Porn

[sxyNYCcpl]

I think all porn is degrading to women on some level.

 

Really??

 

Every conceivable and/or available type of porn is degrading to women? Are you sure you want to go on the record with such an opinion?

[missdependant]

*Sigh* Why does every thread regarding porn have to turn into this..

 

I understand people have their opinions.. but it seems like every single porn thread turns into a huge battle of the sexes, or a debate topic of why it's good or why it's bad. Really, no one is right it's not good or bad. No one is going to agree on anything, so just move on..

 

If you don't like it, don't watch it. If you like it, then watch it. If you don't want a boyfriend that watches porn, then date a guy that doesn't watch it.

 

Simple as that.

[utterer of lies]

I have a question for the men.

 

Would you be bothered if your wife or girlfriend was a porn star presently or in her past? What about a sister, mother, or daughter?

 

If so how? If not, why?

 

I would be bothered, because I don't want them working in some blue-collar bottom-feeder job with no future. They got their education for a reason, why waste it.

 

However, if they were too stupid to have good alternatives (e.g. the alternative positions would be waitress or working in a mall restocking shelves or something like that)... then, well, they are old enough to make their own decisions.

[clv0116]

I have a question for the men.

 

Would you be bothered if your wife or girlfriend was a porn star presently or in her past? What about a sister, mother, or daughter?

 

If so how? If not, why?

 

I've dated ex-strippers, porn stars, webcam girls, and even an ex-hooker. Other than being cute and (for the hooker particularly) really good at sex I didn't judge them differently than anyone else.

 

It's not a good line of work due to the dangers and social stigma, and I'm too jealous to date someone who's currently in those lines of work for very long though. But that's more about me than anything.

[Chicago_Guy]

I have a question for the men.

 

Would you be bothered if your wife or girlfriend was a porn star presently or in her past? What about a sister, mother, or daughter?

 

If so how? If not, why?

 

I think that most men would definitely have a problem with that. I would never get involved with a woman who had been a porn star because it would be impossible for me to look at her and not view her as a whore.

[c-riouz]

There was a woman on another thread who, due to severe personal hardships that included poverty, and a child... earned money in the porn industry. She appeared in video and obviously it was broadcasted on the internet. She also posed nude.

 

She shared how she had turned her life around, found a man who she love and who loved her. Out of fear of being chastised for her past, she withheld this information from her now husband. He used porn.

 

Now, he finds out about it and has a major melt down. The mother of his child doing these things? His wife? The guy flipped his lid and the sad things that she conveyed that were done and said were heartbreaking to say the least. But he uses porn.

 

This woman conveyed how she had wished she had never done it but that at the time she had no other way of providing for herself. She explained that she had to appear on screen to be enjoying it but cried on the drive home afterwards. Now, this woman no longer gives her consent. But she's been paid and the deed has been done. And men are masturbating to this guy's wife and the mother of his child.

 

Some of the porn stars have been very good at what they do and have amassed fortunes. Many of the women have not, however, and their images remain on the screen to be utilized by anyone who chooses to utilize it in whatever fashion they so desire.

 

Now, she is living in the present.. with a husband and a baby and has worked to turn her life around. So when we look at porn there must be some understanding that there may be men and women who did this out of desperation and who no longer give their consent. But they are powerless to object. They don't show you their remorse or tears... or shame.

 

But hey. It is there for enjoyment, right? So why not take advantage of it?

 

My husband knew of my view on porn prior to marriage, was dishonest about it, and did it anyway. And also cheated on me with a woman he knew before we got married. I have had a man sit in the other room transfixed at his computer doing in secrecy the very thing you describe. While I laid in bed. Since, he has been to a psychologist and while I won't get into what was going on psychologically, suffice to say unpleasant crap went down when he was a young boy and it screwed him up.

 

I understand that human beings are human beings. And by virtue of being human there are many desires, draws, impulses, and needs. And people reach to fill the needs in ways that seem to work to squelch the void or aspect of life left unfulfilled. Everyone wants to be loved.

