I'm in no rush for anything to happen, I still have a few emotional things to square away, so till then I'm just going to keep myself busy, keep some distance between me and him, and maybe let my interest in this other guy I've known for 4 years maybe pick up and let happen...

[somedude81]

But when you are attracted to this person, I think its 10x's harder to really draw a line down the middle and keep boundaries, especially after a certain point in time, because sooner or later one of you will end up trying to make some sort of advance or just never do anything ever, which causes frustration and then the friendship most likely ends because you can't handle not being with this person as more then a friend.

That's exactly what happened to me. At first I just thought that she was a cute girl and it would be fun to hook up with her. But after spending lots of time with her, I ended up wanting more than just sex from her.

I believe in trying to do something. I've already done so with one guy friend whom I've had romantic interest in on and off for the past 7 years. After having slept together twice in a span of 4 years, even after he has told me why he can't be more then friends, we still have managed to stay friends after all this. We are actually closer now because of this, but we also took the route of being two mature 20-somethings and not let it get in the way of destroying our friendship.

I really wish she was willing to try something. Her only reason was that she didn't like me in that way. And that reason was so strong that she believed it was more important than staying friends.

 

I'll never forget this line in our text conversation.

 

Me: So you don't like me enough to ever give me a chance?

Her: No, it's not that I don't like you enough to give you a chance, it's that I don't like you in that way.

 

I really wish I could understand her reason. Why not having sex with me was more important than all the time we spent together, all the fun we had and all the time we could have spent together in the future. She willing thew all that away. Now I'm wondering if I have a right to be mad at her? BTW I'm not a bad looking dude by any means. I made sure to always look and smell good when I was around her. So there is no physical reason why she wouldn't want to hook up and she liked my personality to have me as one of her closest friends so why the hell was she so against sex?! BTW she was and still is single.

[vanilla87]

Me: So you don't like me enough to ever give me a chance?

Her: No, it's not that I don't like you enough to give you a chance, it's that I don't like you in that way.

 

Because she isn't into you on a sexual level. Any girl that isn't into a guy will not have sex with him unless for three reasons: 1)she hasn't had sex in a really long time, 2) doesn't care if she ever sees you again, or 3)is very drunk and is very horny at the moment.

 

I only had sex with a guy friend of mine that I wasn't into, because I haven't had sex in a really long time, but also because I was very lonely and in mind frame that allowed me to not care if it was a friend or not. I was also never romantically attracted to him, but he was and that was sort of the problem why I sort of don't really talk to him anymore because he doesn't get why I don't want to be with him.

 

I think the problem is that she was being mature and told you straight up, but you just don't get it and I think she needs to just flat out say: "I don't like you or have any feelings for you and I don't ever want to have sex with you. I only see us ever being friends", cause thats what she meant by the text message you got back from her.

 

Also look at the type of guys she has dated or hooked up with, maybe that'll give you a clue to what she finds attractive on a daily basis so you know if she may change her mind, but more so then not once a girl puts you in the friends-zone, you never get out unless she was once attracted to you, then you have a chance of coming out of there.

[somedude81]

Because she isn't into you on a sexual level. Any girl that isn't into a guy will not have sex with him unless for three reasons: 1)she hasn't had sex in a really long time, 2) doesn't care if she ever sees you again, or 3)is very drunk and is very horny at the moment.

 

I only had sex with a guy friend of mine that I wasn't into, because I haven't had sex in a really long time, but also because I was very lonely and in mind frame that allowed me to not care if it was a friend or not.

I don't understand #2. Does that connect to the "not care if it was a friend or not?" Does that mean you were actually more likely to have sex with a random person than a friend?

I think the problem is that she was being mature and told you straight up, but you just don't get it and I think she needs to just flat out say: "I don't like you or have any feelings for you and I don't ever want to have sex with you. I only see us ever being friends", cause thats what she meant by the text message you got back from her.

lI do understand that she only ever saw as firends and that she never wanted to have sex with me. That was clear as day. What I don't get is why her decision to not hook up with me was more important than staying friends? I wasn't asking to be her boyfriend or anything like that. I wasn't asking for her soul or for some large some of money.

