Do you believe the opinion = the person?

[moimeme]

There have been several discussions on LS since I've been around in which some posters post their opinions, other posters disagree, and those who disagree are accused of 'attacking' the posters.

 

I'm hoping Paul or Midori or one of the Psych students will weigh in but how common is it for people to equate deeds/words with people? For instance, if I say something you disagree with, do you then dislike me? Or do you separate me from my words?

 

So far, I have found people who feel both ways. I think this is about the black/white versus grey issue. It seems to me that people who live in black/white worlds need to make the person bad if their deed is bad (my ex was like that - it's a known phenomenon in psychology). The grey-dwellers think that a good person can do or say things one might not like, but that does not make the person himself bad.

 

How many folks here are in each camp, I wonder? Thoughts?

[midori]

Originally posted by moimeme

I'm hoping Paul or Midori or one of the Psych students will weigh in but how common is it for people to equate deeds/words with people? For instance, if I say something you disagree with, do you then dislike me? Or do you separate me from my words?

 

not my research area, sorry.

 

 

So far, I have found people who feel both ways. I think this is about the black/white versus grey issue. It seems to me that people who live in black/white worlds need to make the person bad if their deed is bad (my ex was like that - it's a known phenomenon in psychology). The grey-dwellers think that a good person can do or say things one might not like, but that does not make the person himself bad.

 

How many folks here are in each camp, I wonder? Thoughts?

 

I'm sure there all sorts here, and that any one person may react to the person or the opinion, depending on the subject matter and how the opinion is worded.

[yes]

i think that since on this forum, all people learn about is each are opinions, people do tend to base their liking/disliking of everyone on those.

 

but in real life, there's so much more going on, and the judgement is based on a mixture of things, isn't it?

 

anyway, i think it'd be best if people stopped judging entirely - others and themselves.

 

2c,

-yes

[moimeme]

people do tend to base their liking/disliking of everyone on those.

 

Hm. You're probably right. And people expect people to be the same as them so people who judge the people by the posts think that all people do, I suppose. Well, I changed my sig. Maybe that'll help. Thanks, yes. I'm interested in other folks' views, too.

[yes]

And people expect people to be the same as them so people who judge the people by the posts think that all people do, I suppose.

--------------

 

Perhaps. I do my best not to judge anybody, period. I guess it depends on - how do you define judge? I don't label anybody as good or bad, but I do have a scale of whose advice I think is usually good in my head, I think... I think... heheh.

 

-yes

 

PS Plz don't ask me what "good advice" means

[cindy0039]

Originally posted by moimeme

There have been several discussions on LS since I've been around in which some posters post their opinions, other posters disagree, and those who disagree are accused of 'attacking' the posters.

 

I'm hoping Paul or Midori or one of the Psych students will weigh in but how common is it for people to equate deeds/words with people? For instance, if I say something you disagree with, do you then dislike me? Or do you separate me from my words?

 

So far, I have found people who feel both ways. I think this is about the black/white versus grey issue. It seems to me that people who live in black/white worlds need to make the person bad if their deed is bad (my ex was like that - it's a known phenomenon in psychology). The grey-dwellers think that a good person can do or say things one might not like, but that does not make the person himself bad.

 

How many folks here are in each camp, I wonder? Thoughts?

I think a person's reaction to a post, and whether they feel judged or attacked or not, is based on how the post is worded. There are non-attacking ways to say the same thing, for instance. There are people who have a way of talking (or writing) that sometimes comes across as judgmental, even if it wasn't meant that way. Since we can't see the person's face, hear their voice inflections, note compassion (or lack thereof), or get a more detailed explanation, it's hard to know exactly how to "read" the post.

[moimeme]

but in real life, there's so much more going on, and the judgement is based on a mixture of things, isn't it?

 

Which takes me back to that article about cyber-life; I probably wouldn't think the way I do now had I not had the delightful experiences I've had of getting to know forum-ites in person or by email or other ways (I've been on a few forums over time). You find how many more dimensions there are to people even when they've written reams; it drives home the point that there's much more to someone than the words on the screen. A lot of people have never done this, I imagine.

[Fancy]

I've learned online (and in real life, too) that generally when you disagree with someone or point out that what they're doing is wrong, you're considered "attacking" them. However, if you respond and give full support to whatever it is they're doing (cheating, abusing someone, stealing, etc.) then you're A-okay. Some people can't handle the truth, plain and simple. When I sense that in someone's topic, I just move on to another one and forget trying to help. It's not worth my time trying to make someone see who's chosen to remain blind.

 

To answer your question, yes I do separate you (and everyone else) from your words. Just because I don't agree with you (or anyone) doesn't make me right and you wrong or vice versa. If we didn't all have differing opinions, this board wouldn't survive.

[midori]

Originally posted by moimeme

but in real life, there's so much more going on, and the judgement is based on a mixture of things, isn't it?

 

Which takes me back to that article about cyber-life; I probably wouldn't think the way I do now had I not had the delightful experiences I've had of getting to know forum-ites in person or by email or other ways (I've been on a few forums over time). You find how many more dimensions there are to people even when they've written reams; it drives home the point that there's much more to someone than the words on the screen. A lot of people have never done this, I imagine.

