Selfishness cures?

[lonelypiscesguy]

My exGF said I was selfishish. OK, I can agree with her up to a point, but I still think that her issues coupled with her little games made me make some regrettably selfish choices. I don't think I'm THAT selfish, but just a little. And I don't want to be anymore! At all, not even a little. I have made it my sole focus in life to date until I can find "her" and I want to lay the ground work for this mission NOW! I am 42 y.o. and I am running out of time. Any thoughts, dear people on LS?

[Ronni_W]

Well, first step would be to work towards TOTALLY owning that part of you that can sometimes act "selfishly". Right now, you're still blaming it on an external source.

 

Second, what is your personal definition of "selfish" -- how do YOU know when you're acting out your "selfish" part? (What are your perceptions thoughts, feelings before, during and after you act that way -- about yourself and the other person/people involved?)

 

Third, how does it impact others when you act that way?

[You'reasian]

My exGF said I was selfishish. OK, I can agree with her up to a point, but I still think that her issues coupled with her little games made me make some regrettably selfish choices. I don't think I'm THAT selfish, but just a little. And I don't want to be anymore! At all, not even a little. I have made it my sole focus in life to date until I can find "her" and I want to lay the ground work for this mission NOW! I am 42 y.o. and I am running out of time. Any thoughts, dear people on LS?

 

So your selfish behavior toward her seems a little conditional, partially a reaction to her issues, but you said you might be a little?

 

I think all people are a bit selfish to some extent - we have preferences afterall - that in itself is selfish.

 

Being selfless is even more challenging - whether its giving of yourself, your resources etc. - but I think being around the right people and focusing on others close to you is helpful.

[lonelypiscesguy]

Well, first step would be to work towards TOTALLY owning that part of you that can sometimes act "selfishly". Right now, you're still blaming it on an external source.

 

Second, what is your personal definition of "selfish" -- how do YOU know when you're acting out your "selfish" part? (What are your perceptions thoughts, feelings before, during and after you act that way -- about yourself and the other person/people involved?)

 

Third, how does it impact others when you act that way?

All very good, hard questions!

 

1. You are correct, and I really did realize this as I was first thinking it when going over the break-up. Ex GF would play games that I would fall into, get pissed, and she would tell me after "you're selfish". But you're still correct! Right now, I'm still figuring out all that went wrong and trying to assign "blame" where it belongs. I know I did a lot of jerk things, but sometimes it was provoked, IMHO.

2. OK, toughie. The ex told me after break-up she thought me selfish, I told her I thought I could be thoughtless at times, but certainly not selfish! Gasp! Now I am more inclined to agree with, but still, up to a point. She had to tell me after the fact that she found me selfish, unfortunately, I couldn't recognize it at the time, that's how oblivious I am! My friends said she was wrong, but of course, your lover expects more from you, and in different ways. I guess I should just say, she would play c***tease games, I would get pissed (issues with), she would say I just wanted sex, after not seeing each other for a couple months. Could have handled it better when it came up, I now know, but that bridged is nuked.

3.Again, my friends don't find me anymore or less selfish than anybody else, but they have fewer expectations than a lover. It impacted my ex enough to break up with me. I hope I can get more input, I'm loving this!

[Ronni_W]

I'm loving this!

I know...it can be so fun, can't it?

Just a small problem though -- you didn't answer any of the questions from your own perspective . Yes, you TYPED a lot of words...and they're all in grammatically correct sentences...but. Well, I'm getting that you don't really know what's going on for you about this, yet. That is, it seems that so far, you've been relying on external sources to inform you about your "selfish" behaviour.

 

1. When you can JUST say, "I do some selfish things sometimes," THAT'S when you'll be owning it.

 

2 & 3. Thanks for sharing what you ex and your friends perceive about it. For your self-reflection, though, it's more important to get YOUR thoughts and feelings.

I get that when you feel "pissed", you can act selfishly. Is anger the ONLY feeling that triggers it? What makes it okay to act "selfish" just cos you're feeling pissed?

