DDay#3...OM#4...Devestation

[Darth Vader]

Judge signed the ex parte, meaning I have temp custody of the kids. He would not, however, grant me custody of the house. So she gets to move back in until the temp hearing next Friday. At that point my attorney believes I will get custody of the house.

 

I expect her back here around 3:30 PM.

 

The plot thickens...

 

 

I don't like this......

 

You better make darn sure that your wife doesn't somehow make it so you're booted out of the house or anything. She may try something as well. You've got to realize that she's devious (to say the least) enough to try, because she's been at this for several years, she knows what she's doing!

 

I'd make sure that she couldn't find this site, if I were you. Make sure the computer history, cookies, and any autotype and passwords are deleted, this is your place to come to, not hers!

 

Now if she finds this place on her own, well, then she finds it. I just don't know if she's computer savvy or not.

[Darth Vader]

Have to agree with Mr. Vader on this one. 4 affairs, took her back 3 times too many, no admission, he has the right to broadcast to the world that his SBXW is a lying, cheating, wh#re. Seems to me he's doing society a favor by warning them, be aware, stay away.

 

 

That bolded part is also a very good reason to broadcast it! It's ranks right up there with the better treatment for animals, except in this case, it's better treatment for Humans!:lmao:

 

Hmmm.... Mr. vader, I could get used to that!

[tami-chan]

The stbxw should just give the house as part of the divorce settlement. That's the least she can do. She is a medical doctor and apparently very capable of attracting the opposite sex ( perhaps mary another MD). Getting a house is not a big deal, not if she is earning mid-6 figures ( at least).

 

Can OP afford the house mortgage on his own? what about his 50% contribution towards child support? His kids are not very little kids and if he is supposedly highly educated, the judge will compel him to go find for a job.

[Reggie]

Typically, depending on the age of the kids, the court will at least award temporary maintenance until he can get whatever additonal training is required to become fully employed.

And, depending on the jurisdiction, if he has been home moer than 10 years, he may get alimony for life. A rule of thumb here seems to be alimony lasts at least as long as he was out of the labor market, if not longer for longterm marriages like this. Also, his subsidization of her schooloing, internship and residency by manning the homefront may be considered.

As for 50% child support, in most jurisdictions it is not calculated 50/50. The % of custody time, and the disparity in incomes is figured in. I expect that if he only gets 50-50, with her high income, there will be considerable $$ flowing in his direction only. His lawyer will know all this.

She will be required to contribute toward daycare, as well as support, typically. He is in a good position.

[Reggie]

I was wondering the same thing as Darth. Where on earth did folks come up with this notion that he gave her a script? This is a woman who says and does as she pleases, not a sock puppet.

[DNU1]

Reggie is correct. No script for telling the kiddos. I simply said they need to be told the truth. For the record, she told them about "another man" not "other MEN." She used her words when describing why we were getting a divorce. We did not talk about what to say...

 

And I have that whole conversation recorded -- CYA!

 

 

Judge signed the Ex Parte giving me temp custody of the kiddos. But he did not give me the house. So she moved back in last night and stayed in the guest bedroom.

 

My attorney said keep communication open, which I did. We had a long talk about attorneys (she doens't want to hire cut-throat expensive ones), money (she doesn't want to move half cash and cut off my access to paychecks as attorney suggested), and about Dr.X...

 

I told her I'd rather here the complete truth now rather than a month, a year down the road. She gave up a little more information, saying they would play smoochy-face in Docs lounge when people not around, but still maintains that it was one-time-sex. And the sad part is I started to believe her...for a minute.

 

She knows I can see texts, so we just opened up that topic. And I read the texts to her. She says it was just banter back and forth. I don't believe that, but she's sticking to her story. Part of me wants to believe her, and part of me thinks this is just more crap she's trying to hide. I won't approach the subject again cause it really doesn't matter. The deal-breaker was her repeated lying. The fact that it's *over with him* as she states it doesn't matter to me a bit.

 

I'd like something to still be going on between them...would make it easier for me to hate her. Maybe she understands that and is trying to keep me calm and not take shirt off her back.

 

Temp hearing is set for next week...so she lives in house at least that long.

 

I must stay strong...

[taylor]

Reggie is correct. No script for telling the kiddos. I simply said they need to be told the truth. For the record, she told them about "another man" not "other MEN." She used her words when describing why we were getting a divorce. We did not talk about what to say...

 

You should have talked to her and decided TOGETHER EXACTLY what was going to be said to the children...what TRUTH they needed to hear and what TRUTH they didn't need to hear. You BOTH acted IRRESPONSIBLY.

 

If it was important to you that your children be shielded from hearing about your wife's sexcapades with the good doctor you would have made that clear to her before she talked to them. But you didn't. You wanted your children to have "nuclear exposure" and suffer the repercussions, just like the rest of the world. Admit it.

 

And when she did provide the kiddos with "nuclear exposure" by telling them the WHOLE truth, you were IMPRESSED. You were glad she told them. It's just what you wanted. Admit it.

 

And I have that whole conversation recorded -- CYA!

 

That's sick. For what purpose? A momento for your children to play over and over again..perhaps on Christmas morning? Something to remind them of their lovely childhoods.

 

Or are you going to use that tape every time your children say something nice about their mother...something to remind them of the witch that she is.

 

You are acting on pure ugly emotions with regard to your children.

 

You are hurting and you want to make everyone else hurt as well, including your children.

