quit it, y'all.

[dobler33]

if you have never been the OW/M, if you have never experienced the conditions that are described at the top of this page: "those who find themselves involved with a committed partner", then it is respectfully requested that you find another forum. there are PLENTY. if you have experienced these conditions and have differing views from other posters, then debate will be spirited and potentially ellucidating for all parties. but it is unacceptable for people who have not experienced what is being discussed here to pass judgement or profer their own emotional agenda on this forum. i'm new here and have been totally appalled by the disrespect shown in a conversation where people are vulnerably trying to cope with their conflicted, unflattering, controversial and fundamentally personal feelings. it's not ok.

[wildsoul]

This forum has been overrun lately by overt bullies and narcissistic BS's that use nice words to hide an intent to make OW's feel bad. I'm totally sick of it. 80% of it belongs in the infidelity forum.

 

We don't go into that forum to "show the other side," and "support" by making BS's feel worse than they already do, yet that's exactly what some posters do to the OW's here.

 

Maybe the mods SHOULD close this part of the board down (as was recently posted by a weary moderator.) Then the OW's and BS's can ALL be in the infidelity section. I'm starting to think that's a great idea.

[SidLyon]

if you have never been the OW/M, if you have never experienced the conditions that are described at the top of this page: "those who find themselves involved with a committed partner", then it is respectfully requested that you find another forum. there are PLENTY. if you have experienced these conditions and have differing views from other posters, then debate will be spirited and potentially ellucidating for all parties. but it is unacceptable for people who have not experienced what is being discussed here to pass judgement or profer their own emotional agenda on this forum. i'm new here and have been totally appalled by the disrespect shown in a conversation where people are vulnerably trying to cope with their conflicted, unflattering, controversial and fundamentally personal feelings. it's not ok.

 

You forgot to quote it in full - it says:

 

"The Other Man / Woman The other side of the story: Support and discussion for those who find themselves involved with a committed partner."

 

It is at least as valid to interpret this as saying it is not only about support, but also about discussion relating to the OM/OW. Nor does it say that only people who are or have been OM/OW can contribute to the discussion.

 

S

[LakesideDream]

This forum has been overrun lately by overt bullies and narcissistic BS's that use nice words to hide an intent to make OW's feel bad. I'm totally sick of it. 80% of it belongs in the infidelity forum.

 

We don't go into that forum to "show the other side," and "support" by making BS's feel worse than they already do, yet that's exactly what some posters do to the OW's here.

 

Maybe the mods SHOULD close this part of the board down (as was recently posted by a weary moderator.) Then the OW's and BS's can ALL be in the infidelity section. I'm starting to think that's a great idea.

 

 

Wildsoul, The same people haven't ignored the few OM who have posted here. My opinion they are bitter, tortured souls. Most have been hurt, and place the blame on the person their spouse or S.O. fell in love with. IMO that's a misplaced emotion.

 

My then wife had a married OM for many years. Once discovered, I couldn't blame him for being in love with her. He loved the same qualities, that I did. Truth be told after a decade of hindsight, we are probably more alike than we are different as she also chose us both.

 

People often are irrational about what they fear. Attacking OM/OW may be a symptom of that irrational emotion.

[boldjack]

I'm sorry Dobler, I didn't know that you had been made a moderator. Surely, as a PSYCHOANALYST, you realize that people have to sometimes, vent. BS's vent against Ow's because they see them as the authors of their troubles. It may not be right or pleasant, but if this is to be a free speech forum, then we OM/OW"S should accept it as gracefully as we can. You railing against the BS's is in what way different from the BS's railing against you? Perhaps a little courtesy from both sides of this question would not be amiss. :)

[joybean72]

Well said boldjack. Also many OW/OM go in to the Infidelity, Divorce. Friends & Lovers & Dating forums asking for advice. If we were to give them "the boot"...that would be a double standard, would it not? Some BS's are looking for honest answers & a little insight from the other side. Just sayin'...

[stuckinoz]

BS's vent against Ow's because they see them as the authors of their troubles

 

OW or OM played a PART as in their troubles. NOT THE ENTIRE!

Remember............the spouse participating in the affair played a HUGE ROLE as well. Let us not forget that!!

[confusedinkansas]

I agree - there is a lot of "bashing" in LS.

Some I understand, others I don't. I've been the OW & while things have worked out in my life at the time it was one of the most heartbreaking things I endured. LS did help some with the pain. But along the way, arguing with some of the posters because they "typed" like they were better than the rest of us. I think some believe that the OW should be stoned to death (my assumption - because of the comments some make)

Those that have a 'holier than thou' attitude...I have a problem with. But as in anything in life, some can play nice, while others can't.

