How could I have...

[Ajay]

Hi to everyone:

 

After reviewing several postings on this forum, I knew I had found an appropriate place to ask for comments/suggestions/advice, etc.

 

Here's my story:

 

I am a 40-year-old divorced female (10-year-marriage to an alcoholic, both of us with LOTS of problems including childhood molestation/abandonment, and huge communication and intimacy issues, but infidelity was NOT a contributing factor in our list of reasons to end the marriage. We are good friends now, but our days of happiness are long gone.)

 

I have since met a very special man. I have never felt for anyone the feelings of trust, respect, love, and longing which I feel for him (and YAY! it's mutual). We plan to spend the rest of our lives together.

 

We did not come to this point in our relationship overnight. We met in December of 1998. Since then, we have lived together, split up, been "just friends", decided to make a commitment, split up again... I thought I was going to go crazy. When I was ready, he wasn't; when he decided he was ready, I wasn't. Well finally, 17 months later, we have finally decided we are great together and have spent the past few weeks talking and talking and...

 

While we were apart, we were not seeing other people. I was still trying to work out the details of my divorce, and he was still tying up loose ends after the breakup of his 20-year relationship. (He had been single 10 months when we met, me only 3).

 

All I could do was think of him, dream of him, pray things would work out. So why did I start sleeping with someone else? It was not someone I loved; not even someone I liked really. I did not want a commitment, and he only wanted to be friends. He was totally the opposite of the man I loved in everyway, and often I found myself crying from shame and guilt for even being with him. This continued off and on for several months until he admitted he had fallen in love with me; it was then I broke things off with him.

 

Five months ago, the one I love called me to talk. I was so excited and couldn't wait to see him again but when I did -- I could barely look him in the eyes, I was certain he knew I had been with someone else, and I lied about it when he asked me outright. Actually, he said he didn't want to know. He only wanted to be with me (I felt like my prayers had been answered)!

 

Then came the guilt -- How could I have slept with another man when all I had to do was wait for the one I loved (who also loved me and I knew it, we just wouldn't admit it to each other). Now I am having a terrible time getting through this. The truth has all come out over these past few months. I guess in a way it's a blessing because we are finally communicating, talking about our feelings for each other and working things out.

 

Two days ago, when it seemed everything was going to be okay, he let me know that he too had been with someone else.

 

Even though we were not "together" when it happened, part of me felt like he was trying to pay me back even though he says he was just trying to get over me and end our relationship once and for all. I cannot express the pain...

 

Now were are both hurting and have moments of fear and doubt when we are not together. We discuss it daily and everyday the pain seems to diminish a little while the love is growing in leaps and bounds. We are certain, in time, we will both heal.

 

I just can't stop wondering, how could this have happened to two people who love each other so much? I know we were both scared of how we felt about each other and commitment shy but...why, why, why?

 

Anyone willing to discuss/advise and/or share their stories, please do. I need help to get through this and would appreciate assistance dealing with these infidelity and reconciliation issues. I really believe we are going to make it. Please share your thoughts...

 

Ajay

[billy the kid]

well where do I start.. of course you were wrong in messing around, but stuff happens not that it makes it right.. but it does.. ok your forgiven, by me any way, I was married at one time and we split up and hadn't seen each other for a few days, well I missed her so much it wasn't funny, so this one evening I got on my knees and cried and prayed that no matter what she asked I would do... so not more than 10 min. passed and she called and asked me to meet her.. so I did and she say's " well i want to see you, but only for sex"... I'm no stud but what we had was really great.. but then imagine how I felt when she told me this also with the fact that I had prayed for this. it killed me but I kept my promise, so we worked things out for a long while but eventually I gave up and so did she. I later found out that she cheated on me.. to me it didn't mater you see I truley loved her and would forgive her for anything.. we never got back together but I still hold a place in my heart and think of her often...so I would say If you really care for this guy no mater the bad thing's , If you really care don't ever, ever not for a moment, a second, ever give up hope... now then there is this talk of abuse... another subject... THAT you can not put up with!!never let him hurt you or your kid's phys,that is the only reason I would say leave..!I wish you the best with your love but mostly with your heart..

