clv0116 Posted June 11, 2009 Posted June 11, 2009 Instead of seriously addressing her question, you play it down with a joke. Jokes are great, but please follow it up with some real answers that women can try to undestand. I think I was pretty clear, in all my answers. It's natural, literally, to have ones eyes track a bright shiny sports car or anything else striking and unusual. It's partially a survival trait in fact. The damage comes in if we start to dwell on anything beyond the superficial. There's nothing wrong with noticing and acknowledging something eye catching. There is something wrong with working out some elaborate daydream around it, or him, or her. The first one I write off as nature at work, the second is a bad habit that should be worked on.
sailing Posted June 12, 2009 Posted June 12, 2009 Love the analogy......... but allow me please to play devil's advocate...I think that for some this questions is more about not just noticing but more about what it involves. I think it a bit curious that "your" car is just a car... not a jag or a boxster but a car and the one you notice is a bright yellow porsche...the dream car for many guys maybe??? is this a soft subconscious analogy of the woman in your life as just the car but the ones you notice are the shiny yellow desirable porsche?? the truth..dare ye tell?????? truly, I think lots of women are asking...if you notice what does the notice consist of.... do you dare be truthful and share your last "noticed" experience and thoughts...honestly. when you notice..what do you notice ....and what are the things that run through your mind for the next few minutes as life goes on?? You of course being general not you specifcally clv0116.... do you undress her, do you think nice________, do you think you wish you could run your hands across her nice shiny yellow body, put your hands on her wheel, look under her hood, take her for a ride??????? LOL:p fess up if you dare be truthful and honest..... I for one am just curious..... I really don't check out other guys .... I can notice they are attractive but that is it..... I don't really care beyond that point...... but I never come close to thinking about anyone else stick shift except my sweety's.... Great post! I'd really like to read some truthful, honest replies to this too. Not to judge, but know where we, as women, stand. Perhaps then the "bangers" among us can try to adjust our own expectations and loyalty. That's only fair, isn't it?
hummingbird Posted June 12, 2009 Posted June 12, 2009 Great post! I'd really like to read some truthful, honest replies to this too. Not to judge, but know where we, as women, stand. Perhaps then the "bangers" among us can try to adjust our own expectations and loyalty. That's only fair, isn't it? THANK YOU..... it is truly meant as a curiousity fulfilling analogy-question..but I have a feeling....the honest truth is still under the hood or in the back seat........... I am not seeing any forthcoming.......responses.... ah, the truth does set whom free????????? really, I'll fess, the last guy I "noticed" sitting in a lobby, dark hair, nice face.... I walked by,.............. end of story...not even a thought beyond that. arrhhmmmm next?????????????????????? guys???????????? ps. clv.... glad to see you see the woman(men) in your life as a ferrari....classy and exotic..... as every man should see the woman in his life...........
Jersey Shortie Posted June 15, 2009 Posted June 15, 2009 Funny how many guys will jump the gun on the discussion to defend porn and crap but how many have avoided answering Hummingbird's good questions. I think I was pretty clear, in all my answers. It's natural, literally, to have ones eyes track a bright shiny sports car or anything else striking and unusual. It's partially a survival trait in fact. The damage comes in if we start to dwell on anything beyond the superficial. There's nothing wrong with noticing and acknowledging something eye catching. There is something wrong with working out some elaborate daydream around it, or him, or her. The first one I write off as nature at work, the second is a bad habit that should be worked on. But how many men honestly do infact day dream or fantasize about other women? Alot is my guess and since no other guy wants to chime into it, you can't help but think there is alot of truth in what is being said. And I disagree that the only damange is when you start dwelling on more then just the superficial. That obviously has it's own issues. But enough men spend enough time dwelling on the superficial that it DOES cause issues, and naturally so. Maybe if men spend more time focusing on what they do have, instead of what they didn't, they could get more of what they wanted from their partner, instead of less. The last thing in the world I feel like doing is being giving and kind and sexual with a man that was oglging other women in porn or out in the street. Why don't you guys cut us a break and give us a chance? You know how you work hard all day long in some 9-5 job and want to come home to a happy woman, a safe haven so to speak. Well women want the same thing. Expect we never get that because no matter where we go or are, at home or go out, he is still seeking out other women to make himself happy first. That's what most men care about.