 

I am not a zealot nor do I pretend that standards of absoluteness are something that anyone can attain. Including myself. However, I am brutally frank with myself and when I look upon things and choose to see them for what they are and own them.

 

The absolute is the benchmark for attaining and living in the highest truth. While variations on this truth is human, it doesn't alter the truth.

 

If I fantasize about another man, I've done it in my heart. I own it. I know that my heart and mind are the true reflection of who I am. What I do when no one is looking is who I am. I fool no one.

 

The truth in absoluteness may not be an ideal you hold as something you want to attain. However, if you were to remove all personal attachments to the variations of the absolute ... one can reach only one conclusion. That it isn't absolute. It is a version of absolute.

 

For some, marriages include other people. For them this is preserving their union. But again, a variation.

 

I'm as hopelessly flawed as every other person who walks the face of this earth. However, I am brutally honest with myself and I don't give myself much room to lie to myself. Am I pure? Hell no. But I strive to be pure of heart, anyway.

 

So porn... while entertainment for some, represents other things to others.

 

 

Great post, Gamine. But most men don't want to think about that and could care less if the women in porn were used, not doing it out of "pleasure" or maybe were even forced into it. Men are selfish and only think about themselves, use women as tool to get off and then turn around and call women in porn business "whores" and despise them and talk bad about them, even though they just used them a minute ago, but I guess using women as "whores" to get off to is okay.

[Jersey Shortie]

Well sadly that is ture. I see such ambivlence towards women from men when it comes to porn it is truly disheartening. The only guy here that even commented on Gamine's story pretty much still put the woman down from it.

 

Apparently a man's desire to have a masturbation visual is more important then actually treating women with dignity and respect. Just because there are women that choose to do porn, doesn't make a good man should be promoting it by viewing it.

 

I think that most men would definitely have a problem with that. I would never get involved with a woman who had been a porn star because it would be impossible for me to look at her and not view her as a whore.

 

Thank you for being honest. I also believe most men would have issues. And the real reason men would not like it, the reason that most guys avoid admitting to is because they know the women in those movies are degraded and dispresected. Can you imagine if we treated the whole Jewish population or African American community in the same manner that women get treated in through porn? I mean holy cow! That would be uncalled for. Why is it that it's okay to treat women like they are pieces of crap?

 

And how can men that look at porn look at themselves in the mirror and think they are a worthy man of respect from women themselves? I think it matters more what people do when no one is looking then when they are. Maybe guys show outward respect to women but if a guy is looking at porn that is using women, maybe men don't respect women at all. Because I can't see how men can truly rsepect us if behind closed doors they revel in seeing women used. Funny how men have this weird thing where they do think less of the women in porn, yet they will fight tooth and nail agaisnt their own woman for the right to view porn. And at the end of it, think they are better for it!

 

It's just so freaking frustrating and upsetting the level of obviously disrepect men have for women. Hey guys, guess what? We are people too and it STINKS seeing other women degraded and humilated for your pleasure. It sends a big message about exactly what men think of women and apprently men don't think very much of us at all if they can do the things they do with porn. But who cares about that right? Guys will be guys, wink wink , nudge nudge right? Even if it's at the expense of women it's okay.

[sxyNYCcpl]

It's just so freaking frustrating and upsetting the level of obviously disrepect men have for women. Hey guys, guess what? We are people too and it STINKS seeing other women degraded and humilated for your pleasure.

 

I really debated with myself about asking you this, as I have asked a similar question dozens of times and never received an answer.

 

Just what the heck kind of porn are you watching? (Or, presuming guys are watching?) Because when I watch porn, I see people having sex. I see people having sex pretty much the way I have sex. I see men having sex with women, sometimes I see women having sex with other women, sometimes I see entire groups in a puppy pile. But there is no degradation, there is no humiliation, and while I concede such genres certainly exist, I do not believe it is "mainstream" nor is it something that I consume. By choice.

