He gave up the porn...why can't I get over it?

[Inspector71]

Bravo..... Well said. She is so over the place, it is hard to figure everything out. For instance she has claimed in one place they have been married 4 years, other places 2. She is 25, yet yet claims at 23 she had already been alone for 10 (making her 13) and single for 5 (since 18).....

 

They have been separated multiple times. When I brought up her post of March 6 in another section, she claims that was 2 reconciliations ago!!!!!

 

I will reiterate and apologies to Inspector71, that there is no such a thing as a 59 yo who is "in place" with 20 yo as she claims.

 

Add to that he is a 59 virile, stud??? Sorry if I find that unbelievable.

 

The good news is he never had kids and there is only a divorce that is 30+ years ago.

 

And finally to Reggie, you are telling me a $400,000 401K for the most respected Professor in the country (in his field) that has been amassed by a 59 yo is good???? Remember he has no immediate family (maybe parents) and has been a single male. Maybe if he has multiple millions in Real Estate, which again if so shows that Inspector71 has again left out a huge chunk of the story and better not sign the post nup.

 

I can't keep up with her stories.

 

 

I NEVER said I was married for four years! Anywhere! I didn't know where that came from, and I still don't. If you can find where I said 4 years, I'd like to see it. If I did, it was a typo- but I've NEVER claimed to be married four years. Also, please re-read my post. I said HE was living alone for ten years before me and single for five years; not me! What is your problem?

[Inspector71]

Reggie,

 

Everyone is entitled to their opinions. The OP can do with them what she wants. It really doesn't matter what she does or doesn't do. None of it will affect any of us. Only her.

 

It's my opinion she should divorce because this man demonstrates utter lack of respect for her AS A PERSON and AS A WOMAN.

 

I repeat, where there is no respect, there is no love. She deserves better.

 

Hey, if this OP finds this man attractive, so be it.

 

I don't. Not so much because of the age difference, but because of his behavior. Would you want your daughter married to a man that would treat her the way this man treats the OP?

 

And if she felt so fulfilled, she wouldn't be posting.

 

Yes, life is full of trade offs. OK, she has traded respect for...what?

 

I have been sticking this out because of the good times. When the times are bad- yes, they are horrible. But when times are good, it's the best time of my life- I've never been happier. No contest. We have the most amazing time together, we mesh on so many levels, and we compliment each other in so many other ways. All that is SO hard to let go. I never wanted mediocre. What I have with him when times are good is SUBLIME.

[Inspector71]

Yes, Anthony, I would still like to hear from some 25 year old males. I want to hear from them why or why they would not marry a 60 year old woman.

 

And I would love to hear from any 25 yo who is happily married to a 60 yo....

 

Or anyone who knows of a 25 yo married successfully to a 60 yo.

 

There is a reason why these unions are far and few between. Good reasons.

 

Michael Douglas and Catherine Zeta-Jones...25 years, I think?

 

Clint Eastwood and Dina Eastwood- 35 year age difference.

 

It happens outside of Hollywood, I'm sure.

[soserious1]

Yes, Anthony, I would still like to hear from some 25 year old males. I want to hear from them why or why they would not marry a 60 year old woman.

 

And I would love to hear from any 25 yo who is happily married to a 60 yo....

 

Or anyone who knows of a 25 yo married successfully to a 60 yo.

 

There is a reason why these unions are far and few between. Good reasons.

 

I'm female, in my early 50's and divorced, I've had exactly one sexual encouter/date with a man I met on craig's list, I paid for the entire evening.

 

I haven't had so much as a glance from a man in my age range let alone from a 25 yr old and I'm slim and reasonably well kept.

 

OP, you've asked specifically about the porn... I'm not sure how to advise you, I can tell you from my experience that knowing that my ex would decline sex with me using all sorts of excuses but find plenty of time and energy to self-pleasure with porn was really hurtful..over time his hurtful behaviors in this area grew to the point that I felt about an inch tall. I think that once you're doubting your sexuality and how desirable you are to your partner the relationship is basically toast.. Btw, some people, due to their own issues rather like it when they keep you feeling low and like you aren't worthy.. it's about control.

[Reggie]

Reggie,

 

Everyone is entitled to their opinions. The OP can do with them what she wants. It really doesn't matter what she does or doesn't do. None of it will affect any of us. Only her.