sxyNYCcpl Posted June 15, 2009 Posted June 15, 2009 The last thing in the world I feel like doing is being giving and kind and sexual with a man that was oglging other women in porn or out in the street. So I guess I shouldn't send you the invitation for the big swing party coming up out in the Hamptons? 300 people, an open bar, and a clothing optional heated pool... Best party of the year!
jasminetea Posted June 15, 2009 Posted June 15, 2009 Please don't make those generalisations about men, jerseyshortie. Not all men want or need to 'see out other women to make themselves happy first' and unless you've done a survey of all men, the statement 'That's what most men care about' is never going to have any credibility. If you go around with this attitude the whole time (and I can't see how you would fail to do so) its not really any wonder you attract the men you b!tch about.
clv0116 Posted June 15, 2009 Posted June 15, 2009 Great post! I'd really like to read some truthful, honest replies to this too. Not to judge, but know where we, as women, stand. Perhaps then the "bangers" among us can try to adjust our own expectations and loyalty. That's only fair, isn't it? I am not seeing any forthcoming.......responses.... ah, the truth does set whom free????????? Well this was the unvarnished truth as I see it.
clv0116 Posted June 15, 2009 Posted June 15, 2009 But how many men honestly do infact day dream or fantasize about other women? Alot is my guess and since no other guy wants to chime into it, you can't help but think there is alot of truth in what is being said. It's reflex to notice, as in to have one's eyes flick and follow for a few seconds. If you can't stand that, you should resign from the human race, because everyone does this. Mammals reflexively focus on, track and identify anything striking that enters their visual perception. It keeps us alive and well fed. It's a bad habit to do more, to dwell on the way her knees dimple or whatever. Unfortunately a lot of single guys actually cultivate this bad habit while they are younger and single and as we all (should) know, ingrained habits can be difficult to root out. If you can't patiently help with that eradication process then you need to find someone who has that in control already.
stephy Posted June 16, 2009 Posted June 16, 2009 I'm wondering if you've been in a HAPPY, committed relationship with an attractive girl, do you notice other girls? Do you still think "oh man, she's hot." Or do you have eyes only for your girl? I'm not asking if you'd actually act on it...just, do you notice them? Honest answers please! Thanks! all guys rather they are in a happy relationship will look just the same as all women will look at guys.Nobody should feel its wrong to do its just human nature.
Jersey Shortie Posted June 16, 2009 Posted June 16, 2009 So I guess I shouldn't send you the invitation for the big swing party coming up out in the Hamptons? 300 people, an open bar, and a clothing optional heated pool... Best party of the year! Your problem Sxy is that you are a sexual snob. You think that because you engage in sexual practices that many don't, that this somehow makes you more evolved, aware and healty. Of course, others will disagree. Just because you swing from the rafters and have an open relationship or swingers party doesn't mean your more sexually evovled then anyone else. It's reflex to notice, as in to have one's eyes flick and follow for a few seconds. If you can't stand that, you should resign from the human race, because everyone does this. Mammals reflexively focus on, track and identify anything striking that enters their visual perception. It keeps us alive and well fed. Focusing on your partner also can keep you alive and well fed. If you can't patiently help with that eradication process then you need to find someone who has that in control already. Sorry but I am not looking for a man to come to me in hopes that I can make him be more of a man. I am looking for a man to come to me with his own will power to want to be a better man and actually put that in practice. The first seeks strength from a woman, the second seeks to be strong for a woman. A huge different and unfortunetly a problem that alot of men let themselves be controlled by.
clv0116 Posted June 16, 2009 Posted June 16, 2009 Focusing on your partner also can keep you alive and well fed. It's a reflex, like pulling your hand back from a fire. Don't be disingenuous. Sorry but I am not looking for a man to come to me in hopes that I can make him be more of a man. I am looking for a man to come to me with his own will power to want to be a better man and actually put that in practice. The first seeks strength from a woman, the second seeks to be strong for a woman. A huge different and unfortunetly a problem that alot of men let themselves be controlled by. Silly distinction with no difference. A lot of men, rightly or wrongly, see no downside to cultivating the ogling habit while they are single. Later it has become ingrained AND reinforced by biology, very tough to break. Some men will still never care and will try to write off their bad habit as 'being a man'. They are dolts. Others will want to fix it, but breaking such a habit takes time and effort. If the woman they are with is unsympathetic and constantly critical rather than understanding of the fight they are putting up it just makes things harder. Do you want to help your man where he needs help, or do you expect him to be perfect and rigidly condemn him for every error he makes? I think the best way to fix this is to find a man who realizes it's a problem, a bad habit, and to support him in his ongoing efforts to become a better man. Who knows, maybe such a man would be inclined to do the same for you, if you have any flaws or bad habits yourself.
