still trying to fix the porn issue I created - any ideas?

[Enema]

So basically you're admitting that on average you divide your energy between porn and your partner but a lot of weeks you have actual sex once but beat off to porn twice ?

 

 

You're still not getting it. To quote myself:

 

I will restate that I think that masturbating and sex drive are unrelated.

 

So I'm not "dividing my energy between sex and porn". They're two completely different things.

 

There have been weeks where I've had sex 5-6 times... but guess what? I still masturbate a few times. They're not related.

 

What will I do with a partner who wants to self-pleasure with porn more than he's intimate with me? that's easy,I'll sleep with other men. I'm no longer interested in serving as the faithful, loving lil'l wifey who goes thru life not getting her needs meet.

 

You shouldn't have gotten married in the first place if your sex drives were so incompatible.

 

My wife and I have very similar libido's. I wouldn't have married her if we weren't satisfied.

 

If any person is unhappy with the frequency of sex in their relationship, I think they should move on rather than trying to change their partner, or force them to have more sex.

[Enema]

Puzzling. Can any other men relate?

 

To be honest I've not known a man to think like that -- most of them seem to vastly prefer sex to masturbation and only masturbate when they can't have sex, in my experience.

 

I suppose that's why I don't have issues with porn.

 

God, I still can't get over that. You really only want sex 1-2 times a week???? :eek:

 

Yep, once or twice a week and I'm fine.

 

I realize that this is different, have had all the blood tests and am perfectly fine, testo is normal. I am young, healthy and exercise frequently.

 

I've even stopped masturbating entirely for 2 months as a test and still only wanted sex 1-2 times a week.

 

This is just normal ol' me.

[Enema]

You know, Enema, I have no issue with anyone who wants to spend time masturbating..but why would a man want to masturbate when he could be making love to his wife/gf?

 

Single guys with no choice but to masturbate are shaking their heads right now.

 

You're viewing it the same way as others in this thread. As if sex and masturbating are either / or. I don't choose sex or masturbating, both of them are separate parts of my life.

 

To try and put it in a terrible analogy: You guys are suggesting that sex costs $2, masturbating costs $1 and I have a $10 pleasure budget each week.

 

Then, I am choosing to have sex twice and spend the rest of my budget with masturbating. It doesn't work like that, I have two separate budgets and they can't borrow from each other.

 

Women have stress, too. But they don't choose to masturbate to relieve it when they have a husband standing outside the door hungry for some loving. If you were that man, would it not bother you that your wife was choosing to masturbate to relieve stress, rather than open that bedroom door and let you in?

 

This situation would only annoy me if I had sex needs that weren't being met. If I was happy (because I was getting it 1/2 times a week) then she could masturbate to relieve stress all she wants.

 

The problem with most people in this thread seems to be mismatched sex drives with their partner, then trying to force them to be like you.

 

FWIW, exercise is another great stress reliever.

I exercise frequently too. That's a different budget again

[Brulee]

I guess I do not understand this subject very well at all. Given a choice I would always pick actual sex with a partner, over masturbation. As a matter of fact, I am perfectly happy with an active sex life, without any masturbation. Maybe this is part of my problem in lacking the compassion to understand him. I always thought masturbation was for when there was nobody there to enjoy sex with you in the real life! Thus my acceptance of single men masturbating to porn.

Why does he need to pretend in his head to be f____ing other woman? How do I think this is nice, thoughtful, and committed to our relationship and our promise to be faithful to each other?

Honestly, if I take care of a man, why does he need to masturbate to porn - it is not like I am ever saying no! I guess this bothers me too - his choosing imaginary f____buddies over me. I once told him that I felt that if I could not satisfy him, then resort to your porn masturbation, but please give me this opportunity first.

I wish men could understand. As I wash and fold, put away his clothes, make his morning coffee, serve it to him with love, it all gets ruined if I start thinking about him wanting to pretend to be with other women. Suddenly these warm fuzzy loving feelings start to turn into pain and anger.