 

Or, is it that you affiliate sex with degradation and humiliation? That would certainly explain your position here.

 

Oh, and for the record, my SO doing porn, past, present, or future, so long as it was done of her own free will, is not a problem for me in the least.

 

You never define your terms.

 

If you are complaining about Max Hardcore type stuff, guess what, I'm on your side as it is sick and degrading. If you're talking about people having sex, well, that's not.

 

Is a 40-something married couple who films their sexual adventures, and posts it online for interested parties to view degrading to women?

[Gemini09]

I don't think there is anything wrong with watching porn, unless it becomes a huge priority in your life. Personally, when I'm in a relationship, I rarely watch any of it. When I'm single, I will watch it from time to time. I have to say it would bother me if I found out my boyfriend or husband watched it, or watched it on a regular basis. I wouldn't understand that. I don't see the problem, unless it becomes obsessive, as in a porn addiction. In general, I don't approve of porn, because its involves people who do not share any emotional bond. Its purely physical, and that aspect I do not approve of. Regardless, I put that idea aside at times and watch it anyways. I don't really see the harm in it.

[Teslacoil]

Apparently a man's desire to have a masturbation visual is more important then actually treating women with dignity and respect. Just because there are women that choose to do porn, doesn't make a good man should be promoting it by viewing it.

 

Have you ever bought a pair of shoes?

 

Chances are pretty darn good that those shoes were made by people in 3rd world countries who are essentially wage slaves. By buying shoes, you're promoting sweat shops and the idea of keeping people in poverty in order to provide developed countries with inexpensive luxury items.

 

Does that argument make sense? Neither does yours.

 

I treat all women with dignity and respect. Saying that I don't because I occasionally watch porn holds as much water as thinking I support 3rd world exploitation when I buy clothes, or that I support chicken farms when I eat at KFC, or that I support wars in Africa when I buy diamonds.

 

Would I rather diamonds weren't fought over in wars? Sure!

Would I rather clothes weren't made by wage-slaves? Sure!

Would I rather the porn industry wasn't exploitive? Sure!

Would I rather I ate happy, well raised chickens instead of miserable, cooped up, unhealthy chickens? Sure!

[Jersey Shortie]

I treat all women with dignity and respect. Saying that I don't because I occasionally watch porn holds as much water as thinking I support 3rd world exploitation when I buy clothes, or that I support chicken farms when I eat at KFC, or that I support wars in Africa when I buy diamonds.

 

Look, you say yuo treat women with respect, then you treat women with respect. I however stand by questioning how much most men really respect women if behind closed doors when no one is looking, they aren't treating them with respect at all.

 

 

Would I rather diamonds weren't fought over in wars? Sure!

Would I rather clothes weren't made by wage-slaves? Sure!

Would I rather the porn industry wasn't exploitive? Sure!

Would I rather I ate happy, well raised chickens instead of miserable, cooped up, unhealthy chickens? Sure!

 

You rather it but you don't do the things to help ensure it happens. Of course I buy shoes but not all shoes are made in third world countries. Especially the expensive designer shoes I do buy. That would be detrimental to the designer. I also buy free range meats and organic fruits from local farmers. I try not to add fuel to the fire. Am I perfect? No. And I don't ask men to be either. But I ask for some effort. I don't shrug my shoulders and say "well hey I wish these weren't exploitive but since they are I might aswell still enjoy them".

 

 

 

Or, is it that you affiliate sex with degradation and humiliation? That would certainly explain your position here.

 

No that wouldn't explain my position and no, I don't affiliate sex with degradation. I affiliate the type of sex that is protrayed through porn with degradtion. And seriously, I just tested this on my computer. All you have to do is type in the word "porn" and hardcore stuff comes up.

 

The average girl in porn lasts 6 months - year. And in that time frame she is asked to do more and more graphic stuff. There is a high turn over because of how physically tough it is on a woman..and not to mention emtionally. I truly believe that men are more interested in seeing hardcore sex then not. That's what is most popular. And often, hardcore sex is protrayed degradingly for the woman.