Jersey Shortie Posted June 16, 2009 Posted June 16, 2009 It's a reflex, like pulling your hand back from a fire. Don't be disingenuous. Who is being disingenuous? I am really tired of the excuses. When do men start to stand up for the things they keep telling women they think are important instead of saying they are important but making justificatoins and buts for behavior to the contrary? Silly distinction with no difference. No, it's a fabulous distinction and a huge different. In one case the man is asking for his woman to provide the strength, in the other the man is being the one to provide it. I want a man to come into a relationship bringing strength. Alot of women look to men for strength. The problem is alot of men fall victim to thinking that their woman can be the one to install strength in them. And a woman can't. If the woman they are with is unsympathetic and constantly critical rather than understanding of the fight they are putting up it just makes things harder. Do you want to help your man where he needs help, or do you expect him to be perfect and rigidly condemn him for every error he makes? No one said he needs to be condemned for every error he makes. The issue is that it's an error that isn't made just once-in-awhile. You forget that she obviously has a "fight" to deal with as well. For alot of women, it's something they have to deal with and face everyday with their guy. Whether he is out in public or at home on his computer looking at other women. There is no place now-a-days that a woman gets a safe haven to come home to. I think the best way to fix this is to find a man who realizes it's a problem, a bad habit, and to support him in his ongoing efforts to become a better man. Who knows, maybe such a man would be inclined to do the same for you, if you have any flaws or bad habits yourself. No, I have no flaws and bad habits.
clv0116 Posted June 16, 2009 Posted June 16, 2009 No, I have no flaws and bad habits. No wonder you're such a happy person, and such a joy to be around.
sxyNYCcpl Posted June 17, 2009 Posted June 17, 2009 Your problem Sxy is that you are a sexual snob. You think that because you engage in sexual practices that many don't, that this somehow makes you more evolved, aware and healty. I don't think that, I know it for a fact. We have discovered a way to have an adult relationship without any drama. It doesn't matter if I look, it doesn't matter if she looks, it doesn't matter if either of us does. Because we know that having sexual thoughts, acts, or deeds towards other people means absolutely nothing when it comes to our relationship. I cannot provide everything she could possibly want, and that's okay, because I provide her with enough love that she wants to be with ME, and vice versa. I realize it sounds a bit arrogant, but to be honest I feel sorry for you. We are able to not only handle, but actually enjoy each other enjoying physical pleasure from other people, whereas you cannot even deal with your SO looking at photos of strangers being sexual. So do I feel superior to you? Absolutely. We are insanely happy, you are insanely miserable. Given the choice of those, which do you think is better? OMG, he checked out the waitress!! Should I dump him? OMG, she looked at dirty pictures!! Should I make her hit the road? Please. You think you are being reasonable, rather you are creating yourself unnecessary drama and angst. If you like how that makes you feel, keep it up. If you don't, perhaps looking at a different way of thinking is in order.
Jersey Shortie Posted June 17, 2009 Posted June 17, 2009 Sxy, It's not a fact, it's your experience. And what you do is what makes you feel your open minded and that is fine. But in my world, flamboyancy doens't equal true open mindedness. Don't assume that people that practice different sexual practices then you are less evovled just because they don't prescribe to your idealogies. For someone who is proud of his free thinking ways, you aren't very open to idealogies that are different from yours. As for feeling sorry for me, it's all in the eye of the beholder isn't it. Because I feel sorry for you. I don't need to seek sexual satisfaction from many partners. That's me. That doesn't make me miserable or "less" in any way shape or form. And I feel sorry for you that your ideologies, while on one end of a spectrum, are bascially born from the same ideologies that Jesus-loving-Bible-Thumpers tout to the extreme that they give religion a bad name sometimes. And unless you know me, telling me that I am insanely miserable is an illogical and completely false statement to make. I hate to tell you but you don't come off like Mr. Happy. You could be very happy, but goign by your posts, I don't see much evidence that proves that your blissfully happy. No wonder you're such a happy person, and such a joy to be around. I am a happy person and a joy to be around. Thank you for being intelligent enough to realize that reality and message board projections are two different animals.
proton Posted June 17, 2009 Posted June 17, 2009 yep guys do. and some girls have problems with that.
