Utterly Confused & Hurt

[tojaz]

It's been almost a week now since the last I spoke with my husband. He called me twice today but never leaves a message. I just sometimes wish I knew what it is that he wants. I cry every night, because truthfully, I do miss him. I discussed this with the group tonight and they all told me that the first few weeks feels that way bc this is the process of letting go. I have been holding onto him for 5 years so of course, there's a fear of the unknown.

 

Is it possible that maybe it was me that turned him into the guy he is today? Maybe, I never expressed how much he meant to me, but instead complain about the tihings he didn't do? I know it that it doesn't justify what his own actions, but I feel sometimes I influenced him to be the kind of man he is now.

 

I talked this over with my counselor and she told me that it's natural to think like that, but again I'm making excuses for his own actions. Even if that was the case, if he loved me enough, he would've done something to make the marriage work in the first place.

 

I am glad that we are separated, but I can't help but ask myself all these things and wonder if he was with someone else, would she make him a better person than I ever could? What was it about me that couldn't make him a better man? blah blah blah. I know. Just venting and contemplating.

 

Never blame yourself for what he did to you. He is an abuser, pure and simple. Unless you threw things at him or beat him while you slept, nothing you did provoked that in him, it was him. Some other woman may have walked on eggshells around him, been his slave, and yes maybe he wouldn't have hit her, but is that the life you want? Is that what marriage is to you? The example you want to set for your daughter? You where the person you wanted to be, and he unfortunately was the person he wanted to be, that is all there is too it. The only thing that could make him a better person, would be his own desire to do so, maybe your leaving will inspire him to do that, and maybe not. it isn't your problem anymore.

 

I've followed your thread religiously since I've found it, and have taken great comfort in your posts on mine. You are a woman with a good heart and a caring soul. You did the best you could to try and save your marriage under terrible circumstances. Take comfort that you tried all you could and got out with your child when you couldn't. You valued your family while he neglected. You are not to blame. You deserve to be happy, and he deserves to be alone.

 

I put a picture of Allison in my profile. If your curious, I added you to my contacts.

TOJAZ

[KAP84]

From Kaps thread>>> For the physical abuse, I only hit her a few times but she knew I had an anger problem and she just didn't know when to stop arguing with me. :eek:

 

So it's her fault your an abusive SOB, Suddenly all becomes clear!!

TOJAZ

 

Don't judge me, I read your thread about you shoving your wife. When your wife acts out, you got angry bc of something she did! that's exactly my point.

 

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t192211/

[Gunny376]

I raised my daughter and step-daughter to be self supporting, independent and never~ever dependent upon any man for so much as spit!

 

Nor to be with a worthless, supplicating, @zz kissing man!

 

My DD bought her first new car (without a co-signer) at age 21, bought a house at 23 (without a co-signer) a house.

 

I'm more proud of them and my son than having done twenty years in the Marines! :) :bunny::bunny::bunny:!

 

I post this not for me?

 

But for the OP?

 

Raise her right, and make her self supporting and independent! To where she can look and any man in the eye, and tell him?

 

"You know what? You can just kiss my @zz!" :mad: :mad:

 

Your making the right choices and the right decisions for you and the DD!

 

Forget these clowns talking about you cheating on him!

 

I don't generally agree with ~ "When a man cheats on his wife its his fault, and when a woman cheats on her husband? Its still his fault!"

 

And too often? That's the case!

 

I was young, dumb and just plain too ignorant when I got married at 22.

 

I didn't have a freaking clue as to how to make it work?

 

I said all the wrong things! I did all the wrong things!

 

I didn't cheat!

 

I didn't hang out with 'tha boys in the bars' anymore!

 

I didn't do enough of the 'right' things?

 

It wasn't so much of what I did?

As it was what I didn't do?

 

You've got to date your mate!

[Gunny376]

Don't judge me, I read your thread about you shoving your wife. When your wife acts out, you got angry bc of something she did! that's exactly my point.

 

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t192211/

 

You've a long way to go and much to learn my Friend!

 

Take a Fool's Advice!

 

Its not about them?

 

Its about you!

 

The pain you suffering?

 

From some little gal that broke your heart?

 

Is yourself looking within!

 

Its your own self doubts and insecurties!