 

I know my problem is that I'm looking at this too logically and I'm placing too little value on sex. Sex must have been very very important to her.

 

Also look at the type of guys she has dated or hooked up with, maybe that'll give you a clue to what she finds attractive on a daily basis so you know if she may change her mind, but more so then not once a girl puts you in the friends-zone, you never get out unless she was once attracted to you, then you have a chance of coming out of there.

I'm extremely aware of the friendzone concept. I didn't start having lady friends till a couple of years ago and I've been placed into the friendzone by every one. I was really stupid to spend so much time with this girl and get so attached to her. I should have tried to make a move within the first couple times we hung out. Once she rejected me, I would have kicked her out of my life and none of this crap would have ever happened.

 

It was never my intention to have a platonic friendship with a girl. I should have known better than to let it happen. I'm always the one who gets screwed in the end.

[vanilla87]

I can tell that she is the type of girl that only sleeps with guys she is in a relationship with, which means your never going to sleep with her, because she has way too much self respect for herself first off and second have you ever wondered if maybe settling for a kiss instead? I think you have a better chance of getting that then having her sleep with you.

 

But being that probably won't happen. I think you need to realize that you let it all get way too personal and she didn't and what not. You should of talked to her before you ended the friendship like two mature adults and not the way you did originally, which is why she ended up crying in the first place.

 

Anyway, while you weren't getting with her, maybe you should have tried focusing on other girls, spend time with 'em, and let your friend not be as important as you make her out to be, which will light a fire under her, and cause her to get needy and a little jealous happens all the time, even with girls that think they don't have feelings for a guy.

 

By becoming elusive, a girl wants you more, that whole unavailable thing is what girls sort of like, none will admit it, but they do. I bet you if you tried to be an out of mind out of sight kind of person the last 5-6 months before you ended the friendship, he would have paid the kind of attention to you that girls use on guys they like.

 

My cousin was being pursued by this friend of her's that she has know for over 10 years. The guy would express interest left and right, till one day she set him up with a friend of her's. Those two hit it off well, were kissing, hugging, talking a lot and being a really cute couple. Only one problem: my cousin suddenly realized she liked him, alot. He broke it off with the girl after my cousin told him how she felt and they ended up dating.

 

They broke it off after they were going to be going to separate collages in new york, about 6-7 hr drive one way. They stayed good friends and are till this day.

[somedude81]

I can tell that she is the type of girl that only sleeps with guys she is in a relationship with, which means your never going to sleep with her, because she has way too much self respect for herself first off and second have you ever wondered if maybe settling for a kiss instead? I think you have a better chance of getting that then having her sleep with you.

In all honesty several things went wrong or were just weird.

 

From the time I first met her Aug 08 till November she actually had a girlfriend that she was with for a year. Before that she was with dudes she also said that she would never have another GF. She was also a virgin. I was really hoping to be her first and I actually thought I was close to sleeping with her. If I was braver I probably could have had sex with her a few weeks ago when she was at my house during a party, we were both a little drunk, horny and still lucid but I couldn't get over my fears.

 

Then 3 days later I found out that she lost her virginity to some dude she's only mentioned once or twice. I also know that it happened the day after I was with her. I'm with her the whole day Friday, the whole day Saturday and she gets laid on Sunday. She's not dating the dude nor does she want a relationship. Heck I've spent more time with her than he has.

 

Basically I freak out without letting her know. A couple of days later confess my feelings to her and she tells me that she only saw me as a friend etc. We're still technically friends but I know we won't hang out again for a while. A few days after that something makes me snap then I talk to her about the whole giving me a shot thing. I knew it had a 99% chance of failure but I was pissed and I wanted her to be mad too. I know realize that everything I did that night was extremely stupid.