 

It's my opinion she should divorce because this man demonstrates utter lack of respect for her AS A PERSON and AS A WOMAN.

 

I repeat, where there is no respect, there is no love. She deserves better.

 

Hey, if this OP finds this man attractive, so be it.

 

I don't. Not so much because of the age difference, but because of his behavior. Would you want your daughter married to a man that would treat her the way this man treats the OP?

 

And if she felt so fulfilled, she wouldn't be posting.

 

Yes, life is full of trade offs. OK, she has traded respect for...what?

 

Yes, but Taylor, we have posters on this forum that remain married to WSs and many here do not advocate divorcing them if they are renmorseful and willing to do the work. Many of the books on infidelity list infidelity as the most severe form of emotional abuse and the utmost display of disrespect.

So, if her H is addressing the porn and thepast abuse, as she says he has, isn't it a bit of a double standard to single his past abuse and disrespect out as justification for divorcing.

If we follow your logic, a Ws should not be given a second chance. I think cheating with another person clearly is worse abuse than porn use and occassional unwillingness to have sex.

Please explain why cheaters, who, by definition are abusers and disrespectful should all not be divorced.

[taylor]

Yes, but Taylor, we have posters on this forum that remain married to WSs and many here do not advocate divorcing them if they are renmorseful and willing to do the work. Many of the books on infidelity list infidelity as the most severe form of emotional abuse and the utmost display of disrespect.

So, if her H is addressing the porn and thepast abuse, as she says he has, isn't it a bit of a double standard to single his past abuse and disrespect out as justification for divorcing.

If we follow your logic, a Ws should not be given a second chance. I think cheating with another person clearly is worse abuse than porn use and occassional unwillingness to have sex.

Please explain why cheaters, who, by definition are abusers and disrespectful should all not be divorced.

 

Reggie,

 

I truly do hear what you are saying here.

 

I believe there are 4 things that make a marriage work: Respect, Compatibility, Responsibility, and Generosity (time, attention, affection, support...NOT money).

 

At the top of the list, though, is RESPECT. If you don't have respect it really doesn't matter if you have the other three.

 

It is true that when WS cheat the very act is disrespectful to the BS, as are the lies, the desceptions, etc. The WS disrespects their spouse, their marriage, their vows, and, if made before God, they disrespect God. They also disrespect themselves by compromising their value system in order to carry out the affair in many cases (they become someone temporarily who they truly are not).

 

But in our OP's case, the disrespect appears to stem from how he view HER as a person. He criticizes how she looks and how she talks. He is critical of her family. He doesn't seem to value the person that she is..WHO she is. He doesn't seem to hold her in high regard as a person.

 

She, on the other hand, can't stop singing the praises of this guy. He's brilliant, he's talented, he's virile, he's amazing in bed...HE'S PERFECT.

 

But I just don't get the feeling he feels this amount of admiration/appreciation/respect for her. I just don't see it.

 

A WS certainly disrespects his spouse by an irresponsible act(s) of infidelity. But it doesn't mean that they don't find their spouse to be a good, decent, wonderful, intelligent, beautiful, amazing PERSON.

 

In my case, I never lost sight of the VALUE of my husband. He IS the best person I have ever met in my life. But I couldn't connect with him when our marriage deteriorated and once the marriage broke down, it became vulnerable to an affair.

 

My affair, and I would venture to say, many affairs do NOT occur because we believe our spouses have lost all the good qualities we saw in them AS PEOPLE when we married them. Even during my affair I would have said my husband was the best person I had ever met. He has the best qualities I have ever seen in a person, let alone a husband. I truly did affair-down with the OM in search of an emotional connection. It's those good qualities in my husband that made it quick (not easy) for me to recommit to him and our marriage.

 

But the thing is I am just not so sure this OP's husband would rave about her in the same way she raves on and on about him. I just don't see the same respect..the same admiration...the same appreciation...for her as a person.

 

 

Perhaps she can shed some light. OP?

[taylor]

OP, you've asked specifically about the porn... I'm not sure how to advise you, I can tell you from my experience that knowing that my ex would decline sex with me using all sorts of excuses but find plenty of time and energy to self-pleasure with porn was really hurtful..over time his hurtful behaviors in this area grew to the point that I felt about an inch tall. I think that once you're doubting your sexuality and how desirable you are to your partner the relationship is basically toast.. Btw, some people, due to their own issues rather like it when they keep you feeling low and like you aren't worthy.. it's about control.

