Marrying a divorced man

[carhill]

(Oh and...please stop describing yourself as an "older man" carhill. You're making me feel old. I think you're only a couple of years older than I am..if that.)

 

LOL, well the OP is 30 and I'm 50. She could be my daughter. Many of my friends have grandchildren. So, IMO "older" is OK. I'm not "old" yet.

[Touche]

OP, I know you don't have baggage and your BF does so I don't think you can actually put yourself in his shoes to see what it's like to have kids - maybe you can but you can never fully understand the relationship between a parent and children until you have some of your own.

His children will always be a part of your relationship with him - it's part of the package. You have to accept that and if you can't, you might as well just end it. Let him find someone that can accept his baggage as her own.

 

That's it in a nutshell. But I think the OP wants everything neat and orderly with no complications. Good luck with that. Who has a life with NO complications? No one I know of.

 

(Ok, I hear ya carhilll...we're "older" not "old." That works for me! I guess I'm hyper sensitive to the age thing...looking at 48 this summer! YIKES!)

[Trialbyfire]

Look Eeyore, I hear you about not wanting a man with ex issues or children. The good news is that if the divorce is finalized and the kids are older, the exes won't be able to touch anything. As for the kids, they're part of him and something you HAVE to accept if you marry him, with no holds barred.

 

Btw, a prenup can trump spousal rights, in inheritance and estate law.

 

In all honesty, I wouldn't marry a man who already had kids, unless it was the perfect relationship and the kids were great. As it stands, I'm going to marry a divorced man next year. I'm also divorced. Neither one of us has any kids or greedy exes. Both of us have careerist exes, so financial support to the exes, is a non-issue. The reason I mention this, is that it's not difficult to find men while in your thirties, who don't have kids.

[Touche]

That's funny because in my own experience, finding a man in his 30's with NO kids and ex, was not the norm.

[Trialbyfire]

That's funny because in my own experience, finding a man in his 30's with NO kids and ex, was not the norm.

I agree with that it's impossible to find a man with no exes but men with no kids aren't that hard to find.

[Touche]

I agree with that it's impossible to find a man with no exes but men with no kids aren't that hard to find.

 

I didn't find that to be true when I was single. Maybe it depends on where you live. I mean you're in a big metropolitan area.

[Trialbyfire]

I didn't find that to be true when I was single. Maybe it depends on where you live. I mean you're in a big metropolitan area.

Environment will make a difference, as well as timing. You were looking a decade and a half ago, where demographics have changed since then. People are getting married older, nvm delaying children. As well, the higher in age your target audience, the more likely they will have children.

 

Consider the guys I've dated in the last two years+. None had kids, some were single, some were divorced.

[Eeyore79]

My father worked very hard to give me the money I am lucky enough to have, and I worked hard at school and I work hard in my job - for MY future, for my partner and my children - not for his kids and exes. So there is an element of not wanting HIS responsibilities to become MY responsibilities - I didn't make those mistakes, he did, so I don't see why I (or any kids we might have) should pay for them. This is essentially why I'm so keen to maintain financial independence and separate assets (difficult as it may be) and why I want to ensure that his financial status won't have a severely adverse effect on my future.

 

I grew up extremely poor and it was miserable - I don't want to experience that again, and I don't want my kids to experience it either, just because their mother married a man with baggage and didn't think things through properly. If I were to end up in a messy situation because of marrying this man, I would never survive my father's disappointment in me, or my own disappointment in myself. As it stands, I daren't even tell my father that I'm dating a divorced man with kids, because he would disown me - he's met my bf but I warned him that my father must never find out about his past, or I would be in serious trouble.

 

In a way I find it difficult to justify his past. I worked hard, I got an education and a good job, I was sensible and didn't make any big mistakes, so why should I expect less than that from someone else? Why should I suffer for someone else's mistakes, when I worked so hard not to make any myself? This is why I don't usually date men with kids, until my current bf charmed me into dating him. The situation is complicated by the fact that I'm madly in love with someone who has made a great deal of mistakes, so I feel that I'm only prepared to marry him if I can establish that his mistakes won't have a huge impact on my future. He keeps trying to tell me that his past will have a minimal impact, he pays no alimony, his kids are almost grown - but I'm dubious. Our relationship is perfect, he's my best friend, he's wonderful and handsome and intelligent - but I'm concerned about how his past might tear down this future that I've worked so hard for.