 

And I get the result of its' impact -- she left. But what types of feelings would she had to have experienced, in order to leave. (Unless she specifically told you how it made her feel, these would be your guesses and assumptions. But that's okay for purpose of this.)

 

Unless someone tells you, how do YOU know when you've acted "selfishly"?

Do you have a difference between acting angrily and acting selfishly?

[lonelypiscesguy]

First, a little background; I haven't dated for about ten years (that ex was, indeed, a lying slut, I was on the rebound from divorce, was a doormat). Either my bitterness (what a waste of life!) or my employment kept me from being able to date for ten years! So having a GF was new to me. Had I been dating, I would have recognized the "games" for what they were, and could have acted more mature and less selfish, I know this now. I can accept when I am being selfish with guy friends, and will own up to it when I do, that's how we keep friends, right? With women, well, I don't have a lot of women friends, never have, don't even care to now. I just like hanging out with the boys, always have. So a womans perspective is hard to understand for me, even though I was married for ten, we were happy for 8, believe it not!

OK, I'm rambling now, but what I'm trying to get at is, I can recognize my selfish behavior, I could with the wife, and I admitted being selfish with this ex (just reflecting on triggers when I say her games would piss me off). I try to be a descent guy, I try to be brutally honest with and about myself, so I don't think I'm in denial as much as I may come accross in my post. I guess what I am asking is, and to coin a phrase, what about "relationship selfishness"?

As I think about it, the answer is date more, find a healthy relationship with a woman, and nuture it. My ex GF's mental/emotional issues and her recovery issues sometimes made it difficult to relate to her, and I swear, I tried to be understanding and patient, but I have little patience for women that play the tease game. I still can't help but feel that she was being a D tease the whole time (LDR, spent about 10 days together in a 7 month period, 3 of those days were sexual). She confused me and I am still confused. I loved her and she said she loved me. Why not more time together and intimacy when we were together?

Anyway, sorry to ramble again, I'm still trying to work some things out, but she made me realize that I do, indeed, have some issues of my own to work out. Thanks for the great advice, folks!

[Ronni_W]

I don't think there's such a thing as "relationship selfishness" that is terribly different from any other type of selfishness.

 

It's still is not clear if you ACTUALLY were so "selfish" that she couldn't stand it -- what if HER perception is what is totally effed up? What if HER personal definition of "selfish" is so far away from what is 'commonly accepted' that it does not even belong under the "selfish" umbrella?

 

Cos, that's what I was thinking might have been going on -- but it's impossible to tell at this stage.

Thing is, don't go beating yourself up over somebody else's distorted image of you; and don't go looking for something "negative" within yourself that just isn't there. Know what I mean?

 

Uncover for yourself if YOU think you are or are not this "selfish" person that SHE (thinks she) saw. She could just have been projecting her own crap onto you!

[lonelypiscesguy]

Thanks, Ronni. I think that is exactly the case, that her princess standards weren't met, so I wasn't trying hard enough to please her and how dare me for wanting my needs met! I am realizing that she is indeed a sick woman that I should have kept my distance from, but hindsight is 20/20 after all...I don't know how selfish I am, I mean, I did overlook all of her baggage and issues to be with her (rehab, bipolar, AA, etc.), would somebody selfish do that? I guess a player would, but I'm not a player and I ended up falling in love with her. When she said all she wanted to do was get high about 3 and half months into our budding R, I talked to her until she felt better (I hope), told her relapsing wouldn't be a deal breaker, within reason. Would a selfish man do this? The more I think about it the more I realize it was a sick R with a sick woman. She really seemed healthy, though.

[Sweetcheripie]

Oh my goodness - sounds like it is such a good thing you got away from that relationship.

 

From what you have described it doesn't sound like you were selfish but being healthy and standing up for yourself.

 

If you are really worried about the selfishness - try volunteering. There are tons of organizations that you can give your time. It doesn't have to take a lot of time - like simple things of delivering meals to seniors once a week but it will mean the world to the people you help.