 

You want answers?

 

Look within yourself!

 

Your angry?

 

Look within yourself!

 

There you will find the answers!

[tojaz]

Don't judge me, I read your thread about you shoving your wife. When your wife acts out, you got angry bc of something she did! that's exactly my point.

 

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t192211/

 

This is pretty childish Kap, but youve picked a subject I'm pretty passionate about for obvious reasons, "Just a few days ago, I lost my best friend to an abusive husband. He pushed her down a flight of stairs!! She was trying to save her marriage, and now she is gone, she was 29." so I'll lay it out there.

 

From Kaps Thread>>> She said that I mistreated her verbally, emotionally, and physically for the past few years and she was starting to lose herself in the marriage.

 

For the physical abuse, I only hit her a few times but she knew I had an anger problem and she just didn't know when to stop arguing with me. But I never hit her for more than a year now. She says emotionally, I am incapable of fulfilling her needs (whatever that means). She says I'm insensitive and all I do is bring her down. Hell, every time I come home from a hard day of work, all she does is nag on me. What man wouldn't be angry and want to listen to a woman's mouth when coming home? She says I don't take her out and don't make her special. I call her sexy and beautiful all the time, we have sex, and I take her out. What more can she want from me?

 

I feel lately, I can't stand being around her. no matter how much counselling there is, I will always think of her as a slut

 

From My Own Thread>> While I do not punch holes in the wall, or anything like that, there are instances that I reacted violently. Early in our relationship, I had shoved her pretty good a few times. I would say enough to be counted on one hand, but not sure of the number. She had never gone to the ground, but after the last time I sought out counseling so that I would not allow it to escalate further. I believe that i can honestly say that i have never laid a hand on her in anger since.

 

The difference here is that I own my faults. I did not blame her and when I didn't like what I saw, I sought help. I never hit her, I pushed her and that was enough to tell me there was a problem. Even here on an annonymous forum about relationships, even a lot of your writing is abusive! You are more focused on defending your own actions then fixing the problems that exist.

 

In my 400 odd posts here, almost all of my advice has been toward working on the marriage, get counseling, don't give up, etc. Vangels thread was the first time I ever felt the need to suggest that they leave. If your wife should find LS, she will be the second, and that is based on YOUR side of the story, which I am sure puts you in the best possible light. I would love to hear hers.

 

If you want to continue to play tit for tat, then start a thread and have your fun. An abused womans thread is no place for an abuser to try and justify his actions.

TOJAZ

[tojaz]

Vangel,

Sorry about the rant on your thread above. I appreciate the beautiful comments you left on Allies picture. I am speaking at her service next week and would like to relate the part her story played in helping you, if that is alright with you. I think her family woud take a lot of piece of mind from that.

TOJAZ

[vangel2]

Vangel,

Sorry about the rant on your thread above. I appreciate the beautiful comments you left on Allies picture. I am speaking at her service next week and would like to relate the part her story played in helping you, if that is alright with you. I think her family woud take a lot of piece of mind from that.

TOJAZ

 

That would be more than fine with me. I would love to contribute whatever is needed to give them some sort of peace within her family. Although her death is tragic and unfair, the loss of her life has made a big impact on my life & I know it will for others. Like I said, I truely mean it when I say my heart and prayers goes out for her and her family. I will never forget her tragedy.

[vangel2]

I raised my daughter and step-daughter to be self supporting, independent and never~ever dependent upon any man for so much as spit!

 

Nor to be with a worthless, supplicating, @zz kissing man!

 

My DD bought her first new car (without a co-signer) at age 21, bought a house at 23 (without a co-signer) a house.

 

I'm more proud of them and my son than having done twenty years in the Marines! :) :bunny::bunny::bunny:!

 

I post this not for me?

 

But for the OP?

 

Raise her right, and make her self supporting and independent! To where she can look and any man in the eye, and tell him?

 

"You know what? You can just kiss my @zz!" :mad: :mad:

 

Your making the right choices and the right decisions for you and the DD!

 

Forget these clowns talking about you cheating on him!

 

I don't generally agree with ~ "When a man cheats on his wife its his fault, and when a woman cheats on her husband? Its still his fault!"

 

And too often? That's the case!

