DDay#3...OM#4...Devestation

[Reggie]

DNUI, I am not sure this applies to your situation, but there is a recgnized trend that may. It seems a high percentage of BS's , in the aftermath of the trauma, overestimate the physical attractiveness of their WS.

I have seen this a lot.

I actually read a book by a woman investigator who specialized in busting WSs. She noted this phenomenon. When she would ask for a physical description of the WS , for investigative purposes, most of the time she would be told how physically attractive the Ws was. When she would look at phots or see the WS in person, she was flabbergasted at how ordinary or even homely the WS was.

IN my own case, I was convinced my wife was very beautiful. However , my sisters and others could just not see it and told me I was nuts.

I'm not sure I understand why this happens. Perhaps it is because the BS is so down in the dumps, he/she undervalues his/her own appeal> I'm not sure I can understand, though , the inflation of the WS's.

But, it is a real phenomenon. Not sure if this helps. But , you might want to think about it.

[soserious1]

Holy chit, I do believe you hit the nail on the head!

 

IC is coming soon...trust me, having worked along side counselors in training at University, I know the benefits of good cousneling.

 

Prince rescuer, yep. I've always been the "great guy" friend who loved to talk women through their problems, help them, etc. The emotional payoff for me...a pretty face who said they cared about me and threw a little loving my way.

 

STBxWW was my first and only partner. I didn't really fall so hard for her in as much as I grew used to having her around, and really felt she needed me to *help* her. And I was getting sexed well. Helping people is a high emotional need for me...in many ways it's more important than making $$ when it came to choosing a career path.

 

I think I've always felt like a bit of a shrek standing next to princess fiona (the hottie one), in our marriage. Always been fearful that I could never land a woman as beautiful as my STBx.

 

After 5 months of reading, growing, learning, I've come to realize just how out of whack our relationship was. And that beauty is only skin deep. Even through I look like shrek, I've got a heart of gold and would make a great husband...and deserve much better from a wife.

 

You are right. She was never my best friend. I was just her fix-it-man, her emotional host.

 

Spot on soserious1! Thanks.

 

DNU1,

 

There is only 1 thing I wish to add to what I said.. you obviously need to look inwards to discover what needs of yours were being served in your marriage and yes, you do need to learn about healthy boundaries and how to set them.. you must keep your STBX at arm's length.. however and this is a big however, in your dealings with her over time and as you heal and get stronger keep in mind that though your wife is a damaged person, chances are good that she got that way by abuse of various sorts perpetrated against her. People with her problem set seldom set about to destroy other people, while she has caused you great pain, remember that her own inner emotional landscape more than likely is probably like living in hell and is much likely more painful than any retribution that you could toss at Her. Also remember that mosyt people with abusive backgrounds do actually love their children and do want them to grow up healthier than they did.Try to show and remind your children about their mother's good points.. as she is a Doctor I will assume she is bright, energetic and does have the capacity to

learn. There is considerable research that shows that while an NPD or BPD

is not cured without tremendous work on the part of a patient that as these folks grow older a lot of the more damaging effects of the condition can lessen. It is very possible that your wife might well seek some therapy on her own and that coupled with growing older might well render her more emotionally stable and thusly better equipped to be an involved, caring mother.

[DNU1]

People with her problem set seldom set about to destroy other people, while she has caused you great pain, remember that her own inner emotional landscape more than likely is probably like living in hell and is much likely more painful than any retribution that you could toss at Her.

 

Yep, she's hurting inside right now. She doesn't even want to show her face in the neighborhood. Can't bring her self to be around or even talk to my family on phone. She's so ashamed and embarrased.

 

I don't swing the 2x4 at her because she's already hitting herself in the head.

 

I do bring up points and questions from my own perspective. Questions she has no answers to and only cause her to weep and say, "I don't know."

 

Also remember that mosyt people with abusive backgrounds do actually love their children and do want them to grow up healthier than they did.Try to show and remind your children about their mother's good points.. as she is a Doctor I will assume she is bright, energetic and does have the capacity to

learn. There is considerable research that shows that while an NPD or BPD

is not cured without tremendous work on the part of a patient that as these folks grow older a lot of the more damaging effects of the condition can lessen. It is very possible that your wife might well seek some therapy on her own and that coupled with growing older might well render her more emotionally stable and thusly better equipped to be an involved, caring mother.

 

I certainly hope that STBx can slay her deamons and make something of what's left of her life. I asked her the other night this question..."

 

"I'm not sure if you and your IC will ever have the answers to why this happaned. If you do find the answers, I'd like to hear them...but that decision to tell me would be up to you -- I will no longer be your husband. I would like you to do one thing regardless of finding answers or not...learn from this! Learn from your actions throughout this marriage and these afairs. Learn from this..."