[lonelypiscesguy]

Thanks, but I made my mistakes. Drunk dialed her and 5 days before my B-Day. We live 400 miles apart and I live with 2 other bachelors (not even decent excuses, I know) and other much less severe squabbles and misunderstandings, but that WAS a biggie. I don't have to be told how lame it was to do that, blackout drunk, to a recovering GF. I still feel like a piece of s*** to this day (oh, poor me!). I instigated what was set into motion, but in a way I think it was for the best. We never would have lasted. Even if we got to the point of living together, well, the break up could have been much more painful after being together 2 or 3 years. She told me in the last email as BF/GF that "I don't think you're a selfish pig. We are all selfish at times and I guess I was being so well this weekend." There were a lot of things, red flags, that I ignored that have come crashing down around me now. There were times when I thought of ending it with her. But I have learned. I will be a lot more aware of my thoughtless behavior, and I'm not a drunk, I just like to drink with the boys. But it broke her heart, nevertheless. I still wish I could make it up to her, but that's a done deal.

[lonelypiscesguy]

OK, the fact is I, I chose to get drunk and call her. It was selfish of me to want to get drunk, especially with a recovering GF, even if it was an LDR, especially since it was an LDR. Trust is too important and too easily lost in an LDR. I blew it. There, I said it. She forgave me, but I still felt the c***tease stuff was a little too much. It shouldn't have pissed me off as much as it did, but those are MY issues, I can't stand that s***! It was me that instigated our downfall, I fear that she really did love me and I did, in fact, break her heart. Sometimes I really could doubt her, though. A lot of mixed signals in our R. I just want to get over this, get over the guilt, and learn from my mistakes. Yes, I know, alcohol played a HUGE part in this, but she was more sensitive than most to having a 'rowdy' BF. I'll forgive myself eventually, but I hope she never loved me so I DIDN'T break her heart, if that makes sense.

[Ronni_W]

How about that you BOTH made some poor choices and unwise decisions? Cos, if YOU were the recovering drunk and suffering from bipolar, how smart is that for YOU to hook-up with a woman who is living with two other women, all of whom know how to party???

Same as, no, it was not too smart on your part, to hook-up with a recovering drunk who is suffering from bipolar.

 

But usually our BEST life lessons are there to be learned after our seemingly "worst" choices and decisions.

 

I did overlook all of her baggage and issues to be with her (rehab, bipolar, AA, etc.), would somebody selfish do that?

From what you've said, I'm not interpreting that you "overlooked" her emotional baggage or issues. Sounds more as if you made all the allowances that were within your knowledge, skills and resources to make.

I'm assuming that you are NOT a mental health care professional, so what more did you expect of yourself? (What SHE may or may not have expected is not the point but if you do want to go there...what more could SHE have realistically and reasonably expected from you?)

 

It is not "selfish" to not give what you don't have to give! When it comes to our emotional needs and wants, there is this expectation that others ought to just have what is necessary and/or know how to support us.

It's like saying, "When I need a million dollars, I expect you to have it to give to me" or, "When I want an oak desk, I expect you to know how to build it for me." It's ludicrous, of course. But it points to how under-educated and ill-informed we are about emotions in general.

 

It is not "selfish" to want/try to take care of and fulfill your own wants, needs and goals! People use that label "selfish" in order to manipulate/guilt/shame others into doing what they want. There is only ONE person who has enough insight to know if you really do have a "selfish" tendency, and that person is YOU.

 

There is a huge difference between self-care/self-advocacy and "selfish."

 

I chose to get drunk and call her. It was selfish of me to want to get drunk, especially with a recovering GF, even if it was an LDR, especially since it was an LDR.

 

I dunno. Why couldn't she just have said, "I really don't like when you do that. Please don't do it again"? Why does SHE get to NOT be understanding, accepting, empathetic, forgiving? What is HER responsibility insofar as your weak moments?

