Is this our final goodbye or are there more to come??

[nobandaid]

I know that this is a verrrry long thread...but please take the time to read it if you have a couple of minutes to spare...as I am in DESPERATE need of advice!!!!!

 

Hi there, I am in serious need of some advice as I just don't know what to do anymore. Long story short... my relationship of 2 and a half years ended just under three months ago. During the first couple of months there was very little contact (please see my other post for further detail etc) but for the past couple of weeks we have been speaking somewhat regularly.

 

Out of the blue, having not called me at all in over two months and ignoring all of my attempts to reconcile, my ex-boyfriend has begun to call me again.

 

The first time he called me we just chatted, for half an hour, had a few laughs, caught up with what was going on in each other's lives etc, without mention of getting back together or anything serious like that. I called him the next day and he tells me that he didn't want to give me the wrong idea be calling, that we have to "stay the way we are," goodbye.." blah blah. So (even though I didn't think this) I told him that his feelings were mutual, we can't get back together etc.... Then he turns around and starts screaming out that I don't care about him anymore and love him etc etc and that I seem like I am totally over him and that he is not over this etc - basically tells me that I am the worst person in the world for having the same feelings as him!! Therefore I conclude from this that he is playing games.

 

So I go to his place the next day and text him out the front asking him to come out (he doesn't answer my calls 90% of the time), so he comes out, acting really distant. He says that if things don't work out between us then he will have to move away. I replied with "things will work, I love you, please don't move away from me..." He then says that he doesn't want a relationship and that things can't work between us. I can't believe this! It seems that whenever I reveal my true feelings for him he runs away, like this is some sort of a game that he wants control of!!! So anyway we both cry for like 2 hours and kiss and hold each other and everything, all the time him saying he can't have a relationship with me because it is inevitable (ok??!!!) that we will break up again and it is too much pain blah blah...... so we both agree that it's over and I drive away crying, extremely upset, but finally knowing that it has come to an end.

 

So the next night I am out with my friends, and he calls! I ignored the call because I seriously can't keep playing these games of cat and mouse, and plus we agreed on no phone calls. That was Thursday night... I didn't hear back from him on Friday or Saturday...and then it came to my mind that maybe he has moved away and was calling just to say bye??!!! So I call him on Saturday night and I'm like "Hi, how are you" etc...then I ask where he is and he says at a mate's house..I then ask him why he called me on Thursday night and he says "I don't know..it just happened...I shouldn't have..I'm sorry." I then say "we agreed not to talk...are you not serious about not wanting a relationship??" He replies with "yes I am serious, sorry for calling.." Anyway then his mates in the background are all like "hang up on her man" so I cracked the s***s, because they have always hated me for NO reason, and I imitate them "hang up on her man" so he hangs up the phone!! So straight away I receive a text message from him saying "It seems like you have moved on with your life and are totally done with me, this breaks my heart.."

 

I am very confused at this point. It seems like he just wants to keep me hanging and I feel like I'm being used and manipulated. I know this is bad, but I decide to join in the game. So I write back and tell him that a guy is taking me out for a coffee tonight (this is true, however they do not know each other), and that he should feel happy for me because he doesn't want me. Btw, the coffee was just a casual date, with a guy that I met the night before - I didn't want to go but my friends told me I had to try to move on with things, meet new ppl etc - I had NO intention of this guy becoming my new boyfriend!!! So anyway, D calls me straight away, in response to this message, and starts crying on the phone, telling me I am purposely trying to hurt him, that he loves me and how could I try to replace him?? I calmly tell him that it is just a casual coffee and I have no intention of starting anything new with this guy. Anyway we chat for about 10 mins, the whole time him begging me not to go, questioning why can't I just be single for a while, begging me not to do anything to hurt him, please not to kiss this guy etc etc. So I tell him that he doesn't want me back, so how can he expect me not to have anyone else?? - it has been 3 months since we broke up.

 

Later on I receive a message from him saying : "The decision is up to you but I can only pray that you make the right one." Then I receive a phone call from him at 4am, asking how the coffee was, do I like the boy, did I kiss him (stupid meaningless questions)... We talked for 2 hours over the phone...and finally I said to him : "This is the last time I will ever ask you - Do you want me back or not?" He replies with "maybe I do." I then invited him over to talk and he was hesitant about it saying "what if i get there and you don't want me back." I assured him that I did want him back - that he was a huge part of my life etc etc.

