Dating during separation

[delia88]

Hi,

 

I am dating a man who is separated. It's going really well and he has a three year old daughter. He wants me to meet her. Everything I have read tells me I headed for heartache. He has not been apart from the x for the two recommended years. Am I fooling myself into thinking this should ever be anything more than just casual dating?

 

Thanks

[meanon]

It could be more risky than dating someone else but everyone takes a risk of being hurt when they love. I've never heard of the 2 year rule and know couples who have stayed together when they met after a shorter time of separation. No book can compare to your gut instinct - listen to that instead. You will need to be able to share your life with his daughter, accept that she may come first and tolerate ongoing contact with his ex.

[delia88]

Thank you.

[Kay]

Delia, I just read your post and I can't help but remind you that "separated" is still married. He is a married man until he is divorced. It does not matter how long he has been separated, what the circumstances are, or how much you care for him. If you are to have a future together, he needs to legally divorce his wife before continuing his relationship with you.

 

As far as introducing you to his child, please reconsider. Until both of you are absolutely certain that you plan on a future together (and he is legally divorced), this child should not be brought into the picture. Children become attached far more quickly than adults and it is simply not fair to confuse her. Think with your head. This man might be the man of your dreams, but right now, he is a married man, a father and he is basically cheating on his wife.

 

Tell him you care about him, tell him you want to spend your life with him, but tell him he needs a divorce first. There really aren't any "if's and's or but's" about it. You will learn the lesson of a lifetime by his response.

[bark]

I, too, am unaware of the two year rule. The rule, if it exists, seems arbitrary. Follow your sense of the matter: is he still intimate with his wife? ; how often does he see his wife and what transpires?; does the wife have any expectations that he will remain faithful during the separation?; does his wife view this as a trial separation and that they will eventually reconcile?; is the wife involved with someone else?; does he have any expectations about his wife's fidelity during the separation?; does he view the separation as a prelude to an inevitable divorce or simply as a last ditch attempt to save his marriage?.

 

These questions are important and, with apologies to Kay, the answers (or best guesses) to these questions should guide you in determining whether this guy is "serious" about entering into a serious relationship with you.

 

While rules are important an absolute ban on dating during separation ignores the hopes, dreams, feelings and general messiness of relationships. I prefer a more situational approach where one can gauge the seriousness, honesty and authenticity of a prospective lover. Plus, divorce ultimatums at the inception of a relationship most likely are relationship-killers. The sanctity of marriage is preserved, and you're sitting home alone on a Saturday night.

 

Good luck.

[lipglossboost]

I dated during the seperation with my husband, and after 8 months we ended up back together. The man I was seeing was angry and devastated. I had told him I was sure things between my husband and I were over. I had moved out, everything was in place for divorce. My husband knew of him, even met him on a few occasions. We had no secrets. The man I was seeing did nothing wrong, he was absolutely wonderful, but I still left him to go back to my marriage.

 

Why has he not initiated divorce yet? It sounds as if he loves you very much, if he wants to introduce you to his daughter.

 

I loved the man I as seeing very much, and after yet another seperation from my husband, I wanted him back. I realized how stupid I had been, but it was too late. The trust was broken. The point I am trying to make is, it doesn't matter how much he loves you. I think the man I was seeing may well have been "the one". I still miss him terribly. There is no rhyme or reason in love, and it does not guarantee that he will not go back.

 

Do you know if his wife is seeing anyone? Does she want him back?

 

All I can say is that I hope you do not end up hurt like the man I was with. You sound like an intelligent person with a good heart. Be guarded, until the divorce is final.

[bark]

There is no rhyme or reason in love, and it does not guarantee that he will not go back.

 

 

 

Lip makes a very valid point: a marriage aint over until it's over--especially when a young child is involved. A reconciliation for the child is always a real possibility.

 

It happened to me. I got burned.

 

Be careful delia or you might get burned, too.

[furby19]

what he plans on doing. Make sure he knows that he really doesn't want to be with him. It happened to me. I was with a guy for 7 months. He wasn't married at the time and him and his children's mother weren't together. However, he ended up back with her because she found out about me and decided that she wanted to be with him. She told him that if he didn't want to be with her anymore then she was going to take their children and move out of town with her mother. So, they ended up back together and I ended up hurt.

[delia88]

Hi everyone,

 

I didn't know so many of you had responded until now. I've only been dating this man for two months now. I figured I should ask questions now. But, as someone mentioned I can't ask if he loves me and wants to marry me because that's not even remotely where we are.