 

I was young, dumb and just plain too ignorant when I got married at 22.

 

I didn't have a freaking clue as to how to make it work?

 

I said all the wrong things! I did all the wrong things!

 

I didn't cheat!

 

I didn't hang out with 'tha boys in the bars' anymore!

 

I didn't do enough of the 'right' things?

 

It wasn't so much of what I did?

 

As it was what I didn't do?

 

You've got to date your mate!

 

You're an inspiration for me to want to become that role model for my daughter. My relationship with my dad is not as strong as yours, but I know that he wouldn't want this for my life and when I told him about my husband he was very upset that I didn't tell him this earlier.

 

You keep it real and I love reading your posts! you are full of wisdom, my friend and I enjoy learning them. =)

[vangel2]

Don't judge me, I read your thread about you shoving your wife. When your wife acts out, you got angry bc of something she did! that's exactly my point.

 

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/t192211/

 

Didn't you come on this forum to get advice from others? If you don't like the feedback then I suggest you need to go elsewhere. Otherwise, take into account with what many ppl are saying about you. Maybe part of the reason you're really angry is because you can't accept that you are part of the problem. You sound very angry and upset, and I get that. But that doesn't mean you should go out of your way and upset others with your harsh comments. Just like you, these are real people who are dealing with real problems. You're not going to like many of the feedbacks, but sometimes it's good to see it from another perspective. Like in your case, the focus should be on you instead of your wife. All I'm hearing is that you were cheated on and your wife was wrong for it, and it was her fault things went bad in the relationship. Well, did you ever stop to think why she cheated on you? You basically answered your own question when you said that she said she was unhappy and that you mistreated her verbally, emotionally, and physically. Doesn't that tell you anything? When a woman feels like she's being abused they become depressed and they feel worthless. You made her feel those things which is why she kept nagging on you about you not making her feel special. If you just sit there and just think it through and meditate on it, maybe you would see things differently.

[tojaz]

That would be more than fine with me. I would love to contribute whatever is needed to give them some sort of peace within her family. Although her death is tragic and unfair, the loss of her life has made a big impact on my life & I know it will for others. Like I said, I truely mean it when I say my heart and prayers goes out for her and her family. I will never forget her tragedy.

 

Great, i'm glad you approve. Now I just have to write it. If I'm particularly proud of it, maybe I'll post it. Thank you for your prayers, you are in mine as well.

TOJAZ

[vangel2]

Great, i'm glad you approve. Now I just have to write it. If I'm particularly proud of it, maybe I'll post it. Thank you for your prayers, you are in mine as well.

TOJAZ

 

That would be nice. I'm pretty sure whatever it is you write, it would turn out beautiful & so full of life & meaning.

[tojaz]

That would be nice. I'm pretty sure whatever it is you write, it would turn out beautiful & so full of life & meaning.

You have far to much confidence in my abilites. Still i truly hope so, it's slow going though.

[WARREN86]

You have far to much confidence in my abilites. Still i truly hope so, it's slow going though.

 

I think it's great that you're doing that for your friend, she would've really appreciate that. You're a really good friend and you have a good heart.

[WARREN86]

VANGEL2

 

You are going to miss your past for sure and that's what's making you miss your husband now. You have to face the fact that the man you married is gone. You have to focus on the things that made you want to leave this marriage in the first place. You have to be strong & prove a strong point to your husband that this time it's real, and that you're not going to take his crap. Keep us posted still~ would love to hear from you.

[WARREN86]

dont waste any more tears for him bc I know for sure he's not crying over you.

[KellyP]

Vangel2

 

"TOJAZ" related your story at our friends service on Thursday, it was a beautiful story that really did Allisons memory credit. Her parents are so grateful that this senseless tragedy could help someone else in need it gives her loss meaning in a strange way. He also organized donations to Christy's Hope, a charity for abused women and children in her honor. He and I also made donations seperately in your name. Please be safe and find the kind of love that you deserve.

:love:KEL

[vangel2]

Vangel2

 

"TOJAZ" related your story at our friends service on Thursday, it was a beautiful story that really did Allisons memory credit. Her parents are so grateful that this senseless tragedy could help someone else in need it gives her loss meaning in a strange way. He also organized donations to Christy's Hope, a charity for abused women and children in her honor. He and I also made donations seperately in your name. Please be safe and find the kind of love that you deserve.