 

 

I told her I'd rather here the complete truth now rather than a month, a year down the road. She gave up a little more information, saying they would play smoochy-face in Docs lounge when people not around, but still maintains that it was one-time-sex. And the sad part is I started to believe her...for a minute. She knows I can see texts, so we just opened up that topic. And I read the texts to her. She says it was just banter back and forth. I don't believe that, but she's sticking to her story. Part of me wants to believe her, and part of me thinks this is just more crap she's trying to hide.

 

Who cares whether she had sex with the good doctor one time or 50 times. What difference does it possibly make. My gosh, she has had sex with 4 men. Isn't that enough information for you?

 

You do sound like a martyr. I'm starting to think you recorded that conversation between your wife and the kiddos so that you could keep playing it over and over to yourself...true martyr.

 

I won't approach the subject again cause it really doesn't matter.

 

No, you'll approach the subject again. Because you still care about her and as long as you do, you are going to want to know what's going on in her life.

 

The fact that it's *over with him* as she states it doesn't matter to me a bit.

 

Yes, it does. It does matter to you. Or you wouldn't keep asking her about it. And you know in your heart it isn't over between them. It won't stop mattering to you until you stop caring about her. That doesn't happen overnight.

 

I'd like something to still be going on between them...would make it easier for me to hate her.

 

Something is still going on between them. Do you think affairs just end because the betrayed spouse finds out? My gosh, they work together. They see each other every day. Something is still going on. So if you haven't started to hate her yet, you can start now.

 

 

I must stay strong...

 

The faster she's out of the house, the easier it will be for you to gain strength.

[DNU1]

You should have talked to her and decided TOGETHER EXACTLY what was going to be said to the children...what TRUTH they needed to hear and what TRUTH they didn't need to hear. You BOTH acted IRRESPONSIBLY.

 

If it was important to you that your children be shielded from hearing about your wife's sexcapades with the good doctor you would have made that clear to her before she talked to them. But you didn't. You wanted your children to have "nuclear exposure" and suffer the repercussions, just like the rest of the world. Admit it.

 

She didn't say she blew him, she said they had sex. You are putting words in my mouth. PLease stop.

 

And when she did provide the kiddos with "nuclear exposure" by telling them the WHOLE truth, you were IMPRESSED. You were glad she told them. It's just what you wanted. Admit it.

 

No. Nuclear exposure is telling my family and her parents the *whole* truth. Which, by the way, she failed to do with her parents. Nuclear exposure was not mean, nor ever meant telling the kids all the details.

 

That's sick. For what purpose? A momento for your children to play over and over again..perhaps on Christmas morning? Something to remind them of their lovely childhoods.

 

I recorded the conversation at advice on my attorney...to covery my tail. Nothing more, nothing less. Simply to make sure my LYING wife did not come back and say I called her a whore to the kids, put words in her mouth, or lied again. NOthing more, nothing less.

[/b]Or are you going to use that tape every time your children say something nice about their mother...something to remind them of the witch that she is.

 

You are acting on pure ugly emotions with regard to your children.

 

You are hurting and you want to make everyone else hurt as well, including your children.

 

How can you even say this? I'm protecting my children from lies and deceipt. I'm protecting my children from believing that THEY were the cause of this divorce. Marriage counselor, school counselor, three books I've read and many I've talked to believe telling the kids the truth about the affair was the RIGHT thing to do. You can bash me all you want. You can rationalize all you want. The truth shall set you free. My kids have seen daddy working on this marriage 110% for the past five months. Doting on my wife, loving her, spending time with her, even waiting on her hand and foot at times. What message does it send the kids if I just stop interacing with her now. They NEED to know the truth.

 

Who cares whether she had sex with the good doctor one time or 50 times. What difference does it possibly make. My gosh, she has had sex with 4 men. Isn't that enough information for you?

 

You do sound like a martyr. I'm starting to think you recorded that conversation between your wife and the kiddos so that you could keep playing it over and over to yourself...true martyr.

 

Why do you even care? Why do you come here and bash ME for being faithful, loving my wife, respecting marriage, working on our marriage through FOUR other men? Why am I the enemy? What have I done wrong? NOTHING!

 

No, you'll approach the subject again. Because you still care about her and as long as you do, you are going to want to know what's going on in her life.

 

Yes, it does. It does matter to you. Or you wouldn't keep asking her about it. And you know in your heart it isn't over between them. It won't stop mattering to you until you stop caring about her. That doesn't happen overnight.

 

Something is still going on between them. Do you think affairs just end because the betrayed spouse finds out? My gosh, they work together. They see each other every day. Something is still going on. So if you haven't started to hate her yet, you can start now.

 

The faster she's out of the house, the easier it will be for you to gain strength.

 

These last paragraphs I agree with. Thank you.

 

Yes, I still have strong feelings for her. I've been *helping* her for 20 years. It's hard to shut that off over night.

 

I approach the subject again because I want her to come clean. I believe that only when she comes clean will she hit rock-bottom and start to heal herself and learn from this. If she continues to lie it never gets better.

 

It's terribly hard. I want to hate her. I want to hate her...but I have so many feelings for her.

 

Getting over her addiction is the hardest thing I have ever done in my life.

[taylor]

I was wondering the same thing as Darth. Where on earth did folks come up with this notion that he gave her a script? This is a woman who says and does as she pleases, not a sock puppet.

 

No one said he gave her a script.

 

He did say he was hell-bent on nuclear exposure and that he wanted his children to know the truth.