 

OP, I hope you take time to reread this post. SoSerious tells you straight up what porn can do to a woman's sense of self and self-esteem.

 

I think women who have tons of self-esteem struggle less with porn issues, especially those who feel like they have the "upper hand" in a relationship.

 

But women like you who struggle with self-esteem issues are going to find the porn issue much more challenging to cope with.

 

You say he used it only while you were separated. From my seat over here in the peanut gallery, I don't see this as him choosing porn over you..you were separated. Aside from having an affair or spending all the money in a joint account, I don't really think it was much of your business what he did while you were separated. His time was his time to do with what he wanted. He was no longer accountable to you in terms of how he spent his time.

 

As far as him masturbating..I think you said that bothered you, too, right? If he is choosing to masturbate instead of having sex with you (rejecting you in order to masturbate) then you two have a sex problem that you need to talk about. You need to find out why he would rather masterbate than climax with you. Maybe his orgasm from masterbating is stronger than any that he gets with you. Ask him. If that's the case, have him teach you what to do to make his orgasms stronger.

 

I wouldn't worry too much if he is masturbating and providing you with lots of good sex. It's two different types of experiences that he enjoys having. Why begrudge him from finding pleasure in his own body as long as he is satisfying your sexual needs.

 

I think this all comes down to self-esteem and by the way he treats you (from what you have written) I am not surprised you have esteem issues.

[taylor]

Michael Douglas and Catherine Zeta-Jones...25 years, I think?

 

Clint Eastwood and Dina Eastwood- 35 year age difference.

 

It happens outside of Hollywood, I'm sure.

 

How happy are their marriages? Do you know?

 

And what about the younger man/older woman, say 25 to 35 year age difference?

 

Recently Mel Gibson's wife filed for divorce. Gibson, 53, is having an affair with a 24 year old woman. She says they are in love and she hopes it's a lasting union. How long do you think it will last? It will be interesting to see what transpires. I think they've been together since Aug. 2008.

 

It really would be beneficial for some spouses in May-December marriages to post here. Their insight would educate all of us.

[taylor]

I have been sticking this out because of the good times. When the times are bad- yes, they are horrible. But when times are good, it's the best time of my life- I've never been happier. No contest. We have the most amazing time together, we mesh on so many levels, and we compliment each other in so many other ways. All that is SO hard to let go. I never wanted mediocre. What I have with him when times are good is SUBLIME.

 

I hear you, Inspector71. A guy can make you feel like you are in heaven...like all of the planets have alligned perfectly..and as if the sun will never stop shining. I know, I have been there.

 

But I will tell you something my mom told me about relationships. Not that I ever listened to her, even though I knew she was right, but I still feel compelled to share (lol)

 

When a relationship starts hurting you more than it is uplifting you, it is time to move on. A relationship is supposed to ADD to your life..enhance it...not TAKE FROM your life...reduce it.

 

Assess your marriage. Do the math.

 

Ask yourself if it is possible..POSSIBLE...to turn it into something that will and can bring joy and peace into your life. But remember, WANTING and BEING ABLE TO are not the same thing.

 

The good thing is you do not have children together so that does not have to figure into the mathematical equation. Kids make the calculation so much more difficult.

[Reggie]

Yes, but Taylor, she says he is addressing the past abuse, just like a Ws must adress and repair the past abuse. If that is the case, there is no difference.

Most WSs demonize their spouses while in the throes of an affair, so there is no respect going on. Yet, if they wake up, accept responsibility, and do the hard work, the marriage may survivie and become good.

I think the age thing bothers you and that is what you feel distinguishes this case. It is what you brought up right away, not the abuse. You focused on that to the exclusion of abuse, citing your own feelings on the attactiveness of older men.

I take no issue with your own personal preferences in that regard, just like I have no problem with older women preferring younger guys. Folks have very different preferences in these areas.

So, if this young woamn loves this guy and is attracted to him and he shows he is willing to work on their issues, I think it is out of line to tell her she should divorce him for the way he was in the past. It is very difficult for me to draw a meaningful distinction between past cheating, which is about as abusive as it gets, IMO, and the types of deficiencies he may have displayed.