 

Is it accurate that you sat down, made a conscious plan, and said to yourself, "I am going to get drunk, just so I can call her in an inebriated state, because I know that she's a recovering alcoholic"?

I'm also not getting what difference it makes as to your timing of the drunk dial, nor what makes it "even worse" just cos it was an LDR.

 

You got drunk, whether you chose to or it just ended up that way. How is that some type of statement about or against her? In fact, being a former drunk herself she ought to have understood BETTER, that getting drunk is about the Self who did the drinking...about the demons, fears and shadows of that Self.

 

Trust goes both ways. Surely it would have been reasonable for YOU to trust that she would have the knowledge and skills to be able to put your behaviour into its' proper context, and not make it about her. SHE blew that one, IMO.

Or, you both blew it equally...you didn't do it any MORE than she did.

 

Possibly she believes that she is entitled to special allowances and privileges, and ought not be held accountable for HER behaviour, because she has emotional baggage and issues, and is a recovering drunk, in rehab, suffering from bipolar.

That is BS. It is her own faulty belief system.

 

You did NOT have the knowledge, skills and resources to take on a woman suffering from bipolar and trying to overcome an addiction. That does not make you a "selfish" person, or "less than", or "not good enough".

 

IMO

[lonelypiscesguy]

Thank you, Ronni. I really do love the advice here. I was thinking about going to therapy (never been) for my "selfishness", but you guys an gals are very therapeutic. I am trying to own up to my mistakes. I DID blow it, I did set things in motion. She told me she had issues with talking to people who are buzzed, drunk or wasted, before I called her the FIRST time I had a buzz. I wasn't drunk, I was drinking with friends and was a happy but bordering on drunk. She brought up my ex-wife as we were talking and that kind of upset me, but didn't say anything at the time. We talked the next day, I told her, heatedly, that I didn't appreciate her bringing up what she new was a very painful episode in my life. She cried, said her father would only call her when he was drunk and he hasn't spoken to her since she was 12. I felt like s***, but how could I know? She doesn't like it when her mother drinks too much, either. So, I did this TWICE, though the first time, I had about 4-5 beers and had a slight slur and buzz. I DID promise her I wouldn't do it again.

Look, I want to be brutally honest with myself and I would appreciate it if you good folks would as well. It has been 2 months and I still am torn-up with conflicting emotions of betrayal, remorse, resentment and regret. But I want to learn EVERYTHING I need to learn so that I can reenter the dating world as a good catch, emotionally, finacialy and mentally.

Yes, I think she did some things and said some things that still leave me scratching my head, but right now I want to forgive myself and LEARN and IMPROVE. I want to be in love again and I want to be that good catch guy in his early 40's that did the hard work of losing all his baggage in the terminal! It's only fair to my future love interest. Sorry these are so long, I have to get this out and writing has always helped.

[Ronni_W]

Sorry these are so long,

Er, did you happen to notice the length of my previous?

 

If you really want to "go hard", then maybe one question you need to answer for yourself (and not necessarily post about it) is the POSSIBILITY that you may have an alcohol-intake management problem.

Not because you drink or get drunk but because you allowed it to negatively impact your relationship AFTER you knew that it would do so.

 

At the same time, your ex had her core issue about her drunk-dialing dad LONG before she knew you existed. Within my belief system, she attracted you into her life so that you could reflect this very issue back to her (that was one of your unconscious "relationship jobs", so to speak.) SHE then had a choice to seek therapy, which SHE did not do. But. You did YOUR job as it relates to her core issue. You owed her nothing else, about it.

 

And she had a job to do that relates to YOUR core issue (again, within what I believe is the purpose of relationships.) Any idea what issue she reflected back to you, with which you'd been struggling LONG before she showed up?

 

-----

After two months, things can still be terribly raw...especially if you were also dealing with core issue stuff. You mention "emotions of betrayal, remorse, resentment and regret" and, earlier, guilt.