 

To me, that implies he WANTED his children to know EVERYTHING, including the sexcapades. And I'll bet he made this clear to his wife during the hour-long discussion they had just before she made the confession to the children.

 

He says NOW that he wishes she would have stopped short of telling them about the SEXCAPADES. If it was that important to him that THAT MUCH truth NOT be told, he would have made his wishes known to her.

 

Do you honestly think in the hour before she met with the kiddos that he implored her NOT to talk to the kids about the SEXCAPADES and that she INSISTED that they do? That's backwards.

 

He may not have told her exactly what to say but being hell-bent on nuclear exposure, I am sure he was pleased as punch that she hit the kids between the eyes with news of the affair. After all, he said he was "IMPRESSED" with how forthcoming she was. And he did get the nuclear exposure he was so hell-bent on getting, didn't he?

 

I just think both parents acted irresponsibly with regard to how much information was told to the children. It should have been discussed thoroughly beforehand and it was not...not at all. Shows you how much these parents were actually thinking of their children's best interests at that time.

 

You say this woman says and does as she pleases. Sorry, but I just do not believe any mother would CHOOSE to tell her 8 year old that she had sex with another man...not without someone nudging her to do so.

 

I read some posts with a grain of salt, sometimes. And this is one of them.

 

This is my final word on this worn out subject. It's all water under the bridge now. The kids KNOW all the dirt now. He got the nuclear exposure he wanted. YAY.

[DNU1]

Taylor: I appreciate that everyone has an opinion and is free to express it. By your actions -- repteated attacking me, referring to me in the third person, failing to respond to me, etc., I believe you have an ax to grind here. I'm confindent your issues are not with me, but with something that happened in your past, and you are just externalizing your frustrations on me.

 

You ignore the facts, you are twisting the truth, and you fail to respond to my replies.

 

So here's the deal...GET THE F OFF THIS THREAD! Right now I dispise you more than my STBxWW. At least I can have a civil conversation with her. And frankly I wish my STBxWW would take an attitude like yours right now...it would make it very easy to drain my love-bank for her.

 

So let me be clear. Get off this thread. You aren't helping, you are badgering. Be gone.

[taylor]

She didn't say she blew him, she said they had sex. You are putting words in my mouth. PLease stop.

 

Who said she blew him? I never used those words. You are putting words in my mouth.

 

 

 

No. Nuclear exposure is telling my family and her parents the *whole* truth. Which, by the way, she failed to do with her parents. Nuclear exposure was not mean, nor ever meant telling the kids all the details.

 

You and your wife should have given your children age appropriate "Truth" and that truth should have been discussed thoroughly beforehand.

 

This is the ONLY thing I take offense with regarding your posts. I hate to see children hurt by anything adults do. Yes, your wife had the affair, but you BOTH had an opportunity to shield them from the SEX detail, which I think is not age-appropriate, and you did not.

 

If this comes across as bashing, I apologize, but hurting children unnecessarily with information that does not benefit THEM, enrages my senses and it shows in these posts.

 

 

 

I recorded the conversation at advice on my attorney...to covery my tail. Nothing more, nothing less. Simply to make sure my LYING wife did not come back and say I called her a whore to the kids, put words in her mouth, or lied again. NOthing more, nothing less.

 

OK, makes more sense now...the involvement of an attorney.

 

 

How can you even say this? I'm protecting my children from lies and deceipt. I'm protecting my children from believing that THEY were the cause of this divorce.

 

Did your children think they were the cause of the divorce?

 

Was your wife lying to the children?

 

They NEED to know the truth.

 

I agree with you. They needed to know the truth. But we will just have to agree to disagree on the AMOUNT of truth an 8 year old NEEDS.

 

My mom had me looking for lipstick smudges on my dad's shirts when I was 11 years old. It was all THE TRUTH. He was having an affair and TRUTH be told, there were indeed lipstick smudges, as well as perfume and blond hairs, on his shirt. THAT was THE TRUTH.

 

BUT, as an 11 year old, I didn't NEED that much truth to understand why my parents were getting divorced. They could have just told me they were getting a divorce because they couldn't stop fighting...and that would have been enough for me. They could have waited until I was 17 to tell me about the affair. It would have been the kinder thing to do.

 

 

 

 

 

Why do you even care? Why do you come here and bash ME for being faithful, loving my wife, respecting marriage, working on our marriage through FOUR other men? Why am I the enemy? What have I done wrong? NOTHING!

 

I care about people who are hurting. I am not here to bash you and again I apologize for that. I came across as bashing because I totally disagree with the notion of "nuclear exposure". It unnecessarily upsets the worlds of many innocent people who love and care for BOTH of you. And it hurts everyone who loves BOTH of you. There is a thing called "damage control" that can be exercised to keep from hurting and upsetting the lives of all those you love and care about. I would exercise it. You wouldn't. We just differ on this and for that reason alone that my posts come across as bashing.

 

Certainly I am not bashing you "for being faithful, loving your wife, respecting your marriage, or working on your marriage" as you say.

 

I have only commended you, especially on your ability to be a SAHF.

 

And I do care about how much you are dwelling on the details of your wife's affair. You are already hurting and you are in the midst of filing for a divorce. You are on emotional overload. I am concerned that more information regarding the affair...ALL the details...will drive you to some breaking point. Not healthy.

 

Focus on the kids and a successful divorce. And take care of yourself. Be kind to yourself. Focusing on her and her sordid affair with #4 will not make you strong. It will weaken you. It will make it harder for you to think straight. And right now, with legal proceedings upon you, the last thing you need to have on your mind is how many times she had sex with this guy.