Good luck trying to get it to stop. I started a thread here Notice A Pattern....& it took on a whole life of its own. Ended up having nothing to do with the initial post.

[lkjh]

if you have never been the OW/M, if you have never experienced the conditions that are described at the top of this page: "those who find themselves involved with a committed partner", then it is respectfully requested that you find another forum. there are PLENTY. if you have experienced these conditions and have differing views from other posters, then debate will be spirited and potentially ellucidating for all parties. but it is unacceptable for people who have not experienced what is being discussed here to pass judgement or profer their own emotional agenda on this forum. i'm new here and have been totally appalled by the disrespect shown in a conversation where people are vulnerably trying to cope with their conflicted, unflattering, controversial and fundamentally personal feelings. it's not ok.

 

This is so funny, you actually want to filter the advice and thoughts to fit your agenda. You don't have to be something to understand it or to give advice. If that was the case there wouldn't be any therapist. The fact is that people can learn from observation. Not just observation of the situation but everyday life. If you pick and choose what you want to hear then you really can't learn about your case. You need to see it from every angle. If rapist only get advice from rapist then they will not see the damage they cause to the victim

[lkjh]

oh but now that you made this request everyone will stop this instance.

[skywriter]

It's very true that some of the responses made by certain posters, has been about thses individuals and their pain and lack of understanding and not about the initial post. I agree it does come off as an attack on the initial poster at times,nstead of supportive.

 

In this instance it does indeed frighten posters away, because wether or not anyone agrees, some people involved in an A,are beating themselves up and don't need any assistance in doing so. As Jackson Browne once said in a song, "Don't remind me of my faults, I have not forgotten".

 

While I do believe,we can all converse peacefully. It just requires some creative effort,on every adults part. Maybe someone can accidently obtain some resolutions. peace....

[fooled once]

But how do you know someone isn't a former OW/OM?

 

Maybe they are and you just don't like their advice?

 

MANY former OW/OM do post here -- and we are trying to stop other OW/OM from feeling some of the pain we have felt.

 

So is there a list of who is and who isn't an OW/OM?

 

And the generalizations on BS's should stop too - including many posted right here on this post.

[dobler33]

some of these responses are considered and thoughtful, even the ones that are disagreeing with my views. disagreement is not the issue. some of these responses beautifully display the mean-spirited, personally attacking, ill-informed immaturity i'm talking about. so thanks for that.

[OWoman]

This forum has been overrun lately by overt bullies and narcissistic BS's that use nice words to hide an intent to make OW's feel bad. I'm totally sick of it. 80% of it belongs in the infidelity forum.

 

Not sure bashing belongs in any forum, if you read the TOS. Perhaps we should club together to buy them a big pillow, we can paint a face on it and label it OW and let them kick and punch that the way little kids vent their aggression on an inanimate object when they get frustrated at not getting their way.

[dobler33]

btw, wildsoul, i noticed a "nevermind" post from you on another thread. are you giving up because of the bashers? don't. there are still those of us who are interested in giving support rather than vitriol.

[joybean72]

I will agree that when I got on here, I was full of hate...etc. Not just to the OW, but to my husband as well. Did I handle it wrong...yeah, I did...there are MANY things I wish I would have done differently. (Don't think I did with the first one though!) You want honest answers from a BS, I'll give em. He is almost (Hopefully!) a past issue as is she. Just putting it out there that not ALL of us BS's are evil bitches. Not all of you are either. I have much respect for many of you that are going through this, however it ends up. Does it make me narcissistic? I don't think so. Ultimately we end up with who we are to be with. I know NOW that I wasn't meant to be with him...not at all. Not narcissictic...just aware of what I want in a life partner.

[dobler33]

thank you, joybean. another good example of a diverse yet respectful view. clearly you are no longer in a place where you need to come here and cause pain. and so, yes, your experience from the other side of the board is very helpful.

[wildsoul]

btw, wildsoul, i noticed a "nevermind" post from you on another thread. are you giving up because of the bashers? don't. there are still those of us who are interested in giving support rather than vitriol.

I've been an active member of this forum since July 2008. It's been a vital part of my process. I thank you.

 

Many of the people that helped me most are BS's. I won't name you all, because I don't want to leave anyone out, but you know who you are.

 

Sure, there's always been an element of hostile people who don't add any meaningful dialogue. For them, I just use the ignore feature. But it's become overrun lately to the point where newbies are afraid to post and threads had degenerated to hypothetical questions to make up for the lack of actual posts from OW/M.

 

I'm 3 mos out of my relationship with xSM. I took a couple week break from the board awhile back to get my head clear of the whole topic. Then I came back and the board was so contentious, and I felt so bad for the newbies, that I started posting a lot again. Trying to help. I was staying mostly for that.