 

Is there one specific incident for which you are particularly needing your self-forgiveness? And, how will you know that you have given yourself the forgiveness that you need? (What will have changed, and how will it have changed?)

 

Feel free to PM me, btw.

 

Look, I want to be brutally honest with myself

How do you feel about being lovingly, gently and compassionately honest with yourself? I mean generally...why not make a commitment to treat yourself with care and respect ALL the time, from this day forward?

Because "BEST catches" are loving, gentle, compassionate, caring and respectful

[lonelypiscesguy]

Er, did you happen to notice the length of my previous?

 

If you really want to "go hard", then maybe one question you need to answer for yourself (and not necessarily post about it) is the POSSIBILITY that you may have an alcohol-intake management problem.

Not because you drink or get drunk but because you allowed it to negatively impact your relationship AFTER you knew that it would do so.

 

At the same time, your ex had her core issue about her drunk-dialing dad LONG before she knew you existed. Within my belief system, she attracted you into her life so that you could reflect this very issue back to her (that was one of your unconscious "relationship jobs", so to speak.) SHE then had a choice to seek therapy, which SHE did not do. But. You did YOUR job as it relates to her core issue. You owed her nothing else, about it.

 

And she had a job to do that relates to YOUR core issue (again, within what I believe is the purpose of relationships.) Any idea what issue she reflected back to you, with which you'd been struggling LONG before she showed up?

 

-----

After two months, things can still be terribly raw...especially if you were also dealing with core issue stuff. You mention "emotions of betrayal, remorse, resentment and regret" and, earlier, guilt.

 

Is there one specific incident for which you are particularly needing your self-forgiveness? And, how will you know that you have given yourself the forgiveness that you need? (What will have changed, and how will it have changed?)

 

Feel free to PM me, btw.

 

 

How do you feel about being lovingly, gently and compassionately honest with yourself? I mean generally...why not make a commitment to treat yourself with care and respect ALL the time, from this day forward?

Because "BEST catches" are loving, gentle, compassionate, caring and respectful

I don't really drink that much anymore, when I pulled my little trick, I told her I was going to take a break for a while and I did for a month. I bought a 12 pack because things were going so well for me at the time. She didn't mind me drinking while I was talking to her on the phone (I told her, "BTW, just so you know, I'm having a couple beers, thought I should tell you." She; "Oh, I don't mind, I just don't want you to talk to me drunk." I don't rememeber making the call or what I said. She had to tell me I did it.). But the regret I feel is blackout drunk dialing. And I really don't even drink that much anymore! Not an excuse, I know. I had cut back a lot even before she found me, but I went and did that. Therein layeth my guilt.

I wish I could see what you mean by the issue I brought to the R. I guess I need to meditate on that. Throughout our 7 month 'experiment', I would sometimes feel like I knew we wouldn't be long term. Too much bickering and her being demanding and taking things I said out of context (bipolar symptom?). Plus, even though we were LDR, a lot more talk of sex than doing. Could you tell me what you think I was struggling with? I'm oblivious!

I do need to be more compassionate with myself, and I am trying. As always, Ronni, you are right, 2 months in and the feelings are still raw! I won't date until I am over her and can truly forgive myself. Done the rebound thing before, not fair to the new girl or to me. Thanks Ronni!!!

[Ronni_W]

the regret I feel is blackout drunk dialing. ... I went and did that. Therein layeth my guilt.

Fair enough.

Mind if I make a request? Right now, say to yourself (out loud is preferable -- even if you'll feel like a tool, it's still preferable.) Say, "I give myself permission to SOME day forgive myself for my blackout drunk dialing."

 

Perfect Thank you.

 

I would sometimes feel like I knew we wouldn't be long term. Too much bickering and her being demanding and taking things I said out of context...a lot more talk of sex than doing. Could you tell me what you think I was struggling with?

It's kind of something that will resonate with you when you hit on it. In general terms (my interpretation is): you weren't always seen in an accurate light, you didn't always get your own needs met, and there was more conflict/drama than your own psyche prefers.