Taylor, I appreciate that you picked up on the fact that he said if I was doing it, then I had a problem. I pray that he can see his own double standard, and I pray that he has enough integrity to not only recognize the double standard, but to actually correct his double standards.

 

But you guys, please explain to me, does masturbating feel different than sex to you? I am being serious in my question. Does it provide better pleasure?

[Mr. Lucky]

So, where's Mr. Lucky when we need him? He's the one who said he would take steak any day over a picture of a steak.

 

Guess it's different strokes for different folks.

Sorry, been out of touch for a few days. I don't judge Enema, but for me masturbation (with or without porn ) interests me only if circumstances prevent sex for some period of time. Personally, I would never chose the role of soloist if I can play with the orchestra, but that's just me...

 

Mr. Lucky

[cn283]

Brulee,

 

Have you tried masturbating yourself? Not out of spite or to make sure he "gets a taste of his own medicine", but just for yourself. I think if you did, you would understand a little better that sex and masturbating are indeed two separate things. It's not that it's better, it's just different.

[Mr. Lucky]

Brulee, Have you tried masturbating yourself?

Is there anyone that hasn't ???

 

Mr. Lucky

[Els]

Yes actually, I know quite a few people who haven't.

[Jada]

Yeah I can sympathise with you, my ex liked to watch porn not often and he even had videos that I gave away to one of his friends early on in the relationship. Sometimes we'd watch porn together to heighten our sex life. Years later I now don't see it as a problem, just as he's watching porn and nothing else shoud be fine. What you need to relay to him is WHY you don't like him watching it. It would be a different story if he was seeing girls on the sly so porn isn't that bad if you really think about it.

[taylor]

Sorry, been out of touch for a few days. I don't judge Enema, but for me masturbation (with or without porn ) interests me only if circumstances prevent sex for some period of time. Personally, I would never chose the role of soloist if I can play with the orchestra, but that's just me...

 

Mr. Lucky

 

Love the way you put this, Mr. Lucky. You certainly are scoring points with the ladies here with this one.

 

See, that's the whole jist of the porn issue. Women need to feel like their man WANTS them. It truly is what makes us happy...sometimes even more than the sex itself.

 

When a man turns to porn...acts like he wants it more than us..we lose the feeling of being WANTED. And when we don't feel wanted, we stop feeling good about ourselves and the relationship. THis is what stops Brulee from wanting to do those loving wifely things like bring him his morning coffee, make him a nice dinner...even have sex.

 

A man who makes a woman feel wanted is a man who will have a woman all over him. She becomes putty in his hands. She becomes a very giving and loving creature in many ways.

 

I do understand what Enema is saying...that sex and masturbation are different experiences, both satisfying though....BUT...

 

I don't think women would mind if men masturbated if their own sexual needs were being met AND if men did not masturbate to pictures of other women. I don't think there would be nearly as much opposition if men met their wives sexual needs AND masturbated without the use of porn or masturbated to only pictures of their wives. In fact, I think most wives would take it as a complement if their husbands masturbated to pictures of them! What a tribute that would be to the wife's sexuality! How desireable do you think that would make her feel?

[Jersey Shortie]

I don't think most men are interested in masturbating to images of their SO. You rarely here men suggest it or encourage other men to look at pictures of their partners. Men want other women AND their partner. Then they want their women to feel good about it even though he is displaying very obviously that he wants to be with other women indirectly.

 

Also, so many men say that sex with their partners is 10X better yet still defend the use of porn. I wonder how many men could honestly live without porn if their partner was willing and able for sex more times then not.

[taylor]

You're viewing it the same way as others in this thread. As if sex and masturbating are either / or. I don't choose sex or masturbating, both of them are separate parts of my life.

 

I agree, Enema, that sex and masturbation are two entirely different kinds of experiences for a person. They also differ in where the focus is put during the experience and they differ in the amount of energy that one needs to expend.