Hi to everyone: After reviewing several postings on this forum, I knew I had found an appropriate place to ask for comments/suggestions/advice, etc. Here's my story: I am a 40-year-old divorced female (10-year-marriage to an alcoholic, both of us with LOTS of problems including childhood molestation/abandonment, and huge communication and intimacy issues, but infidelity was NOT a contributing factor in our list of reasons to end the marriage. We are good friends now, but our days of happiness are long gone.) I have since met a very special man. I have never felt for anyone the feelings of trust, respect, love, and longing which I feel for him (and YAY! it's mutual). We plan to spend the rest of our lives together. We did not come to this point in our relationship overnight. We met in December of 1998. Since then, we have lived together, split up, been "just friends", decided to make a commitment, split up again... I thought I was going to go crazy. When I was ready, he wasn't; when he decided he was ready, I wasn't. Well finally, 17 months later, we have finally decided we are great together and have spent the past few weeks talking and talking and... While we were apart, we were not seeing other people. I was still trying to work out the details of my divorce, and he was still tying up loose ends after the breakup of his 20-year relationship. (He had been single 10 months when we met, me only 3). All I could do was think of him, dream of him, pray things would work out. So why did I start sleeping with someone else? It was not someone I loved; not even someone I liked really. I did not want a commitment, and he only wanted to be friends. He was totally the opposite of the man I loved in everyway, and often I found myself crying from shame and guilt for even being with him. This continued off and on for several months until he admitted he had fallen in love with me; it was then I broke things off with him. Five months ago, the one I love called me to talk. I was so excited and couldn't wait to see him again but when I did -- I could barely look him in the eyes, I was certain he knew I had been with someone else, and I lied about it when he asked me outright. Actually, he said he didn't want to know. He only wanted to be with me (I felt like my prayers had been answered)!

 

Then came the guilt -- How could I have slept with another man when all I had to do was wait for the one I loved (who also loved me and I knew it, we just wouldn't admit it to each other). Now I am having a terrible time getting through this. The truth has all come out over these past few months. I guess in a way it's a blessing because we are finally communicating, talking about our feelings for each other and working things out.

 

Two days ago, when it seemed everything was going to be okay, he let me know that he too had been with someone else. Even though we were not "together" when it happened, part of me felt like he was trying to pay me back even though he says he was just trying to get over me and end our relationship once and for all. I cannot express the pain...

 

Now were are both hurting and have moments of fear and doubt when we are not together. We discuss it daily and everyday the pain seems to diminish a little while the love is growing in leaps and bounds. We are certain, in time, we will both heal. I just can't stop wondering, how could this have happened to two people who love each other so much? I know we were both scared of how we felt about each other and commitment shy but...why, why, why? Anyone willing to discuss/advise and/or share their stories, please do. I need help to get through this and would appreciate assistance dealing with these infidelity and reconciliation issues. I really believe we are going to make it. Please share your thoughts... Ajay

[Tony T]

I don't see any infidelity issues here. Neither one of you was committed to the other at the time.

 

Why people make such a big issue of sport sex is beyond me. Whether you are masturbating or having sex with another person, if there is no emotional involvement behind it, it is merely an orgasm...if you're lucky.

 

There is no harm if you don't let it affect current or future relationships. Sex is just the friction of a part of one person's body against a part of another person's body for a brief period followed by a really heightened sense of well-being (orgasm) and that's it. It's not a bank robbery or a trip to the moon (although it may feel that way sometimes).

 

Man was created to have a sexual appetite. Acting on that appetite is not that big of a deal if done between two consenting adults who don't have a lot of emotional hang-ups. Now, if you want to get all guilty about it, that's your choice. IT IS A C-H-O-I-C-E!!! Frankly, I always choose to feel good. I think I owe it to myself while I'm on planet earth not to bogg myself down in emotional gump that will take me nowhere. I have done a lot of crap in my life, I knew it was wrong at the time, but afterwards I admitted my humanity, forgave myself, moved on and all is well. I apologize to people I may accidentally hurt, but if they keep bringing it up...I just get out of their lives because I don't need the aggravation...and neither do you.