[Reggie]

I agree with Taylor on making a decent assessment. It is tough to know, however.

For what it is worth, I was married to a woman 16 years younger than me and we had 3 kids. In my estimation, whe was personality disordered , so this may not be representative. But, it was the lonliest existence I have ever known. If not for my kids, who all started exceeding her intellectual capability at around age 7, it would have been worse.

I was relatively recently divorced from a woman who had serially cheated and left me to raise my two sons, one with severe handicaps, alone. This 27 year old who looked like she stepped out of a Victoria's Secret Catalogue was all over me and "accidentally" became pregnant. I was pretty good looking at the time , in really good shape.

Anyway, from my perspective, it simply was not a good idea to marry someone so much younger. It ain't al lits cracked up to be.It was a nightmare for my two boys and I am relieved that she resurrected her past habit of cheating which allowed me to get out.

[Inspector71]

Reggie,

 

I truly do hear what you are saying here.

 

I believe there are 4 things that make a marriage work: Respect, Compatibility, Responsibility, and Generosity (time, attention, affection, support...NOT money).

 

At the top of the list, though, is RESPECT. If you don't have respect it really doesn't matter if you have the other three.

 

It is true that when WS cheat the very act is disrespectful to the BS, as are the lies, the desceptions, etc. The WS disrespects their spouse, their marriage, their vows, and, if made before God, they disrespect God. They also disrespect themselves by compromising their value system in order to carry out the affair in many cases (they become someone temporarily who they truly are not).

 

But in our OP's case, the disrespect appears to stem from how he view HER as a person. He criticizes how she looks and how she talks. He is critical of her family. He doesn't seem to value the person that she is..WHO she is. He doesn't seem to hold her in high regard as a person.

 

She, on the other hand, can't stop singing the praises of this guy. He's brilliant, he's talented, he's virile, he's amazing in bed...HE'S PERFECT.

 

But I just don't get the feeling he feels this amount of admiration/appreciation/respect for her. I just don't see it.

 

A WS certainly disrespects his spouse by an irresponsible act(s) of infidelity. But it doesn't mean that they don't find their spouse to be a good, decent, wonderful, intelligent, beautiful, amazing PERSON.

 

In my case, I never lost sight of the VALUE of my husband. He IS the best person I have ever met in my life. But I couldn't connect with him when our marriage deteriorated and once the marriage broke down, it became vulnerable to an affair.

 

My affair, and I would venture to say, many affairs do NOT occur because we believe our spouses have lost all the good qualities we saw in them AS PEOPLE when we married them. Even during my affair I would have said my husband was the best person I had ever met. He has the best qualities I have ever seen in a person, let alone a husband. I truly did affair-down with the OM in search of an emotional connection. It's those good qualities in my husband that made it quick (not easy) for me to recommit to him and our marriage.

 

But the thing is I am just not so sure this OP's husband would rave about her in the same way she raves on and on about him. I just don't see the same respect..the same admiration...the same appreciation...for her as a person.

 

 

Perhaps she can shed some light. OP?

 

 

Yeah, I don't know. My husband would say that he married me because he thinks I'm an amazing person. This is someone who wasn't married for 30 years prior to me; wasn't living with someone for ten years prior; single for 5. He would say he came out of "hibernation" because he thought I was truly extrodinary...well, maybe he wouldn't say those words. You have to remember the generation and sex difference here. He was raised to be the strong man- not sappy or emotional. When pressed, in the past, my husband has said that he married me because he didn't like the breaks I was getting (i.e., serious illness, etc.) and he wanted to give me a great life. My husband believes that the most rewarding things you do are those things you do for others. While I don't appreciate the "charity case" aspect of this, I know him, and I know that simply "being with someone" doesn't rank high on his list. But there are those times since our separation where he opens up...how he wishes he could go back in time and take back the mean things he said. How, despite what he has said, believes that I'm the most beautiful woman in the world. How his world is only right when I'm OK and in his arms. The truly sentimental comments are few and far between...but again, he was raised in a different generation. You all should read Steve Harvey's new book- Act like a Lady, Think Like a Man. He says that no one loves like a woman- that men love in a different way. My husband does love me...he just has his own way of showing it.

[Inspector71]

OP, I hope you take time to reread this post. SoSerious tells you straight up what porn can do to a woman's sense of self and self-esteem.

