Why is it so hard to believe that some MM/MW really DO stay for the children?

[complicatedlife]

My kids are teens & it's a really fragile time for them. They're also great kids who have never caused me any trouble. For my own physical pleasure to be w/ OM is WAY too selfish right now. Sometimes you just have to do the "right" thing, and not the thing that appears to make you "happy" for the moment.

And this is what he believes he is doing.

[jj33]

I appreciate your frustration. But it seems you are banging against the wall.

 

He believes he needs to stay regardless of what else is going on and regardless of the impact on him.

 

Its sad but it is his decision to make

[complicatedlife]

You can make a case for "not a good time" because of the children at any point in their lives. Yet, many, many people with children of all ages get divorced every year.

But just because they do it at various ages doesn't mean that it doesn't affect the child. They choose to divorce in spite of a negative or positive consequence to the child. And there are many studies that support both theories: whether it's better for the child to stay or leave. The parent who wants to leave will choose the theory that supports their decision.

 

My very best childhood friend and cousin is a family and marriage/couples therapist. Although she has written many articles that coincide with her peers' belief that if the parents can get along, it's best to stay married, she personally does not agree with it as she says a relationship void of love is not a good model for children to grow up in.

 

Why is it that all of those people can make that choice, but cheating spouses have such a hard time? Is it the guilt that goes along with having an affair that makes it seem so much worse for a cheating spouse to leave a marriage with children? I wonder if those same people would have such a hard time leaving if an affair hadn't been involved in the decision.

Ok, so what would you say about the person who has NEVER had an affair, but is just as unhappy as my guy friend and committed to remaining married for the children even though they are dying inside? I know of one particular person like that who attempted suicide. And guess what? She STILL didn't get a divorce. Staying just for the sake of childen is not healthy for anyone, whether the spouse is cheating or not. Of course, this is my personal opinion.

[complicatedlife]

I appreciate your frustration. But it seems you are banging against the wall.

 

He believes he needs to stay regardless of what else is going on and regardless of the impact on him.

 

Its sad but it is his decision to make

Thanks - I know all of this and agree, however, I was using my friend as an example and it went off into a tangent - what I was trying to intimate is that there are some people who really do stay for their children because THEY BELIEVE that's what they should do. And I was curious as to why some people find that fact hard to believe.

[norajane]

But just because they do it at various ages doesn't mean that it doesn't affect the child. They choose to divorce in spite of a negative or positive consequence to the child. And there are many studies that support both theories: whether it's better for the child to stay or leave. The parent who wants to leave will choose the theory that supports their decision.

 

Of course - they weigh the situation and make a decision. They are at least CAPABLE of making a decision, regardless of what criteria they use to make it.

 

I think WS's in general have poor conflict resolution skills and are terrible at making decisions in their personal lives. That's what keeps them waffling for years, unlike people who can assess their marriages and make decisions one way or another.

 

So it doesn't surprise me that they'd cling to the idea of "for the children" while continuing to cheat for years instead of divorcing. Complicate that with guilt over the affair, and "for the children" becomes paramount.

 

 

Ok, so what would you say about the person who has NEVER had an affair, but is just as unhappy as my guy friend and committed to remaining married for the children even though they are dying inside? I know of one particular person like that who attempted suicide. And guess what? She STILL didn't get a divorce.

 

I would say that person is misguided in their belief that children don't see how miserable their parents are, and how that translates into a miserable childhood; or that person isn't really that unhappy.

 

As far as the suicide attempt, isn't suicide ALSO leaving the children, in a much worse way than getting a divorce? She would be leaving their children without a mother, rather than a mother and a father who don't live together. She didn't attempt suicide because it would be better for the children!!

 

Clearly, there is far more going on with her than just an unhappy marriage. Her thought process is messed up, and she's likely suffering from severe depression.

[GreenEyedLady]

I think that MM think they are doing their kids a favor by not breaking up their family.

 

I however don't get how they're doing them a favor by cheating on their mom. I think most children would prefer their dad respect their mom and love her as much as they do.

 

Mostly, I think men use the children excuse because they are afraid to be called to the carpet for what they've done. They want their 2 lives to be separate and remain separate. They don't want everyone to know they've done a bad thing. Especially their W.

[Heather1]

When are they not fragile? When they're toddlers? When they start school? When they hit puberty? When they graduate high school? College?

 

I would have to say that teens w/ car keys driving to a HS of drugs & parents getting divorced would be the most fragile.

[norajane]

Thanks - I know all of this and agree, however, I was using my friend as an example and it went off into a tangent - what I was trying to intimate is that there are some people who really do stay for their children because THEY BELIEVE that's what they should do. And I was curious as to why some people find that fact hard to believe.