 

If I had just stayed in control, the fight wouldn't have happened and I might of still had a chance of us getting together. But now that we had our first and only fight we will never hang out again.

 

I think you need to realize that you let it all get way too personal and she didn't and what not. You should of talked to her before you ended the friendship like two mature adults and not the way you did originally, which is why she ended up crying in the first place.

I did talk to her. We had a great conversation everything would have been fine if I just left it as is. All our feelings were out in the open and their was peace. But it only lasted for two days because of what I did after that. I wonder if I can claim insanity in my defense?

Anyway, while you weren't getting with her, maybe you should have tried focusing on other girls, spend time with 'em, and let your friend not be as important as you make her out to be, which will light a fire under her, and cause her to get needy and a little jealous happens all the time, even with girls that think they don't have feelings for a guy.

Yeah I should have done that. I should not have focused on her so much. I made a big mistake by having her be the only girl I spent time with. Hell she was the only person I hung out with outside of school. I was way too invested in her.

 

By becoming elusive, a girl wants you more, that whole unavailable thing is what girls sort of like, none will admit it, but they do. I bet you if you tried to be an out of mind out of sight kind of person the last 5-6 months before you ended the friendship, she would have paid the kind of attention to you that girls use on guys they like.

Wow 5-6 months? That is way too long to wait. There just isn't any point. I've only known her for 7 months. Frankly I need a girl now.

[WTRanger]

Wow 5-6 months? That is way too long to wait. There just isn't any point. I've only known her for 7 months. Frankly I need a girl now.

Yes, they have girls for this. They are called hookers or strippers that take you into the back room.

 

Did you really care about this girl or just busting in her snizz? It seems to me the whole point you really cared about was being her first, and not the 99.99% rest of this girls body or life. Your posts always, always revolve around the fact that she was a virgin and you wanted to have sex with her. The breaking point was when you could no longer be her first, you exploded.

 

In reality if you truly do care about the person as a whole, and not just getting first crack at her minge, then you'd wait for when she's ready. Of course, if she's going to take her sweet time to come around then you might have to consider moving on but you'd also take steps to ensure that you could keep her a part of your life. Not making her mad just becuase you're mad.

 

I'll leave you with some of the most classic lines ever written in cinema history about a nice guy who falls in love with a girl. He finally tells her his feelings, they have a great kiss, she admits she loves him back, and the next morning she says this to him.

Katie: Listen, Coop - last night was really great. You were incredibly romantic and heroic, no doubt about it. And that's great. But I've thought about it, and my thing is this: Andy is really hot. And don't get me wrong, you're cute too, but Andy is like, *cut*. From marble. He's gorgeous. He has this beautiful face and this incredible body, and I genuinely don't care that he's kinda lame. I don't even care that he cheats on me. And I like you more than I like Andy, Coop, but I'm 16. And maybe it'll be a different story when I'm ready to get married, but right now, I am entirely about sex. I just wanna get laid. I just wanna take him and grab him and f*ck his brains out, ya know? So that's where my priorities are right now. Sex. Specifically with Andy and not with you.

[vanilla87]

In all honesty several things went wrong or were just weird.

 

From the time I first met her Aug 08 till November she actually had a girlfriend that she was with for a year. Before that she was with dudes she also said that she would never have another GF. She was also a virgin. I was really hoping to be her first and I actually thought I was close to sleeping with her. If I was braver I probably could have had sex with her a few weeks ago when she was at my house during a party, we were both a little drunk, horny and still lucid but I couldn't get over my fears.

 

Okay see now if you said she was a virgin this would make a whole lot more sense from the first post more then anything and help you a little quicker. The fact that she was testing the waters with another girl, says a lot. The fact that you had a chance says a lot more. Right now I think she just wants sex mostly and to experiment with people she doesn't know too well, kind of an exciting thing probably for her.