 

 

The wife has been unhappy since day one. First she wanted him to change careers, he did then she kept wanting him to change other things and he did but she still wasn't happy. She went for therapy and still wasn't happy so then they both went together. During therapy communication got better so they started having sex again and their daughter was conceived. They were still going to therapy after the birth which was an accident. In the end she said she felt pressured to get married by her parents because they were living together. She knew she did not want to get married because she did not have "the feelings she was supposed to have" for him but thought they would grow after the marriage but she said they never did. He was devestated but tried to keep the family together for three years. She wanted to date other people while they lived toghether and he said forget it. They live seperately and have joint custody. SHe pays for the house and her bills by herself but she's getting certified to be a personal trainer in the mean time she works at various health clubs. SHe couldn't afford health insurance on her own unitl she is full time at one health club so they went for a separation agreement that outlines property, finance and custody. When she is on her feet they just refile for the divorce since everything has been settled.

 

As far as dating she is dating a couple of guys which she brings around her daughter. He dosen't feel that right but he wanted me to meet her. So after some research I did on the subject and aftrer reading the first two responses I got from you guys, we decided that I will meet her at a sporting event that there is always a big group of men and women who go together.

 

I asked him if this was a trial seperation. He said no it was not. That at first he was devestated to know she never loved him but he looks at it now as he has a beautiful daughter out of it and to move on. He said he does not have sex with her and has not for some time. They see each other every month to go over the next month's calendar for visitation whcih they are required to do for the separation agreement other wise they see each other for drop offs and pick ups.

 

Yet, all of this is what he tells me and his perspective on it. Since she is the one who wanted out I cannot predict what he would do if she suddenly wanted him back. It is a possibility. We are not in love.

 

I'm not sure how far I should take this. Or what I should ask moving forward.

 

 

Thank you so much for your responses I did not know that they were there until today. Any other thoughts on what I should ask moving forward would be appreciated.

[lost_in_chgo]

Careful Delia. Guard your heart.

 

Goto the library or bookstore and find a book called the Divorce Sourcebook. Read chapter 8 about dating after divorce. That is what he is and will be going thru.

 

Maybe you can make things work, but you have to discuss this ASAP with him and let him decide if he is willing to work thru things with you. He is going to go thru a crisis at some point. This will be either a crisis over getting divorced at all, as the other have mentioned, or a crisis over getting involved in a committed relationship again.

 

If he runs from you and gets divorced, you are just going to have to wait him out or move on. Once he runs, there will be no talking to him about it, no chance to prevent it. You'll have to wait until he works thru everything. Personally I think that you should stick with him and try to communicate as much as possible and when he asks for space, give it to him immediately. Then let him know you want to get back together when he is ready and go find something/one to do with your life in the meantime.

 

As far as the two year rule: It is arbitrary and probably the most conservative estimate. I've heard 1 year as well. I've also heard a sliding scale that says 1 month for every year of marriage. All of which is a guess. There are no definites here and it depends on the person and the relationship. If they were estranged prior to separation, I'd imagine that would shorten the timeframe for recovery.

 

I'm going thru the same thing, and I wasn't able to keep her. She's been gone for months now. I am hopeful that she will come back eventually, but I can't invest my life in a "what if". It was like throwing a light switch, one day she just decided she didn't want a committed relationship and withdrew. She hung around for a month and then started seeing someone else.

[steveb]

If he wants to date, he should get divorced first.

[delia88]

I will look for that book.

 

Thanks.

[delia88]

Hi Everyone,

Thanks so much for the continuing support and sharing of your own past experiences.

 

We now have been dating for three months. They now are moving the papers from separation to divorce so since it's all been ironed out already in the separation document (Support, child custody/visitation (3 yr old) and the financial aspects including the house) I think that it should be finalized fairly soon. Now I am getting concerned about how he will react once he signs the papers. I brought it up and he said he has already gone through all the emotions prior and he already considers himself divorced. He said he doesn't really now how to prove it to me so I guess we have to wait until I sign the papers.

 

I'm also concerned about how he will feel about me once he is divorced. My understanding is that one...they flip out over being finally divorced not because they want the ex back but, the finalization of it is still emotional and second...they flip out on the new person they are dating because they are now "available" even though there is no pressure for a commitment from the other party and they say they want their freedom.

 

So, I know some of you have experienced getting dumped over this by the still reeling divorcee. What are the signs I should be looking for? Is is the usual breaking plans, lesser and lesser phone calls etc? How soon after signing of the papers did you notice a change... was it immediate?