 

 

 

Yes, I still have strong feelings for her. I've been *helping* her for 20 years. It's hard to shut that off over night.

 

Just curious. But what have you been "helping" her with? Are you a caregiver for her in some way? Not sure I understand this.

 

I approach the subject again because I want her to come clean. I believe that only when she comes clean will she hit rock-bottom and start to heal herself and learn from this. If she continues to lie it never gets better.

 

She isn't your concern anymore. You and your kids are. She may never hit rock bottom and she may never heal. She is broken inside and you can't possibly fix that. She has to fix it herself if it's ever going to get fixed. And the only way that is going to happen is through counseling.

 

Let me ask you this: Do you have any thoughts, even one, hoping that she will have a change of heart and come back to you...start to love you again like a wife should? If she started to talk like this..would you take her back yet again? Be honest with yourself.

 

 

It's terribly hard. I want to hate her. I want to hate her...but I have so many feelings for her. Getting over her addiction is the hardest thing I have ever done in my life.

 

Then, DNU, focus on this..getting over the addiction. Any man who would put up with 4 affairs IS addicted.

 

The best piece of advice I can offer you is get yourself into individual counseling as fast as possibe...ASAP.

 

You need to find out why you have allowed yourself to put up with a woman who treats you like this...and who has treated you like this for nearly a decade.

 

And you need to find out how to break this unyielding addiction you have to her. It isn't easy. It's like a heroin addiction. Chances are you will not be able to do it on your own. You will need help.

 

You have alot on your plate...kids, divorce, grief. Please seek counseling.

 

P.S. No more bashing. I promise.

[DNU1]

Taylor: I debated whether to read your post or not...glad I did. I think we can continue this conversation having understood your past a little more. Repiles to follow:

 

Who said she blew him? I never used those words. You are putting words in my mouth.

 

Agreed...let's stop putting words in each others mouths...

 

You and your wife should have given your children age appropriate "Truth" and that truth should have been discussed thoroughly beforehand.

 

This is the ONLY thing I take offense with regarding your posts. I hate to see children hurt by anything adults do. Yes, your wife had the affair, but you BOTH had an opportunity to shield them from the SEX detail, which I think is not age-appropriate, and you did not.

 

If this comes across as bashing, I apologize, but hurting children unnecessarily with information that does not benefit THEM, enrages my senses and it shows in these posts.

 

Having read your family history and experiences as an 11 year old I completely understand why you would have issues with me on this point.

 

REst assured that I looked at this issue carefully before saying to my wife "the kids need to hear the truth." Author/counselor/PHd of nearly 35 years recommends telling kids truth about infidelity down to age 7. Our MC recommended telling them the truth. School counselors, both who have been through divorce, also recommended telling them the truth. It's not out of my need to nuke expose, It's out of my need to protect the kids from thinking they were at fault.

 

When STBxWW moved out on DDay#4 the kids asked me what they did wrong. This was before I came to divorce decision.

 

They need to be told the truth so they can understand how marriages fail. I i no way wanted them to think that mommie and daddy arguing was cause of divorce. then my kids would believe that arguing was root of problems. No, arguing is how you can air problems and find solution to problems.

 

OK, makes more sense now...the involvement of an attorney.

 

Did your children think they were the cause of the divorce?

 

See above...

 

 

Was your wife lying to the children?

 

I agree with you. They needed to know the truth. But we will just have to agree to disagree on the AMOUNT of truth an 8 year old NEEDS.

 

Again, it was not my wishes that my wife use the word "sex" when telling them about the affair. My kids watch TV and are exposed to the word "sex." I'm 99% sure they have viewed educational material concerning human sexuality at school (wife signed that paper work).

 

We will just have to agree to disaggree on this point...

 

 

My mom had me looking for lipstick smudges on my dad's shirts when I was 11 years old. It was all THE TRUTH. He was having an affair and TRUTH be told, there were indeed lipstick smudges, as well as perfume and blond hairs, on his shirt. THAT was THE TRUTH.

 

BUT, as an 11 year old, I didn't NEED that much truth to understand why my parents were getting divorced. They could have just told me they were getting a divorce because they couldn't stop fighting...and that would have been enough for me. They could have waited until I was 17 to tell me about the affair. It would have been the kinder thing to do.

 

I care about people who are hurting. I am not here to bash you and again I apologize for that. I came across as bashing because I totally disagree with the notion of "nuclear exposure". It unnecessarily upsets the worlds of many innocent people who love and care for BOTH of you. And it hurts everyone who loves BOTH of you. There is a thing called "damage control" that can be exercised to keep from hurting and upsetting the lives of all those you love and care about. I would exercise it. You wouldn't. We just differ on this and for that reason alone that my posts come across as bashing.

 

Please understand that by "nuclear exposure" I meant telling my family the whole truth. I did not expose OM#3 to my family, nor to anyone back five months ago.

 

I have not told OM#4 - DrX wife for fear it might cost my wife her job. Don't want to put my kids in that position.

 

Nuclear exposure meant telling my family, her family and a few close friends of mine. Not telling everyone on earth, her co-workers, all neighbors, etc.

 

And I'm glad I talked with her parents. Cause my STBxWW only said we are getting divorce and she had an affair. She didn't tell them about OM#3, my working on marriage since Dec. She's still ashamed and/or trying to hide things.