 

Then 3 days later I found out that she lost her virginity to some dude she's only mentioned once or twice. I also know that it happened the day after I was with her. I'm with her the whole day Friday, the whole day Saturday and she gets laid on Sunday. She's not dating the dude nor does she want a relationship. Heck I've spent more time with her than he has.

 

Well maybe she didn't want to look at you everytime and think she lost her virginity to you, a lot of girls think that they want it over with or with someone special, but most of the time the first time sucks, so if she just wanted it over with, then with you, she probably would have ended up avoiding you and from what I can tell she is probably avoiding this guy right now as your reading this.

 

Basically I freak out without letting her know. A couple of days later confess my feelings to her and she tells me that she only saw me as a friend etc. We're still technically friends but I know we won't hang out again for a while. A few days after that something makes me snap then I talk to her about the whole giving me a shot thing. I knew it had a 99% chance of failure but I was pissed and I wanted her to be mad too. I know realize that everything I did that night was extremely stupid.

 

Yeah, that was pretty damn stupid I may say. Blowing up at her because you weren't her first, let alone because it was about some other guy and not you, stupid stupid stupid movie!!! I think as far as I can say is give another week of giving her space and then go talk to her, most of the hurt will have blown over by then and she may be willing to actually talk to you, unless you blow up at her again, then your screwed over even more then the last blow up.

[vanilla87]

Yes, they have girls for this. They are called hookers or strippers that take you into the back room.

well put!

 

Did you really care about this girl or just busting in her snizz? It seems to me the whole point you really cared about was being her first, and not the 99.99% rest of this girls body or life. Your posts always, always revolve around the fact that she was a virgin and you wanted to have sex with her. The breaking point was when you could no longer be her first, you exploded.

 

Very true. I think you make one heck of a valid point. If anyone is worth waiting for, sex wouldn't be at the top of the list in why you need this person. Sex is like number 5 or even 10 for that matter.

 

In reality if you truly do care about the person as a whole, and not just getting first crack at her minge, then you'd wait for when she's ready. Of course, if she's going to take her sweet time to come around then you might have to consider moving on but you'd also take steps to ensure that you could keep her a part of your life. Not making her mad just becuase you're mad.

 

Never wait for years and years for someone, thats just crazy right there, trust me. Best bet would have been about a few more months, I mean you waited more then 5, why not wait a few more? its a true test to see if your heart really wanted her or your d**k was the voice of reason because of the fact you wanted to be her first. Any guy that has feelings for a girl will have a lot of respect for her first off to let sex be the main reason why you need to be with her, sex may happen, but not asap thats for sure. It takes time if your friends to even go down that path, trust me, I've been there. You should of given it more time, like another few months to even consider trying to maybe kiss her or even try and kiss her right in the first month of knowing her.

 

I'll leave you with some of the most classic lines ever written in cinema history about a nice guy who falls in love with a girl. He finally tells her his feelings, they have a great kiss, she admits she loves him back, and the next morning she says this to him.

 

What movie is that from? lol, sorry to ask, but I swear I know it, just can't think of the title at hand at this moment.

[vanilla87]

Sorry forgot to answer this part...

 

Wow 5-6 months? That is way too long to wait. There just isn't any point. I've only known her for 7 months. Frankly I need a girl now.

 

First off, why is it so hard to wait anyway? I've been waiting on and off since last february for a guy friend who just got out of a messy break-up back in december who I've been friends with since i was 16 and he was 18, trust me if its worth it in the long run, you can wait, especially if you've hooked up before hand, really makes it easier to wait.

 

Second, why now? Was your last relationship that long ago? lol, I mean I haven't had a good relationship in almost two years or been out on a date in almost 2 1/2 years, so why rush? seriously, your bound to find someone, just don't push it, thats when you don't get anyone even when you have options right in front of you. Let nature take it course, as corny as that sounds, you need to let it flow, thats why the good starts happening. Blowing up at someone is not letting it flow, its letting it get messed up for anything...