 

Here's the deal with me now. Although I could use the ignore feature more than I do, I've reached my tolerence capacity for some of the posters here. Having studied SO much on NPD (narcisstic personality disorder) I'm rather allergic to it when I see it. There's a whole gaggle of new BS's here that are trying to mend their ego wounds by coming here to brag about how great they are and rub salt in the wounds of OW's by going on about how their own MM never loved his OW and all. There is some truth mixed in with that. If he's NOT choosing you, there's your answer ladies. But there is this kind of eloquent shaming going on here. A few of us have been calling bullchip on it. It's mostly falling on deaf ears.

 

My problem now is that I'm finding myself getting annoyed enough that I'm tempted to strike back. But it's not my style to engage in flame wars, and I freely admit that I'm allergic to people that exhibhit NPD tendencies now.

 

Because I can't be neutral right now...

Because I don't want to engage in flaming...

Because I've got other things to do....

Because it's not my job to defend or save others (although I've tried to help, putting in considerable time as a way to pay back for the value I've received here)...

 

I'm going to take a break from the board for awhile. I wish you well. I'll check back in from time to time, but not daily anymore. I send you my love, gratitude, and prayers.

[wildsoul]

Just putting it out there that not ALL of us BS's are evil bitches. Not all of you are either. I have much respect for many of you that are going through this, however it ends up. Does it make me narcissistic? I don't think so.

I agree with you. It's not ALL. There are some pretty amazing BS contributors here.

 

And for the record, since I threw the n-word out there. I really don't mean that as a blanket term! I meant it for a small handful of overly verbose, off topic, bragging, punishing new posters who exhibit actual NPD symptoms (in my non-professional estimation.) By no means was that meant as a catch-all description.

[boldjack]

Yes, the bashing sucks, but I try to understand the hurt behind it. I have been called "homewrecker", among other things, and have been blamed for a number of split-ups, so I have developed a pretty thick skin. I still believe, however, in collective free-speech. and that , in the end, everyone will probably have their say..........Dobler, I agree with MOST of the ideas you have posted, since coming to LS. I disagree with you on this one. My attitude tends to be rather harsh and direct. My perception of yours is that you are rather condescending . I will try to be less harsh if you will try to be less smug. PAX?

[Reggie]

I don't see much bashing. Some, but for the most part, the BS's are respectful.

Sure, they challenge the thinking that OWs/OMs seem to display, sometimes, like lack of empathy, remorse, and selfishness. But, isn't it supportive to do something other than to cheer on hurtful behavior or merely say "there, there, now".

I disagree that pointing out some of the disturbing behavior is a lack of support.

[joybean72]

Not trying to put a bandaid on the hurt of our situation Reggie...I get what you are saying, but the reality is (also) that some of these men and women are hurting...and for whatever reason (true love or lust) they are here just as we have been.................looking for answers to questions we may never find really. People just need to be freakin' honest with eachother...that's what it comes down to! Simple answers. (I'm blabbing! LOL!)

[baloo2]

I just got a little bit of bashing for my thread. Wasn't expecting it-have had nothing but support from most contributors. It made me feel like crying.

 

It's meant to be a thread offering support for the OW/OM

[herenow]

Every time a thread like this is started (and there have been many of them) I think the same thing.

 

To say that the betrayed isn't part of the relationship between an OW and a MM or a OM and a MW is to ignore the fact that a third party exists. Why wouldn't a person coming to this board for help from either side want to see the raw reaction from the other side? Why hide the pain that affairs cause to anyone involved? Isn't it just part of the big picture? Are you really being "helped" when you tell people who's lives have been touched in such a painful way to leave?

 

Sure a BW or BH is going to be angry. Why not? They have experienced a truly devastating thing. If you choose to ignore that pain, that is certainly your choice. But it's real, it's here and it's part of what happens when people engage in affairs.

[fooled once]

I still ask -- how do you know the advice you are getting isn't from an EX OW/OM?

 

I think it is wrong to start telling people "how" to post and what to post.

 

I think it is wrong to make a decision that just because you don't like the advice/post, it must be from a mean old BS.

 

Could very well be from an OW.

 

I was an OW and quite frankly, I don't understand how a person is suppose to support another OW/OM in their actions. I can't jump on a bandwagon yelling "Yeah, the spouse must be a cold hearted, nasty, mean, sexless twit since she/he isn't keeping their spouse happy".

 

*shrug*

 

And for the record, I have never been cheated on.

 

I see these exact same type of us vs them posts on every website - whether it be about being a 2nd wife vs the first wife; childless vs those with children; biomom vs stepmom, etc.

 

You can always ignore someone.

 

Take what you need and leave the rest.