 

 

Certainly I am not bashing you "for being faithful, loving your wife, respecting your marriage, or working on your marriage" as you say.

 

I have only commended you, especially on your ability to be a SAHF.

 

And I do care about how much you are dwelling on the details of your wife's affair. You are already hurting and you are in the midst of filing for a divorce. You are on emotional overload. I am concerned that more information regarding the affair...ALL the details...will drive you to some breaking point. Not healthy.

 

Yes, I agree. But for some crazy reason I want to know the details. I want to know how this happened and why so I can *learn* and make myself a better person. I want to know what signs to look for if/when I'm in another relationship. I want to know simply because I want to never make those mistakes again.

 

Focus on the kids and a successful divorce. And take care of yourself. Be kind to yourself. Focusing on her and her sordid affair with #4 will not make you strong. It will weaken you. It will make it harder for you to think straight. And right now, with legal proceedings upon you, the last thing you need to have on your mind is how many times she had sex with this guy.

 

You are 100% spot on here! I need to work on me. I need to concentrate on my kids. But that's going to be so very hard after 20+ years working on her. And the last five months working on our marriage with 110% effort. It literally consumed me. And now it's over.

 

Just curious. But what have you been "helping" her with? Are you a caregiver for her in some way? Not sure I understand this.

 

Shes' always been needy, self conscious, low self esteem. I've always been her strenght, her cheer-leader, her friend, confidant and sounding board. HOpe that explains it.

 

She isn't your concern anymore. You and your kids are. She may never hit rock bottom and she may never heal. She is broken inside and you can't possibly fix that. She has to fix it herself if it's ever going to get fixed. And the only way that is going to happen is through counseling.

 

Let me ask you this: Do you have any thoughts, even one, hoping that she will have a change of heart and come back to you...start to love you again like a wife should? If she started to talk like this..would you take her back yet again? Be honest with yourself.

 

I will not take her back again. I thought about it after OM#3 and really looked deep inside myself. I wanted to recover this marriage. I wanted to believe in her and believe in us. But now I know that I can never trust her again. I can never be married to her again. This marriage is over, final answer, close the book, done.

 

Then, DNU, focus on this..getting over the addiction. Any man who would put up with 4 affairs IS addicted.

 

The best piece of advice I can offer you is get yourself into individual counseling as fast as possibe...ASAP.

 

You need to find out why you have allowed yourself to put up with a woman who treats you like this...and who has treated you like this for nearly a decade.

 

And you need to find out how to break this unyielding addiction you have to her. It isn't easy. It's like a heroin addiction. Chances are you will not be able to do it on your own. You will need help.

 

You have alot on your plate...kids, divorce, grief. Please seek counseling.

 

P.S. No more bashing. I promise.

 

No more bashing...thanks.

 

And yes, I'm set with counselor very soon. This is hard, terribly hard. But I know it's the right thing to do. I must be strong, must take care of myself, must take care of my children. She needs to take care of herself.

 

I cannot fix her or help her any more.

 

PS: You are no longer banned from my thread...

[taylor]

I have not told OM#4 - DrX wife for fear it might cost my wife her job. Don't want to put my kids in that position.

 

This is a wise move, DNU.

 

Many posters advocate telling the OM's wife. It's a great way to put an end to the affair in many cases and it serves to teach the other man..in this case, the Married Man, that there are consequences to pay for messing with another man's wife.

 

But in your case, I applaud your ability to hold back. Your children will benefit far more with your wife employed than unemployed. And if you are in fact divorcing, there is no need for you to take steps to end her affair. Let her have the scumbag.

 

Be aware that his wife may find out eventually, though. These things have a way of coming out. And both his and your wife's jobs may be at jeopardy if his wife chooses to make a stink about it at work. But then again, she may keep quiet for fear of him losing his job. Dunno.

 

 

 

And I'm glad I talked with her parents. Cause my STBxWW only said we are getting divorce and she had an affair. She didn't tell them about OM#3, my working on marriage since Dec. She's still ashamed and/or trying to hide things.

 

I am sure her parents will learn alot more about her history of cheating before this is all over. She will need to lean on someone and if it's them, they are going to want to know everything that's been happening.

 

 

 

 

But for some crazy reason I want to know the details.

 

Of course, you want to know the details. You're only human. I think most BS, especially men, want to know these details. They need to know them so they can move on and leave all the nagging questions and curiosities behind.

 

But be aware of this: The more detail you have the clearer the images you will have in your head that you will play over and over again in your head. From reading posts by many betrayed husbands, it's the mental images they have of their wive's physical affair, that they have trouble shaking the most..even years after an affair.

 

I had an emotional affair and my husband immediately wanted to know if anything physical happened. It's the physical that stabs a man in the soul, I think.

 

So, I guess I can see how knowing everything can both be hurtful and helpful.

 

But out of concern, I hope you can put those images and curiosities aside once in a while for your own good (mental well-being) and focus on the kiddos and a successful divorce.

 

 

 

 

I need to work on me. I need to concentrate on my kids. But that's going to be so very hard after 20+ years working on her. And the last five months working on our marriage with 110% effort. It literally consumed me. And now it's over.

 

I understand. It's hard when you give it all you have and still don't see the results you were hoping for..especially when what you gave was your heart.

 

 

 

Shes' always been needy, self conscious, low self esteem. I've always been her strenght, her cheer-leader, her friend, confidant and sounding board. HOpe that explains it.

 

Yes, it does explain it. Perfectly. I am not surprised at all by what you say. I truly do believe low self-esteem lies at the very heart of most affairs, including my own EA.