 

But I think that what bothers most women is that if a man is horny...his penis needs some attention...why would he choose to "handle" it himself rather than let her "handle" it, expecially if he knows her sex drive is higher than his and he could satisfy her sex drive by letting her "handle" it?

 

Women like Brulee feel they are being "denied" an opportunity when their horny husbands choose to DIY than let their wives do it.

 

 

To try and put it in a terrible analogy: You guys are suggesting that sex costs $2, masturbating costs $1 and I have a $10 pleasure budget each week. Then, I am choosing to have sex twice and spend the rest of my budget with masturbating. It doesn't work like that, I have two separate budgets and they can't borrow from each other.

 

I understand what you are saying here, Enema, and I think this is great as long as both husband and wife are totally sexually satisfied in the relationship. Using your analogy, if $100 is set aside for sex and $100 for masturbation, and your wife is fine with that, it all works. But what if you start borrowing from the sex fund and putting it into the masturbation fund so that at the end of the year, it looks like this: $sex fund, $25 and masturbation fund, $175? And what if a portion of that $175 is spend on DVD's and magazines of other naked women?

 

Can you see where a wife could get upset, especially if she was expecting, wanting or needing $100 to be in the sex fund and when she looks, there's only $25 there?

 

Now I think we all need accountants to handle our sex lives. NOT!!!

 

 

 

If I was happy (because I was getting it 1/2 times a week) then she could masturbate to relieve stress all she wants.

 

And I think this is the jist of Brulee's problem here. What if you weren't sexually satisfied...would you blame it on her obessession with masturbation or would you see that as a totally unrelated activity, like golf or needlepoint...something that had no bearing on the amount of sex you were getting?

 

What undeniably links the two activities..what makes it possible to not see them as two unrelated activities...is the end result...an orgasm. Women with high sex drives would prefer a man let her "handle" it rather than let him "handle" it himself and leave her out of it.

 

 

The problem with most people in this thread seems to be mismatched sex drives with their partner, then trying to force them to be like you.

 

Their desire for sex with each other may be different, but Brulee's husband appears to be wanting orgasms at least as much as she does. He just doesn't want her to be the one to "handle" it every time.

 

So, it appears to me their libidos are the same. He's just not letting her satisfy his all the time...he'd rather DIY.

[manugeorge]

 

But I think that what bothers most women is that if a man is horny...his penis needs some attention...why would he choose to "handle" it himself rather than let her "handle" it, expecially if he knows her sex drive is higher than his and he could satisfy her sex drive by letting her "handle" it?

.

 

Actually, you can't assume to be as adept in "handling" his horniness as he is, it's HIS equipment. And you can't assume to be better than him in taking care of things. I think sometimes, it's just a different feeling men prefer. Vagina is NOT always the be all and end all of a man's penis. Hell, maybe her vagina is a little loose and it takes him a bit longer to reach orgasm, or maybe her hands are small and they don't quite grip the equipment right, or maybe her jaw gets tired easily. All these reasons and more is why he may choose to quickly rub one out even when she is around because there is just less fuss. Many men will orgasm in 2 minutes or less while masturbating because they know just how to grip their stuff, how much pressure to apply and what image they can conjure in their head to get them from 0-60 in 5 seconds. Full blown sex or even a blow job doesn't take 2 minutes.

 

Maybe he doesn't want foreplay and he doesn't want to spend 20 minutes performing it on her. etc etc.

 

I agree with Enema, I can get all the sex I ever dreamed of and still masturbate. Two separate entities, to me. Masturbation is my time with myself. To get to know my body, discover what pleasures me, touch myself in ways NO MAN will ever be able to. No one should ever be begrudged that.

[Mr. Lucky]

I wonder how many men could honestly live without porn if their partner was willing and able for sex more times then not.

But that "willing and able", while it sounds nice, isn't always applicable. For instance, certain times of the year my wife is gone 2-3 weeks at a time. Am I betraying her somehow if I masturbate in her absence? I have a sneaking suspicion that she's doing the same ...

