Woggle Posted July 11, 2009 Share Posted July 11, 2009 Things wouldn't be so bad if people didn't tend to ascribe so much importance to relationships. It's a relationship, not the answer to all of your existential problems, concerns, and aspirations for crying out loud. I say anybody - man or a woman - who makes a relationship the center of their life and identity - deserves what's coming at them once things fall apart. Women expect men to bring them the world and then some; men understand that and get fooled into thinking that they've accomplished something major once they're in a relationshipo , and both attitudes are messed up big time . What happened to take it or leave it attitude? Not giving a damn is always good, (sans the bitterness.) I very much agree with this. It's a great to find a healthy relationship that works and end up with one of the few rare women worth commiting to but I could live a Hugh Hefner lifestyle and be pefectly happy. I also find that women tend to be much more attracted to a man and much more loyal to him if they know that he could thrive without her. Just look at that other thread where a woman dumped her man is no mad because he is not sitting around in a funk pining for her. No matter how much I love her I will never a woman the power to crush me. Link to post Share on other sites
green apples Posted July 11, 2009 Share Posted July 11, 2009 It seems that the women are also taken. Everywhere I look, it seems every woman and man is attached. Men I like or men I have no interest in are involved in a relationship. Link to post Share on other sites
Sam Spade Posted July 11, 2009 Share Posted July 11, 2009 It seems that one of the big mistakes people make in selecting a mate is trying to approach it rationally (in the strict, technical sense). I.e. come up with a list of criteria and try to fond a persom that satisfies all of them. For a truly rational decision, one needs to be aware of, and evaluate all possible alternatives and select the one that fits the constraints the best. Moreover, as any mathematicions/decision expert will say and roll their eyes (), mathematically speaking, it is very difficult to find a solution that satisfies multiple constraints (criteria) simultaneously. In the realm of relationship, it is obviously impossible, unless you leave everything to chance (and are extremely lucky on top of it). So, this is purely a mathematical fiction . The bounder rationality approach (and pretty much the only realistic one where human decision making is involved), on the other hand, proceeds through completely different logic: once the the general parameters of the goal are established, a search for alternative commences. However, the search stops as soon as the first satisfactory (good enough) solution is found. I bet the second strategy is associated with greater likelihood of success (not just in relationships). Class dismissed . Link to post Share on other sites
Woggle Posted July 11, 2009 Share Posted July 11, 2009 It seems that the women are also taken. Everywhere I look, it seems every woman and man is attached. Men I like or men I have no interest in are involved in a relationship. The good women are usually taken. Most decent women who don't run off any man that treats them halfway decent have already been scooped up. Most women who have trouble finding a man either want to be single or do something to drive men away. This whole thing about men fearing smart women is crap. Men love strong and intelligent women but most women who proclaim to be that are covering up for something else. Link to post Share on other sites
BobSacamento Posted July 11, 2009 Share Posted July 11, 2009 It seems that one of the big mistakes people make in selecting a mate is trying to approach it rationally (in the strict, technical sense). I.e. come up with a list of criteria and try to fond a persom that satisfies all of them. For a truly rational decision, one needs to be aware of, and evaluate all possible alternatives and select the one that fits the constraints the best. Moreover, as any mathematicions/decision expert will say and roll their eyes (), mathematically speaking, it is very difficult to find a solution that satisfies multiple constraints (criteria) simultaneously. In the realm of relationship, it is obviously impossible, unless you leave everything to chance (and are extremely lucky on top of it). So, this is purely a mathematical fiction . The bounder rationality approach (and pretty much the only realistic one where human decision making is involved), on the other hand, proceeds through completely different logic: once the the general parameters of the goal are established, a search for alternative commences. However, the search stops as soon as the first satisfactory (good enough) solution is found. I bet the second strategy is associated with greater likelihood of success (not just in relationships). Class dismissed . The constraints aren't that vast. Attractive and single is pretty much it. I guess the question is: are "taken" attractive men really off limits? Because I'm going to be totally honest and say no unless they are engaged or married. Link to post Share on other sites
