The "Talk" (a sub-thread from "Why I believe best friends shouldn't date")

[Milanista]

they never do. if they did then the entire world would be making out every second of everyday, lol.

 

i mean it can happen where someone is drunk and it doesn't mean anything, once that can only happen, which is okay and what not. But more then once, always means there is something going on especially when your so close to each other that you talk about anything and everything, even things that would turn peoples noses up in horror, like farting or jerking off, which has actually been talked about with my friend, don't ask lol.

 

Anyway, my point is that if two friends are just friends they avoid anything that could lead to kissing or anything sexual of any kind, even if they are tempted they back off, its instinct to do so and its also called self control when your not sexually attracted to someone or desire that person on any level.

 

The thing is, the night before the sober make out.... we were close to kissing but both managed to back off, once her, and once me. The morning after it was initially a play fight, biting, tickling, then poof--- passionate kissing for 2 hours. Later in the day I asked her about it, and she shoots it down saying "Its not love", and that its her fault..... the day after shes even TOUCHIER than ever.... kissing my cheeks etc (Sorry for repeating myself so much, but it doesnt make any sense, i mean... humans never do) Why is this so complicated... i mean, for me, its obvious there is sexual tension between us. When we're drunk, we're quite clingy, when we're sober, we're so close and kinda touchy.

[vanilla87]

The thing is, the night before the sober make out.... we were close to kissing but both managed to back off, once her, and once me. The morning after it was initially a play fight, biting, tickling, then poof--- passionate kissing for 2 hours. Later in the day I asked her about it, and she shoots it down saying "Its not love", and that its her fault..... the day after shes even TOUCHIER than ever.... kissing my cheeks etc (Sorry for repeating myself so much, but it doesnt make any sense, i mean... humans never do) Why is this so complicated... i mean, for me, its obvious there is sexual tension between us. When we're drunk, we're quite clingy, when we're sober, we're so close and kinda touchy.

 

sounds like to me she either has unresolved issues about guys in her past or she doesn't want a relationship of any kind, just wants to kiss ya and probably find you to be a really good kisser. Give it time and let her grow on you. She is bound to realize she likes you sooner or later, more so later, but still she will. I'm a female, I know females and she likes you on some level, but is afraid to admit it period.

[Milanista]

sounds like to me she either has unresolved issues about guys in her past or she doesn't want a relationship of any kind,....

 

I know females and she likes you on some level, but is afraid to admit it period.

 

She had a good friend who became a BF that ended badly - they dont talk anymore. I think she got really hurt, and is afraid of it happening to me. But I have a feeling that she likes me but wont allow herself to or is afraid to tell me. We made a promise that if anything ever got in our way, we will always be friends...

[MagicRat09]

 

Anyway, my point is that i can let go if I wanted to, but I kind of figured that ever since last year, that this time was different and that I don't think i'll get over him, but i think I can let him go if i need to do so. it'll be hard, but if it comes down to it, i could do it....

 

I know you can, I've been thinking about that too, if I have to move on I will. As I always have.But here's hoping we don't have to.

[vanilla87]

I know you can, I've been thinking about that too, if I have to move on I will. As I always have.But here's hoping we don't have to.

 

lol, i know it would be nice to end up with him, but its a 50/50 shot to hell if it happens, lol. Anyway, I'm going to go off an stay busy and not think about him and hang out with friends. I'll probably be back later to help anyone else out on this thread.... leave what you want I'll play catch up with everyone tonight!

[Milanista]

Look, I'm not ready to jump head first into a relationship of any kind beyond friendship with him or any guy right now, I've got unresolved issues about an ex that prevents me from trusting guys, yet I trust my friend with my life in his hands, but thats cause he is a good medic in general. I'm not going to be selfish and demand him to make up his mind, thats ludicrous first off, I mean seriously shake up a 7 year friendship just cause i have feelings for him!? lmao you really don't get it do you? I mean I'm not the type of person to do that to someone that I've known for years. I'm more willing to do that to someone I just met who I like, because there is nothing to lose if you take a risk like that. I know the saying "the higher the stakes the higher the risk...", but still thats not how I go about making the right attempt in telling someone this. I always make sure that there is nothing holding me back or him as well emotionally so either one of us can be open to the possiblity of it happening. I know there is no right time to do it, but there is a right way to go about it and your suggesting something that is too out of left field.

 

I feel exactly the same as you. Some of my friends suggest that I'm being 'used'... its a horrible way to put it. I mean it in the sense that I might be being used to fill in what she doesn't have. She said to me once - before we got really really close, that she relies on friends for these kinds of things (cuddling etc).... so I can't help but feel that I might only be there as a go to. Whats happened to us has only happened really in the last 3 months. Like in that "Why you shouldn't date best friends" thread... I'm at that point where I have to either choose something more or friendship.

