Narcissists

[deux ex machina]

Do narcissists react differently than most do when you break up/divorce them?

 

Do they react differently if you go NC on them?

 

If so, in what ways?

[Tony T]

Do narcissists react differently than most do when you break up/divorce them?

 

Do they react differently if you go NC on them?

 

If so, in what ways?

 

They will initially resist a break up because their supply of goodies is being cut off. Once they see you mean business, they will go away and you'll never hear from them again because they are busy hunting another sucker who will supply them with their wants.

 

You don't have to initiate NC...it's rare they will contact you unless they want something they haven't yet found another source for. They are users of the worst kind and are not able to emotionally bond with anybody. A narcissist could care less if you are dead or alive, except to the extent that you can do something for them...or give them something they need.

 

Narcissists are the worst form of human vermin on the planet.

[Tony T]

Here's an interesting link to details about narcissists: http://www.halcyon.com/jmashmun/npd/howto.html

[deux ex machina]

Tony, thank you so much.

 

I honestly feel like this person sucked out my soul, and the mystery to me is how in the hell did he do it?

 

If there's any insight on that, I'm all ears.

 

 

 

I'm going to read that link right now. Thanks again.

[Starshine Black]

Yes. They do.

 

 

Their initial reaction upon rejection will be to belittle you in every manner possible. They will bring you down to nothing, so that they do not have to face any kind of loss or blow to their ego. You will be ripped to pieces in their eyes.

 

 

If you go NC, they will most likely go insane wondering WHY they're being ignored. They will then do mental gymnastics to explain and protect their fragile ego (believe it or not, narcissists at their very core have EXTREMELY FRAGILE egos). You should expect for them to either contact you ripping you apart, or just nothing at all. Depending on what gymnastics their mind is doing.

 

Ultimately though, your loss is insignificant, as they never loved you to begin with. They love themselves and ONLY themselves. You are nothing to them. Nothing.

 

 

-Thomas Xavier Z

[Trialbyfire]

Tony, I read the entire article and although I agree with the general concept, it's an extreme, very emotional perception of someone with NPD. While I'm sure, some are that bad, the one I married and divorced wasn't so far gone. And yes, OP, he was clinically diagnosed as one, after we separated.

[Starshine Black]

Tony, I read the entire article and although I agree with the general concept, it's an extreme, very emotional perception of someone with NPD. While I'm sure, some are that bad, the one I married and divorced wasn't so far gone. And yes, OP, he was clinically diagnosed as one, after we separated.

 

 

Narcissists rank upon the axis 2 personality disorder tests as between 0 and 120 in the narcissism category. Anything above a 74 is diagnosable narcissist. Was this man you married diagnosed, or are you just assuming?

 

Alas, a narcissist with a score of even 90 can be saved ultimately through the right psychological help. Anything 100+ though, you never had a chance, and never will have a chance with. They are completely gone. The article written, regards a narcissist with a score of I believe between 105-115

[Trialbyfire]

and yes, op, he was clinically diagnosed as one, after we separated.

 

narcissists rank upon the axis 2 personality disorder tests as between 0 and 120 in the narcissism category. Anything above a 74 is diagnosable narcissist. Was this man you married diagnosed, or are you just assuming?

 

Alas, a narcissist with a score of even 90 can be saved ultimately through the right psychological help. Anything 100+ though, you never had a chance, and never will have a chance with. They are completely gone. The article written, regards a narcissist with a score of i believe between 105-115

fyi.......

[Starshine Black]

Ah, read too fast. My apologies.

 

I'm curious what compelled him to seek help though TBF. Most narcissists would not go NEAR a psychologist, unless threatened with the loss of something important, if they do not go. At least none with a score of 90+ would decide on their own to seek help. They already think they're perfect. I could understand if you threatened divorce if they didn't seek help. But AFTER the divorce?

[deux ex machina]

...still reading...

 

The guy I was around? Diagnosed. I'm not some bitter ex Wiki-diagnosing someone. At the time he was getting his masters, if I recall the story correctly.

 

In fact, within 5 minutes of meeting him, he told me, "I lack empathy."

 

Seriously. Just like that.

 

I thought he was messing me about. It sounds crazy now, I know. I'd run today. At the time, it just slid by amongst other topics. The whole diagnosis thing wouldn't come up until later...