 

Why people like to make themselves feel certain ways (like yukky guilty) is something I have never been able to understand. Try to resolve today to feel good and proper about everything you do, stop passing judgements on yourself, your behavior and that of others. As long as you don't cause physical, financial or other serious harm to another person, you are OK. IT IS OK TO BE HUMAN....YOU HAVE PERMISSION ON THIS PLANET TO ACT THAT WAY.

 

If your current relationship is going to survive, you should have only one more short discussion, one in which the two of you agree to forgive, forget, put it in the past, and just move forward with your love. The longer you stir manure in conversation or in your mind, the longer it stinks.

 

While I'm here, I want you to know the best gift you could ever give yourself is a tight mouth...along with being guilt free. A tight mouth is a highly productive possession while a guilty conscience serves no purpose other than to make you feel bad and depressed. Should you ever be tempted and act on something with another man, enjoy yourself, enjoy the moment, and then just forget it. Don't run home and tell your husband how bad you feel about it. Just don't feel bad about it. You have that control. While we never set out to be unfaithful, sometimes it just happens. We are human. We make mistakes. It is OK!!!

 

Now, move on with your life, enjoy people, enjoy activities, love, forgive, forget and don't bog yourself down with all the guilt crap. And I will end this the way I end so many of my posts....LIFE IS JUST TO SHORT!!!!

[LT]

I agree very much with Tony's post. Would like to add a little more philosophy here, tho.

 

Fidelity is NOT a measure of love.

 

Let me say that again.

 

Fidelity is NOT a measure of love.

 

Fidelity is only one of many vows we make when we WED. If you want to get religious, then understand that God himself considers all the other vows JUST AS IMPORTANT. And yet couples break those vows all the time (with impunity) but if they sexually stray it's supposed to make null and void everything else?

 

Some people are monogamous. Very few actually. I'm one of them. I can't stand even dating more than one guy at a time. This isn't a moral issue and I don't consider myself better than anyone else (I consider myself "focused" hehehe). I was in a 14 year marriage with a man who never cheated on me and it fell apart because he ended up believing that his schlong and a paycheck were the only things he needed to contribute to the marriage (those cherish vows meant nothing, basically). A while after that I fell madly in love with someone who, after a year or so, ended up cheating on me. I have never been so angry or hurt as I was at that man!!!!! How dare he!!! Long story short, I went out and had a meaningless fling (I really wanted to do it on his front yard but I'm too old to not show a little restraint:). Lo' and behold that fling, short lived as it was, was the best present I could have given myself. My recovery from that cheating guy was fairly quick after that and it tickled me to think I could just "get some" from some stud who was 12 years younger than I. In other words, that fling was the best reaction I could have had to recover from the wound. It restored my faith in my own sexuality.

 

Now...as for love. I went on to have other relationships and basically forgot about that man until one day he reappeared in my life. He told me he had wanted to marry me!! heheheheh What a way to show it, eh? But I believe he really did love me! I'm pretty sure he's just the kind of person that needs sexual conquest to feel good about himself (that is different than what I'm talking about here, btw). And, happy ending: I did NOT get back together with him. But it got me thinking carefully.

 

Sex is sex unless it's making love. We, as humans, have the capacity to love without limit. Limiting ourselves to one person is a human contraption, designed to perpetuate the species. I often wish I could be promiscuous (would make the dry spells a lot less drier!) but that's not my nature.

 

It doesn't sound like it's yours, either, but you did "stray" while you were unattached. Maybe you needed it!!! Maybe neither of you would have gotten back together without having had those experiences. Don't beat yourself up about it. Don't be upset by your S.O.'s straying either. Let your heart and then your mind be the judge and then let it go. Quit talking about it and enjoy the love that's there NOW. Concentrate on practicing those other vows so you'll know what you're doing when you finally tie the knot. Even great, exclusive sex can't save a bad marriage. That's where all the other stuff comes in! Good Luck!