[WTRanger]

Vanilla87: Never wait for years and years for someone, thats just crazy right there, trust me.

 

I wouldn't wait years and years for someone to come around, and only be focused on that one person. I would move on to other people. But what I was referring to, was that if that person who was taking the ultra slow path, but you still cared about them. You would take steps, while you are out exploring other people, to still keep the slower person in your life as a friend. Because lets face it, you have no idea what the future and even the distant future holds. When that person does come around, and the two of you are single, who knows what could potentially happen. When you strip away everything, if you really care about someone you'd want them in your life no matter what label you have applied to them.

 

Though sometimes when a person makes you wait while they "process" over whether or not they see you as a friend or more can be a long frustrating time period. Especially if they do a lot of waffling, give vague responses, or have weeks of zero progress because of other factors in their life. Meanwhile you are on the other end beating yourself up for bringing up the topic of "us." You start to think that it might have been better for you to swallow your feelings because at least you'd still be able to talk to the other person. Sure, it'd be weird and it'd eat you inside but you'd be able to talk to them. Then reality kicks in and you are glad that you told them because it is a huge pressure relief off of your mind. But secretly you wish the other person would hurry it up as the wait and not knowing is starting to become a drain on your mental state. You start to think that you should just piss them off, just so they'd have a reason to seemingly avoid you. Then you realize that this person is important to you so you just give them the time they need and hope they come around within a reasonable amount of time. Not years, of course.

 

Because if the other person really runs away from the topic, then there must be something deeper that they are scared of. Whether it's their own feelings, your feelings, not getting hurt again as they are still recovering from a hard break up, etc. If there wasn't anything there, and they just truly saw you as a friend then they would have no problem with the talk.

 

Or is that a false assumption? That the farther someone runs from the talk, they might be scared of realizing that there just might be a spark between the two of you but for that one person the time in their life just doesn't fit being in a relationship. But they do not know the best way the deal, so they just run away and take long periods of time to "process" or that I really might like the other person but I'm not ready for it so I'll just ignore them and hope it all goes away.

 

The movie, by the way, is "Wet Hot American Summer." A freakin' classic of American cinema history.

[vanilla87]

I wouldn't wait years and years for someone to come around, and only be focused on that one person. I would move on to other people. But what I was referring to, was that if that person who was taking the ultra slow path, but you still cared about them. You would take steps, while you are out exploring other people, to still keep the slower person in your life as a friend. Because lets face it, you have no idea what the future and even the distant future holds. When that person does come around, and the two of you are single, who knows what could potentially happen. When you strip away everything, if you really care about someone you'd want them in your life no matter what label you have applied to them.

 

Though sometimes when a person makes you wait while they "process" over whether or not they see you as a friend or more can be a long frustrating time period. Especially if they do a lot of waffling, give vague responses, or have weeks of zero progress because of other factors in their life. Meanwhile you are on the other end beating yourself up for bringing up the topic of "us." You start to think that it might have been better for you to swallow your feelings because at least you'd still be able to talk to the other person. Sure, it'd be weird and it'd eat you inside but you'd be able to talk to them. Then reality kicks in and you are glad that you told them because it is a huge pressure relief off of your mind. But secretly you wish the other person would hurry it up as the wait and not knowing is starting to become a drain on your mental state. You start to think that you should just piss them off, just so they'd have a reason to seemingly avoid you. Then you realize that this person is important to you so you just give them the time they need and hope they come around within a reasonable amount of time. Not years, of course.

 

Because if the other person really runs away from the topic, then there must be something deeper that they are scared of. Whether it's their own feelings, your feelings, not getting hurt again as they are still recovering from a hard break up, etc. If there wasn't anything there, and they just truly saw you as a friend then they would have no problem with the talk.