 

Does any of that remind you of any other relationship you had in the past? Could be a parent, sibling, friend or a prior love relationship.

 

Your intuition that it wouldn't last too long was obviously correct. But you must not have trusted it on some level, or thought you could over-ride it somehow? Do you have a history of not listening to your Inner Voice, maybe facing negative consequences because of not taking your own counsel?

 

But also, it's that you're beating yourself up over something that you KNEW was inevitable. You KNEW what was going to be the outcome and you're STILL choosing self-hostile thoughts and feelings. If you had to guess, what is up with that?

 

You're welcome, btw -- I'm continuously learning about myself, too, and also find that it helps to crystallize things when we share our words with others instead of just hearing them in our own mind's ears.

 

Okay so.

What is the first thing that you will need to have or know in order to start to forgive yourself for your blackout drunk dialing?

[lonelypiscesguy]

Is my issue that you say she reflected back to me, desperation? I don't know about that but it's hard to say bc we did the LDR thing. If we were in the same town, things may have been a lot different in our R, at least in the early stages, say first 2 months of getting to know each other. I do kind of have a rescuer 'fetish', I like the feeling of being a womans knight errant, having sympathy for all the bad choices she has made or how down she is, thinking that I can make it all better. Two times in a row I have lived to regret it (Pisces are notorius for this!) I wasn't really desperate, I was just getting back on my feet and was ready to start dating again, but wasn't hurting for attention or sex! But maybe I allowed myself to settle. The first month we talked on the phone, I found myself saying "What a train wreck! Do I really want to involve myself in THIS?!" Her tellimg me sha had herpes AFTER everything else should have been enough, even at the risk of hurting HER feelings. I hate hurting peoples feelings, especially when they're already vulnerable. I did start feeling sorry for her, while seeing that she had made positive changes to not be a mess anymore. *SIGH*...Oh well...

[lonelypiscesguy]

Fair enough.

Mind if I make a request? Right now, say to yourself (out loud is preferable -- even if you'll feel like a tool, it's still preferable.) Say, "I give myself permission to SOME day forgive myself for my blackout drunk dialing."

 

Perfect Thank you.

 

It's kind of something that will resonate with you when you hit on it. In general terms (my interpretation is): you weren't always seen in an accurate light, you didn't always get your own needs met, and there was more conflict/drama than your own psyche prefers.

 

Does any of that remind you of any other relationship you had in the past? Could be a parent, sibling, friend or a prior love relationship.

 

Your intuition that it wouldn't last too long was obviously correct. But you must not have trusted it on some level, or thought you could over-ride it somehow? Do you have a history of not listening to your Inner Voice, maybe facing negative consequences because of not taking your own counsel?

 

But also, it's that you're beating yourself up over something that you KNEW was inevitable. You KNEW what was going to be the outcome and you're STILL choosing self-hostile thoughts and feelings. If you had to guess, what is up with that?

 

You're welcome, btw -- I'm continuously learning about myself, too, and also find that it helps to crystallize things when we share our words with others instead of just hearing them in our own mind's ears.

 

Okay so.

What is the first thing that you will need to have or know in order to start to forgive yourself for your blackout drunk dialing?

God, Ronni, and to think, I was considering therapy for all of this! How much do I owe you per hour?! Yeah, that's why I have such deep-seated issues with c***tease games from my previous ex. I don't like being played the fool! Maybe she was doing it to see if I would put up with it, if I would establish boundaries with her. I didn't tell her bc I never wanted to start yet another bickering match. I think I keep beating myself up, I think, because I feel like I broke her heart after looking for me for 26 years, that I was a major diappointment in her life and always will be. I didn't want it this way, I was captivated with the romance of an old high school crush (we both liked each other at 15, never said so at the time). It really was the most romantic episode of my life, and I was happily married for 8 years (last 2 sucked)! Was I trying to force something that wasn't there?