[HsMomma]

I grew up extremely poor and it was miserable - I don't want to experience that again, and I don't want my kids to experience it either, just because their mother married a man with baggage and didn't think things through properly. If I were to end up in a messy situation because of marrying this man, I would never survive my father's disappointment in me, or my own disappointment in myself. As it stands, I daren't even tell my father that I'm dating a divorced man with kids, because he would disown me - he's met my bf but I warned him that my father must never find out about his past, or I would be in serious trouble.

 

Ok - THAT'S messed up - you are 30 years old. Daddy shouldn't have any say in who you choose to make a life with...

 

 

In a way I find it difficult to justify his past. I worked hard, I got an education and a good job, I was sensible and didn't make any big mistakes, so why should I expect less than that from someone else? Why should I suffer for someone else's mistakes, when I worked so hard not to make any myself? This is why I don't usually date men with kids, until my current bf charmed me into dating him. The situation is complicated by the fact that I'm madly in love with someone who has made a great deal of mistakes,

 

I don't believe that you are "madly in love" with him - I believe you are (as other posters have said here) doing your utmost to establish a "reason" not to marry him. I think you love yourself MUCH more than you love him. It seems to me you've set yourself up on a pedestal and think that you are better than your bf...

 

so I feel that I'm only prepared to marry him if I can establish that his mistakes won't have a huge impact on my future. He keeps trying to tell me that his past will have a minimal impact, he pays no alimony, his kids are almost grown - but I'm dubious. Our relationship is perfect, he's my best friend, he's wonderful and handsome and intelligent - but I'm concerned about how his past might tear down this future that I've worked so hard for.

 

Your relationship is so far from perfect as to be almost laughable. How can you even type that with a straight face? You've judged & convicted this man for actually daring to have the audacity to have a life before he met you.

 

Advice? Get out...you are not equipped to handle being a wife, nevertheless a stepmother to children you obviously disdain. God forbid something happened to the mother of those children & your bf had to take over their custody - even if they ARE teenagers who will be out of the house soon. Do you honestly believe that his commitment to them just ends when high school does? I would think you'd know better - you're 30 & your father obviously still has some really tight reins in your life.

 

I usually try very hard to not be judgmental or harsh when posting, but I have to say, this whole situation just chaps me - I feel incredibly sorry for your bf, since everything seems to revolve around you & your money.

 

Just my 2 cents' worth.

[Eeyore79]

My family is very traditional, and my father would have the same reaction if I married someone from a different ethnic group as he would if I married someone who was divorced with kids. He feels that he has made a huge investment into my future and I have to make him proud. However my bf's kids live 150 miles away with their mother, and my family also live far away from us, so it's not an issue that is ever likely to come to light. My bf himself doesn't usually tell people he has kids, when he visits them he simply says he's "going out of town" for the day. He doesn't want my family to know about his past, partly because of the embarrassment it would cause him and partly because of the problems it would cause for me. He told me about his past when we started dating, but very few of his friends or colleagues know.

 

Are you suggesting that I should tear my family apart by informing them unnecessarily about my bf's past, embarrassing him in the process? Or should I allow my family to dictate who I date, and give up a man I love because he doesn't fit with my family's traditional values?

[HsMomma]

Are you suggesting that I should tear my family apart by informing them unnecessarily about my bf's past, embarrassing him in the process? Or should I allow my family to dictate who I date, and give up a man I love because he doesn't fit with my family's traditional values?

 

No, I'm not suggesting anything of the sort. I am confused as to why he should be embarrassed because he's been married before & has children. Seems a bit too "old world" to me, but ok....

 

As far as allowing your family to dictate who you date, seems to me you're already doing that.

[bean1]

Shame on this man. He sounds embarassed to have children (doesn't usually tell people, says he's just "going out of town", keeps this hidden from her parents). What did these children do to deserve their 2nd class status in his new life?

[HsMomma]

Shame on this man. He sounds embarassed to have children (doesn't usually tell people, says he's just "going out of town", keeps this hidden from her parents). What did these children do to deserve their 2nd class status in his new life?

 

I second this, bean!

[Touche]

Oh and P.S. his kids aren't "mistakes." Shame on you. Shame on him.