 

To me, it's hard to believe because many people do get divorced who have children. And they love their children just as much as WS's do. WS don't have the market cornered on loving their children and wanting to do what is right and best.

 

And it's also hard to believe because it is SUCH a convenient excuse to give to the OW to maintain status quo...having both his wife and his OW. It's a "reason" that an OW wuld be considered a cold-hearted bitch if she argues with it. And it's easier for her to swallow that he'd be staying for his children, at least until it's the "right" time to leave, rather than believing that he's staying because he's really not that unhappy in his marriage, or has no intention to leave. It makes it really easy to string an OW along. Most OW will eventually gather the fortitude to walk away if it's clear that he is NEVER going to leave. But MM can make it seem like he wants to leave and be with her, but, oh, if it weren't for the children!

 

Are there cases where people stay solely for the children? Sure. But not nearly a many cases as MM would like their OW's to believe.

[Heather1]

oops...I don't know how to do the quotes so that first couple of sentences weren't mine & were supposed to be a quote!!

 

Let me add here that my Dad had A's all through the 20 yr marriage & did us no favors by staying married. I was numbing the pain in HS of my parents STAYING TOGETHER. It wasn't until the divorce the elephant finally left the room.

 

In my current situation though, my kids are doing great & are responsible kids. My oldest treats his girlfriend like a queen and is in a healthy relationship where he's very respectful. That's not a boat I'm going to rock for any OM, because it would blow my kids out of the water for sure.

[norajane]

Let me add here that my Dad had A's all through the 20 yr marriage & did us no favors by staying married. I was numbing the pain in HS of my parents STAYING TOGETHER. It wasn't until the divorce the elephant finally left the room.

 

In my current situation though, my kids are doing great & are responsible kids. My oldest treats his girlfriend like a queen and is in a healthy relationship where he's very respectful. That's not a boat I'm going to rock for any OM, because it would blow my kids out of the water for sure.

 

But you're willing to risk rocking that boat by continuing to be in an affair and maybe getting caught? Or are you not in an affair?

[Heather1]

I don't know if I'm still having an A or not. When OM first kissed me I didn't see it coming & had been under years of extreme stress. Day before a funeral too, just really vulnerable timing. I didn't go into it with a clear brain cell.

 

Once we crossed that line, I'm having a tough time getting out. It's a drug. But not one that I'm allowing to ruin a childhood that has otherwise been successful. Ideally, in my situation, I'd love to discreetly continue (have my cake) without throwing a bomb into my family life (and OM). AND I have a LEGAL CONTRACT w/ my H. I guess I'm saying it's not fair to ask a parent to make a decision between kids and OP. Like I said, some things are more important than "happiness" at other people's expense....especially kids expense. It's not fair to question a parent's relationship to their children.

[Chrome Barracuda]

Before I comment on your post, are you saying this about 1. my friend, 2. ME, complicatedlife or are 3. you saying "your affair " as a general statement? I hope it's the latter.

 

Your friend. I was referring to.

[Chrome Barracuda]

Before I comment on your post, are you saying this about 1. my friend, 2. ME, complicatedlife or are 3. you saying "your affair " as a general statement? I hope it's the latter.

 

Duplicate post*

[NoIDidn't]

OMG - this is so true - my boyfriend (former MM) used to say this all the time; that no matter what route he chooses, he will STILL appear to be the bad guy - that he was in a "damned if you do, damned if you don't" situation.

 

That would be because he was the bad guy if he was the one that chose to go outside the marriage. Doesn't matter what he claimed drove him to do it. The fact of the matter would be he did it. And noone forced him to.

 

 

Thanks - I know all of this and agree, however, I was using my friend as an example and it went off into a tangent - what I was trying to intimate is that there are some people who really do stay for their children because THEY BELIEVE that's what they should do. And I was curious as to why some people find that fact hard to believe.

 

Actually, they believe that they are staying for the kids when its usually much more than that. Much more than just those kids.

 

I find it totally disengenuous of anyone to claim they are staying for the kids while cheating on the kids' mother. I echo GEL. Those kinds of cheaters aren't doing those kids any favors. They are also the same ones who then claim that the BW is turning the kids against them, when they seem to do a great job of that all by themselves.