 

So he came over and we made love. Real, passionate love. Before hand he was like "this doesn't mean we're back together.. I don't know what I want and I need a few days to think about things." I agreed with him..even though I have known for the past three months that I have wanted nothing but him back in my life, I just thought I wouldn't pressure it and give him space. So he stays at my place for 5 hours, just lying in bed with me, talking like we used to, drifting in and out of sleep, most importantly just holding each other. He then gets up to leave, saying that he will speak to me in a few days... and I said "I bet you'll call me today!" And he goes "Nah, I won't. But we'll speak in a few days ok baby?" So i agreed, and he left. Anyway, a couple of hours later, whatdya know..he calls, acting as if we're back together, just to see "how I am." We have a short, happy conversation, then he hangs up, saying he'll speak to me in a couple of days. So I get lunch etc..then about 4-5 hours later I'm bored, thinking of him and I decide that it would be OK if I call him just like he did me earlier. So I call him and he acts sort of "off" and says he will speak to me in a few days.

 

So that night I don't know whether to expect a call from him or not....anyway a call doesn't come.. so another sleepless night. I call him the next day, he is at a mates place, and i ask if we can meet up. I know that I probably should have given him a couple of days and in hindsight it seems easy but it was so so hard and i didn't know who was allowed to call etc.. so we meet up and i suggest that we hang out for a bit over the next week and then discuss how we are feeling and how the week went, if it was the same as it always was etc...then decide whether or not we want to get back together. He doesn't agree to this, simply stating that he "already knows what it is like to spend time with me..we went out for 2 and a half years." So i got angry as I believed it was a reasonable request and spending time together would help us or him to make up his mind. I tell him then and there that I care about him very much and want him back etc... long story short(ish), he finally agrees to go for a coffee with me. He drives and he holds my hand and sometimes leans over to kiss me at traffic lights. He is acting like we are together again. Then when we arrive at the cafe, he gets this really distant, misty look in his eyes. I assume that this is due to the large dose of valium that he takes on a daily basis (40-50mg). The valium is a long story but a doctor initially put him on it for the pain that I had "apparently" caused him. Anyway, that was three months ago now... and he has upped his dose severely and is now addicted to it.. whilst his doctor believes that he stopped taking it only weeks after he was initially prescribed it. But....that's another story in itself..please see my other post.

 

Anyway...so we have coffee..in silence. However he still manages to intertwine our legs under the table (something we always used to do.) After coffee we walk back to my car and he walks up to my door with me, pulls me close to him and starts kissing me passionately. We then drive back to his house - one thing leads to another and we sleep together again...then I go home, him telling me that he still needs 'time' to work out what he wants and that we will speak in a few days.

 

So another sleepness night where I toss and turn in maybe ANGER? Confusion? I was angry more than anything because after being so sure of my feelings for him I expected him to feel the same I guess and the fact that we were sleeping together again only made my feelings more intense and things worse. So I called him the next day (Tuesday) and told him that I couldn't wait around for him to make up his mind whether he "wanted me or not," because it was too painful and I felt like I was being manipulated, my self esteem was really low and most of all I felt unwanted and used. He just goes : "OK. I can't ask you to wait around." So I got angry at him because he didn't put up a fight at all about me walking out of his life. He then said to me : "I know that I want to be with you and have a relationship with you right now, but I need to make sure, in my own mind, that you are the girl that I definitely want to marry before I get back with you." We are 19 YEARS OLD for heaven's sake! So I tried to convince him that he was definitely the one for me etc etc and suggested that we spend some more time together which would hopefully make him realise his true feelings for me. And he was like "No, there's no point seeing each other right now. I need time by myself. I need to work out whether or not I want to be with you forever. We already know what it is like spending time with each other..nothing has changed. But you can't live on impulse, acting upon your emotions. Whenever I am with you all I want to do is hold your hand..kiss you..hold you. And they are all just surface emotions...maybe we're not supposed to be feeling those together in ten years time..." (Something pretty close to that anyway.) So I concluded the conversation with "Well I'm not going to wait around forever so I'm asking you for an answer." I then basically said "I guess I'll speak to you when I speak to you then D." And he said OK, then we said bye.