 

LT

Hi to everyone: After reviewing several postings on this forum, I knew I had found an appropriate place to ask for comments/suggestions/advice, etc. Here's my story: I am a 40-year-old divorced female (10-year-marriage to an alcoholic, both of us with LOTS of problems including childhood molestation/abandonment, and huge communication and intimacy issues, but infidelity was NOT a contributing factor in our list of reasons to end the marriage. We are good friends now, but our days of happiness are long gone.) I have since met a very special man. I have never felt for anyone the feelings of trust, respect, love, and longing which I feel for him (and YAY! it's mutual). We plan to spend the rest of our lives together. We did not come to this point in our relationship overnight. We met in December of 1998. Since then, we have lived together, split up, been "just friends", decided to make a commitment, split up again... I thought I was going to go crazy. When I was ready, he wasn't; when he decided he was ready, I wasn't. Well finally, 17 months later, we have finally decided we are great together and have spent the past few weeks talking and talking and... While we were apart, we were not seeing other people. I was still trying to work out the details of my divorce, and he was still tying up loose ends after the breakup of his 20-year relationship. (He had been single 10 months when we met, me only 3). All I could do was think of him, dream of him, pray things would work out. So why did I start sleeping with someone else? It was not someone I loved; not even someone I liked really. I did not want a commitment, and he only wanted to be friends. He was totally the opposite of the man I loved in everyway, and often I found myself crying from shame and guilt for even being with him. This continued off and on for several months until he admitted he had fallen in love with me; it was then I broke things off with him. Five months ago, the one I love called me to talk. I was so excited and couldn't wait to see him again but when I did -- I could barely look him in the eyes, I was certain he knew I had been with someone else, and I lied about it when he asked me outright. Actually, he said he didn't want to know. He only wanted to be with me (I felt like my prayers had been answered)!

 

Then came the guilt -- How could I have slept with another man when all I had to do was wait for the one I loved (who also loved me and I knew it, we just wouldn't admit it to each other). Now I am having a terrible time getting through this. The truth has all come out over these past few months. I guess in a way it's a blessing because we are finally communicating, talking about our feelings for each other and working things out.

 

Two days ago, when it seemed everything was going to be okay, he let me know that he too had been with someone else. Even though we were not "together" when it happened, part of me felt like he was trying to pay me back even though he says he was just trying to get over me and end our relationship once and for all. I cannot express the pain...

 

Now were are both hurting and have moments of fear and doubt when we are not together. We discuss it daily and everyday the pain seems to diminish a little while the love is growing in leaps and bounds. We are certain, in time, we will both heal. I just can't stop wondering, how could this have happened to two people who love each other so much? I know we were both scared of how we felt about each other and commitment shy but...why, why, why? Anyone willing to discuss/advise and/or share their stories, please do. I need help to get through this and would appreciate assistance dealing with these infidelity and reconciliation issues. I really believe we are going to make it. Please share your thoughts... Ajay

[Ajay]

billy the kid: thanks for the input, but please note -- there was no abuse involved in this new relationship, ever. I re-read my posting wondering if I indicated this to be the case, it isn't. Just wanted to clear the air. Thanks again.

 

Tony: Wow! We hold a lot of the same beliefs in this matter. The guilt thing has definitely got to go, I've just never had to work through anything like this before. It's rearing its ugly head less and less these days. As far as the tight mouth -- I couldn't agree with you more. I've always felt admission of "sidelinig" wasn't about being truthful to the partner but actually a lame effort by the "guilty" party to alleviate their guilt. In this situation; however, he KNEW I had gone astray, and I KNEW he knew it, so...

 

I wanted to thank you for your input and give you an update. Our last discussion of this crap was last night. We kept it very brief, spread the manure thinly, and agreed to leave it there. No more need to stink up the relationship. Things are better than ever. Thanks again.

 

LT: Thank you as well. Your contribution was appreciated. Like Tony, I could see you and I also share similar beliefs about this situation. I was glad to see you recognized (as I did) the silver lining around this oh-so-black cloud. Amazing at it seems, a bad situation that could have destroyed our relationship once and for all actually made us stronger than ever. We continue to talk, for hours at a time, bypassing the bad, focusing on the good, and falling deeper in love every day. Hope to get back to you again sometime, sounds like you and I have had some similar exploits in the love dept. Have to get back to you later on that one...

 

Question to you all:

 

At first I was hurt and angry that he had been with someone else (like I said earlier -- as though he were paying me back). Now I find myself being sort of glad it happened because I have the security of knowing he cannot use my infidelity against me in the future, because he did it too. IS THIS SICK OR WHAT???