 

You're both too immature for marriage in my opinion. I mean you can't really even be true to who you are. You're letting your family dictate your choices. Anyone that immature is NOT ready for marriage and all that it takes to succeed.

 

I don't see this as being a very viable relationship if you DO marry. You'll more than likely end up divorced and with baggage of your own.

 

And maybe TBF has a point about not finding it too difficult to find a man in his 30's with no kids.

[z1850]

If there's any doubt (which there is), don't do it.

[Trialbyfire]

I would be ashamed of being with a man who hides his kids. For that matter, to hide his past from your parents, is just as bad. Respect is sadly lacking in this relationship.

[Gamine]

I share much in common with your situation so I will try and share as much with you as I possibly can if it will be of assistance to you.

 

I am wife #3. He was married to his first wife for just over 2 years in his mid twenties. She had some mental health issues if you ask me due to sexually acting out, etc... Wife #2 he married a few years after the divorce and remained married to her for 6 years. He suspected there was cheating on her end as he puts it and he cheated on her. They divorced when she found out. No children.

 

An in between relationship with the women he cheated on his wife with that lasted a few months, ended and left him as a disaster. I walk in at age 33 him 35 and we marry 1 1/2 later. Things moved rather quickly between us.

 

I did not know the history of the above relationships with any accuracy prior to marrying him. I did not know about the strange and destructive behavior and resulting marriage of wife #1, did not know of his infidelity to wife #2 (did not surface until his infidelity in our marriage) and look back upon the explanations of the ending of the marriages before we married... knew they didn't seem accurate... but accepted what he had to say about it.

 

I thought that he just married the wrong women and that we were 'meant to be'. So, I did not focus or really invest all that much in being concerned over the prior marriages. However, in retrospect, I should have taken the matter much more seriously.

 

Whether one wishes to admit it or not, there are reasons behind why someone has multiple marriages. There are deficiencies within communication skills, perhaps 'unrealistic' reasons for getting married, and more importantly... it can be a sign that the man does not know himself very well.

 

It also reflects upon their views on commitment to working on a marital relationship. In other words, if it isn't working .... the remedy becomes changing out the partner. It may be a reflection upon his ability to 'live in the real world' in understanding himself and his partners.

 

I did not give his divorces any importance. I wish I had. Premarital counseling is essential.

[Eeyore79]

Admittedly I don't want my family to know about his past because they would disown me, but it doesn't bother me if friends and colleagues and people around us know. He's the one who prefers it not to be public knowledge, because he feels ashamed of his past. Perhaps that's why he assures me that it won't have a great impact on our future, and perhaps that's why he continues to pursue the sort of young single professional women he would have wanted to date during his 20s if he hadn't been tied into a bad marriage.

 

Apparently he had a period several years ago where he moved 400 miles away with his then-gf, who insisted that his kids were in his past and he had to stop seeing them. He did for a short while, but then he started seeing them again once every 4-6 weeks. When the relationship ended he moved back to where we live now, which is 150 miles from where his kids live. He told me he had a struggle to create a relationship with his kids again, and he's happy to be in his present situation where he sees them one afternoon every two weeks and talks to them on the phone several times a week - when their mother doesn't take the phone away from them, that is.

 

He estimates that they used to stay overnight with him perhaps once a year, and when he was in other relationships they never visited his home at all. Since he's been with me, his kids have stayed over roughly once every 3-4 months, and they were invited more frequently but their mother wouldn't allow them to come. I also invited them to come right after Xmas for a special dinner, but their mother wouldn't allow it. Obviously she wanted to have them for Xmas, but afterwards she took them to their grandparents and their step-grandparents. They weren't even allowed to visit in January, we had to drive there and give them their Xmas gifts over a pizza lunch.

 

So I have made some effort to be decent with them - I've invited them to stay, gone with him to visit them, sent them gifts, spent hours online helping them with homework - but we don't have a huge amount of contact with them, he'll only be paying child support for a few more years, and they're less of an issue than his ex-wives are. I don't know how divorce works, I don't know how alimony works, or any of that stuff - hence why I wanted to go to a lawyer to find out what sort of impact his divorces would have on our future and on me, and also for a pre-nup and wills etc to ensure my assets belong to me and any children I might have. This is a move he has actively resisted because he doesn't want to drag up all the details of his past and lay them all out on the table. Which takes me back to my original point - he thinks I should marry him because I love him, without insisting on seeing a lawyer to determine his financial situation first.