 

I'm trying to prepare myself for the worst. If he wasn't the most wonderful man I've ever met I would walk away. I guess I have to hold tight and wait and see. But, I want to protect myself and since it's only been three months I think I can still handle what is to come.

 

Thank you.

[reservoirdog1]

Hi... Thought I'd offer my perspective. After seven years of what I thought was a happy marriage, my TBXW sat me down at the beginning of August and told me that she'd been basically unhappy for the whole marriage, starting shortly before it. She'd had one affair shortly before it, an 8-month one that started 6 weeks after the wedding, and another about 3 years ago, plus an emotional affair with #3 after the physical one ended.

 

We tried for 2 months to work it out but decided it wouldn't work. Seemed mutual. Started "emotional separation" at the beginning of October (no physical contact, I slept on the couch, etc.) and moved out November 1. I had a fling of a few weeks with a woman I'd known for awhile that started as soon as I moved out (it DID NOT start at all while I was still living with TBXW), then I broke it off. In mid-December, I started dating another woman. We're taking things slow (no sex yet) despite having seen each other every day since Christmas.

 

Since I moved out, TBXW has begged me on three separate occasions to come back. At the end of attempt #2, she told me that, even at the time we married, she knew it was a mistake because I'm X (personality type) and she needed somebody who's Y in order to be happy. She'd also had "fantasies" in the last few years about living as a single parent (we have 2 small kids). I was totally oblivious to her feelings and her cheating until August -- I thought it was a happy marriage.

 

Anyway, attempt #3 to get me back happened a few days ago. She's finding that single parenthood actually DOESN'T live up to her fantasies and that it's not a lot of fun. But, the reason she wants me back, I've gathered, is that fact, and secondly, she doesn't like the fact that I'm dating somebody. The way I see it, none of the underlying issues are resolved -- she still can't be happy long-term with me. And, I don't want to be anybody's comfort choice or backup -- I want somebody who wants to be with me for who I am, not for who they need me to be.

 

The point I'm making is this. Divorce in Canada requires a one-year separation, until the end of which a couple is still legally married. We aren't getting back together -- it's dead, all that's needed is a funeral. I absolutely do NOT consider myself to be "cheating on my wife" -- in any practical sense, she's already my ex-wife.

 

Delia, you're right to approach the situation with caution. I've racked my brain over the last few weeks trying to figure out if this is another "rebound relationship"; it doesn't feel like one, but then again, who knows what a rebound relationship "feels" like? I don't want to hurt this woman, and she knows the score and how recent everything is. One piece of advice I've been given is that, as long as I'm totally honest with her and she knows the whole story, then she is responsible for deciding for herself whether or not the risks are too great for her liking. So, you have every right to expect your BF to be totally honest with you about what's going on and how he's feeling, but ultimately you have to make a decision as to what you're comfortable with. Nobody can make it for you, including your BF. And, just remember, getting into ANY relationship involves the possibility of getting hurt, so you're never going to avoid that entirely.

 

So, I agree with the previous poster: go with your gut.

[delia88]

Thanks for your response. I was wondering about the women you first dated after the marriage was over...Now looking back do you think you were with her to get over the remaining feelings you had for your wife?

 

He says he's fine with the divorce coming because they were only separated so she could get the insurance and now she can afford it on her own. But, you said you don't know what a rebound relationship feels like. Did you feel your feelings for the first women were real after it was over? I know you didn't date her for long but I am just trying to tell if I'm a rebound person for this guy so I'm using your experience to delve into what might be happening to me.

 

Thanks.

[reservoirdog1]

Delia -- A bit of background to answer your question. I moved out on November 1. On Halloween, I was at a party and met a woman I'd known socially for years. One thing led to another, and we wound up back at her place. However, I begged off -- TBXW and I made an agreement when we decided to separate that neither of us would date or sleep with anybody else while we were still under the same roof. I had one more day to go, so I asked this woman if we could delay till the following evening (first night in my new place). She was OK with that, sparks flew that next evening, and I got to leave the marital home knowing that I'd kept my word and behaved honourably right up to the end.

 

Anyway, I specifically told this woman that I didn't want a relationship, which was true... it was too soon, obviously, and in any case I didn't want one with her particularly. Neither did she. It basically turned into a few weeks of sex and hanging out together. That was pretty transparently a rebound, and I recognized it as such while I was in the midst of it. To some degree, it was a bit of a f*ck-you to TBXW -- "you had a bunch of affairs during the marriage, so look at me... first night in my own place and I get laid."