 

So anyway...didn't hear back from him that day or night... I was sort of unclear as to whether things were over or if I was giving him more time or whatever so I waited until the next night (last night) and when I hadn't heard from him I called him. He answered after my second attempt.. (I hid my number) and so he is like "why are you calling me?" Once again, my guard goes straight up and I try to control the frustration at being asked this. I said : "D, I need to know whether or not this is over and if it is I need closure from this relationship so I can move on with my life." He says : "No, I'm not giving you that closure." I tell him that he can't control my life and that he is treating me very badly. We get into another argument and I tell him that the same guy that took me out for coffee has asked me out to dinner tomorrow night and I want D to admit things are over if thats what he truly wants, so I don't have to feel guilty about going on a date with someone else. He completely blows his fuse, telling me he wishes he never met me, I am only out to hurt him etc.. I ask him to please give me the closure and he screams "NO, NO, NO, NO" then hangs up in my face. So what can I do????

 

I got a mutual guy friend to call D and all D can say to him is that he doesn't want a relationship (tried this one before) and that he is a grown man now so therefore needs to start making some serious life choices...e.g. deciding who he is going to marry. D tells our mutual friend the same thing he told me : That he never wants to have another relationship with another woman until he meets his wife. How are you supposed to know who you want to end up with if you don't have any relationships along the way???? I am so confused.... So anyway our mutual friend suggests to D that he takes me for a coffee and we have a chat and either walk away from it back together or break up for good - no messages, calls etc.... So D agrees with this, and tells our mutual friend that he will do so. So later on in the evening, after discussing the situation with our mutual friend, I attempt to call D, and, surprise surprise, he ignores my calls. So I leave a message on his voicemail saying that he told our friend he doesn't want a relationship, therefore he should be relieved and want to meet for coffee and give me the closure that I want. Anyway he just ignores it all and turns his phone off.

 

I woke up this morning feeling sick to the stomach, so I call him straightaway and his phone is switched off still. I leave another voicemail saying that I would much rather go out to dinner with him but he hasn't invited me out to dinner or made any effort whatsoever (apart from coming to my house once) in the last three months to see me. I tell him that I don't want to lose him and that I love him and to please call me if he loves me too (He told me that he loved me for the past few weeks and I know that he does, very much). Anyway he doesn't call me so I drive to his house and his car is there so I message him that I am out the front and please come out so I can at least say goodbye...he then writes me a message saying : "I am not home..we are over...Charlie (our mutual friend) said on the phone that you wanting closure to be with someone else made him feel sick..i never want to see you again..everything is over...stop calling me." This hurts so much.. so I write back "Don't jump to conclusions D.. I never wanted to be with anyone else.. I only accepted the dinner invite because you didn't want anything to do with me and I craved male company and a good sense of humour.. I want you back and love you..please call me..or if you are 100% serious about this being over then at least meet up with me to tell me to my face and settle this once and for all for both of us.." So he doesn't reply....turns out he turned his phone off again! I can't believe it. I waited until the afternoon and when I didnt hear back from him I wrote him a message saying : "You know what? Fine. It's over. Don't bother calling me in a week when you panic that you have lost me. This has happened too many times. This time you really have lost me. Good luck with the future, I know you will find true happiness with your soulmate one day. Goodbye D."

 

I haven't heard anything back. This has happened so many times though. He will say it's over and then when I agree he panics that he has lost me or lost control or something and calls me frantically within a few days. Maybe he just wants to keep me hanging there or something??? Please read my other post for further insight into the story...the pieces of the puzzle should fit together then.

Sorry that this is so long but I really needed to get it off my chest and thank you so much to all the people that have read this far. Has anybody got any advice on the situation? Any ideas? How do I cope with this behaviour? I love him so much and when he does call me a few days after doing all this I can't stand not to answer his calls because I know the pain he is going through and care too much for him to go through it, so usually I give in and talk to him. Ugh, help! I am so lost and miserable. Is he worth the trouble or should I cut all ties and move on??? I have tried to do this but it seems every time that he makes contact with me again I am back to square one. Any advice and tips would be greatly appreciated!!!

 

Sincere thanks from a lost Aussie girl

[Bravegirl]

You are much younger then me but I recognise a lot of similarities. It sounds very like my situation of the last few months, so I will try to give you some insight. Bear in mind though that it may not apply to you, you can just read and judge.

I too have written other threads, with different questions, and I don't know if they add up to a complete picture!

 

Anyway, my boyfriend (37!) does exactly the same thing of turning off phone, not replying to calls etc. I too have gone to his house when he hasn't answered, he has looked cross, but we have ended up talking and flirting for hours. When he is intimate and affectionate, he too has said, 'But we are not having a relationship,' then treated me as if we are. I too have pretended to perhaps be about to see someone else.