:love:KEL

 

I am speechless. I am utterly full with tears of happiness knowing that there are great ppl out there who cared enough to help strangers like me. I constantly come back on here to read all of the support I have gotten over the past few weeks, and it's really been motivating me to keep moving forward. God will definitely reward the goodness of your heart & I will forever be thankful for the expression of the true empathy over my situation.

 

God bless you all & I truely have great love for you all.

[Dan&Ellen]

Mrs. Vangel,

I would just like to offer my condolences to you and your daughter. "TOJAZ" shared your story with us at my daughters service, I could not think of a nicer way to cope with her loss then to know that she was able to touch your life in this way. I have read your tale here and it is heartbreaking. I deeply hope that you are able to build a better life for yourself and your child after all of this. Please know that you are and will forever be in my prayers.

Ellen&Dan S.

 

P.S. "TOJAZ" gave me his notes from the service, I would like to share them with you. I hope that is alright.

 

"We are here today to remember Allison, a young woman whose tragic loss will forever touch those of us in this room.

 

I have known Allie for over 25 years, she was my best friend and will always be remembered as the bright girl, so full of life and energy that it was impossible to see her and not smile. A spirit that existed solely to bring happiness and care to those around her, friends, family, and strangers alike. She was a generous and selfless person whose first thought was rarely of herself.

 

As there are several people who would like to speak tonight, I would like to relate just this one story which just recently happened after her passing.

 

It is truly tragic and senseless how she came to leave us. Yet not meaningless. As some of you know, I am going through a divorce and one of my outlets for support has been a fantastic online forum, Loveshack.org. On this forum i had the occasion to meet a woman I only know as Vangel2. I have never met her, never seen her, or know where she lives. All I know is her story. Unfortunately Vangel and Allison share a lot of common traits in their marriages, far too many for anyone to bear. She was on the forum looking for advice to save her marriage. As her story unfolded, she admitted that her husband was quite abusive and she held a lot of fear for her safety and that of her five year old daughter. Upon hearing this I related Allisons story to her and urged her to escape this situation. She did, and it taking steps to move on and to act in her own best interests and in those of her daughter. She has sought out support and guidance and I truly believe that this is directly in response to Allies story.

 

It is of great comfort to me and hopefully to you all, that something positive could come from this tragedy, that Vangel could be inspired to choose a different path, and that all who read her and Allies story may do the same, this in the end i believe is how Allison would like to have been remembered. I urge all of you who are willing to keep Vangel in thier prayers and to ask Allie to watch over her and her daughter."

[trippi1432]

I raised my daughter and step-daughter to be self supporting, independent and never~ever dependent upon any man for so much as spit!

 

Nor to be with a worthless, supplicating, @zz kissing man!

 

My DD bought her first new car (without a co-signer) at age 21, bought a house at 23 (without a co-signer) a house.

 

I'm more proud of them and my son than having done twenty years in the Marines! :) :bunny::bunny::bunny:!

 

I post this not for me?

 

But for the OP?

 

Raise her right, and make her self supporting and independent! To where she can look and any man in the eye, and tell him?

 

"You know what? You can just kiss my @zz!" :mad: :mad:

 

QUOTE]

 

I'm still going through all of these forums, but I have to say AMEN to this advice from Gunny. My daddy raised me this way and it helped me to be a good mother to my daughter, she tells me that I am the strongest woman she knows but she has no idea of how proud I am of her inner strength and the strong woman she has become at the age of 22.

 

At any rate, any man who hits is a weak man IMOP. My current husband and I have had our rows early in our relationship. It only took one time making him watch The Burning Bed and one fanatical moment to make him sleep with 911 pre-dialed into the phone and him sleeping on the couch (yes, I pre-dialed it for him) to show him hitting a woman doesn't make her submissive, it just pisses us off more. Women want strong men, not weak ones...but that strength comes from knowing yourself (emotionally as well as intelligently) not from the back of your hand. That's a coward and it is recognized.

 

I am still working thru the thread, but I see where it is going and my sincere condolences.