[HsMomma]

Admittedly I don't want my family to know about his past because they would disown me, but it doesn't bother me if friends and colleagues and people around us know.

 

 

Which takes me back to my original point - he thinks I should marry him because I love him, without insisting on seeing a lawyer to determine his financial situation first.

 

Your family would disown you because he's been married before & has children? What kind of family do you have that that wouldn't support a marriage if it would make you happy? And don't tell me "traditional." My family is traditional, too, and it wouldn't matter if I'd married a Martian if I loved him and we had a good relationship. Glad to hear it "doesn't bother you" that friends/colleagues and people around you know his past - how very generous of you.

 

Which takes me back to my original point - you have no business marrying someone you don't respect, whose children you don't care about, who you have to lie to your family about and who I don't believe for a moment you really love.

[Eeyore79]

Thanks for sharing your situation Gamine. I have to admit that I have concerns about why my bf divorced twice, I think perhaps he jumps into marriage without thinking it through, or perhaps he just isn't good at relationships?

 

He maintains that he has never cheated on anyone. His teenage gf got pregnant and due to his religious background he felt obliged to marry her even though he wasn't in love with her. He says she grew up into the sort of woman he didn't want to be married to - uncultured, uneducated, unemployed, bad tempered, etc. He attempted to make the marriage work for seven years, until she cheated and they finally divorced. His second wife was a young professional woman who was in the country on a work visa. She proposed marriage so she didn't have to leave the country, and he married her in haste and regretted it at leisure. She refused all physical contact for a year, and initiated divorce as soon as she got her green card. After this there were two girlfriends very similar to myself in age, education, professional career, etc. The first insisted on moving 400 miles away from his kids and wanted him to cut contact with them, eventually she ended the relationship because she disliked his past. The second insisted on moving 300 miles away, she met his kids but made no real effort to relate to them, and apparently she ended the relationship because she disliked his past.

 

Then there was me! He moved back to my city and met me when we started attending the same church, but nobody at church knew of his kids and two divorces (they still don't know). When he decided he wanted to date me he told me all about his past, but asked me not to spread it around. He said his past wouldn't be of concern and I didn't have to be involved with his kids unless I wanted to be - he thought I would immediately say I didn't want to date him, but I liked him and I felt sorry that he had such a difficult time.

 

He says he loves his kids and they are involved in his life to a certain extent, but he feels that most people don't have to know about his past - he's concerned about how it would reflect on me as well as on him. He said he wants to turn his life around and do things the way he should have done them in the beginning: a lasting relationship, then marriage, a home, and then a baby.

 

But I have issues with having to essentially lie to my parents about his past, and I have concerns about how his past might impact upon me. As well as financial and legal concerns, I also have concerns about him being twice divorced, and whether if we married he might end up thrice divorced. I also have concerns about how special it would really be to marry and have children with a man who's done it twice before. I don't know if he just made some bad choices or whether he's really bad at relationships - things seem fine between the two of us at present, except for the concerns raised by his proposal of marriage.

[Eeyore79]

Well HsMomma, I'm glad your family would be so accepting. Mine would not. If I wanted to be completely truthful I would either lose my family because they would be upset by my choice of partner, or lose my partner so I didn't have to lie to my family. If I want to keep both partner and family, I can't tell my family the truth. They would have the same reaction if I was with someone of a different ethnic group, or a different religion, or if I was with a woman instead of a man, or even if I was with someone who they deemed to be not good enough. My sister's bf was banned from the house because he was only a store cleaner (and there was no end of trouble), while my brother's gf was invited to dinner because she was a lawyer. Unfortunately we don't get to choose our family. I don't care who knows about my bf's past, but I don't want to hurt my family.

[Chocolat]

This gets worse and worse. This is not love.

 

So there is an element of not wanting HIS responsibilities to become MY responsibilities - I didn't make those mistakes, he did, so I don't see why I (or any kids we might have) should pay for them.

 

First off, your BF didn't necessarily make mistakes, unless chosing a woman who cheated on him should be racked up as one of his mistakes. Sometimes, no matter how much we love someone and invest our all, the other person does something that makes the situation untenable. Do you intend to punish your BF for this for the rest of his life?

 

Second, I doubt your BF agrees that his children are mistakes. That you can categorize your BF's children as such speaks volumes about your heart and character.