 

If, in fact, she doesn't have feelings for me, I should really blame her for teasing me like this, but I can't help but think its my fault as well (I could've said no.... but my friend thinks that I shouldn't take the blame because she KNOWS how I feel yet still insists on being all close to me even if she made it clear she doesn't want to hurt me). It sounds selfish both ways....

 

But in your case, I really hope it works out, because us (the in love with best friends people) have each other, and it feels nice to have others in common.

I may seem stubborn and reluctant, but I'm not dumb, just smart enough to know that my instincts tell me what I see and hear, which with him always contradict each other when it comes to him telling me he wants more then friendship. I'm pretty much onto him at this point about what's really going on, actually i've always known the truth, just never had the correct amount of guts to call him out on it. Oh well, in due time, my waiting will pay off...

I really wish it was simpler for us!

 

By the way, I didn't mention earlier, thanks for your replies! It feels nice to have others that 'care'... if you know what I mean. The best way to stop thinking about the dilemma in my head and heart is to remain busy as Vanilla mentioned. In fact, I read in another thread about your age.... heh-- I'm only a year younger.

[MagicRat09]

You're not being used in the sense that she's evil or doesn't care about you; but we all gravitate to people who validate us and make us feel good. A lot of people like the idea of getting all the benefits of a relationship without having to go all the way and do the work that comes with a commitment.

 

Mine asked me to see her on Valentine's day, and I almost said no because I suspected that I was, in a way, just a stand in for the ex she was still pining for. I went and had a good time but with my eyes open wide.

[Milanista]

You're not being used in the sense that she's evil or doesn't care about you; but we all gravitate to people who validate us and make us feel good. A lot of people like the idea of getting all the benefits of a relationship without having to go all the way and do the work that comes with a commitment.

 

No no, I completely agree with you that shes not evil and that she cares about me... but I think she's using our friendship to her advantage (Im trying my best for this to not sound horrible).

 

It irritates me a bit though. But looking back over the long talk (it just happened on msn... i know its a bit cowardish to have it on MSn but it just happened out of the blue).. When I told her that I could see myself falling for her in the future, she started crying, got all upset and blamed her self, and we promised that it was all good and that we'd fight it.... I felt like I had a huge weight lifted off my chest and that I knew nothing was there. During that big talk, she was saying how caring for a close friend and caring for a boyfriend is very similar, we then spoke about what the limits are of being close friends. I clearly said that kissing/sex is too far for good friends... she agreed... yet we kissed afterwards a few weeks later.

 

By looking over the conversation, it looks more and more likely that there's nothing there based on what shes saying, but this is still before the whole couply-behaviour.

 

Deep inside, I've been trying to protect myself by thinking negative about the outcomes - thats just me, I'm a pessimist - and I really believe that we will have the same conversation again, I"m going to feel good about myself again, then something will happen between us that will kick it all off again. But I'm going to try the whole "limit contact" thing first. In fact, I'm away for a week where as she's away for 3 weeks... but we are both on msn quite often... I'm going to avoid starting convos with her or going online too much.

 

But like Vanilla said previously, sorry for constantly repeating myself or rambling - she might have issues with getting too close, because she lost a best friend because of this a while ago.

[MagicRat09]

I lost a friend once too when I got too close. She was a young girl, troubled, had spent time in an institution. We had a lot of fun but she was seeing someone, and I think she finally realized we had to stop. We sort of had an emotional affair, she leaned on me a lot when her BF wasn't around. It was very sad.

[WTRanger]

Say you've had a rough time lately, life has basically been taking it's sweet time dropping a nice steamer right on your chest. The girl in my case said something to me around the lines of that she feels angry sometimes when she talks to me because of how seemingly depressed I sound. I won't lie, I'm not exactly going through the sweetest time in my life right now and these are all things happening to me outside of what is going on between me and her. Somehow, everything bad seems related to each other even though they are not.

 

I know when she was going through a rough time], she was really depressed and it made me really frustrated and angry at times. Frustrated that I cared so much about her and the she was depressed and I really felt powerless to do anything about it. Her life could be much worse than it was. Which, in turn, is what I think she's trying to say to me.

 

So I guess the question is. Does seeing someone you care about in a little rut of depression make you angry? Angry that the depressed person won't just snap out of it? Or is she just telling me in a nice, extremely vague way to piss off or that she's upset because the attention isn't focused back on her. Or am I just once again over thinking this thing and getting myself all confused over nothing?

 

Not that I sought her out or dumped on her, we were talking and she moved the topic over to what was going on in my life and it sort of took off. By nature, I'm probably the least depressed person I know. I always find humor in any situation, but lately life has just really beat me up. Sometimes it's just good to have a "whoa is me" moment and right now, for me, now is the time for that.

 

I was doing some pondering today and I'm really starting to wonder if the lopsided amount of effort I've been putting into this, even the friendship, was really worth it. Somehow I feel used by the whole deal. She got the support she needed and now when I need her, she's giving me some support but she's using a 10ft pole to do it with.