 

Later,

 

Ajay

[Ajay]

Greetings from Ajay. Being new to this forum stuff, I wasn't sure how to respond back to responders -- think I'm getting the hang of it though.

 

Please see previous response titled "thanks for the input"; there's a message for each of you as well as a question at the end...

billy the kid: thanks for the input, but please note -- there was no abuse involved in this new relationship, ever. I re-read my posting wondering if I indicated this to be the case, it isn't. Just wanted to clear the air. Thanks again.

Just noticed...the abuse mentioned was in reference to my relationship with my ex-husband and occured during our childhood -- not to our children.

[Ajay]

billy the kid:

 

Thanks for the input. I didn't get back to you earlier 'cuz I was still learnin' how to navigate in this here forum...

 

I did, however, want to assure you there was NO abuse in this realtionship now or ever. When I referred to my marriage (making it clear infidelity was not the cause of our split) I made mention of several problems we had which, unfortunately included abuse we had suffered as children.

 

I didn't want you to think anything like that was going on with me and honey now...

 

I also wanted to let you know things are going great for me and mine. We are working on forgiving each other (and -- thanks again, you forgave me before anyone else did), getting happier together by the day. The only heart problem I'm currently experiencing is that it is so full of LOVE I feel like it's going to burst.

 

well where do I start.. of course you were wrong in messing around, but stuff happens not that it makes it right.. but it does.. ok your forgiven, by me any way, I was married at one time and we split up and hadn't seen each other for a few days, well I missed her so much it wasn't funny, so this one evening I got on my knees and cried and prayed that no matter what she asked I would do... so not more than 10 min. passed and she called and asked me to meet her.. so I did and she say's " well i want to see you, but only for sex"... I'm no stud but what we had was really great.. but then imagine how I felt when she told me this also with the fact that I had prayed for this. it killed me but I kept my promise, so we worked things out for a long while but eventually I gave up and so did she. I later found out that she cheated on me.. to me it didn't mater you see I truley loved her and would forgive her for anything.. we never got back together but I still hold a place in my heart and think of her often...so I would say If you really care for this guy no mater the bad thing's , If you really care don't ever, ever not for a moment, a second, ever give up hope... now then there is this talk of abuse... another subject... THAT you can not put up with!!never let him hurt you or your kid's phys,that is the only reason I would say leave..!I wish you the best with your love but mostly with your heart..

 

[Ajay]

Tony:

 

I have wanted to get back to you to thank you for your response to my posting. I was such a wreck that day...

 

Trouble was, I didn't know how to conduct myself (so to speak) in this forum. I think I'm getting the hang of it. The original thanks I sent was on Tues 5/23 - a group thing for all who responded. Please accept my sincere thanks and know how much I appreciate your input.

 

I know we've responded to each other's responses on other postings, I just wanted to backtrack to this one and write you directly (now that I get it...)

 

Ajay

I don't see any infidelity issues here. Neither one of you was committed to the other at the time.

 

Why people make such a big issue of sport sex is beyond me. Whether you are masturbating or having sex with another person, if there is no emotional involvement behind it, it is merely an orgasm...if you're lucky. There is no harm if you don't let it affect current or future relationships. Sex is just the friction of a part of one person's body against a part of another person's body for a brief period followed by a really heightened sense of well-being (orgasm) and that's it. It's not a bank robbery or a trip to the moon (although it may feel that way sometimes). Man was created to have a sexual appetite. Acting on that appetite is not that big of a deal if done between two consenting adults who don't have a lot of emotional hang-ups. Now, if you want to get all guilty about it, that's your choice. IT IS A C-H-O-I-C-E!!! Frankly, I always choose to feel good. I think I owe it to myself while I'm on planet earth not to bogg myself down in emotional gump that will take me nowhere. I have done a lot of crap in my life, I knew it was wrong at the time, but afterwards I admitted my humanity, forgave myself, moved on and all is well. I apologize to people I may accidentally hurt, but if they keep bringing it up...I just get out of their lives because I don't need the aggravation...and neither do you. Why people like to make themselves feel certain ways (like yukky guilty) is something I have never been able to understand. Try to resolve today to feel good and proper about everything you do, stop passing judgements on yourself, your behavior and that of others. As long as you don't cause physical, financial or other serious harm to another person, you are OK. IT IS OK TO BE HUMAN....YOU HAVE PERMISSION ON THIS PLANET TO ACT THAT WAY.