[highwind]

I dunno.. I like porn, but I don't get why your bf seems to want to watch it to get "in the mood" :\ i mean..I would rather just jump him and kiss him allover, give him a nice backrub, be gentle and say naughty things :\ maybe a few candles some rose pettles.. maybe greet him on his way home from work wearing nothing but a whipedcream thong..or something, I don't know, but I don't see a reason for porn to put anyone in the mood :\

[Teslacoil]

Jersey, you're so afraid of any kind of comparison with other women, and you think men are somehow lacking in virtue because we do. You've said the same thing in the boobs thread, and other porn threads, etc. You're completely sold on the whole "Barbie Doll is the ideal woman which is perpetuated by the media" concept that you can't get off of it. Every magazine, film, or photo of an actress, porn movie, etc, is all showing us men what the ideal woman is, and thus putting you in competition with an unrealistic image of women that you can't live up to. You resent the fact that that image is out there to compete with, and that men expect you to live up to something you can't. You think most men are scum because we want big boobs, small waists, and air-brushed faces which don't really exist. We simply "settle" for the closest to that air-brushed model we can get, in your opinion.

 

Guess what, some men are dumb and do that think that way. A lot of guys aren't that dumb though. On top of that you should realize that sex sells, and better sex sells better. So what you see in the media is always pushing the envelope beyond what is realistically attainable. To think that belittles you, a normal person, because a magazine wants to sell a few subscriptions more, or coke wants to sell more softdrinks is selling yourself and other women short.

 

I really wonder if you'd be happy with anything other than a world where every woman looked JUST LIKE YOU, so that there would be nothing to compete with, and no woman would have any kind of image to aspire to. There'd be no fashion magazines with airbrushed women for little girls to compare themselves to, no porn except where the porn stars looked just like everyone else, etc.

 

The only other alternative is a world where all men have these magical blinders which prevent them from seeing any woman sexually except that man's partner.

 

I disagree with your premise that "behind closed doors" by consuming porn I am somehow disrespecting women, either the woman I am with, or the women in the porn. I'm enjoying a fantasy, plain and simple, and it doesn't hurt or disrespect anyone. Of course I know you'll disagree with that.

[Vet]

You rather it but you don't do the things to help ensure it happens. Of course I buy shoes but not all shoes are made in third world countries. Especially the expensive designer shoes I do buy. That would be detrimental to the designer. I also buy free range meats and organic fruits from local farmers. I try not to add fuel to the fire. Am I perfect? No. And I don't ask men to be either. But I ask for some effort. I don't shrug my shoulders and say "well hey I wish these weren't exploitive but since they are I might aswell still enjoy them".

 

This paragraph might mean something if you saw any sort of middle ground with regards to pornography. You don't though, so it doesn't. You shrug your shoulders everyday at many pervasive social problems just by virtue of living in the United States. It doesn't make you a bad person, it makes you a person born into this society. Our entire economy and social structure is built on the backs of the exploited. The only thing an individual can do is try to be moral in their personal actions and mitigate the effects their contribution and consumption brings (whether that be buying free range chickens or not watching porn that doesn't hurt people).

 

Your nose is just too high in the air to smell it though. Keep on keeping on. I'm sure someone will care about your fanatical, hypocritical approach to this topic.

[sxyNYCcpl]

I don't affiliate sex with degradation. I affiliate the type of sex that is protrayed through porn with degradtion. And seriously, I just tested this on my computer. All you have to do is type in the word "porn" and hardcore stuff comes up.

 

You are overgeneralizing. There is NO SUCH THING as a single "type of sex that is portrayed through porn" because there are many different genres. You are lumping it all together as though it were all the same. So, for s--ts and giggles, let's create some definitions.

 

Erotica: Imagery that contains nude or partially nude humans, not engaged in any sexual situations but for the fact that they are nude.

Softcore Porn: Imagery that contains sexual situations, but from which the viewer is shielded from the action.