 

I think women who have tons of self-esteem struggle less with porn issues, especially those who feel like they have the "upper hand" in a relationship.

 

But women like you who struggle with self-esteem issues are going to find the porn issue much more challenging to cope with.

 

You say he used it only while you were separated. From my seat over here in the peanut gallery, I don't see this as him choosing porn over you..you were separated. Aside from having an affair or spending all the money in a joint account, I don't really think it was much of your business what he did while you were separated. His time was his time to do with what he wanted. He was no longer accountable to you in terms of how he spent his time.

 

As far as him masturbating..I think you said that bothered you, too, right? If he is choosing to masturbate instead of having sex with you (rejecting you in order to masturbate) then you two have a sex problem that you need to talk about. You need to find out why he would rather masterbate than climax with you. Maybe his orgasm from masterbating is stronger than any that he gets with you. Ask him. If that's the case, have him teach you what to do to make his orgasms stronger.

 

I wouldn't worry too much if he is masturbating and providing you with lots of good sex. It's two different types of experiences that he enjoys having. Why begrudge him from finding pleasure in his own body as long as he is satisfying your sexual needs.

 

I think this all comes down to self-esteem and by the way he treats you (from what you have written) I am not surprised you have esteem issues.

 

He doesn't masturbate while we are together, to the best of my knowledge. If he does, I'm sure I'm better off not knowing. He doesn't give me all the sex I want when we are together- but I'm pretty far above the mean for a 59 year old man, I would guess.

 

The issue is simply this- if he can masturbate daily for a week straight when we aren't together, why can't he have sex with me everyday for a week straight when we are? What's the difference? I do have feelings of rejection...when he turns me down for sex, I can't help but feel a little bitter- like, "How come you can't have sex? You could masturbate everyday."

 

I can see what you are saying about it being "his time", but really- I view porn as a form of infidelity. Even if we are separated, as long as we are working on the marriage, isn't he required to still be faithful? We aren't even legally separated- we've always been working on the relationship. I just think that behavior should still reflect being married as long as you are still in a committed marriage- we were not physically together, but we were working on our marriage.

[Inspector71]

How happy are their marriages? Do you know?

 

And what about the younger man/older woman, say 25 to 35 year age difference?

 

Recently Mel Gibson's wife filed for divorce. Gibson, 53, is having an affair with a 24 year old woman. She says they are in love and she hopes it's a lasting union. How long do you think it will last? It will be interesting to see what transpires. I think they've been together since Aug. 2008.

 

It really would be beneficial for some spouses in May-December marriages to post here. Their insight would educate all of us.

 

The Gibson thing is different...the research says that 98% of marriages that begin as affairs end in divorce. I believe it's a rare thing to come out of a marriage, and your first relationship being one with staying power.

 

I agree...they need to have a May/December forum, although I'm not sure how many of us there are. I don't think there are a lot of younger men/older women situations. The man would have to be convinced that he didn't want any children, and I wonder how many young men are convinced of that enough to marry someone 25-35 years older. Men don't have the clock ticking, so younger woman/older man works (in that aspect).

[Inspector71]

I hear you, Inspector71. A guy can make you feel like you are in heaven...like all of the planets have alligned perfectly..and as if the sun will never stop shining. I know, I have been there.

 

But I will tell you something my mom told me about relationships. Not that I ever listened to her, even though I knew she was right, but I still feel compelled to share (lol)

 

When a relationship starts hurting you more than it is uplifting you, it is time to move on. A relationship is supposed to ADD to your life..enhance it...not TAKE FROM your life...reduce it.

 

Assess your marriage. Do the math.

 

Ask yourself if it is possible..POSSIBLE...to turn it into something that will and can bring joy and peace into your life. But remember, WANTING and BEING ABLE TO are not the same thing.

 

The good thing is you do not have children together so that does not have to figure into the mathematical equation. Kids make the calculation so much more difficult.