 

Or is that a false assumption? That the farther someone runs from the talk, they might be scared of realizing that there just might be a spark between the two of you but for that one person the time in their life just doesn't fit being in a relationship. But they do not know the best way the deal, so they just run away and take long periods of time to "process" or that I really might like the other person but I'm not ready for it so I'll just ignore them and hope it all goes away.

 

I think your pretty dead on about someone who avoids the "talk". Makes a lot of sense now when you put it the way you've worded it all together. I think your onto something very interesting... I'll have to do an update down the road...

 

 

The movie, by the way, is "Wet Hot American Summer." A freakin' classic of American cinema history.

 

found a youtube channel with the movie uploaded into 10 parts, probably going to watch it now... thanks for letting me know it was that movie!

[somedude81]

Yes, they have girls for this. They are called hookers or strippers that take you into the back room.

I've actually been with a few hookers. Haven't seen one in 5 years and I never plan on doing that again. It just gives me an empty feeling. I believe that sex without an emotional connection to somebody is pointless. And no I've only given her a half truth on my sexual history. She thinks I've only been with one girl that I met on craigslist 5 years ago. It's still pretty embarrassing but it's better than saying hookers. She also doesn't know how old I really am.

Did you really care about this girl or just busting in her snizz? It seems to me the whole point you really cared about was being her first, and not the 99.99% rest of this girls body or life. Your posts always, always revolve around the fact that she was a virgin and you wanted to have sex with her. The breaking point was when you could no longer be her first, you exploded.

I do care about her. Much more than any girl I had feelings for in the past. I actually was not planning on bring up her virginity. But the topic warranted and it helped to clear up some misunderstandings.

 

The breaking point was a combination of things. We've been going on "non-dates" at least once a week, every week for 4 months, I knew we weren't a couple but I still got very attached to her. As far as my emotions were concerned, she felt like my girlfriend. As crazy as it sounds, when she told me that she had sex, it felt like she cheated on me.

 

The fact that she lost her virginity also meant that we couldn't learn about sex together. I can count the number of times I've had sex on one hand. Most people are in the hundreds or higher (times not people.) So it was a double whammy to me.

 

In reality if you truly do care about the person as a whole, and not just getting first crack at her minge, then you'd wait for when she's ready. Of course, if she's going to take her sweet time to come around then you might have to consider moving on but you'd also take steps to ensure that you could keep her a part of your life. Not making her mad just becuase you're mad.

I know what I did was stupid. I was just stupid and looking back at what I did it doesn't make any since. I'm not a spiteful person, I don't hold grudges, I don't believe in revenge. And yet I was so mad at her. See the thread, "Is love a type of insanity" for possible insight.

 

Okay see now if you said she was a virgin this would make a whole lot more sense from the first post more then anything and help you a little quicker. The fact that she was testing the waters with another girl, says a lot. The fact that you had a chance says a lot more. Right now I think she just wants sex mostly and to experiment with people she doesn't know too well, kind of an exciting thing probably for her.

Yeah I really think she was testing the waters and just see what sex is like. BTW I'm not saying I had a chance, I actually don't know if I had one or not. Would she have let me kiss her? I don't have a clue. I do think the night when she was at my house was the best opportunity I've ever had.

 

Why would she want to experiment with people she doesn't know well? That doesn't make any sense.

Well maybe she didn't want to look at you everytime and think she lost her virginity to you, a lot of girls think that they want it over with or with someone special, but most of the time the first time sucks, so if she just wanted it over with, then with you, she probably would have ended up avoiding you and from what I can tell she is probably avoiding this guy right now as your reading this.

That's a very interesting point. Would it have been weird for her to look at me in the office and think "I had sex with Somedude" It's probably something she wouldn't be able to tell our mutual friends. Maybe, maybe not. Also I wouldn't just want to have sex with her one time and then be done with her. That's just stupid.

 

She did tell me that her first time sucked. I don't know if she ever saw him again. Though, It's not a question I have a right to ask. Also I would only be fine if she told me that she hasn't seen him since. I don't want to hear about her having sex with other people.