 

If your current relationship is going to survive, you should have only one more short discussion, one in which the two of you agree to forgive, forget, put it in the past, and just move forward with your love. The longer you stir manure in conversation or in your mind, the longer it stinks.

 

While I'm here, I want you to know the best gift you could ever give yourself is a tight mouth...along with being guilt free. A tight mouth is a highly productive possession while a guilty conscience serves no purpose other than to make you feel bad and depressed. Should you ever be tempted and act on something with another man, enjoy yourself, enjoy the moment, and then just forget it. Don't run home and tell your husband how bad you feel about it. Just don't feel bad about it. You have that control. While we never set out to be unfaithful, sometimes it just happens. We are human. We make mistakes. It is OK!!! Now, move on with your life, enjoy people, enjoy activities, love, forgive, forget and don't bog yourself down with all the guilt crap. And I will end this the way I end so many of my posts....LIFE IS JUST TO SHORT!!!!

[Ajay]

LT:

 

Thanks for your input on this one...

 

I would have thanked you earlier, but I was still new to this forum and unfamiliar with the on-line commands, etc.

 

Please see thanks posted 5/23 "Thanks to all..."

 

Your response was filled with insight and gave me a great deal to think about; I felt a lot better after reading it. We view many things in the same light, and I really needed to know I wasn't the only one who ever sat in this boat. Your openness and ability to share your own experiences meant a lot to me.

 

Thanks again,

 

Ajay

I agree very much with Tony's post. Would like to add a little more philosophy here, tho.

 

Fidelity is NOT a measure of love. Let me say that again. Fidelity is NOT a measure of love. Fidelity is only one of many vows we make when we WED. If you want to get religious, then understand that God himself considers all the other vows JUST AS IMPORTANT. And yet couples break those vows all the time (with impunity) but if they sexually stray it's supposed to make null and void everything else? Some people are monogamous. Very few actually. I'm one of them. I can't stand even dating more than one guy at a time. This isn't a moral issue and I don't consider myself better than anyone else (I consider myself "focused" hehehe). I was in a 14 year marriage with a man who never cheated on me and it fell apart because he ended up believing that his schlong and a paycheck were the only things he needed to contribute to the marriage (those cherish vows meant nothing, basically). A while after that I fell madly in love with someone who, after a year or so, ended up cheating on me. I have never been so angry or hurt as I was at that man!!!!! How dare he!!! Long story short, I went out and had a meaningless fling (I really wanted to do it on his front yard but I'm too old to not show a little restraint:). Lo' and behold that fling, short lived as it was, was the best present I could have given myself. My recovery from that cheating guy was fairly quick after that and it tickled me to think I could just "get some" from some stud who was 12 years younger than I. In other words, that fling was the best reaction I could have had to recover from the wound. It restored my faith in my own sexuality. Now...as for love. I went on to have other relationships and basically forgot about that man until one day he reappeared in my life. He told me he had wanted to marry me!! heheheheh What a way to show it, eh? But I believe he really did love me! I'm pretty sure he's just the kind of person that needs sexual conquest to feel good about himself (that is different than what I'm talking about here, btw). And, happy ending: I did NOT get back together with him. But it got me thinking carefully. Sex is sex unless it's making love. We, as humans, have the capacity to love without limit. Limiting ourselves to one person is a human contraption, designed to perpetuate the species. I often wish I could be promiscuous (would make the dry spells a lot less drier!) but that's not my nature. It doesn't sound like it's yours, either, but you did "stray" while you were unattached. Maybe you needed it!!! Maybe neither of you would have gotten back together without having had those experiences. Don't beat yourself up about it. Don't be upset by your S.O.'s straying either. Let your heart and then your mind be the judge and then let it go. Quit talking about it and enjoy the love that's there NOW. Concentrate on practicing those other vows so you'll know what you're doing when you finally tie the knot. Even great, exclusive sex can't save a bad marriage. That's where all the other stuff comes in! Good Luck! LT