 

Mr. Lucky

[taylor]

Actually, you can't assume to be as adept in "handling" his horniness as he is, it's HIS equipment. And you can't assume to be better than him in taking care of things. I think sometimes, it's just a different feeling men prefer. Vagina is NOT always the be all and end all of a man's penis. Hell, maybe her vagina is a little loose and it takes him a bit longer to reach orgasm, or maybe her hands are small and they don't quite grip the equipment right, or maybe her jaw gets tired easily. All these reasons and more is why he may choose to quickly rub one out even when she is around because there is just less fuss. Many men will orgasm in 2 minutes or less while masturbating because they know just how to grip their stuff, how much pressure to apply and what image they can conjure in their head to get them from 0-60 in 5 seconds. Full blown sex or even a blow job doesn't take 2 minutes.

 

Maybe he doesn't want foreplay and he doesn't want to spend 20 minutes performing it on her. etc etc.

 

I agree with Enema, I can get all the sex I ever dreamed of and still masturbate. Two separate entities, to me. Masturbation is my time with myself. To get to know my body, discover what pleasures me, touch myself in ways NO MAN will ever be able to. No one should ever be begrudged that.

 

I understand what you are saying here, Manugeorge, and in a perfect world where both husband and wife are getting sexual needs met, neither partner would probably begrudge the other having a little self-indulgence.

 

But can you see how a partner could feel slighted or rejected if they were begging for sex while their partner laid their masturbating, saying, "Not now honey, I'm busy."

 

How would it make any partner feel if they were told what you wrote above: "Honey, I'm masturbating instead of having sex with you because it just feels better..I can do it better than you...your vagina is not the be all...it's loose...and your hands are too small to get a good grip...and I really don't feel like putting all that time into foreplay...I really just want to pleasure myself and not worry about pleasuring you."

 

This is the reality. This is honesty. But this kind of honesty can hurt a wife, especially one who is begging for sex. And even if a husband isn't as candid, a wife still knows and it still hurts.

 

The same can be said for a husband who wants more sex and sees his wife masturbating INSTEAD of taking care of his penis. In all honesty, she may be masturbating because he just doesn't know the best massage techniques or the right kind of pressure to put on the right spots...maybe he doesn't even know where the "good" spots are...or maybe his penis is too short or too narrow to provide enough friction.

 

She can be totally honest with him and tell him her fingers massage better than his and his penis is not as effective as her vibrator...and that's why she masturbates instead of having sex with him sometimes. That would be honest. That would be reality. Who would begrudge her indulging in some self-gratification with her own body? But it would still be hurtful to a man who was standing there begging for sex.

 

Yes, there are logical, rational reasons to masturbate. And no one would begrudge anyone doing anything with their equipment that they wanted to.

 

But at what point do you begin to take into consideration the feelings of your spouse and his/her needs? How much honesty do you throw in their face?

[Jersey Shortie]

But that "willing and able", while it sounds nice, isn't always applicable. For instance, certain times of the year my wife is gone 2-3 weeks at a time. Am I betraying her somehow if I masturbate in her absence? I have a sneaking suspicion that she's doing the same ...

 

Mr. Lucky

 

It's life, of course you can't have everything you want the minute you want it. If my man is working hard for a couple weaks, I am not going to make demands that he shower me with dinner dates and flowers and I don't go seeking those things otu from other men directly, or indirectly. Are you unable to use self control Mr. Lucky?

[You'reasian]

There are men out there who say they want a sexy, fit woman...a woman that will do anything and everything in the bedroom....a woman with a heart of gold...good sense of humor, great attitude, beautiful inside and out...and whatever else you can list.....and SOMETIMES it will never be enough for SOME men. Those people who never see the good i appreciate her good qualities and not so good qualities and flaws etc, will never be with just one woman anyway. Nothing is good enough for him, no matter what you say, do or try.

 

This kind of guy sets his standards high, knowing that he can get it. Women can be the same way.

 

Its an approach that works. If this guy believes with every fiber of his being that he deserves absolutely the best (for whatever reason), has his own attraction currency and will not settle until it comes even close, he will be successfull.