 

 

 

I will not take her back again. I thought about it after OM#3 and really looked deep inside myself. I wanted to recover this marriage. I wanted to believe in her and believe in us. But now I know that I can never trust her again. I can never be married to her again. This marriage is over, final answer, close the book, done.

 

This is very good to hear, DNU. I think most posters are breathing a sigh of relief right now.

 

Faith in a person dies hard. We want to believe in them with every fiber in our body. But when you have been dealt as many undeserving blows as you have, there comes a time when you have to let go of that faith. It's very hard to let go. I had to let go of a relationship with a sibling that I didn't want to. I know it's not the same as a marriage. But I still understand how hard it is to give up on a person you so much believed in.

 

 

 

And yes, I'm set with counselor very soon. This is hard, terribly hard. But I know it's the right thing to do. I must be strong, must take care of myself, must take care of my children.

 

Sounds like an excellent plan.

 

 

 

PS: You are no longer banned from my thread...

 

Thanks, DNU. And again, apologies for causing you undue stress. Was not my intention.

[Reggie]

No one said he gave her a script.

 

He did say he was hell-bent on nuclear exposure and that he wanted his children to know the truth.

 

To me, that implies he WANTED his children to know EVERYTHING, including the sexcapades. And I'll bet he made this clear to his wife during the hour-long discussion they had just before she made the confession to the children.

 

He says NOW that he wishes she would have stopped short of telling them about the SEXCAPADES. If it was that important to him that THAT MUCH truth NOT be told, he would have made his wishes known to her.

 

Do you honestly think in the hour before she met with the kiddos that he implored her NOT to talk to the kids about the SEXCAPADES and that she INSISTED that they do? That's backwards.

 

He may not have told her exactly what to say but being hell-bent on nuclear exposure, I am sure he was pleased as punch that she hit the kids between the eyes with news of the affair. After all, he said he was "IMPRESSED" with how forthcoming she was. And he did get the nuclear exposure he was so hell-bent on getting, didn't he?

 

I just think both parents acted irresponsibly with regard to how much information was told to the children. It should have been discussed thoroughly beforehand and it was not...not at all. Shows you how much these parents were actually thinking of their children's best interests at that time.

 

You say this woman says and does as she pleases. Sorry, but I just do not believe any mother would CHOOSE to tell her 8 year old that she had sex with another man...not without someone nudging her to do so.

 

I read some posts with a grain of salt, sometimes. And this is one of them.

 

This is my final word on this worn out subject. It's all water under the bridge now. The kids KNOW all the dirt now. He got the nuclear exposure he wanted. YAY.

 

You are inferring way too much, taylor and have unreasonable expectations re his ability to control his wife.

First off, there is absolutely nothing wrong with the kids knowing his wife had a sexual affairs with other men. Yo seem to have the notion that this will damage them in some way. Many therapists advocate telling the kids the truth about affairs, in an age appropriate way. Not the "mommy and daddy are not getting along. Mommy met someone else" watered down version. It confuses them.

Secondly, you are all hung up on the expression "nuclear expousure", it simply menas widespread, simultaneously timed exposure and hads nothing to do with a damage assessment. So, you have no basis to say he wanted to see massive damage(although she clearly desrves it). But to interpret this expression as meaning he wants his kids to suffer is a big stretch and not accurate.

This is a guy, who, in the face of serial infidelity tried to keep his family intact. This is a guy who gave second chances for a long time, only to be lied to and abused for years. Your accusatio that he is a martyr is insulting, although imn my mind, he is close in the good sense of the word.

This guy has done really well throughout this monstous abuse. He has cared for the kids, not cheated, tried to get his wife to come clean. It is just such a good idea to get the word out on his wife. It protects him from the lies she will surely tell about this. It let's the kids know what happened.

DNUI, you are doing a good job under adverse circumstances. Stay strong.

[taylor]

Reggie,

 

I promised DNU I would not broach this subject again and I will stick to my promise.

[Reggie]

Sounds good, taylor. This poor guy has been beat up enough and the disclosure thing is in line with the advice given by many who work in this field.

[tami-chan]

I cannot fix her or help her any more.

 

I think this is the second time that OP said this about his wife. He has a condescending way of talking about her...like she is a child. I am not the only who has picked this vibe either...and OP has a way of expressing his feelings AS IF he is out for blood and probably under the circumstances, rightfully so)...e.g. "nuclear explosion" "...recorded the conversation-CYA", "bring it on"...it's difficult to be sympathetic to him...at least it is difficult for me to be sympathetic to him. I mean, after 4 affairs ( known to him) he is now all balls out...hmm...

 

I still do not believe his wife said those things to their kids...I don't know why i think that, probably because I am also a mother( and just can't believe a parent would do that) and I would do everything to lessen the negative effects of adult's bad behavior to the kids.

 

I also do not believe that most counselors think full disclosure to the children should include details. As a matter of fact, I know that counselors would say, the most important thing is for the kids to know that the divorce was not about them and that the love that they have grown accustomed to through the years will not change because their parents don't love each other anymore.

 

i think DNUi will be better off without his wife...and I am sure his wife will be better off without him-she has never been happy with him, nor even loved him, I don't think. But I have a feeling that DNUi will post soon that his wife wants to work on the marriage and refuses to leave or sign the divorce paper because she can't live without him..I could be wrong and If I am, i would be very relieved for DNUi's sake. He needs somebody worthy of him.