 

I know what you mean. I just...I can't. I can't let go yet. I don't know if I'm not in the right place; and maybe having hope is overrated. Every time I've gone back to him to try to work on this, it's ended badly. I feel like I'm harboring bitterness and resentment; I don't think we can move forward meaningfully while I have these feelings. However, we DEFINITELY can't move forward while he still behaves the way he does when he's upset. A big part of me wants to go back to him one more time, watch it fall apart one more time...I don't know when enough is enough. When I'm finally going to learn that he'll never change, and I need to move on with my life. All I know is how bad I miss him when I don't talk to him everyday...how the thought of not being with him just crushes me. The pain is too intense; I feel like I won't survive it. I know a lot of people feel like this in divorce, but I don't WANT to, and it's kind of in my power. I can go back to my husband permanently, whenever I want. Making the choice to end it once and for all is so much to bear...I'll still have to see him at professional conferences, read about him, etc....I doubt that I'll ever be OK with that. That ending it will be the biggest mistake I've ever made, and I've got to live with that mistake for the rest of my life- seeing him, reading about him, being constantly reminded of him. I just can't make that choice yet.

[Inspector71]

OP, I hope you take time to reread this post. SoSerious tells you straight up what porn can do to a woman's sense of self and self-esteem.

 

I think women who have tons of self-esteem struggle less with porn issues, especially those who feel like they have the "upper hand" in a relationship.

 

But women like you who struggle with self-esteem issues are going to find the porn issue much more challenging to cope with.

 

You say he used it only while you were separated. From my seat over here in the peanut gallery, I don't see this as him choosing porn over you..you were separated. Aside from having an affair or spending all the money in a joint account, I don't really think it was much of your business what he did while you were separated. His time was his time to do with what he wanted. He was no longer accountable to you in terms of how he spent his time.

 

As far as him masturbating..I think you said that bothered you, too, right? If he is choosing to masturbate instead of having sex with you (rejecting you in order to masturbate) then you two have a sex problem that you need to talk about. You need to find out why he would rather masterbate than climax with you. Maybe his orgasm from masterbating is stronger than any that he gets with you. Ask him. If that's the case, have him teach you what to do to make his orgasms stronger.

 

I wouldn't worry too much if he is masturbating and providing you with lots of good sex. It's two different types of experiences that he enjoys having. Why begrudge him from finding pleasure in his own body as long as he is satisfying your sexual needs.

 

I think this all comes down to self-esteem and by the way he treats you (from what you have written) I am not surprised you have esteem issues.

 

Oh, hell yes it's about control. I absolutely believe that, and it's one of the big reasons I harbor bitterness for my husband. It's "putting me in a place" where he has absolute power over the way I think and feel...he would deny it to the end of the numbers, but there is no other explanation for what he does to me. (i.e., while I'm trying to make a point, he corrects my word usage and grammar- I get to feeling so stupid that I am afraid to express myself because of the fear of being so harshly criticized. The result? I keep my mouth shut = more peace for him)

 

My self-esteem is terribly low. I don't think the porn thing would bother me like it does if I had high self-esteem. I'd be more logical (although I would still consider it infidelity...another issue...). I'd see that it's easier for a man to masturbate than have sex, so of course he can do that simple act everyday but not "perform" everyday. And he didn't watch it when I was around- he watched it when I was in a different state. He doesn't choose it over me.

 

But, as much as I wish I was that woman...I'm not. Just typing that made me want to vomit. I picture in my head the times when we were together where he just "didn't want to have sex". I sit here and I get angry over how understanding I was about him not wanting to have sex everyday...but now I know he could masturbate everyday. It makes me want to hate him.

[taylor]

When pressed, in the past, my husband has said that he married me because he didn't like the breaks I was getting (i.e., serious illness, etc.) and he wanted to give me a great life. My husband believes that the most rewarding things you do are those things you do for others. While I don't appreciate the "charity case" aspect of this, I know him,

 

First let me say I truly have no agenda here. I truly am not trying to "win" a debate or something.

 

Second let me say that I truly do want to put the age difference issue to rest and focus on the specifics.

 

With that said, however, I can't help but say that from reading the above your husband sounds more like a caring father figure than a husband or equal partner, if you will.

 

Some women look for that in a husband. There are also men who look for nurturing mother figures in their wives.

 

But the dynamic in these relationships, while complementary, are far from equal. The mother or father figure has the upper hand...the control. That can translate into being told what to do or having things done for you..as opposed to you having a role in the decision-making. You run the risk of being treated like a child...scolded, criticized, disciplined. You aren't viewed as an equal, but as a person who is dependent.

 

Please tell me if I am totally off-base here.