Hardcore Porn: Imagery that contains sexual situations and penetrative sex, in which the viewer is able to see said penetration.

Demeaning Porn: Porn in which women (or whomever) is intentionally degraded. Could include slapping, insulting, spitting upon, what have you.

 

There are others, S&M, fetish, but you get where I am going. I hope. Point is you label it ALL as though it were ALL demeaning porn. Is a playboy centerfold porn as you use the word? Is a 40-YO married couple who tapes their marital bed porn as you use the word?

 

You have over generalized so bad that I honestly haven't got a clue what you mean when you use the word.

 

I truly believe that men are more interested in seeing hardcore sex then not. That's what is most popular. And often, hardcore sex is protrayed degradingly for the woman.

 

How are you defining "hardcore" in this context? To me, as I said above, that word merely means I get to see the action.

[You'reasian]

I think that is pretty key here. And should really be noted doubley or even tripley. Even if women don't mind the porn, or put up with it or don't like it. Not one woman thinks a man is better, stronger, deserving of more respect when he is sitting infront of his computer/tv/magazine pathetically working himself over for the girls in it. I mean that's just the plain truth. Porn is a huge weakness for men. And it makes men look weak. I think at the heart of that men do understand that and that is why they spend so much time trying to defend themselves in light-hearted joking ways about how "virile" they are and "sexual". So virile and sexual now means how many times you can spank it to an image of a woman? Geez, come on guys. Don't you want better for yourselves.

 

The issue seems to be a personal one for you.

 

I don't remember saying that guys picked porn over me. Infact, I remeber saying that I think most men rather pick both the real woman and the porn. It's never a matter of men picking just porn. It's the fact that men choose to not use self-control and want it both ways. They don't really want to be committed to a woman. They want a woman that loves them sure, and real sex. But they also still want a variety of young pretty women on the side. As a woman, it plain sucks. It's like men don't give a crap about us.

 

I do remember being very clear about my issues with porn and my issues with how men engage with porn and view it. To say that porn is my problem and not men is completely ridiculous! If men didn't sell their souls for a couple naked boobs on screen, alot more women would be more willing to work harder with men and actually probably respect them more for it. Porn is the problem dude. And yes so are men. If you can't even admit to that, I have no idea what to tell you. That's kind of sad...

 

What's kind of sad is your defeatist attitude and finger pointing at men.

 

Men aren't selling their souls for a couple of naked boobs on a screen anymore than a woman whose working a plastic device for the same end-game, nothing wrong with either.

 

You claim porn isn't your issue but have gone to great measures to rant about it. Its definitely your issue.

 

Don't want guys to look at porn? Keep em occupied in the sack - if you are attracted to men.

[Jersey Shortie]

Tesla:

Jersey, you're so afraid of any kind of comparison with other women, and you think men are somehow lacking in virtue because we do.

 

I think that some form of competition between men and women is healthy. But I don't think the standard that men have been sold on is. I do worry about the comparisons men make. I never said I was a completely secure creature. There are many pretty women out there. And ususually men are defending their right to view them more then they are trying to understand how freaking hard it is for a girl in this day and age who really wants a healthy, fun sexually adventorous relationship with a man that can infact be happy with jsut her. I don't think men today can be just happy with one woman. And yes, that strikes right at the heart of what every woman from 5-90 wants. A man that thinks she is special enough that he doesn't need other women in his life to slake anything for him. Unrealistic or natural? Has the modern world made us feel that certain needs that really aren't important need to be important. Gratuitous eating is frowned on but gratuitous sex is okay. While I am sure back in the day men had high sex drives, they were not bombared with the images they are today. And that doesn't just affect men. It affects women who want men to love them and think they are beautiful. It's not very satisfying being in a relationship with a man that wants to enjoy your beauty along with anything else he can get his visual eyes on.

 

 

 

Every magazine, film, or photo of an actress, porn movie, etc, is all showing us men what the ideal woman is, and thus putting you in competition with an unrealistic image of women that you can't live up to. You resent the fact that that image is out there to compete with, and that men expect you to live up to something you can't.