westernxer Posted July 11, 2009 Share Posted July 11, 2009 Most women who have trouble finding a man either want to be single or do something to drive men away. This whole thing about men fearing smart women is crap. Men love strong and intelligent women but most women who proclaim to be that are covering up for something else. Yep, it only takes a little experience to see through this crap. Online dating is a psycho haven for these types. When I hear this drivel in the office I turn up my headphone volume, or else I'll pretend not to listen even though I'm all ears. Some real drama freaks in this world. LOL Link to post Share on other sites
green apples Posted July 11, 2009 Share Posted July 11, 2009 The good women are usually taken. Most decent women who don't run off any man that treats them halfway decent have already been scooped up. Most women who have trouble finding a man either want to be single or do something to drive men away. This whole thing about men fearing smart women is crap. Men love strong and intelligent women but most women who proclaim to be that are covering up for something else. I'm not sure what it is I do that drives men away. But hey, I don't even date enough to drive them away. I don't have a problem going on subsequent dates with guys but I have a problem in getting first dates. I'm not sure if I'm covering anything up by being smart though. I also think I'm a decent enough woman so this whole thing is confusing. Sorry for the thread jacking, OP. Link to post Share on other sites
Ariadne Posted July 11, 2009 Share Posted July 11, 2009 Ok, I'll post an anecdote of one available bachelor that I found in an online dating service. Available Bachelor Characteristics: - Handsome (beautiful blonde hair, blue eyes) - Polite, excellent manners - Nice person - Good son - Intelligent (IQ over 150) - Age 41 - Good in bed Everything looked good in paper... Well, good thing I didn't fall in love with this guy! He was still living with his parents, and at that age, he couldn't even afford to buy a two dollars burger. He was always in the minus in his bank acct and paying for overdrafting. He owed money to every person he knew, and even tried to borrow a few thousands from me that he said he'd return when he'd get his income tax money (I didn't give him). When I met him he seemed very industrious. He had a good job that he hated and soon quit, and was just about to become a millionaire. He was constantly coming up with businesses ideas that were going to translate to millions, and in his mind they all worked out. But he was completely detached from reality and his businesses just made him more broke. His parents were successful business people, had a restaurant at some point, and managed to buy a beautiful house in the Palisades that was worth in the millions. But now they were both retired. He managed to borrow so much money against the house, that the house of the parents was repossessed by the bank and the parents were left on the street. So he had to live with the parents and barely make the rent for a small house, and couldn't afford to get a place of his own. On top of that, he never wanted to get married or have a relationship with anybody. And after we broke up (after three years), he started meeting women on the internet, usually Asian girls, and started making trips to Thailand, Vietnam, and the Philippines. One time he did a trip with stops in different countries and had sex with five of them, all of whom he had an online relationship with (since he didn't want to get married, that worked for him). Now, some 7 years later, he is still living with the parents, still struggling to pay his basic expenses, still just about to become a millionaire, and still single. And because he is so depressed, he has become obese. Link to post Share on other sites
Author shadowplay Posted July 11, 2009 Author Share Posted July 11, 2009 It seems that one of the big mistakes people make in selecting a mate is trying to approach it rationally (in the strict, technical sense). I.e. come up with a list of criteria and try to fond a persom that satisfies all of them. For a truly rational decision, one needs to be aware of, and evaluate all possible alternatives and select the one that fits the constraints the best. Moreover, as any mathematicions/decision expert will say and roll their eyes (), mathematically speaking, it is very difficult to find a solution that satisfies multiple constraints (criteria) simultaneously. In the realm of relationship, it is obviously impossible, unless you leave everything to chance (and are extremely lucky on top of it). So, this is purely a mathematical fiction . The bounder rationality