 

That really hit her hard...tears like niagra falls ensued. (okay, before you bash me for swinging the 2x4 at her head, I didn't say the above out of spite or revenge. I contemplated even saying this. I don't want her to ever put herself in a situation like this again. And I really don't want her to be on the BS end of a situation like this in the future. I will always have deep feelings for the mother of my children and the woman I loved with all my heart for 20 years.)

 

 

Thanks Reggie: I go back and forth. When STBx gets all dolled up, hottie shirt on showing off the body, makeup, smelling nice...well, she does look good in some way. But when I look deep into her eyes I see a broken soul who just doesn't understand why she jeapordized her husband, family, kids and career to be with OMs. She has no clue as to why these affairs happened.

 

Three weeks ago I thought she was the most beautiful woman on the planet. Now, she's not so good. Beauty is only skin deep...

[soserious1]

Yep, she's hurting inside right now. She doesn't even want to show her face in the neighborhood. Can't bring her self to be around or even talk to my family on phone. She's so ashamed and embarrased.

 

I don't swing the 2x4 at her because she's already hitting herself in the head.

 

I do bring up points and questions from my own perspective. Questions she has no answers to and only cause her to weep and say, "I don't know."

 

 

 

I certainly hope that STBx can slay her deamons and make something of what's left of her life. I asked her the other night this question..."

 

"I'm not sure if you and your IC will ever have the answers to why this happaned. If you do find the answers, I'd like to hear them...but that decision to tell me would be up to you -- I will no longer be your husband. I would like you to do one thing regardless of finding answers or not...learn from this! Learn from your actions throughout this marriage and these afairs. Learn from this..."

 

That really hit her hard...tears like niagra falls ensued. (okay, before you bash me for swinging the 2x4 at her head, I didn't say the above out of spite or revenge. I contemplated even saying this. I don't want her to ever put herself in a situation like this again. And I really don't want her to be on the BS end of a situation like this in the future. I will always have deep feelings for the mother of my children and the woman I loved with all my heart for 20 years.)

 

 

Thanks Reggie: I go back and forth. When STBx gets all dolled up, hottie shirt on showing off the body, makeup, smelling nice...well, she does look good in some way. But when I look deep into her eyes I see a broken soul who just doesn't understand why she jeapordized her husband, family, kids and career to be with OMs. She has no clue as to why these affairs happened.

 

Three weeks ago I thought she was the most beautiful woman on the planet. Now, she's not so good. Beauty is only skin deep...

 

 

Can you really blame her for avoiding the neighbors and your family ? As to the rest,what's happening with her moving, have you suggested to her that it might be best if she went to stay with friends or rented a room immediately?

 

You both are going to need to begin to rebuild your lives, she's got to get on solid footing emotionally, she's got years of hefty alimony and child support payments to make, cut her off completely, no more of these maudlin emotional sessions. She needs to foocus on moving to the cheapest possible housing so that she can begin handing over the bulk of her earnings to you and the children, btw, suggest now that she take on moOnlighter hours..you'll get more money in court and she'll be firmly harnessed into basically working round the clock most days as the judge will count her moonlighter hours as regular income. You'll get most of what she earns and she'll be so busy hustling at work to keep up with the payments there won't be time to see other men, not unless she wishes to bring em over to her cheap rooming house between 16 hour on call shifts at the hospital:)

[Reggie]

I don't think she will be that destitute. Child support is a formula and the court will not force her to live on a pittance, soserious. Also, he has no lverage to ask her to work more hours and her attorney will advise against that. And, even if she did work more hours, a good attorney will point out it is unrealistic to expect that into the indefinite future.

She will do just fine as a single doctor paying support and alimony, just like the guys do. Her lifestyle may be affected, but a decent doc will still ahve plenty to live well on.

The important thing for DNUI is to have his lawyer advocate for the most $$ that can be awarded within the law. Hopefully, he will be treated fairly and his gender will not be a factor. The trend, with the exception of custody isues , is to treat gender as a non-factor. Even in cusstody disputes, the primary caregiver trumps the bias against men.

On the issue of his wife's background, you are right, although genetics plays a significant role and some folks with PD's come from normal families. It is really tough, inspite of their lack of control re the circumstances that caused them to be disordered, to step back and realize they did not ask for this disorder. Their behaviors are just so hurtful, it is hard to look at it like this. My first wife is definitely a Narcissist and I feel sorry for her, now, years after our divorce. She will try to engage in battle, but he has learned it will not be tolerated. I have firm boundaries and if she starts with the abuse, I hang up on her.