 

So, the point is, I knew the fling with her was a rebound from the start, but we were both OK with that. There was no commitment, and no expectation of anything long-term, serious or exclusive.

 

With the woman I'm seeing now, we're taking it pretty slow, physically. We've seen each other every day since Christmas, but haven't slept together. I guess I figure that, if it was a rebound, I wouldn't be investing this much time and effort into it. Also, I actually have feelings for this girl.

 

Hope this helps!

[whatswrong23]

I am in the same boat except I have the the kids and my husband filed for divorce and he is taking his sweet time....I have been dating m boyfriend for about six months now alot of it being long distance (military), but we have a lot in common and even if we were not dating we would be friends.....now, my soon to be ex husband filed for divorce in July and shortly after that is when I started dating...a whole year and a half later AFTER we separated! So I learned that in life there is a lot of gray areas...i have no intentions on being back with my husband (he would fight me when i was pregnant!) and he had a girlfriend four months before we even broke up....why didn't i file for divorce? Because I am POOR and I have to Rob Peter to pay Paul (100.00 dollars left every month, thats it!) so to speak just to live everyday with two toddlers until I finish college.....so I met this man that is a whole lot like me...he isn't smothering and he lets me have my freedom and we actually talked alot about that seeing that we are both separated.....now, for him with divorce, i don't know and i really don't care.....I like where things are right now and I have no intentions on taking it any further than dating just like we are now.....so just know what you are getting into and know what you want.....and you will do just fine!

[delia88]

Thanks for the feedback. We are committed t each other and we are not seeing anyone else. He said he's not going anywhere. I know I like him very much but I do not know what I want long term as of yet. I asked him why he didn't want to date around and he said that was never his style and he likes being in a relationship.

 

I am concerned how he will feel once he signs the papers though. Not that he's still in love with his wife but that he be confused over the finalization of it all. I do not know the time line on the divorce. He said that since everything was ironed out for the legal separation papers filed in Jan of 2003 that all they have to do is refile the agreement as a divorce. Since it is uncontested I would think that once they pay it takes 30 day to become final but I really have no idea. Can anyone help with this? I don't feel comfortable asking but if I know when this is coming I can brace myself for what may be to come.

 

Thanks again.

[delia88]

So when you are out with the new girlfriend or boyfriend do you mention the ex? I went to dinner with a couple that knew both of them as a married couple and they kept mentioning her...Do you do this cause she an instructor..or have you met her? Then even directed to my boyfriend..did you know your ex did this it was so funny.

 

Isn't that inappropriate? I don't think it was intentional. And now tonight he mentioned a story about her and said did I tell you about that?... I said no and changed the subject.

 

At dinner he said to the couple enough and apologized in the car. Now tonight he brings up a story about her himself.

 

What does all this mean? Am I crazy? My friends didn't bring up old boyfriends when he was out to dinner with them. Wasn't the purpose of me going to dinner with them so they could get to know me?

 

Thanks.

[Sfx5150]

I think what's going on is that you're man is sharing with you his feelings about the divorce and sometimes the way they do that is by diggin up old stories about their ex. Yeah, I know, it's the last thing you want to hear, but with you deciding to be a part of this, it comes with the territory.

 

Divorce is the death of a relationship. When mourning a death, alot of people talk about the person who died, and the experiences they shared, to better help them cope with their loss. I think it's kind of similar here. I know you want him to get over it, but it's all on his own time.

 

I commend your guy for sharing with you. It means he's honest about his feelings and feels comfortable opening up to you know you'll understand and will be supportive. I, myself, am in a relationship with a divorcee and have to deal with that all the time. But at the end of the day, if he wanted to be with her, he would be and not with you!

 

Keep your head up. I have the same thing happen to me and I feel just how you are, but then have to look at the positive to shed that negative.

 

Hope that helps!

[Karlise13]

That's funny because in my book...it's four years.

 

IT's just based on personal experience.

 

I dated a seperated guy and a divorced guy. In each instance, they were just completely messed up over the marriages not working out. The seperated guy (I'll call him Tom) had been married 15 years and one day she just came home and announced she was leaving.

 

When I met him, they were still not legally divorced, but in the process of doing so.

During the first part of the seperation (which was about 2 years) he'd dated one woman. They had a pretty serious relationship, even lived together, but when it came down to getting engaged he knew he wasn't ready and ended it.