[vangel2]

Mrs. Vangel,

I would just like to offer my condolences to you and your daughter. "TOJAZ" shared your story with us at my daughters service, I could not think of a nicer way to cope with her loss then to know that she was able to touch your life in this way. I have read your tale here and it is heartbreaking. I deeply hope that you are able to build a better life for yourself and your child after all of this. Please know that you are and will forever be in my prayers.

Ellen&Dan S.

 

P.S. "TOJAZ" gave me his notes from the service, I would like to share them with you. I hope that is alright.

 

"We are here today to remember Allison, a young woman whose tragic loss will forever touch those of us in this room.

 

I have known Allie for over 25 years, she was my best friend and will always be remembered as the bright girl, so full of life and energy that it was impossible to see her and not smile. A spirit that existed solely to bring happiness and care to those around her, friends, family, and strangers alike. She was a generous and selfless person whose first thought was rarely of herself.

 

As there are several people who would like to speak tonight, I would like to relate just this one story which just recently happened after her passing.

 

It is truly tragic and senseless how she came to leave us. Yet not meaningless. As some of you know, I am going through a divorce and one of my outlets for support has been a fantastic online forum, Loveshack.org. On this forum i had the occasion to meet a woman I only know as Vangel2. I have never met her, never seen her, or know where she lives. All I know is her story. Unfortunately Vangel and Allison share a lot of common traits in their marriages, far too many for anyone to bear. She was on the forum looking for advice to save her marriage. As her story unfolded, she admitted that her husband was quite abusive and she held a lot of fear for her safety and that of her five year old daughter. Upon hearing this I related Allisons story to her and urged her to escape this situation. She did, and it taking steps to move on and to act in her own best interests and in those of her daughter. She has sought out support and guidance and I truly believe that this is directly in response to Allies story.

 

It is of great comfort to me and hopefully to you all, that something positive could come from this tragedy, that Vangel could be inspired to choose a different path, and that all who read her and Allies story may do the same, this in the end i believe is how Allison would like to have been remembered. I urge all of you who are willing to keep Vangel in thier prayers and to ask Allie to watch over her and her daughter."

 

DAN & ELLEN:

I am so sorry for the loss of your daughter. Tojaz has posted a picture up of your daughter; she is such a young & beautiful lady that it broke my heart to know that she is no longer here on earth with us today. Ever since Tojaz has shared her story with me, I think about it daily. Her story is the reason why my soon to be ex-husband & I are no longer together. Like I mentioned earlier in one of my posts, everything happens for a reason; God works in mysterious ways. I came on here not knowing what to do & not knowing what directions to take. I had a lot of great advice, but it was the story of your daughter that was like an answer to my prayers. I still think it is such a tragic for such a beautiful lady with a kind spirit & a big heart to have lost her life at the hands of a senseless man, but it was because of her I finally am able to find peace within me. Every day that passes by, I will always think of her when I look at my daughter because I know that in the future, life is going to better for the both of us. The story of your daughter & the help of the many great ppl on this forum saved my life & I thank God for allowing such great ppl to be a part of my life. Allie's family will forever be in my thoughts & prayers.

[vangel2]

"We are here today to remember Allison, a young woman whose tragic loss will forever touch those of us in this room.

 

I have known Allie for over 25 years, she was my best friend and will always be remembered as the bright girl, so full of life and energy that it was impossible to see her and not smile. A spirit that existed solely to bring happiness and care to those around her, friends, family, and strangers alike. She was a generous and selfless person whose first thought was rarely of herself.

 

As there are several people who would like to speak tonight, I would like to relate just this one story which just recently happened after her passing.

 

It is truly tragic and senseless how she came to leave us. Yet not meaningless. As some of you know, I am going through a divorce and one of my outlets for support has been a fantastic online forum, Loveshack.org. On this forum i had the occasion to meet a woman I only know as Vangel2. I have never met her, never seen her, or know where she lives. All I know is her story. Unfortunately Vangel and Allison share a lot of common traits in their marriages, far too many for anyone to bear. She was on the forum looking for advice to save her marriage. As her story unfolded, she admitted that her husband was quite abusive and she held a lot of fear for her safety and that of her five year old daughter. Upon hearing this I related Allisons story to her and urged her to escape this situation. She did, and it taking steps to move on and to act in her own best interests and in those of her daughter. She has sought out support and guidance and I truly believe that this is directly in response to Allies story.