 

This has happened numerous times over the last few months, we have got back together at times, only for him to close the door again, leaving me frustrated and demanding answers.

 

It is obvious from what he says that this makes me look demanding, over emotional, too dependant etc. etc. He said recently, 'when I don't call you you go mad' or some such thing. I have explained that if you picked up the phone like a normal person this would not happen. Checkmate, Catch 22.

 

I don't know what to say now. It did not end well for us. Basically he said he couldn't take this trauma anymore.

 

I am in two minds about what happened (not in my relationship, but during the period similar to yours). Either I handled it wrong, was too demanding, needy etc. and drove him away eventually. Or when this started he thought he wanted to end the relationship (even though yes he cared a lot) and as he has said himself he has been indecisive about it.

ie. The end was inevitable whatever I did, or I handled it wrong.

I still don't quite know.

 

You have to think long and hard. Your boyfriend is obviously very worried about what he has to do with his life. Like mine, he would love it to work and share his life with you, but every little problem makes him think, 'oh dear' maybe that's a bad sign. I have given my boyfriend too many 'bad signs' for a good outcome as I have become more desperate.

 

As people here have told me, do you want someone who is so unsure? You are very young.

My last advice would be, cool of, I know it feels impossible, I have been crap at that. Be unavailable (but not hostile), try to let him come to a decision himself. It may take months. Be patient, even though you think you can't be.

 

I at my old age! am beginning to think maybe he and I will do other things, see other people (however painful that feels) and even in years to come find that we were the ones after all.

It may be that you and he are right for each other, but not right now.

[nobandaid]

So we haven't spoken in ten days. No contact from either one of us.

 

It was his birthday on Friday. I didn't contact him for it, didn't feel he was worthy of birthday wishes from me after what he has put me through. Plus, there is no doubt that it would have only set us both back anyway.

 

Our 29 month anniversary the next day - no contact for that either.

 

One would assume that I had a very tough weekend. I did think about him non-stop on Friday, true. But I went to the horse races on Saturday and had a great day. We then went out Sat night and although all of his friends were there, I had a good time nevertheless.

 

The funny thing is that when I walked into the club on sat night, the second his mates saw me they pulled out their phones and started messaging. I can only assume that it was to him. If he sincerely wanted to get over me though, why would he or they care what I was doing? All of his friends were watching me over the night - it was like they were keeping an eye on me for him or something. Whenever a guy approached me or whatever, whatdya know? The phones came out again. I don't get it. It only makes me feel guilty about trying to move on with me life.

 

Anyway, that negativity aside...

 

As weird and sad as it is, I think I am beginning to get over him. Hell, so i should be : it's been over three months.

 

How are you going bravegirl? Keep us posted.

 

Keep smiling all

[Butterfly1]

I know I am a few days late responding but I just wanted to let you know what I thought of your situation.

 

For one, your ex is very very confused. I know you wish you could walk him through this or reason with him that you are just dating and to not take everything so serious, but this guy does not sound like someone who can be reasoned with at this time. He wants you, he doesn't want you, he wants you, oh wait...he doesn't want you. My ex ex did the same thing to me and it destroyed my self esteem along the way. He would not give you closure because he isn't ready to close the door. Its TOTALLY unfair to you. What does he expect you to do, just sit around and wait for him to realize/ figure out what he wants.

 

I have realized in life that the one person you really have to look out for is yourself....and that means that you have to respect yourself first before anyone else will. I have at times sacrificed my own self respect or dignity in order to accomadate a guy I had strong feelings for....but 9 times out of 10, I am the one getting hurt in the end. By sleeping with him when you are not officially "together", gives a sign to him that he can be "confused" and you are okay with it. I don't blame you for finally snapping when he wasn't giving you a decision. That again is SOO unfair to you. Patience has never been a virtue for me and it doesn't seem to be one for you.

 

I think this guy just needs time. And the best thing you can do is to let him have it so both of you can pull back on your emotions and see the relationship and the situation a little clearer. His friends text messaged him because he still cares (that can't be surprising) I know it must have been hard when you didn't contact him over the past 10 days but honestly thats the best thing you can do. You have already been way too accomadating to him in the past and its time that he grows up and realizes what his "confusion" has done to his life. And if its meant to be, it will work out.