 

As it stands, I daren't even tell my father that I'm dating a divorced man with kids, because he would disown me - he's met my bf but I warned him that my father must never find out about his past, or I would be in serious trouble.

 

This is ridiculous. You are going to impose this condition on your BF and expect him to be happy with it? Perhaps he is in love enough now to go along with such a thing, but at some point he is going to resent your attitude toward his children. Does this mean that, if you were to marry, his children would not be invited to their own father's wedding? Or would they have to pretend to be nephews perhaps? And what do you plan to do when the truth is exposed, because it will be one day. This is not the sort of secret that can be kept for alifetime nor should it have to be.

 

 

In a way I find it difficult to justify his past.

 

Huge red flag for your BF. His past is not for you to justify.

 

Why should I suffer for someone else's mistakes, when I worked so hard not to make any myself?

 

Ouch. Some day you are going to have an come-uppance and I think you will regret these words (and this position). Until then, I recommend that you find someone as callow and heartless as you are.

 

 

The situation is complicated by the fact that I'm madly in love with someone who has made a great deal of mistakes, so I feel that I'm only prepared to marry him if I can establish that his mistakes won't have a huge impact on my future.

 

I don't think I've read the word "mistake" this many times in any one post here.

 

The biggest mistake of all will be if you marry this man and let him be crushed a third time.

[HsMomma]

Do you intend to punish your BF for this for the rest of his life?

 

Second, I doubt your BF agrees that his children are mistakes. That you can categorize your BF's children as such speaks volumes about your heart and character.

 

Huge red flag for your BF. His past is not for you to justify.

 

 

 

Ouch. Some day you are going to have an come-uppance and I think you will regret these words (and this position). Until then, I recommend that you find someone as callow and heartless as you are.

 

 

I don't think I've read the word "mistake" this many times in any one post here.

 

The biggest mistake of all will be if you marry this man and let him be crushed a third time.

 

I cannot stress enough just how VERY much I agree with this, Chocolat!! How she (OP) can justify her rigid, unforgiving, judgmental stance on her bf's previous relationships & his children is simply beyond my ability to grasp.

 

I don't think, OP, that you are really here for advice...I think you are already set on your course of action. I also think that if you are seriously considering marrying this poor guy based on a BOATLOAD of lies (to your family, and to an extent, to yourself), the relationship is doomed from the get go.

 

Your view of marriage is unrealistic at best, potentially harmful to your bf at worst. It would appear that you have grown up in an incredibly sheltered, isolated world where bad things 'just don't happen to good people.'

 

I said it before - your posts come off as if you somehow think you are better than your bf. At least it appears that the choices he made in his past were choices made because he's an honorable, caring man. Seems to me that you can't say the same about yourself.

[Eeyore79]

Well, he did make mistakes, and he told me that himself. Firstly getting someone pregnant when they were unmarried, then marrying someone he didn't love out of a feeling of obligation because she was pregnant, then staying in a relationship he didn't want to be in from the beginning, and then jumping into marriage a second time with a woman he didn't love, who he only married because she was acceptable and he was afraid of being alone. None of his kids were planned either, and he believes that each time his ex got pregnant on purpose in order to trap him in the relationship. He said he's glad his kids are around because he loves them, but his whole twenties were one big mistake and he wishes he could go back and do everything differently so none of it ever happened.

 

To answer your questions - no, his kids wouldn't be invited to his wedding, and apparently they weren't invited to his last wedding either. My family wouldn't be invited either because they live too far away. There wouldn't even BE a wedding as such - we would simply elope and have a private ceremony for two. And yes, I fully intend to never tell my family about my bf's past. I can't stand to lose them or have them look at me with shame. My grandmother is 90 and my parents are almost 70, so I won't have to keep the secret for too long anyway. My brother and sister would be okay with it I think, but I can't risk them telling anyone so I haven't told them yet.

[Touche]

Of course I agree with the others...especially Momma and Chocolat. Great posts...that being said, it IS weird that he doesn't want you to go to a lawyer. I'm kind of on your side there.

 

But regardless...this has almost no chance of working out. A marriage isn't always just about the two people involved. Family is very much a part of it and can make or break that marriage depending on the situation.

 

oh and yeah, your family sound like shallow, judgmental, snobs...sorry.