 

Women fawn over guys who know what they want, have something to offer and absolutely don't give a damn.

[soserious1]

This kind of guy sets his standards high, knowing that he can get it. Women can be the same way.

 

Its an approach that works. If this guy believes with every fiber of his being that he deserves absolutely the best (for whatever reason), has his own attraction currency and will not settle until it comes even close, he will be successfull.

 

Women fawn over guys who know what they want, have something to offer and absolutely don't give a damn.

 

If you consider my ex now bedding a woman 20 yrs younger than me while I pay him alimony every month every month to equal "success" then you are right, he's achieved big here

 

However,this woman wasn't "fawning", my ex totally totally leveled my life in every aspect.

[Mr. Lucky]

It's life, of course you can't have everything you want the minute you want it. If my man is working hard for a couple weaks, I am not going to make demands that he shower me with dinner dates and flowers and I don't go seeking those things otu from other men directly, or indirectly. Are you unable to use self control Mr. Lucky?

I'm totally confused as to what dinner dates, flowers, other men and self-control have to do with this ...

 

Mr. Lucky

[Jersey Shortie]

Then let me help you out Mr. Lucky. Focus on this part:

 

It's life, of course you can't have everything you want the minute you want it. Are you unable to use self control Mr. Lucky?

[taylor]

I'm totally confused as to what dinner dates, flowers, other men and self-control have to do with this ...

 

Mr. Lucky

 

I think what she means is this:

 

If a man can't get sex from his wife because she is busy, pre-occuppied, tired, overworked...he can fulfill his sexual need by turning to porn where he uses the images of other naked women to get that need met.

 

If a woman can't get romance/attention from her husband because he is too busy, pre-occuppied, tired, overworked...she (the poster) WON'T turn to other men, directly or indirectly, to get those emotional needs met. She will practice self-control....go without until her husband can provide.

 

She is saying that if she can practice self-control in getting her emotional needs met that he should be able to practice self-control in getting his sexual needs met.

[You'reasian]

She is saying that if she can practice self-control in getting her emotional needs met that he should be able to practice self-control in getting his sexual needs met.

 

I don't think that a man's sexual needs can be equated to a woman's emotional needs.

 

A man's sexual needs are short-term, whereas a woman's emotional needs are more continuous.

 

Women have sexual needs and desires that are just as strong as mens, so they need both sexual and emotional needs met - whereas most men just need the sexual ones, granted there are some metro guys that need the emotional stuff too.

[taylor]

I don't think that a man's sexual needs can be equated to a woman's emotional needs.

 

A man's sexual needs are short-term, whereas a woman's emotional needs are more continuous.

 

Women have sexual needs and desires that are just as strong as mens, so they need both sexual and emotional needs met - whereas most men just need the sexual ones, granted there are some metro guys that need the emotional stuff too.

 

I think they can be equated in terms of importance, tho.

 

Men downplay the importance of their emotional needs, but they still have them. Don't tell me a man doesn't enjoy some words of appreciation and admiration from time to time. Don't tell me he doesn't need to hear his wife complement him on how he looks or on a job well done, or on how smart he is...just to boost his ego a little. All those are emotional needs both sexes need to feel good about ourselves and the people we entrust our hearts with.

 

And once in a while a man has a bad day at work and needs a listening ear when he comes home. He also cries at funerals and can use a hug or two to cope with the grief. And it makes him happy when he can share happy events in his life with someone special, knowing that that other person is happy for him. Again, all emotional needs men also want from the women in their lives.

[Mr. Lucky]

If a man can't get sex from his wife because she is busy, pre-occuppied, tired, overworked...

Well, in my case it's none of the above. My wife is simply 200 to 2000 miles away several times a year for weeks at a time. As I've said before, if it's a choice between sex with someone I love or a picture of sex, my preference - and that of most men - is clear.