GorillaTheater Posted June 17, 2009 Posted June 17, 2009 It's not a fact, it's your experience. Definitely words to contemplate.
Island Girl Posted June 17, 2009 Posted June 17, 2009 My gross irritation is when people like yourself, in your zest to codemn all men for their primitive behaviors, summarily ignore and piss on shining examples of positive male behavior. Sorry I am just catching up on this thread -- read all the way through it and what I do not understand is why people have such a problem with generalizations by JS when comments like the quoted below are being put out there as well. Or breathe. Noticing other women is as natural as breathing. Guys who insist otherwise are lying or extraordinarily whipped. Or gay.... but the gay guys even notice hair, make up, clothing and accessories of other woman. For the record my husband is like carhill's original post and he isn't gay, lying, or whipped, etc. I doubt carhill is either. But according to a lot of posters here because he doesn't notice other women he isn't a man or doesn't have testosterone...
carhill Posted June 17, 2009 Posted June 17, 2009 LOL, I think we've agreed upon "abnormal" as the politically correct descriptor Again, this is role modeling. I had a father who did not ogle women, nor did he comment about other women in or out of my mother's presence. It just was not a feature of my socialization. Men can have the same drives and setpoints and yet process behaviors differently. Celebrate the difference, as it provides you with diversity to be attracted to. Something for everyone
clv0116 Posted June 17, 2009 Posted June 17, 2009 I am a happy person and a joy to be around. Of course you are dear. I just realized the reason after you informed me you have no bad habits. I wonder, did you ever have a bad habit or have you always been as perfect as the driven white snow?
Jersey Shortie Posted June 17, 2009 Posted June 17, 2009 Of course you are dear. I just realized the reason after you informed me you have no bad habits. I wonder, did you ever have a bad habit or have you always been as perfect as the driven white snow? I consider myself more of a blush colored snow. You'd be yellow no? Definitely words to contemplate. I hold those words true for myself too Gorilla.
sxyNYCcpl Posted June 18, 2009 Posted June 18, 2009 Sxy, It's not a fact, it's your experience. I have many experiences. Among these is two marriages, one miserable, that lasted far longer than it should have, and one happy. It's not perfect, but most of it's imperfections has to do with the environment we find ourselves in. Two hour commutes tend to put a damper on certain things. But that won't last forever, and it has an upside as well. The marriage that is happy includes a total lack of drama. We do not worry that the other is doing something on the "forbidden" list because the list is so short you can count it on one hand and have many fingers left over. That you get so worked up over pictures, quite frankly I find sad, because it's such a nothingburger. With the one exception of child porn, which is repugnant, I cannot imagine a picture that would cause us to question each other. But in my world, flamboyancy doens't equal true open mindedness. It's not about flamboyancy, it's about not limiting yourself. You have so many rules. Don't look at pictures. Don't watch videos. For God's sake, don't look at an actual human being. We don't. The less rules you have, the easier it is to live up to the expectations, and the easier it is to be happy. If your rules are more important to you than your happiness, so be it. For someone who is proud of his free thinking ways, you aren't very open to idealogies that are different from yours. It''s not that I'm not "open" to other idealogies, it's that I find them silly. People fretting over so many things, becaue they've been led to believe that things are "supposed to be" a certain way. A way that is counterproductive when it comes to true happiness. Tell me, Jersey, what's more important. Being right, or being happy? I don't need to seek sexual satisfaction from many partners. That's me. That doesn't make me miserable or "less" in any way shape or form. The fact that you do not personally feel the need to seek sexual satisfaction from multiple partners may not make you miserable, but the fact that others do, including possibly, to your horror, those you may be involved with, does. At the risk of being redundant, you suffer from the very concept of your SO merely watching pictures of strangers experiencing sexual pleasure, whereas we do NOT suffer, in fact quite the opposite, from each another actually experiencing sexual pleasure from others. And unless you know me, telling me that I am insanely miserable is an illogical and completely false statement to make. I don't have to know you to see that. It's obvious to anyone who has read enough of your posts. I hate to tell you but you don't come off like Mr. Happy. I sure am curious what leads you to that conclusion. I don't get enough sleep, I don't have enough personal time, and I'm worried that our economy may completely fall off the wheels, but when it comes to Mrs. SXY, I wouldn't trade what we have for the winning lotto numbers plus the entirety of the Dallas Cowboy Cheerleaders.