[lonelypiscesguy]

Also, I do feel as though she pulled the chain A LITTLE too quick. She new I was trying, she knew I have a good heart, MAYBE if I had a little more time to work on myself, i.e. quit drinking, talk about what bothered ME about HER in our R,...Woulda, coulda, shoulda, right? I meant it when I said that when I finally would have been able to relocate to L.A. to be with her, I would HAVE to quit drinking to show support for my recovering GF, I really did mean it! God, it's all so confusing...

[lonelypiscesguy]

Oh, and let's not forget the trust issues. I have pretty deep trust issues.

[Ronni_W]

Was I trying to force something that wasn't there?

Why do I have the feeling that you just answered your own question?

 

You're seeing that you did not disappoint HER but you did, in your own (inaccurate) perception and due to your own (distorted) self-image and (unrealistic) self-expectations, disappoint yourself, yes?

 

And you're seeing the areas in which you need to strengthen your knowledge and skills to allow the "BEST catch guy" (who's already within) to express himself?

Including learning how to treat your own Self with more compassion and respect, and coming to terms with your (human and relationship) limitations. You must see yourself in an accurate light...if you hope to reveal who you truly are to others...so that THEY can also see you in an accurate light.

 

I do kind of have a rescuer 'fetish', I like the feeling of being a womans knight errant, having sympathy for all the bad choices she has made or how down she is, thinking that I can make it all better. But maybe I allowed myself to settle. I found myself saying "What a train wreck! Do I really want to involve myself in THIS?!" I hate hurting peoples feelings, especially when they're already vulnerable. I did start feeling sorry for her,

All of that is part of your distorted self-image and totally misguided belief about your power and role in other people's lives (which leads to your unrealistic self-expectations and subsequent self-disappointment.) It also points to your distrust of your own Inner Voice/Higher Self/Intuition/Gut Instinct. It's part of your self-sabotaging package.

 

Write it down. Stay aware of it. Do more to uncover how it negatively impacts your beliefs, thoughts, perceptions, feelings and behaviours. Therapy will also help you to find out when/where/how it started -- if that is important to you to know. (Some people could not care any less where their crap started.)

 

It is useful to know that, at one point, it all served you very well...but it is NOT doing that any more. It is time to review and revise or delete all the crap that isn't working FOR your happiness and success anymore. Yes?

 

Here's the problem now that you know all of this: You can't, realistically and reasonably, blame anybody else for your "bad" feelings and crappy behaviour, anymore! It's you doing it to yourself. It has always been you doing it to yourself.

 

Do you have 89 more questions? -- Cos sometimes that happens, too. Feel free to carry on...or go out and celebrate your victory, and PM me whenever you "restart" your thread.

 

Oh yeah...my fee. Create a life for yourself that is happier and more successful than you can even imagine right now.

I know, it's kinda pricey. But I'm kinda worth it

[Ronni_W]

Also, I do feel as though she pulled the chain A LITTLE too quick. She new I was trying, she knew I have a good heart, MAYBE if I had a little more time to work on myself,

Boo-freakin'-hoo, here's a tissue.

 

In other words: STOP!!! Stop it immediately. You knew it was NOT going to work. And you NOW KNOW that you were always just trying to force something that wasn't there. This thing NEVER had the mojo. You KNEW that, and you NOW KNOW that. Quit whining that it never had the mojo. Yes?

 

Oh, and let's not forget the trust issues. I have pretty deep trust issues.

Yes, of course you do. You don't trust your OWN intuition, where did you expect to learn how to trust others?

Plus. You haven't learned how to set strong personal boundaries or speak up assertively (firmly and kindly) for your Self. And you sometimes make promises that you don't keep. And maybe you sometimes act without integrity (don't know, we haven't covered that.)

 

So yeah...if you can't/don't/won't trust yourself (to look out for yourself and live up to your OWN values and standards), then how are you gonna do it with anybody else?