DNUI, be prepared for some attacking once she fully realizes the tears and such are ineffective. NPD's hate it when the manipulations they have perfected for years do not work.

My first wife, upon the demise of her subsequnt marriage, tried to get a foothold, again. I was nice, but firm. No way would I let her back into my life.

[DNU1]

DNUI, be prepared for some attacking once she fully realizes the tears and such are ineffective. NPD's hate it when the manipulations they have perfected for years do not work.

My first wife, upon the demise of her subsequnt marriage, tried to get a foothold, again. I was nice, but firm. No way would I let her back into my life.

 

Thanks again Reggie!

 

Knowing her for 20+ years, I'm pretty sure the tears and such aren't being used as intentional manipulation (at least consciously...maybe sub-consciously?).

 

And I'm not letting her back in to my life. There is no chance for recovery in this marriage. It is done. End of chapter. End of book. Close book. DONE!

 

She's said she wants me to "be a friend" when all this is through. I'm letting her hold on to that shred of "friend" hope as we work through this settlement / financial part of the puzzle that is divorce. Hopefully that remorse and guilt will help her realize that she shouldn't try to nickle-and-dime me to death when it comes to alimony and child support.

 

I'm moving forward, moving on with my life. Thinking about life as a single Dad, concentrating on my dear daughters, and looking forward to meeting single, available women who will meet my needs, (unlike the STBx).

 

Just have to be very careful and cautious...and patient. I don't want to fall for the first pretty face who meets some of my needs. Boundaries, high standards, set the bar high!

 

I'm in no way ready to "date", but I would like to meet some women and just talk, maybe enjoy a dinner. That would probably help me see what's out there and drain whatever is left in my STBxs love bank.

 

Thoughts? Opinions?

[Reggie]

DNUI, serial cheaters, like your wife, do not feel real remosre. You are a nice guy. So, you are not cynical enough to realize that the tears are conscious manipulation.

It will be interesting to see if she follows through on her agreements re support and maintenance once she sees she can no longer manipulate you.

If she holds to the agreement, it will not be because of her conscience. It will be soley due to her lack of ammunition.

It's is really hard, at first, to see through the act. One becomes more perceptive about it over time and with distance.

[DNU1]

Reggie: I hope you are wrong...but I fear you are right. Only time will tell...

[DNU1]

Doc called me in to discuss STD testing...and walaaaaa, I've got...are you ready for this...

 

GENITAL HERPES (HSV-2)!

 

Faaaaaaaaaacccccckkkkk!

[angie2443]

but he won't hear it from me

 

I admire your sense of honor, donna ... first and foremost is the kids' relationship with their dad. If they discover what a lying cheating rat he is through means of their own, you are not the one responsible for making him look bad in their eyes ~ he's done it all by himself.

 

my one sister took the high road, too. Very upset about her adulterous husband, but never said a word about it to their boys, just kept reiterating that both she and he loved them. As they got older, they got a better idea of their dad and dealt with it on their terms, not through the terms of my sister's hurt, anger and betrayal. I wish more parents dealt with things that way, because when you've got kids, THEIR needs should be first and foremost, even it means suffering your pain in silence.

 

Having had a father who cheated on my mother, I disagree. My mother suffered in silence. I wish she had talked to me about it. I don't mean I wanted the gory details, just the truth. I could tell something was wrong. I could tell that my mother had lost her spirit. It was extremely painful to see and I couldn't wrap my mind around it because I was kept in the dark. I believe if she had talked to me about the situation in an age appropriate mannor, I would have dealt with things better. I eventually did find out through other people. They weren't concerned about my feelings when they told me about my father's cheating, they just wanted to gossip. It would have been much better to hear it from my mother first.

[DNU1]

...and the part that sucks the most about all this STD thing, is that I was looking forward to being free and meeting new women, being intimate with someone other than my one and only partner, the POSSTTxWW.

 

Genital Herpes is not contained through use of condom. It's genital area contact thaat spreads it. So *if* I would like to get intimate with someone, I need to tell them I've got Genital Herpes first.

 

So now my STBx has successfully screwed up the past 20 years of my life AND the next 40 years of my life!

 

I am no longer free...About the only thing that could be worse would to be HIV positive. Can't test for that for six months. SUCK!

[Reggie]

JUst , wow. You should consult your lawyer re a cause of action.

On the suffering in silence for the sake of the children thing, many therapist feel not telling is very damaging to the kids. So, the basic premise, that not telling is better for the kids is not in line with what these counselors feel.

So, in essence, maybe it is those who elect not to tell the truth, that are doing their kids a disservice. Maybe they are the self serving ones.

[Reggie]

This is the fourth case I've read where the BS contracted a STD. So much for all the poo-pooing of this risk by people that have cheated.