clv0116 Posted June 18, 2009 Posted June 18, 2009 I consider myself more of a blush colored snow. You'd be yellow no? No, more a light beige sort of shade, a lot lighter in winter.
gopher Posted June 18, 2009 Posted June 18, 2009 I don't think that, I know it for a fact. We have discovered a way to have an adult relationship without any drama. It doesn't matter if I look, it doesn't matter if she looks, it doesn't matter if either of us does. Because we know that having sexual thoughts, acts, or deeds towards other people means absolutely nothing when it comes to our relationship. I cannot provide everything she could possibly want, and that's okay, because I provide her with enough love that she wants to be with ME, and vice versa. I realize it sounds a bit arrogant, but to be honest I feel sorry for you. We are able to not only handle, but actually enjoy each other enjoying physical pleasure from other people, whereas you cannot even deal with your SO looking at photos of strangers being sexual. So do I feel superior to you? Absolutely. We are insanely happy, you are insanely miserable. Given the choice of those, which do you think is better? OMG, he checked out the waitress!! Should I dump him? OMG, she looked at dirty pictures!! Should I make her hit the road? Please. You think you are being reasonable, rather you are creating yourself unnecessary drama and angst. If you like how that makes you feel, keep it up. If you don't, perhaps looking at a different way of thinking is in order. I disagree with this, my experiences and others I know of that were in the "lifestyle" were not as completely positive as your experiences. There are negatives, whether you would like to acknowledge them or not. I'm glad that it works for you, but that isn't a blanket statement for everyone. That said, I agree with your posts much of the time.
Jersey Shortie Posted June 18, 2009 Posted June 18, 2009 It's not about flamboyancy, it's about not limiting yourself. You have so many rules. Don't look at pictures. Don't watch videos. For God's sake, don't look at an actual human being. We don't. The less rules you have, the easier it is to live up to the expectations, and the easier it is to be happy. If your rules are more important to you than your happiness, so be it. It's always easier to live up to a standard when the bar is set low. That is not to say your standards are low, that's only to say what I pesronally think on the topic. As for limiting myself, I don't limit myself at all. I actually think the things I want from life, from a relationship, will get me close to having more then less. I don't agree with your idealogy at all. I don't have an issue with how *you* choose to live your life. But I don't think your way of life is the correct way, at least for me it's not. You seem to think the only way a person is truly open minded is if they approach things with your same flare. It's jsut not true. And what is most important to me is finding a man that values the things I value in life. Not how many rules I do or don't have. You don't have an inkling what is important to me so stop presuming you know anything of me. It''s not that I'm not "open" to other idealogies, it's that I find them silly. People fretting over so many things, becaue they've been led to believe that things are "supposed to be" a certain way. A way that is counterproductive when it comes to true happiness. Tell me, Jersey, what's more important. Being right, or being happy? If you're so contect with being happy why are you trying so hard to prove me wrong? The fact that you call other idealogies "silly" shows your lack of open mindedness to how others choose to live. You consider yourself some kind of renagade, maverick among a flock of sheep don't you. I don't live my life because that's how things are "supposed" to be. I live my life looking for the things that I find important and that will add quality to it. Just as I am sure you do. The fact that you do not personally feel the need to seek sexual satisfaction from multiple partners may not make you miserable, but the fact that others do, including possibly, to your horror, those you may be involved with, does. At the risk of being redundant, you suffer from the very concept of your SO merely watching pictures of strangers experiencing sexual pleasure, whereas we do NOT suffer, in fact quite the opposite, from each another actually experiencing sexual pleasure from others. I don't suffer from anything. Really, I am not even on here telling you that how you live your life is wrong. And I am certainly not looking for life advice from you.
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