 

The really EXCELLENT news about all of this is, of course, that it can all be turned around. It takes courage, determination, and lots and lots of practice. And then...more practice, and lots and lots of compassion and forgiveness when you screw-up.

 

Is this fun, or what?

[lonelypiscesguy]

God, your good. Promises, integrity, well, I don't know. I pretty good in both departments, I think. Assertiveness? Covered. Boundaries? Better respect mine, or else! BUT! This is with men, and women as friends or strangers, the difficulty arises in relationships. Most definitely the last two. I was a rebound doormat to the first one and emotionally stunted with the second, having been bitter for too long and not having a woman in my life for ten or eleven years. My ex liked me for my honesty, my intelligence, my senitivity and of corse, my modesty, lol. But she said I was too detached and emotionally selfish. Now, for all the things I have said about her, she is still to me a warm, caring, VERY honest woman. Her recovery is going fantastic, clean and sober for 2 years 3 months. I do love her, I would love a second chance, however toxic that may be. But I don't think it would be as toxic as may appear at first glance (famous last words, right?). What draw us to each other was, among other things, we were getting back on our feet after many years of bad "luck" (don't really believe in the stuff) and hard partying. I quit meth about 10 years ago and was never really a commited user, so quitting was the easiest thing I've ever done, seriously. I don't get being addicted to it, but that's my brain chemistry, I guess. I was able to see past the addictions and see the beautiful woman that is E. I fear that a reconcilliation is NOT forthcoming, I don't think she would ever be able to truly forget the venom I spewed. Forgive? I'm not sure about that one either. As much as I still love her, somethings cannot be undone, and words can never be unsaid. I do hope we can be still be the lifelong friends we were probably always meant to be. As romantic a notion of high school secret crushes reunited after 26 years is, some things are better left in the friend zone, I suppose. She a Leo and me a Pisces, we joked about her being Lucy to my Desi, and we all know they remained lifelong friends, they just couldn't be together.

Wow! Thank you Ronni. You have me looking forward to therapy, believe it or not! I already feel as though I have at least got my toe in the water and I can't wait to take the plunge into inner peace. I think we scared everyone else away, Ronni!

[Ronni_W]

I would love a second chance, however toxic that may be.

I have GOT to be misinterpreting what you mean by that! What do you mean by that?

 

Promises, integrity, well, I don't know. I pretty good in both departments, I think. Assertiveness? Covered. Boundaries? Better respect mine, or else! BUT! ... the difficulty arises in relationships.

But we're talking about how you are in (romantic) relationships, no?

And also about how you are with your Self. As in, giving forgiveness to your SELF, instead of to someone else or needing/receiving it from anybody else.

 

Have you set a personal boundary for your Self, that you do NOT want to be involved in any toxic relationships? Did you make a promise not to drunk dial?

 

I was too detached and emotionally selfish.

With that piece of information about yourself, you may want to uncover who, in the past, treated YOU that way -- where did you learn how to be emotionally selfish and detached? What made you believe it is a "good" way to do relationships?

 

Which is to point out that it is about YOU and your really old stuff...not about this ex or that ex. It is that we simply repeat the same pattern with this ex and that ex.

 

What draw us to each other was, among other things, we were getting back on our feet after many years of bad "luck" (don't really believe in the stuff)

Figuring out how you are making that make sense would help you uncover something that your unconscious mind is not revealing to you.

Cos it's not a logical statement, is it: you believe you two were attracted to each other by force of something you don't believe in. (NOT that you are "in denial" but that there is something about this of which you are currently unaware.)

 

The process is about taking your ex out of all the equations, and just exploring you -- your own beliefs, thoughts, perceptions, feelings and actions. Looking at the "naked" you, one might say.

It is daunting...and it is SO much fun. It is difficult...and fun. It can be stressful...and fun. It gets worse before it gets better...and it can still be fun. Go in there with a positive and optimistic mindset...and it will be fun.

 

Wishing you courage, hard work and happy outcomes from your therapy.