 

Yes actually, I sort of do think that. Not 100% exactly but overall yes. I don't feel like women ever get a break. We know there is competition out there and a certain amonut os healthy. But you can't even come home to your guy and be out of the competition now-a-days. Because he has a computer that he can pop on and explore a vast world of more exciting, better looking newer women. As a woman, you don't get a safe haven anymore from the preasures.

 

You think most men are scum because we want big boobs, small waists, and air-brushed faces which don't really exist. We simply "settle" for the closest to that air-brushed model we can get, in your opinion.

 

I don't think men are scum but I think me buy into the fake images presented to them and do infact "settle" for what they can get. And then spend the rest of their lives compensating what they want through something like porn.

 

 

I really wonder if you'd be happy with anything other than a world where every woman looked JUST LIKE YOU, so that there would be nothing to compete with...

 

I have no issue with other women being beautiful. My issue is how men go about handling this, their sexuality and treating women and their relationships all in the same of "being a guy" and that mentality "boys will be boys". Maybe I am wrong but how often do men use self control and how often do they turn to porn to limit their self control?

 

The only other alternative is a world where all men have these magical blinders which prevent them from seeing any woman sexually except that man's partner.

 

I don't expect men to never view another woman sexual ever again. What you don't get is what I am saying is it's the lack of trying I see from guys that hurts. It's all the options out there that men have that the readily devour. What happened to self control? And making your girl number one?

 

I disagree with your premise that "behind closed doors" by consuming porn I am somehow disrespecting women, either the woman I am with, or the women in the porn. I'm enjoying a fantasy, plain and simple, and it doesn't hurt or disrespect anyone. Of course I know you'll disagree with that.

 

Well, you're not the one that has a billion dollar industry that is geared to using men like nothing but objects. WOmen are. Truth is there is no industry equal to porn that treats men to the level and degree that women get treated in it. Women don't spend billions to objectify men. There aren't billions of websites putting men in vunerable compromising situations by hetero-sexual women. So it's really easy for you to say any of that. But I do question men that say they respect women yet can shut the door and use women to best benefit themselves. Or support an industry that, lets be honest, isn't about treating women like human beings. I will say this a third time, can you imagine if we treated the Jewish or African American culture how we treat women in pornogrpahy? That would never be allowed to be. But it's okay to treat women like that through porn. Funny that.

[Jersey Shortie]

What's kind of sad is your defeatist attitude and finger pointing at men.

 

Men aren't selling their souls for a couple of naked boobs on a screen anymore than a woman whose working a plastic device for the same end-game, nothing wrong with either.

 

You claim porn isn't your issue but have gone to great measures to rant about it. Its definitely your issue.

 

Don't want guys to look at porn? Keep em occupied in the sack - if you are attracted to men

 

 

I never claimed porn wasn't my issue. I said that porn AND how men react and use porn is my issue. Previously you tried to make it seem like it was all porn that was my only issue. But considering men make porn, watch porn and are the biggest pushers of it; yeah the two tie together.

 

Why is it my responsiblity to make sure a man doesn't look at porn? I really hate that mentality because you are putting all the weight on the woman's shoulders to police the man. Maybe if HE made more of an effort to engage his real life woman, put the porn down, he wouldn't need the porn to feel happy with himself.

 

And yes, I am feeling defeatist about this issue lately. I can't even bring myself to date because I am so sick of the same problem, different man. Men have taught me they can't be happy with just me. And what's the point in working so hard at trying to make a man happy if he is just goign to keep doing the same old tricks? Darned if I do and darned if I don't. Why waste my effort? The pay-off isn't a more loyal happy man, that's for sure.

[sxyNYCcpl]

I can't even bring myself to date because I am so sick of the same problem, different man.

 

I think your problem with this topic, especially in light of this comment, is just a hair shy of complaining that every man you meet has a penis, and wondering why you just can't find a man who has enough self control to not grow one.