 

It is of great comfort to me and hopefully to you all, that something positive could come from this tragedy, that Vangel could be inspired to choose a different path, and that all who read her and Allies story may do the same, this in the end i believe is how Allison would like to have been remembered. I urge all of you who are willing to keep Vangel in thier prayers and to ask Allie to watch over her and her daughter."

[vangel2]

You have far to much confidence in my abilites. Still i truly hope so, it's slow going though.

 

Speechless. The words you chosen in your speech is beautiful & it was heart-warming. I have printed it out & framed it. It is sitting on my dresser to remind me daily of your friend Allie & of a man I know as TOJAZ that really has done something for me in such a way I never expected. You are a man with a kind heart who I believe God has a special plan for you in your life. Thank you for always being there for me when I needed someone the most.

 

Btw, I tried to look for an email you said you keep posted... but I'm new on here, so I don't know what I'm looking for. I would love to K.I.T.!!

[tojaz]

Speechless. The words you chosen in your speech is beautiful & it was heart-warming. I have printed it out & framed it. It is sitting on my dresser to remind me daily of your friend Allie & of a man I know as TOJAZ that really has done something for me in such a way I never expected. You are a man with a kind heart who I believe God has a special plan for you in your life. Thank you for always being there for me when I needed someone the most.

 

Btw, I tried to look for an email you said you keep posted... but I'm new on here, so I don't know what I'm looking for. I would love to K.I.T.!!

 

Thank you for your kind words Vangel. I am ot much of a writer or anything like that, hell i paint cars for a living and am typically a little rough around the edges. I probably would have never posted it if Allies mom hadn't. I always check for your thread when I'm on LS and you can write me anytime you like. Drop me a line at [email protected]

TOJAZ

[LisaUk]

Mrs. Vangel,

I would just like to offer my condolences to you and your daughter. "TOJAZ" shared your story with us at my daughters service, I could not think of a nicer way to cope with her loss then to know that she was able to touch your life in this way. I have read your tale here and it is heartbreaking. I deeply hope that you are able to build a better life for yourself and your child after all of this. Please know that you are and will forever be in my prayers.

Ellen&Dan S.

 

P.S. "TOJAZ" gave me his notes from the service, I would like to share them with you. I hope that is alright.

 

"We are here today to remember Allison, a young woman whose tragic loss will forever touch those of us in this room.

 

I have known Allie for over 25 years, she was my best friend and will always be remembered as the bright girl, so full of life and energy that it was impossible to see her and not smile. A spirit that existed solely to bring happiness and care to those around her, friends, family, and strangers alike. She was a generous and selfless person whose first thought was rarely of herself.

 

As there are several people who would like to speak tonight, I would like to relate just this one story which just recently happened after her passing.

 

It is truly tragic and senseless how she came to leave us. Yet not meaningless. As some of you know, I am going through a divorce and one of my outlets for support has been a fantastic online forum, Loveshack.org. On this forum i had the occasion to meet a woman I only know as Vangel2. I have never met her, never seen her, or know where she lives. All I know is her story. Unfortunately Vangel and Allison share a lot of common traits in their marriages, far too many for anyone to bear. She was on the forum looking for advice to save her marriage. As her story unfolded, she admitted that her husband was quite abusive and she held a lot of fear for her safety and that of her five year old daughter. Upon hearing this I related Allisons story to her and urged her to escape this situation. She did, and it taking steps to move on and to act in her own best interests and in those of her daughter. She has sought out support and guidance and I truly believe that this is directly in response to Allies story.

 

It is of great comfort to me and hopefully to you all, that something positive could come from this tragedy, that Vangel could be inspired to choose a different path, and that all who read her and Allies story may do the same, this in the end i believe is how Allison would like to have been remembered. I urge all of you who are willing to keep Vangel in thier prayers and to ask Allie to watch over her and her daughter."

 

Dan and Ellen

I just wanted to pass on my deepest sympathies to you and your family. To lose a child is the greatest loss anyone could ever experience and to do so at the hands of an abuser must be intorable. You are in my thoughts and prayers.

 

Tojaz, that was a lovely speech, you did Allie proud.

[tojaz]

Thank you Lisa!