[DNU1]

I think this is the second time that OP said this about his wife. He has a condescending way of talking about her...like she is a child. I am not the only who has picked this vibe either...and OP has a way of expressing his feelings AS IF he is out for blood and probably under the circumstances, rightfully so)...e.g. "nuclear explosion" "...recorded the conversation-CYA", "bring it on"...it's difficult to be sympathetic to him...at least it is difficult for me to be sympathetic to him. I mean, after 4 affairs ( known to him) he is now all balls out...hmm...

 

I'm sorry you feel this way Tami. This is a woman whom I have spent half of my life with. This is a woman I forgave for two affairs 14 years ago, a woman I worked to forgive with every fiber of my being for the last FIVE months! I do care about her deeply...but I understand that I can no longer help her. I've tried for 20 years to live up to her standard, to get her to accept my love...but I do not believe she is capable. Something deep in side her makes her unable to open up to me completely. Somethign deep inside her makes her unable to stay faithful, to resist the other men paying attention to her, wooing her.

 

She's a broken soul. I can no longer fix her. This is in her hands now.

 

I still do not believe his wife said those things to their kids...I don't know why i think that, probably because I am also a mother( and just can't believe a parent would do that) and I would do everything to lessen the negative effects of adult's bad behavior to the kids.

 

I'd get the tape out and put an mp3 file on here, but I'm sure my attorney would frown on that. Ask this question...why would I lie?

 

I also do not believe that most counselors think full disclosure to the children should include details. As a matter of fact, I know that counselors would say, the most important thing is for the kids to know that the divorce was not about them and that the love that they have grown accustomed to through the years will not change because their parents don't love each other anymore.

 

Again, why would I lie? EVERY counselor I talked to gave me the same advice...tell the kiddos the truth. My kiddos do not know that there were two men, and that they played smoochy face in the Docs lounge, or that Mommy met up with ____ in Vegas while she was supposed to be at conference. They just know that mommie had feelings for another man, kissed another man and had sex with another man. that's all, nothing else.

 

i think DNUi will be better off without his wife...and I am sure his wife will be better off without him-she has never been happy with him, nor even loved him, I don't think. But I have a feeling that DNUi will post soon that his wife wants to work on the marriage and refuses to leave or sign the divorce paper because she can't live without him..I could be wrong and If I am, i would be very relieved for DNUi's sake. He needs somebody worthy of him.

 

Yes, in the long term I believe I will be better off in the long run. I do think we have had happiness in our marriage. And I think, based on her feelings / attitude since the D-papers, that she is realizing that she is losing the best thing she ever had going for her. I see it in her eyes, I see it in her non-verbals.

 

I do need someone worthy of me. And I heard her beg me for another chance when I talked to her and served the papers on Friday. But the deal-breaker had been done.

 

It stinks, it's hard to deal with, it's like a death in the family. I can't begin to tell you how very hard this is. but I have to take this one day at a time. I have to slowly break the addiction I have to helping her, to being with her, to loving her. I've got to move on. I've got to keep breathing, cause you never know what the tide might bring in.

 

D.

[DNU1]

Reggie,

 

I promised DNU I would not broach this subject again and I will stick to my promise.

 

 

Thank you Taylor!

[tami-chan]

I'm sorry you feel this way Tami. This is a woman whom I have spent half of my life with. This is a woman I forgave for two affairs 14 years ago, a woman I worked to forgive with every fiber of my being for the last FIVE months! I do care about her deeply...but I understand that I can no longer help her. I've tried for 20 years to live up to her standard, to get her to accept my love...but I do not believe she is capable. Something deep in side her makes her unable to open up to me completely. Somethign deep inside her makes her unable to stay faithful, to resist the other men paying attention to her, wooing her.

 

She's a broken soul. I can no longer fix her. This is in her hands now.

 

DNU1, there is something organically not right with your relationship even before. Check the bolded statement above-Why did you do that to yourself? Why did you stay? It appears like she never loved you or at least never trusted you. At some point, you must have known that you just did not do it for her. You must have known that given her behavior and what you knew of her, she will stray---I think you are out for blood now, because you realized you failed...you failed in turning her world around, so to speak.

 

If something is broken inside her, you cannot fix it, ever. Nobody can but she herself....or if she is a Christian-only Jesus can...

 

I'd get the tape out and put an mp3 file on here, but I'm sure my attorney would frown on that. Ask this question...why would I lie?

 

Indeed . It is just difficult for me to think there are parents who are thoughtless in their language to their children---all in the name of honesty...please...

 

Again, why would I lie? EVERY counselor I talked to gave me the same advice...tell the kiddos the truth. My kiddos do not know that there were two men, and that they played smoochy face in the Docs lounge, or that Mommy met up with ____ in Vegas while she was supposed to be at conference. They just know that mommie had feelings for another man, kissed another man and had sex with another man. that's all, nothing else.

 

You are missing the point. I am sure you are telling the truth about EVERY counselor telling you the "truth" must be told...But I am pretty darn sure no counselor would say: "yes tell it like it is....mom had sex with the dominoes pizza man and they were sneaking around and even had sex in the guest room when you guys where having your piano lessons in the music room" ( this is just an example, this is not your wife). Your wife was wrong(if indeed she did) in telling your 8 year old that she has sex or even kissed another man...she could have worded it differently...I hope you called her out on that.

 

I do think we have had happiness in our marriage.

 

Really? with you trying so hard to be the man she wanted you to be? And her refusing your "love"?