approach (and pretty much the only realistic one where human decision making is involved), on the other hand, proceeds through completely different logic: once the the general parameters of the goal are established, a search for alternative commences. However, the search stops as soon as the first satisfactory (good enough) solution is found. I bet the second strategy is associated with greater likelihood of success (not just in relationships). Class dismissed . I think you're assuming that most women are pickier than they are. Sure I have ideal traits that I find attractive, but in real life I'm not that picky. I don't skim through a list of traits and then dismiss a guy who doesn't fit a criterion or two. My attraction to men is more like an either or thing. I'm either into a guy or I'm not. The criteria come later when I try to find a pattern in what types of men I'm drawn to. There are a few things I won't compromise on -- intelligence, at least modest attractiveness, decency and a sense of humor -- but the rest are up in the air. I would wager that these are the traits most women are attracted to, and therein lies the problem. Link to post Share on other sites
Sam Spade Posted July 12, 2009 Share Posted July 12, 2009 I think you're assuming that most women are pickier than they are. Sure I have ideal traits that I find attractive, but in real life I'm not that picky. I don't skim through a list of traits and then dismiss a guy who doesn't fit a criterion or two. My attraction to men is more like an either or thing. I'm either into a guy or I'm not. The criteria come later when I try to find a pattern in what types of men I'm drawn to. There are a few things I won't compromise on -- intelligence, at least modest attractiveness, decency and a sense of humor -- but the rest are up in the air. I would wager that these are the traits most women are attracted to, and therein lies the problem. But even the seemingly limited number of traits you list presents computational challenge --> for each trait, just multiply the proporiton of men that possess each individual trait, and you will quickly come up with a very small probability of encountering one that has all 4 . For example, if we assume that 50% of men are attractive, 50% are decent, etc. the overlap of 4 sets is small - you end up with a probability of only 6% probability of encountering a guy who has all 4 traits . Yours truly (uncle sam) being one of them . Even if you generously assume that 90% of men possess the desired trait, it still computes to only about 65% probability of encountering a guy who possess all 4 . That's why the maximum number of criteria should be 2 - pretty and a generally good person . Link to post Share on other sites
Sam Spade Posted July 12, 2009 Share Posted July 12, 2009 Ok, I'll post an anecdote of one available bachelor that I found in an online dating service. Available Bachelor Characteristics: - Handsome (beautiful blonde hair, blue eyes) - Polite, excellent manners - Nice person - Good son - Intelligent (IQ over 150) - Age 41 - Good in bed Everything looked good in paper... Well, good thing I didn't fall in love with this guy! He was still living with his parents, and at that age, he couldn't even afford to buy a two dollars burger. He was always in the minus in his bank acct and paying for overdrafting. He owed money to every person he knew, and even tried to borrow a few thousands from me that he said he'd return when he'd get his income tax money (I didn't give him). When I met him he seemed very industrious. He had a good job that he hated and soon quit, and was just about to become a millionaire. He was constantly coming up with businesses ideas that were going to translate to millions, and in his mind they all worked out. But he was completely detached from reality and his businesses just made him more broke. His parents were successful business people, had a restaurant at some point, and managed to buy a beautiful house in the Palisades that was worth in the millions. But now they were both retired. He managed to borrow so much money against the house, that the house of the parents was repossessed by the bank and the parents were left on the street. So he had to live with the parents and barely make the rent for a small house, and couldn't afford to get a place of his own. On top of that, he never wanted to get married or have a relationship with anybody. And after we broke up (after three years), he started meeting women on the internet, usually Asian girls, and started making trips to Thailand, Vietnam, and the Philippines. One time he did a trip with stops in different countries and had sex with five of them, all of whom he had an online relationship with (since he didn't want to get married, that worked for him). Now, some 7 years later, he is still living with the parents, still struggling to pay his basic expenses, still just about to become a millionaire, and still single. And