 

I know it's just one of the many stages in the waiting room of this whole friends/relationship/talk/confusing/conundrum, but still.... Right now I'd just like to get things resolved, which she again refuses to even consider. Anytime I try to steer her towards the fact that there is some unresolved issues, she backs away. It's starting to get really frustrating right now. I don't want to push the issue and make her snap, but sometimes I feel that's the easiest way out. Just end it in one gigantic argument. Done. Seal the deal. I move on, she moves on. Say all of the nasty and hurtful things I've been thinking lately.

 

I won't do that, but damn. I wonder......

[MagicRat09]

My situation "Post-Talk" and "friendzoning"

 

Update and bump:

 

I actually felt fine afterwards, better than I had in a while. I was anticipating her to react exactly as she did. Only days after the "declaration", she asked me to hang out (in a group). I said I was busy, which I was. She asked me again just a day later, again I was busy. The third time she asked me to hang out, alone, I agreed. I implemented a strategy of showing her that everything was fine, just as it was, and I was ok being friends. We had an amazing time, we were the same as we always were. She acted EXACTLY the same to me as she always has, as if I'd never told her my feelings.

 

Except: she stopped talking about "other boys" completely. I had a better time than I had with her in months because I was relaxed and no longer felt the pressure to say something or make a move.

 

Here comes the most unusual part. This girl likes to document her life, through pictures and camera video, and she posts dozens of pictures of her and me hanging out together, plus loads of videos, on FB. She sends me videos of herself just talking, she comments on my page, constantly refers to me on her own page.

 

Our mutual friends are beginning to think we're together, but it's entirely her doing! I never send her videos, comment on her page or tag her in photos. However she is practically making a documentary of our "relationship".

 

It's like the world is watching and rooting for us, and she's holding back while somehow escalating the intensity at the same time. She's even baffled my therapist!

 

So that's where we are.

JCat

[Charles1978]

My situation "Post-Talk" and "friendzoning"

 

Update and bump:

 

I actually felt fine afterwards, better than I had in a while. I was anticipating her to react exactly as she did. Only days after the "declaration", she asked me to hang out (in a group). I said I was busy, which I was. She asked me again just a day later, again I was busy. The third time she asked me to hang out, alone, I agreed. I implemented a strategy of showing her that everything was fine, just as it was, and I was ok being friends. We had an amazing time, we were the same as we always were. She acted EXACTLY the same to me as she always has, as if I'd never told her my feelings.

 

Except: she stopped talking about "other boys" completely. I had a better time than I had with her in months because I was relaxed and no longer felt the pressure to say something or make a move.

 

Here comes the most unusual part. This girl likes to document her life, through pictures and camera video, and she posts dozens of pictures of her and me hanging out together, plus loads of videos, on FB. She sends me videos of herself just talking, she comments on my page, constantly refers to me on her own page.

 

Our mutual friends are beginning to think we're together, but it's entirely her doing! I never send her videos, comment on her page or tag her in photos. However she is practically making a documentary of our "relationship".

 

It's like the world is watching and rooting for us, and she's holding back while somehow escalating the intensity at the same time. She's even baffled my therapist!

 

So that's where we are.

JCat

Hah sounds like my old situation. Except my experience involved me going to her apartment and seeing pictures of she and I on the walls. That was odd, but I wrote it off as not a big deal. Look, there is some deep-seated issue with her that I do not have the expertise to diagnose. So, I just let it go. We rarely hang out anymore, but like you... it is not becuase she doesn't try. I dodged lunch with her today. I am tired of the games... life is too short, and eventually she'll get the message.

[WTRanger]

Ditto on that Charles! I've decided to stop trying in my situation as well. Things have happened in this month that have finally slammed it home that even the friendship was completely one-sided. I've finally grown tired of the excuses, the avoiding the bigger issues, the hot/cold behavior, and trying to figure someone out who does not want to let anyone close to them. I'm tired of trying and only getting deeper into madness. I've washed my hands of the whole mess. I've suddenly found myself not caring what happens. It's strange. Almost like a light switch was turned on.

 

I have noticed that the more I pull back, the more she tries. The less I care, the more she cares. Where the hell was this when I was putting in all of the effort? It's like we're both playing tug of war but when one side is pulling the other side just lets go. Nothing gets accomplished!

 

I'm not saying that I don't care about her on some level and I'm sure she cares about me on some level. But these games are stupid and they solve nothing. Besides, we'll never get the levels to meet up. So I'm done with putting in the extra effort.

 

So I've decided to put my effort into other people who may actually reciprocate the effort without any of the bullsh*t excuses, head games, etc. If we stay friends, fine. If not, that's fine too. I'll remember the fun times I had with her and move on with my life anticipating who I'll meet next.

[MagicRat09]

Well said Ranger! Kudos

[WTRanger]

Let's just put it this way. I care enough not to care.