I also think it is further evidence that you know the tip of the iceberg re the number of affairs she has had. Not conclusive, but it increases the odds that there were more than 4.

[angie2443]

A parent should never denigrate their child's other parent. I learned that in a class that is mandatory when there is a divorce with a child in the state I lived in at the time. They were the experts, so I figure they must know better than I. And it made sense.

 

I think there is a huge differance between telling children the truth and denigrating the spouse in front of the kids. Again, I think it's very important to tell things in an age appropriate manner. My father had several affairs (short lived) that started when I was around 2. My mother divorced my father when I was 11. It wouldn't have made sense to tell me anything when I was a child because I wouldn't have understood anything. At 8, I could understand some and had plenty of relatives to tell me what was going on. I can only speak from my experience, but I could always sense that things weren't right. It helped me to make sense what was going with my mother and father when I was finally told what was going on with them. I think it also helped me to avoid repeating some of my mother's mistakes.

[DNU1]

Please people, let's drop the "telling the kiddos" thing. can we keep to the topic at hand today... I'VE GOT AN STD!

 

SUCK.

[angie2443]

Sorry:).

 

As far as the STD thing, I've known a few people in my life time with herpes. What I can tell you from their experience, is that you'll go through a lot of anger, shock and the feeling of "why me?". Then you'll come to terms with it and learn to live with it. I with I could tell you more. I would be raging mad at my partner if they gave me a STD from cheating on me.

[Reggie]

Google STD lawsuits, DNUI. There is a lot of info. See if you can find an attorney in your area that handles cases like this.

I am really sorry these folks did this to you. But, you need to seek compensation. You also need to tell the OM's wife. Consult your attorney on ths, first , though.

Your wife is an a-hole. You can use this against her in settling. The prospect of a lwasuit over this should scare the hell out of her and give you greast leverage. I know the tradeoff is not worth it. But, use this.

[DNU1]

Raging mad doesn't even begin to describe what I'm feeling right now. It's like she couldn't just stop with destroying my life over the past 20 years, now I'm left with something that will be with me FOREVER!

 

I'd punch something but I know I would just break my hand.

[DNU1]

Oh, what little sympathy I had for her, (and it was shrinking less and less every day) is now completely gone.

 

I get to live with genital herpes for the remainder of my life. She ought to be paying for this for the rest of my life!

[seibert253]

Oh, what little sympathy I had for her, (and it was shrinking less and less every day) is now completely gone.

 

I get to live with genital herpes for the remainder of my life. She ought to be paying for this for the rest of my life!

 

Sucks big time DN. I can hear the smackdown a comin.

[soserious1]

You need to get the kids DNA tested DNU1, you need to know the full and total truth of your situation. She's had several affairs that you know of, you cannot

rely on hunch or intution to tell you that these kids are in fact your own. You are owed the full truth.

[DNU1]

You need to get the kids DNA tested DNU1, you need to know the full and total truth of your situation. She's had several affairs that you know of, you cannot

rely on hunch or intution to tell you that these kids are in fact your own. You are owed the full truth.

 

Thought about that. Looking at pictures and looking at their manerisms I'm pretty darn sure they are mine. Even if they aren't, I'm going to love them and treat them as they are. I don't want to know if they aren't really mine.

 

They are all I have left from this marriage.

[soserious1]

Thought about that. Looking at pictures and looking at their manerisms I'm pretty darn sure they are mine. Even if they aren't, I'm going to love them and treat them as they are. I don't want to know if they aren't really mine.

 

They are all I have left from this marriage.

 

DNU1, but this isn't all about you.. it's also about the kids, they have a right to know their genetic background, their very lives might depend upon that info someday.

 

you are talking about the rest of your life, if you're going to be giving up career and possible social and romantic prospects in order to raise these children, you need to do that with ALL of the facts laid in front of you. Keep in mind too, that should one of these kids develop an illness requiring a donor and if everybody gets tested, the knowledge that you really aren't the father could come out in a most devasting way at the very worst time possible.

[DNU1]

I understand soserious. Right now I can't bear to hear the news that one or both of my daughters isn't biologically mine.

 

Bad news travels in threes...divorce, STD, what's next? My daughter isn't mine? I'm HIV positive? I'm just waiting for the other shoe to drop...

 

Must remain positive. Must be strong. Even in face of this latest revelation. SUCK.

[Reggie]

Donor and life threatening issue is a long shot and can easily be dealt with in the future, should the need arise. They don't do emergency transplants.

I'm facing the same issue and have decided to keep that Pandora's box closed, DNUI. My kids have been through enoguh with all this and it would change nothing.