 

The one descriptor that you left off your wifely list that seems to come up on LS often is "disinterested". The sentence has a different meaning if it reads "If a man can't get sex from his wife because she is disinterested...". Although I'd anticipate that your response would tie her interest to his approach, porn included. Maybe it really is a "chicken or the egg" situation in many relationships...

 

Mr. Lucky

[taylor]

Well, in my case it's none of the above. My wife is simply 200 to 2000 miles away several times a year for weeks at a time. As I've said before, if it's a choice between sex with someone I love or a picture of sex, my preference - and that of most men - is clear.

 

The one descriptor that you left off your wifely list that seems to come up on LS often is "disinterested". The sentence has a different meaning if it reads "If a man can't get sex from his wife because she is disinterested...". Although I'd anticipate that your response would tie her interest to his approach, porn included. Maybe it really is a "chicken or the egg" situation in many relationships...

 

Mr. Lucky

 

Let me make it clear that I have no issue whatsoever with anyone masturbating. It's your body. Do with it as you please.

 

I also don't have a porn issue in my household to contend with. Nor does my husband go to strip clubs or get lap dances.

 

I do agree men and women can be "disinterested" in sex at times..or can be on trips that take them 1000s of miles away. If the need to masturbate is there during this time, I have absolutely no issue with that. Actually, I'd expect it.

 

But I think it comes back to the porn itself..not the masturbation. Women don't mind if men masturbate as long as they aren't getting aroused by another woman's naked body..picture of one or a real live stripper. If men were only interested in looking at naked pictures of their own naked wives, women would have no issue. If men were only interested in getting aroused by their own naked wives dancing, women would have no issue.

 

It's that men want and choose to get aroused by looking at other naked women's bodies...whether their wives are around or not.

 

Bottom line is I think what upsets women is the fact that these men want VARIETY which directly contradicts telling a woman, "Honey, you are the ONLY one I need."

 

A woman doesn't FEEL like she is the only one her husband needs if he has a desire to see "Trixie," "Starfire," and "LuLu" at the local strip.

 

How do you think a husband would feel if his wife said, "Sweetie. You are my one and only. But I'm going to take the SUV tonite cuz the girls and I are going to go down to Mac's bar and get lap dances from "Stud Muffin" and "Big Dick. Be back by midnight." Of course, there won't be touching...only LOOKING.

 

****

 

Don't really want to get into the whole subject of partners "disinterested" in sex. Too many causes. But there are women on this forum who have said that when their men turn to porn it makes them less interested in having sex with them. I can understand this because what turns a woman on the most is the FEELING OF BEING WANTED AND DESIREABLE. A man looking at porn doesn't make his woman feel that way, hence, not interested in sex.

 

Men, on the other hand, can get very aroused by SEEING their wives "getting into" porn. Men get aroused by visual stimulation. That's why men don't mind if women view porn. They think if their women view porn it will turn that woman on and they want to see that and reap the benefit of it.

 

But what if women did as men did...viewed porn and orgasmed to it, with NO benefit to be had by their man. What if they went to the strip club and got turned on by a lap dance from "Harry Buffalo" and then went to the parking lot and masturbated to orgasm. And the husband reaped absolutely no benefit from it whatsoever.

 

A poster a few weeks back said "Porn is something for me on the side" meaning it had nothing to do with his wife. She reaped no benefit from it whatsoever.

 

How would men feel if their wives actively participated in porn and went to strip clubs for lap dances without them.

 

So many men here say, "I don't mind if she masturbates to porn AS LONG AS I CAN WATCH." What if you couldn't watch. You weren't permitted to.

 

Other men say, "I don't mind if she goes to the strip club WITH ME. I LOVE WATCHING HER GET ALL EXCITED." What if you weren't invited to go. What if you weren't invited to watch.

 

I really wonder how many men would truly be comfortable knowing their wives went to a strip club and got a lap dance..a man shoving his naked penis in her face, toying with it around her boobs, and grinding it into her crotch....and then she comes home after giving herself an orgasm in the parking lot.

 

How many men would sleep peacefully in their beds knowing their wives were out doing this?