 

Yeah, that was pretty damn stupid I may say. Blowing up at her because you weren't her first, let alone because it was about some other guy and not you, stupid stupid stupid movie!!! I think as far as I can say is give another week of giving her space and then go talk to her, most of the hurt will have blown over by then and she may be willing to actually talk to you, unless you blow up at her again, then your screwed over even more then the last blow up.

Yes I know blowing up with her was stupid. It's probably one of the most stupid things I have ever done in my life. BTW I never told her I want to be her first. I never said I wish she never did that guy. As far as she knows, I'm fine that she had sex with that guy.

 

I did apologize to her a week later after the fight. I even made a thread called "I apologized to her." If we don't go out of our way to see each other I only run into her Tuesdays at work. So the Tuesday after I apologized I made it a point to not go into her work area because I wasn't ready to see her. This week is spring break so we won't see each other. I'm not going to run into her by 4/7/09. She should be totally calm by then but I don't know what to say to her anymore.

 

Very true. I think you make one heck of a valid point. If anyone is worth waiting for, sex wouldn't be at the top of the list in why you need this person. Sex is like number 5 or even 10 for that matter.

 

Second, why now? Was your last relationship that long ago? lol, I mean I haven't had a good relationship in almost two years or been out on a date in almost 2 1/2 years, so why rush? seriously, your bound to find someone, just don't push it, thats when you don't get anyone even when you have options right in front of you. Let nature take it course, as corny as that sounds, you need to let it flow, thats why the good starts happening. Blowing up at someone is not letting it flow, its letting it get messed up for anything...

I have serious hangups over relationships and sex. All I can really say is I've been very unlucky when it comes to girls.

 

I've only actually "dated" and made out with one girl my whole life. I never got past second base with her and we were only "together" for two weeks then she got tired of me. That was 5 or 6 years ago.

 

So it took me till I was 23 to finally kiss a girl and I haven't kissed one since. My sex history is even more strange. If I didn't go out of my way to find sex, I'd be a 27 year old virgin. So letting nature takes it course is something that will not work well for me. So I was rushing because she would have been the first "real girl" that I would have been with. That means so much to me.

Best bet would have been about a few more months, I mean you waited more then 5, why not wait a few more? its a true test to see if your heart really wanted her or your d**k was the voice of reason because of the fact you wanted to be her first. Any guy that has feelings for a girl will have a lot of respect for her first off to let sex be the main reason why you need to be with her, sex may happen, but not asap thats for sure. It takes time if your friends to even go down that path, trust me, I've been there. You should of given it more time, like another few months to even consider trying to maybe kiss her or even try and kiss her right in the first month of knowing her.

I would have been fine waiting a few more months to try and have sex with her. But her having sex with that guy was a complete shock to me. It felt like all the time, energy, closeness and emotions I had put on her were wasted. Everything changed that day.

 

I do see that my biggest problem was that I didn't try to kiss her sooner. If I had tried to kiss her in the first month that we hung out, whether she rejected me or not things would have turned out differently than they are now. We'd either have stopped hanging out by December and I never would have gotten attached to her, or we'd be having sex by now. Both possibilities are 100 times better than what is happening now.

[Yamaha]

I think you're beating yourself up for no reason. She knew how you felt about her and yet she went out with you on "so called dates" every week. She knew you were falling for her but she liked the attention and ego feed you gave her. If she really is your friend she would not just cut you off and avoid you. She would be concerned about your feelings and give you some time to let the pain ebb ( after telling you she did not like you that way ).

 

Don't take all the blame. She really is not your friend. She used you and now that the truth is out she wants to manipulate you into making you feel guilt.

Don't fall for it. When you see her hold your head high and let her know you don't need or want her. Say "hi" and continue on with your life and find a more deserving women to care for ( and make sure you let her know you want to date for a romantic relationship and not just friends ).