 

A fair point, but I don't think it's reasonable to assume that all forum participants (on this or other forums) wish to have personal interactions with other members beyond the specified purpose of the forum itself. I think that this forum in particular is valuable because people are able to come with their real-world problems and get anonymous feedback from people who don't know them personally. It's not meant to supplement a personal life. Which certainly doesn't mean that it can't add a dimension to one's social life, if that's what you're looking for. But not everyone is, so I think that members should not be taken aback to find themselves assessed by others largely or even solely on the basis of the remarks they make on the forum.

[moimeme]

I don't think it's reasonable to assume that all forum participants (on this or other forums) wish to have personal interactions with other members beyond the specified purpose of the forum itself

 

Of course - if I somehow conveyed that, I blew it. I was only pondering on why/how people might feel that post = poster and I could see how not having had an opportunity to meet some humans behind the words could be a factor.

[midori]

Originally posted by moimeme

 

Of course - if I somehow conveyed that, I blew it. I was only pondering on why/how people might feel that post = poster and I could see how not having had an opportunity to meet some humans behind the words could be a factor.

 

Conversely, you could just as easily wonder why people don't choose their words more carefully, given that they are limited to conveying themselves via the written word (and, alas, emoticons). I assume that people reading my posts do not know anything about me, and I don't assume that they share my perspective. So I try to be very conscious of how I might be coming across. I'm sure I give the wrong impression sometimes, and also that I'm misinterpreted. I'm also sure that sometimes people read me rightly, and don't think well of me as a result. C'est la vie. Happens in real life, too, no matter how well the people know each other.

[HokeyReligions]

We've been on opposite sides of the fence in some discussions, Moimeme, but I've never not valued your insight or input - I probably have agreed with you more than disagreed with you. The same with most regular posters. I tend to be the same way in person too. People have more facets then visible in a few meetings. One woman that I couldn't stand (& she couldn't stand me either) she & I actually became friends - after nearly coming to blows! We just had to find common ground and agree to stay away from subjects that we would never agree on.

 

My husband, on the other hand, was raised by people who saw only black or white. My father-in-law is a drunken child abuser. He hates everyone who does not think exactly like he does. My husband was like this for a long time. He absolutly hated women because his father taught him that women were liars, cheats, and were out to do nothing but hurt men and take from them and the only thing we were good for was sex. He was taught that it was a man's part in life to "love 'em and leave 'em" and not to care about tears or consideration - women didn't deserve it. Hubby was like this when I married him and then he went and actually fell in love -- something his father told him nothing about!

 

His mom left when he was a kid so he was raised by his father (who was engaged for over 14 years before finally marrying the woman who became my husbands step-mother. And she is a doormat)

 

After 25 years of total separation from his mother, he looked her up and they have been getting along. One problem that we have with her is that she is a total racist. I've seen her influence creep into my husband's speech a few times and I stomp it down - but he was raised by ignorant bigots and sometimes he doesn't even realize when he is behaving like a racist. Its not so bad now -- he's learning. Part of that is also learning that people are so much more than they appear - especially in writing. There is good and bad in everyone.

 

He sees the grey now, but still has twinges about some things, and some people. He still holds a grudge and doesn't accept that just because someone made him angry that does not mean that person is all bad.

 

In the religion discussion thread I got PM'd from a couple of people telling me that I shouldn't even participate and that they would not even consider my postings because of my handle. Even after I explained where my handle came from I got a response calling me a Vile Pagan. I laughed so hard at that.

 

It is difficult to convey some feelings or tone in words. The smiley faces help some - but I've written things that I was saying in my mind in a joking, sarcastic, not at all serious, manner and in writing they sound angry or even spiteful. I've also read posts that I responded to in the way I interpreted them then come back later and see a bunch of other respondents have got something entirely different from the post -- I just never saw it their way until I read their responses.

[moimeme]

see a bunch of other respondents have got something entirely different from the post -- I just never saw it their way until I read their responses.

 

I'm familiar with that phenomenon And that's just it. I don't think one can possibly figure out beforehand all the ways others may interpret one's remarks. I post what I post and if I find someone has taken something I've said to be pejorative, I try to clarify to turn the meaning back to the issue.

 

One woman that I couldn't stand (& she couldn't stand me either) she & I actually became friends - after nearly coming to blows! We just had to find common ground and agree to stay away from subjects that we would never agree on.

 

I, too, have found friends in sometimes surprising ways. I've grown quite fond only recently of a few people who at first seemed a little off-putting. I really love when that happens

 

On the whole, I think folks are exactly what my sig now says and there are few people I can find it in my heart to dislike - generally these are people who abuse postions of influence. You and I have disagreed, but it seems to me rarely, and I have nothing but admiration for all the difficulties you have withstood. Certainly I never disliked you nor any other poster I can think of. If anything, I get fonder of people than is wise, but then I do that in the rest of my life, too