 

Are you planning to address the questions I posed above?

[Vet]

And yes, I am feeling defeatist about this issue lately. I can't even bring myself to date because I am so sick of the same problem, different man. Men have taught me they can't be happy with just me. And what's the point in working so hard at trying to make a man happy if he is just goign to keep doing the same old tricks? Darned if I do and darned if I don't. Why waste my effort? The pay-off isn't a more loyal happy man, that's for sure.

 

This paragraph is so telling.

 

Are you seeing a psychologist, therapist, counselor, something?

[utterer of lies]

Edit: removed flame post because I feel sorry for JS.

[Jersey Shortie]

I think your problem with this topic, especially in light of this comment, is just a hair shy of complaining that every man you meet has a penis, and wondering why you just can't find a man who has enough self control to not grow one.

 

Are you planning to address the questions I posed above?

 

Has nothing to do with complaining that men have a penis.This is ridiculous. Why are you equating penis = in ability to use self control. I love that men are sexual creatures. But there are times when men abuse that and sometimes it's at the price of the women that love them.

 

 

This paragraph is so telling.

 

Are you seeing a psychologist, therapist, counselor, something?

 

It is tellign because I openned myself up in it. Men aren't happy enough with what a woman can give and seek outside stimulation from other women to maintain their happiness. What is the point of a woman working to make her man happy if the result is that he just keeps turning back to the same avenues?

 

By the way, are you seeing a psycologist, therapist, counselor or something?

[Vet]

It is tellign because I openned myself up in it. Men aren't happy enough with what a woman can give and seek outside stimulation from other women to maintain their happiness. What is the point of a woman working to make her man happy if the result is that he just keeps turning back to the same avenues?

 

By the way, are you seeing a psycologist, therapist, counselor or something?

 

Nope, I don't have deep-seated resentment issues with the opposite sex.

[AAlike]

I love that men are sexual creatures.

 

Definite LOL moment of the thread right here!

[sxyNYCcpl]

This is ridiculous.

 

That's what I've been telling you since we first sparred on this topic.

 

Why are you equating penis = in ability to use self control.

 

Why are you equating images = inability to use self control?

 

I love that men are sexual creatures.

 

It does not appear that way from where I am sitting.

 

But there are times when men abuse that and sometimes it's at the price of the women that love them.

 

So now porn use=abuse. You are becoming more and more shrill.

 

Are you planning to address the questions I posed above?

 

I guess you are not. Can't say I am surprised.

 

Men aren't happy enough with what a woman can give and seek outside stimulation from other women to maintain their happiness. What is the point of a woman working to make her man happy if the result is that he just keeps turning back to the same avenues?

 

JS, you are going to have to come to the realization that your value system is different than 99% of the general population. And you can rant and rave online all you want, but you aren't going to change society, if anything I predict we will continue becoming more and more sexually permissive as time goes by, not less.

 

As such, you have either limited yourself to finding a relationship with the 1% that share your values, changing your values to a more mainstream, modern way of thinking, or dealing with relationships knowing your values are different. The first option is very difficult, as the math works against you, the second would seem to me to be the way to happiness, but you seem too closed minded about it. The third will almost certainly lead to heartbreak and drama in the long run, when that inevitable clash occurs.

 

Seeking "outside stimulation" as you call it, simply doesn't bother most people, especially when said stimulation is merely images.

 

I, like you, have values that are outside the mainstream, insofar as I do not value physical monogamy inside an otherwise committed relationship. Like you, I had to either find someone who held similar values, change my way of thinking, or settle for someone who disagreed with my position on that. I got lucky in that I found someone who has a similar value set, and as a result our relationship is f--king amazing!

 

I have no idea how old you are, speculating based on your online persona I'd say 20-something or 30-something. I suspect finding someone that shares your value-set on this, especially within that age range, will prove very, very difficult, but unless you are willing to step back and reassess your position, I recommend very strongly that you take that approach. I think it's your only hope of finding real happiness.