[Mino]

Hi everybody, I have been reading a very interesting book to help me with my "withdrawels" its called How to get over an addiction to a person" Ibought it because it gives great tips on refecting back to all that was wrong, and staying on track. There was a full chapeter on staying in a addictive Marriage. Its not always about "love, or children, or family. People stay out of many reasons, even out of hate, ( which surprised me.) There is a payout. feeling safe, practical, finacial. It actually all stems from our "belief system that was instilled in us as children. I believe the mm who is staying FOR rthe kids specifiacally is not staying for the Kids, merely for his own selfish needs. His belief system drives him. Because if he VALUEDhis kids so much, he wouldnt hurt them in the first place by having an A. Same as a abused w, She hates her husband, because he beats her, Why does SHE stay? Out of fear? Out of obligation? Bot wanting to hurt her abusive Husband? Its her belief system. I dont think I can coney all that is in this chapter, its queite complex. People stay in miserable situations, because their is a payout. Not because we think they are selfless.... is the opposite...selfish

[NoIDidn't]

People stay in miserable situations, because their is a payout. Not because we think they are selfless.... is the opposite...selfish

 

Yeah, an emotional payoff. One that let's them think that they are doing the "right" thing even though its hurting them more than helping them. But they can't see that because of DENIAL.

 

(This from a book that I am reading on Addictive Behaviors and how DENIAL is actually the thing that keeps people bound to them)

[Mino]

Yeah, an emotional payoff. One that let's them think that they are doing the "right" thing even though its hurting them more than helping them. But they can't see that because of DENIAL.

 

(This from a book that I am reading on Addictive Behaviors and how DENIAL is actually the thing that keeps people bound to them)

The book I am reading is " how to break your addiction to a person, by Howard M. Halpern. PHD. Pretty interesting stuff!. I agree with you, but dont they come out smelling like a roses and it was really not about caring for the w or kids, but just being there normal selfish, self centered, narissistic selves?

[NoIDidn't]

The book I am reading is " how to break your addiction to a person, by Howard M. Halpern. PHD. Pretty interesting stuff!. I agree with you, but dont they come out smelling like a roses and it was really not about caring for the w or kids, but just being there normal selfish, self centered, narissistic selves?

 

Yeah. Most of the time, the kids wish these narcissists would leave too. But they are so convinced in their own minds that "the kids NEED me"!

[Mino]

Yeah. Most of the time' date=' the kids wish these narcissists would leave too. But they are so convinced in their own minds that "the kids NEED me"![/quote'] Well mine was a least smart enough to know that his child adapted well the year without him. The child Actually got to see Daddy alot more. He spent quality time with his child AFTER he moved out. During the A, he wasan hour or so day DAD. He admits that its about HIS needs, and no one eles, and he is pretty upfront he cares nothing about who he is hurting to go after his selfish needs,

[bentnotbroken]

I think that MM think they are doing their kids a favor by not breaking up their family.

 

I however don't get how they're doing them a favor by cheating on their mom. I think most children would prefer their dad respect their mom and love her as much as they do.

 

Mostly, I think men use the children excuse because they are afraid to be called to the carpet for what they've done. They want their 2 lives to be separate and remain separate. They don't want everyone to know they've done a bad thing. Especially their W.

 

 

Bingo. You hit the nail on the head. They want their kids to love and respect them, so they play the martyr role to the max.

[Mino]

Bingo. You hit the nail on the head. They want their kids to love and respect them, so they play the martyr role to the max.

puke, puke:sick: Dont they get it, the only way the kids will respect them is to lead a honest life and be true to oneself.

[NoIDidn't]

puke, puke:sick: Dont they get it, the only way the kids will respect them is to lead a honest life and be true to oneself.

 

Yep, all those cheating while "staying for the kids" suffer from the "do-as-I-say-not-as-I-do" disease.

 

Kids never respect that once discovered.

[norajane]

puke, puke:sick: Dont they get it, the only way the kids will respect them is to lead a honest life and be true to oneself.

 

No, Mino. They don't get it. Because they are self-centered and selfish and they can only see things from their own point of view...and that's really all they care about anyway. It's NOT about how their kids will see them or if they'll respect them. It's about how THEY see THEMSELVES.

[Mino]

No, Mino. They don't get it. Because they are self-centered and selfish and they can only see things from their own point of view...and that's really all they care about anyway. It's NOT about how their kids will see them or if they'll respect them. It's about how THEY see THEMSELVES.

You said that very well Norjane, especially the last part, How they see themselves, back to the screwed up belief system....

[MWC_LifeBeginsAt40]

Kids will only react negatively to divorce if it is presented to them as a negative event. Which spouse is giving them the impression that divorce is a bad thing?

 

My kids have not been affected by my divorce. They have two homes, two parents who love them (and who get along), and if there were any drama between me and my ex, the kids would have no clue because no issues are brought up around them, ever!

 

There is a schedule, routine, and also flexibility in case of a scheduling conflict. We are both parents invested in what is best for our kids. We date others, and live our own lives but our kids are smart, happy, and loved.