 

The truly sentimental comments are few and far between...but again, he was raised in a different generation. You all should read Steve Harvey's new book- Act like a Lady, Think Like a Man. He says that no one loves like a woman- that men love in a different way. My husband does love me...he just has his own way of showing it.

 

I agree men and women don't show love the same way. There are many ways to show love, by word and deed. But the bottom line is whether or not you feel loved by him..truly loved by him. Do you? Does he uphold his vows to love, honor, cherish and respect? How well does he meet your needs on a regular consistent basis?

 

You don't have to answer these questions here. But have you ask them to yourself? Have you really thought about it?

[taylor]

I know what you mean. I just...I can't. I can't let go yet. I don't know if I'm not in the right place; and maybe having hope is overrated. Every time I've gone back to him to try to work on this, it's ended badly. I feel like I'm harboring bitterness and resentment; I don't think we can move forward meaningfully while I have these feelings. However, we DEFINITELY can't move forward while he still behaves the way he does when he's upset. A big part of me wants to go back to him one more time, watch it fall apart one more time...I don't know when enough is enough. When I'm finally going to learn that he'll never change, and I need to move on with my life. All I know is how bad I miss him when I don't talk to him everyday...how the thought of not being with him just crushes me. The pain is too intense; I feel like I won't survive it. I know a lot of people feel like this in divorce, but I don't WANT to, and it's kind of in my power. I can go back to my husband permanently, whenever I want. Making the choice to end it once and for all is so much to bear...I'll still have to see him at professional conferences, read about him, etc....I doubt that I'll ever be OK with that. That ending it will be the biggest mistake I've ever made, and I've got to live with that mistake for the rest of my life- seeing him, reading about him, being constantly reminded of him. I just can't make that choice yet.

 

Ending or saving a marriage. Tough choice. Very tough choice.

 

Although under completely different circumstances, my husband and I were in the same spot one year ago. Our marriage hit rock bottom and I had an emotional affair with a coworker. My husband and I had to decide if we wanted to call it quits or get off our butts, roll up our sleeves and put the broken marriage back together.

 

We decided to recommit. Why? Because through all the hurt, the anger, the frustration, the doom and gloom, WE STILL SAW VALUE IN THE MARRIAGE. We remembered how good it used to be. And we realized where we went wrong.

 

You seem to be at a similar crossroads, seeing as you and your husband are playing this rubberband game...come together, separate, come together again, separate, come together...

 

Inspector71, there is a little voice inside your head and a little one inside your heart that will tell you what the right thing to do is...what is in your best interests. Listen to it. It will speak to you. I guarantee.

 

I learned this past year that the RIGHT THING to do is often THE HARDEST THING to do. I also learned that FEAR often holds us back from doing what we know is the right thing.

 

I truly am not an advocate of divorce. I've been fighting tooth and nail to save my marriage. But there are those here who will tell you that sometimes the writing is on the wall if you care to read it.

 

Only you know what your marriage is and isn't. Only you know who your husband is and who he isn't. Only you know what is in your heart, what is in your head and what your reality is. So only you can make a decision for YOU.

 

You have ALOT of life ahead of you. And you are in some of the best years of your life.Sounds cliche, I know, but it is so true. And life is too short to spend it being miserable..I know, another cliche, but also so very true.

 

Sometimes you have to take a leap of faith into the great unknown. It's scary. And you do have to do it in your own time...when you are ready. When you are certain. Kind of like diving off the high dive. You will know when you are ready. You will find a powerful resolve. And when you make that decision to take that leap of faith you will know it was the right one and you will have no regrets...NO REGRETS.

[taylor]

Oh, hell yes it's about control. I absolutely believe that, and it's one of the big reasons I harbor bitterness for my husband. It's "putting me in a place" where he has absolute power over the way I think and feel...he would deny it to the end of the numbers, but there is no other explanation for what he does to me. (i.e., while I'm trying to make a point, he corrects my word usage and grammar- I get to feeling so stupid that I am afraid to express myself because of the fear of being so harshly criticized. The result? I keep my mouth shut = more peace for him)

 

This is the "children should be seen and not heard" mentality as well as the "teacher/student" mentality. Again, you appear to be in a father-daughter dynamic with your husband, rather than an equal partnerships which most marriages strive for.