When he met me, he'd been seperated about 3 years. We had a wonderful time together for about 6 months before he had an emotional meltdown and backed away.

I talked to him about a year later and he said he couldn't believe how messed up he'd been through those four years of seperation and divorce. "It just changes how you interact with people,"

 

The divorced guy I dated also acted very flaky. By the time he realized we had a good thing, I'd moved on. You know, that was also right around the four-year mark of seperating from his ex.

 

One of my best friends is a guy. For the first 3-4 years after his marriage ended, he just slept with everyone and everyboyd. Everytime a woman really liked him he'd find a way to f*** it up. Since we are platonic friends he told me everything from the guy perspective.

He said women don't often realize how devastated men are when their marriages fail. Men are supposed to hold it all in.

 

So that's just my input. I'd be very wary of a guy who is recently seperated or divorced if what you seek is a permanent relationship.

 

Take it slow

[winterwonderland]

Those without fault should toss the first stone.....I love that quote......kind of reminds me of what you are all saying here....you want to judge someone for what they do in life but are you living her/his life are you feeling what they feel in the situation.....I don't think anyone has the right to judge.....If he/she wants to date while in separation.....let it be....not your life....not your feelings....and definatly not your concern

 

That may seem abit harsh but you know if people would spend more time trying to fix there lives instead of medaling in others this world would bea better place

[winterwonderland]

Quit frankly I am not sure why people even get married. I have yet to see a person mature enough handle a marriage.

[winterwonderland]

Here is something else that I feel is pretty funny. Maybe this should go on the christain board. Christains who want to judge someone who dates right after a separation when in fact they separated becasue someone cheated ......but in God's eyes ....that marriage is no more....but christains who are of God want to judge becuase that person isnt living according to Man's rules. God's rule I guess doesnt matter.

[Laela]

Dalia,

 

Trust your heart. I don't go by rules.. anyone who tells you you shouldn't do this or that should go stand in front of a mirror for a while. It's good to get others' perspectives but live your life for you. I must tell you this though. I believe a man who wants a woman to meet his young daughter has plans for her in his life. I hope things work out well.

 

As for women "going back" to their hubbies after they find out he has a girlfriend, well.. you know how some of us women are. We don't want him until someone else does. Confusion and low self-esteem are contributors.

 

In my opinion: How a person treats you from Day One is how they'll always treat you -- good or bad.

 

Please live YOUR life. I think you have a good thing going!

 

 

Hi everyone,

 

I didn't know so many of you had responded until now. I've only been dating this man for two months now. I figured I should ask questions now. But, as someone mentioned I can't ask if he loves me and wants to marry me because that's not even remotely where we are.

 

 

The wife has been unhappy since day one. First she wanted him to change careers, he did then she kept wanting him to change other things and he did but she still wasn't happy. She went for therapy and still wasn't happy so then they both went together. During therapy communication got better so they started having sex again and their daughter was conceived. They were still going to therapy after the birth which was an accident. In the end she said she felt pressured to get married by her parents because they were living together. She knew she did not want to get married because she did not have "the feelings she was supposed to have" for him but thought they would grow after the marriage but she said they never did. He was devestated but tried to keep the family together for three years. She wanted to date other people while they lived toghether and he said forget it. They live seperately and have joint custody. SHe pays for the house and her bills by herself but she's getting certified to be a personal trainer in the mean time she works at various health clubs. SHe couldn't afford health insurance on her own unitl she is full time at one health club so they went for a separation agreement that outlines property, finance and custody. When she is on her feet they just refile for the divorce since everything has been settled.

 

As far as dating she is dating a couple of guys which she brings around her daughter. He dosen't feel that right but he wanted me to meet her. So after some research I did on the subject and aftrer reading the first two responses I got from you guys, we decided that I will meet her at a sporting event that there is always a big group of men and women who go together.

 

I asked him if this was a trial seperation. He said no it was not. That at first he was devestated to know she never loved him but he looks at it now as he has a beautiful daughter out of it and to move on. He said he does not have sex with her and has not for some time. They see each other every month to go over the next month's calendar for visitation whcih they are required to do for the separation agreement other wise they see each other for drop offs and pick ups.

 

Yet, all of this is what he tells me and his perspective on it. Since she is the one who wanted out I cannot predict what he would do if she suddenly wanted him back. It is a possibility. We are not in love.

 

I'm not sure how far I should take this. Or what I should ask moving forward.

 

 

Thank you so much for your responses I did not know that they were there until today. Any other thoughts on what I should ask moving forward would be appreciated.