because he is so depressed, he has become obese. Wow. I'm not sure whether to laugh or to make a donation to charity in his name. That's an insane story! Except the hooking with asian chicks part. That's always allright, i guess . Why did it take you 3 years to figure this out? While women checking guys job prospects is *always* quite annoying, this does not change the fact that it is simply not possible to pretend that you're a man without having that finance stuff all squared. guys can pull of being endearing financial messes only in their 20s. The other exception is a friend of mine - the most charismatic guy ever, who is about 40, and has bagged more chicks than Casanova and lord Byron combined. He has never held a steady job (except some highschool teaching gigs); instead, he spends his time hunting, working on trawlers in alaska, and working as a guide there. I wish i was like him . Link to post Share on other sites
Ariadne Posted July 12, 2009 Share Posted July 12, 2009 That's an insane story! Except the hooking with asian chicks part. That's always allright, i guess . Why did it take you 3 years to figure this out? Well, he had some good things to him, and I usually had a good time with him. He'd come on the weekends, spend the night, we'd go for brunch, and sometimes we'd go places like museums or dance lessons, and that was it. I was not madly in love with him, but he was just so kind with me always. He never argued, never got mad, those kind of guys always under control. One time I remember we were driving in my car, and he had the hand on the top of the window with the fingers out. I'm used to closing both windows at once and you can imagine what happened, I shut the window on his hand. He just turned around and said, can you lower the window please? And didn't even say ouch. But eventually that had nowhere to go and we broke up. Link to post Share on other sites
Sam Spade Posted July 12, 2009 Share Posted July 12, 2009 Well, he had some good things to him, and I usually had a good time with him. He'd come on the weekends, spend the night, we'd go for brunch, and sometimes we'd go places like museums or dance lessons, and that was it. I was not madly in love with him, but he was just so kind with me always. He never argued, never got mad, those kind of guys always under control. One time I remember we were driving in my car, and he had the hand on the top of the window with the fingers out. I'm used to closing both windows at once and you can imagine what happened, I shut the window on his hand. He just turned around and said, can you lower the window please? And didn't even say ouch. But eventually that had nowhere to go and we broke up. Actually, cudos for sticking it out for 3 years. Sounds like a cool guy my style, too bad that his life otherwise has been such an extreme mess . Making lots of money is not that important, but having zero security and no future prospects makes a longer term relationship not possible. Link to post Share on other sites
Ariadne Posted July 12, 2009 Share Posted July 12, 2009 Making lots of money is not that important, but having zero security and no future prospects makes a longer term relationship not possible. True. Especially since his parents were starting to need lots of medical care, and that created a lot of stress for him. He had to provide for them and that didn't leave much for a family of his own. But at least he has a loving family, they were very close. Link to post Share on other sites
SpanksTheMonkey Posted July 12, 2009 Share Posted July 12, 2009 Flirt with anyone you like... if he's taken he should tell you, you can't be expected to know. Try dating a little older - many men in their late 20s are married, but once men get into their 30s they're probably divorced from the wife they married in haste and have a bit more common sense about relationships to boot. This is very good advice and fairly spot on! I much prefer guys in their 30's. And have you tried online dating? You can meet SO many nice guys that way. This is total horse crap! I mean sure it may work for sum but Ive only personally ran into nutters on line dating I don't think I would overly invest in another on line dating site nutt bag JMHO tho.... Link to post Share on other sites
You'reasian Posted July 13, 2009 Share Posted July 13, 2009 For sure! I'll be the midget with a huge forehead drinking PBR and playing video poker. I think I saw you this weekend. Good game! Link to post Share on other sites
kizik Posted July 13, 2009 Share Posted July 13, 2009 Hey thanks, got a royal flush before I got kicked out for ugliness. Link to post Share on other sites
You'reasian Posted July 17, 2009 Share Posted July 17, 2009 Hey thanks, got a royal flush before I got kicked out for ugliness. The giant heart-shaped sunglasses didn't help either, except with the poker face. Link to post Share on other sites
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