 

 

 

My self-esteem is terribly low. I don't think the porn thing would bother me like it does if I had high self-esteem. I'd be more logical (although I would still consider it infidelity...another issue...). I'd see that it's easier for a man to masturbate than have sex, so of course he can do that simple act everyday but not "perform" everyday. And he didn't watch it when I was around- he watched it when I was in a different state. He doesn't choose it over me.

 

Totally understand the loss of self-esteem. The thing is, Inspector71, this loss of self-esteem makes a person weak and vulnerable to powerful forces that will control you. This kind of weakness makes it so difficult for you to try to take charge of your own life..your own destiny. I truly hope somehow, in some way, you can find your self-worth hiding somewhere inside you. You truly do need to take charge of your life..be responsible for decisions that will chart the course of your life. Otherwise you will get tossed to and fro on an endless sea of waves that will crash over you and over you until you drown under the weight. Do you see what I am saying here.

 

With respect to what you say above in terms of masterbation:: If he is masturbating instead of having sex with you he is being selfish. He wants to put the effort into pleasing himself but doesn't want to put the effort in to pleasing you. 'Nuf said.

 

It makes me want to hate him.

 

And this may be just what needs to happen for you to leave him for the last time.

[gopher]

Seriously, men who are married and would rather masturbate are emotionally detached, either to protect themselves or because they do not want to be emotionally intimate with their wife. My ex-wife was a first rate b1tch...she screamed at me constantly about little things, and then she wondered why I didn't want to have sex with her.

 

That's my experience...

[taylor]

Seriously, men who are married and would rather masturbate are emotionally detached, either to protect themselves or because they do not want to be emotionally intimate with their wife. My ex-wife was a first rate b1tch...she screamed at me constantly about little things, and then she wondered why I didn't want to have sex with her.

 

That's my experience...

 

Maybe your wife was a bi*ch because you were emotionally detached or because you didn't want to have sex with her. It's hard to say which comes first..the chicken or the egg.

 

If women are getting emotional needs met, they are usually putty in a guy's hands, not bi*ches, IMO.

 

Interesting and worthwhile point, though, from the male perspective.

 

OP, your thoughts on how this may apply in your situation?

[gopher]

Maybe your wife was a bi*ch because you were emotionally detached or because you didn't want to have sex with her. It's hard to say which comes first..the chicken or the egg.

 

If women are getting emotional needs met, they are usually putty in a guy's hands, not bi*ches, IMO.

 

Interesting and worthwhile point, though, from the male perspective.

 

OP, your thoughts on how this may apply in your situation?

 

In this case the drugs she was using were a factor....and I definitely withdrew from the relationship as she became more and more verbally abusive. Not to mention that she was horniest when she was high.

 

It isn't always the man's fault....

[Reggie]

In this case the drugs she was using were a factor....and I definitely withdrew from the relationship as she became more and more verbally abusive. Not to mention that she was horniest when she was high.

 

It isn't always the man's fault....

 

I know the feeling. Nothing kills desire faster than verbal/emotional abuse. The suggested method for survival includes detachment while one gathers strength to make the final break.

[taylor]

I know the feeling. Nothing kills desire faster than verbal/emotional abuse. The suggested method for survival includes detachment while one gathers strength to make the final break.

 

The OP is also dealing with emotional abuse. Would you also suggest she detach..perhaps masturbate (like gopher), and then gather strength to make a final break...

 

Or do advocate her making changes in the relationship to try to close the emotional gap in the relationship...to work on the emotional intimacy..

 

How would your advice to gopher differ from your advice to inspector71, if at all?

[taylor]

In this case the drugs she was using were a factor....and I definitely withdrew from the relationship as she became more and more verbally abusive. Not to mention that she was horniest when she was high.

 

It isn't always the man's fault....

 

No, I don't think it's all the man's fault. But I don't think it's all the woman's fault, either, as you suggest.

 

But it takes two to make a marriage work and two to let it fall apart.

 

Did you and your wife try to deal with the drug problem? She took drugs..you didn't? Why was she taking drugs?

 

Why mention the "horny" thing? Are you saying the drugs were like a double edged sword...good in that she got horny from them, but bad in that they made her verbally and emotionally abusive?

 

Or are you saying you withdrew from her even when she was horny because you couldn't handle the emotional abuse?

 

Just trying to understand here.