 

And I think, based on her feelings / attitude since the D-papers, that she is realizing that she is losing the best thing she ever had going for her. I see it in her eyes, I see it in her non-verbals.

 

I do need someone worthy of me. And I heard her beg me for another chance when I talked to her and served the papers on Friday. But the deal-breaker had been done.

 

Lol..I know. It was all in the stars. I also know that you would never give her another chance and you will be firm in your decision....

 

It stinks, it's hard to deal with, it's like a death in the family. I can't begin to tell you how very hard this is. but I have to take this one day at a time. I have to slowly break the addiction I have to helping her, to being with her, to loving her. I've got to move on. I've got to keep breathing, cause you never know what the tide might bring in.

 

Yes, good wishes.

 

I cannot wait for your next post where you have full custody of the children, get the house ( and she has to pay for the mortgage) and massive amounts of child support and alimony and Dr. X dumping her.

[LakesideDream]

DNU1, I just read this thread from end to end.. I cannot find any fault in what you have done or are currently doing. I have "sorta" been where you are now. I had kids (2) that I was responsible for so I kept my mouth shut, and didn't allow myself to try and find out the truth... for 25 years.

 

Look in your old analog dictionary for the word "Gaslight"... see the picture? That's me. I just sucked it up until the kids were grown, and she decided to leave. That path had it's difficulties as well.

 

I agree with most that what your STBXW told your children was not age appropriate. Seems to me like she was burning bridges then. I don't have any problems with you recording it either. With some luck, and the river don't rise, she will continue to look after family.. and not be combative in the upcomming divorce. That wouldn't serve the kids well, maybe she cares about that.

 

Luck to you my friend. Raising kids on your own isn't an easy task. I hope you are up to it. I also hope that you are able to break your "addiction" to this woman. She doesen't appear to be worthy of your love and affection. Life will continue to get worse for awhile. Hopefully there will be light at the end of the tunnel.

[DNU1]

Thanks LakesideDream! I appreciate you posting on this thread. I really hope she's not combative...cause I feel I'm holding a royal flush. She ain't got much on her side right now. And word is spreading around the neighborhood of her infidelities.

 

Now my STBxWW is mad at ___ neighbor whom she believes is a gossip hound. Oh well, I'm sorry that the truth is out there for people to hear.

 

As far as raising kids on my own, well, i've pretty much been raising them since they were born. Even when I was working full time the wife was out the door to hospital before kiddos even woke up. And sometimes home after they went to bed. I've been their rock for their entire lives. I've been there every day, except when I'm off on the once a year hunting trip. Or when STBxWW and I were on vacation.

 

I know it's going to get worse before it gets better. One day at a time. One day at a time...

[Reggie]

What you need to wrap your brain around, DNUI, is that no one can meet the expectations of a BPD or NPD. The happy times usually occur early in the marriage or in very short spurts, intermingled with abuse.It's terribly confusing, the intermittent reenforcemat thing.

You never failed to meet her needs if she is disordered. She is a bottomless pit of needs that no one can fill. The notion that she has now met someone else that makes her happy is absurd. WHo is that guy, OM#1, #2, #3, or #4 ?These folks flit form source of supply to source of supply and have to reunvent themselves periodically and find new friends because they piss folks off.

And you are right on the money re telling the kids the truth. Harley advocates this, as upoint out as do many counselors.

ANd , it would be completely abnormal if you were not angry and bitter about this. That will fade but it is so healthy.

Play the hardest hardball of your life in this divorce. Your assessment of holding a royal flush is right on the money. High wage earning cheating spouse(infidelity is not supposed to count, but most lawyers work it into the picture in some fashion as it ,usually, is somewhat influential provided you hold other cards(like the biggee, primary caregiver).

I'd lay odds that if your situation is as you describe, you will have the house, primary custody and a fair bit of $$ in the form of chold support and maintenance flowing your way.

You were very wise to have recorded the wife rtelling the kids. Not only will it serve to undermine any attempts she may make to deny it in the futeur, but, if push comes to shove in a custody battle, her detailsdisclosure may impact an assessment of her fitness. Really good move there.

[Darth Vader]

Thanks LakesideDream! I appreciate you posting on this thread. I really hope she's not combative...cause I feel I'm holding a royal flush. She ain't got much on her side right now. And word is spreading around the neighborhood of her infidelities.

 

Now my STBxWW is mad at ___ neighbor whom she believes is a gossip hound. Oh well, I'm sorry that the truth is out there for people to hear.

 

As far as raising kids on my own, well, i've pretty much been raising them since they were born. Even when I was working full time the wife was out the door to hospital before kiddos even woke up. And sometimes home after they went to bed. I've been their rock for their entire lives. I've been there every day, except when I'm off on the once a year hunting trip. Or when STBxWW and I were on vacation.

 

I know it's going to get worse before it gets better. One day at a time. One day at a time...

 

 

How did a neighbor find out about your wife screwing around?

[soserious1]

First off I doubt the good Doctor will want custody, it's kind of hard to juggle a blossoming medical career and kids. One thing I will advise you about though, in your quest for "Nuclear Exposure" you need to tread carefully lest you damage her ability to build her practice, such damage could bite you in the rump fiscally.

 

Also, I know a whole lot about MD's, a goodly percentage of them are intently

brillant along with that brillance in many cases comes Bipolar disorder.hypomania is how a good many of them make it thru the grueling years of school and residency and leads more than a handful of them to other excesses and lapses in judgement such as sexual indiscretions.