 

He has a child. He's a very good father. He cannot even love his own child?

 

 

Just wanted to add: he is VERY paranoid, too. Hand-in-hand? How would this affect NC?

[Trialbyfire]

And yes, OP, he was clinically diagnosed as one, after we separated.

 

Ah, read too fast. My apologies.

 

I'm curious what compelled him to seek help though TBF. Most narcissists would not go NEAR a psychologist, unless threatened with the loss of something important, if they do not go. At least none with a score of 90+ would decide on their own to seek help. They already think they're perfect. I could understand if you threatened divorce if they didn't seek help. But AFTER the divorce?

Fyi, again.

 

I pushed him HARD to go. And yes, he lost something that he valued.

[Starshine Black]

Paranoia is not coupled with narcissism by default. It's possible he is suffering from a Cluster A disorder possibly called Paranoid Personality Disorder, with Narcissism. But no way on Earth I have enough details to tell you that. Just a possibility. Depending on HOW paranoid he is, though, he becomes a potential victim of Schizophrenia (axis 1), and Schizoid Personality Disorder (axis 2). Just throwing the worst possible scenarios out there, though.

 

 

You said something that directly contradicts narcissism though. You said he's a great father.

If he truly were a narcissist, he wouldn't give a damn about his own child. Unless this guy BARELY is a narcissist; as in the cut off point, 74 points, in narcissism.

 

I want you to tell me not how he is with his child. But rather how he was treated when HE was a child. What was his relationship with his parents? And were they divorced? Instead of saying what he lacks, he'd brag about what he doesn't. And a narcissist doesn't lack anything. So he'd be bragging up and down.

 

Was he abused in any way that you know of?

 

Also, it's VERY odd for a narcissist to just go about saying he lacks empathy. That isn't the actions of a true narcissist. Unless he thought that that lack of empathy was a good thing. Did he say it with a twisted grin, or did you get the vibe he was bragging about a lack of empathy?

[borbiusle]

Read that article, like 60% of that stuff applies directly to me, especially the fantasies of grandiose and the static images .

[Starshine Black]

Read that article, like 60% of that stuff applies directly to me, especially the fantasies of grandiose and the static images .

 

 

Don't worry. We all have the symptoms of pretty much every disorder. It's important to understand that disorders aren't given just by having symptoms. Disorders are given based on how OFTEN you have the symptoms.

[deux ex machina]

Paranoia is not coupled with narcissism by default. It's possible he is suffering from a Cluster A disorder possibly called Paranoid Personality Disorder, with Narcissism. But no way on Earth I have enough details to tell you that. Just a possibility. Depending on HOW paranoid he is, though, he becomes a potential victim of Schizophrenia (axis 1), and Schizoid Personality Disorder (axis 2). Just throwing the worst possible scenarios out there, though.

 

 

You said something that directly contradicts narcissism though. You said he's a great father.

If he truly were a narcissist, he wouldn't give a damn about his own child. Unless this guy BARELY is a narcissist; as in the cut off point, 74 points, in narcissism.

 

I want you to tell me not how he is with his child.

 

He is protective of his child. Takes him places all of the time, shows up at school meetings, ect.

 

But rather how he was treated when HE was a child. What was his relationship with his parents? And were they divorced?

 

He said he got "stabbed in the back" a lot, from about age 8 onwards. A prevailing theme, according to him.

 

All he says about his parents is they are quiet, distant. He mentioned his father had a bad temper and when he flew off the handle, it was spectacular.

 

They are divorced.

 

 

Instead of saying what he lacks, he'd brag about what he doesn't. And a narcissist doesn't lack anything. So he'd be bragging up and down.

 

When I first met him, he was just divorced, and down and out. He said he hated himself. At the time. My heart went out to him.

 

Was he abused in any way that you know of?

 

I think the whole dad getting in rages thing was probably intimidating, to say the least. He had an upper middle class suburban nightmare upbringing, like millions of other American males.

 

Also, it's VERY odd for a narcissist to just go about saying he lacks empathy. That isn't the actions of a true narcissist. They would only see themselves as perfect.

 

I know it was odd. Very. He's an eccentric person though. One of the things I was charmed [read: made excuses for] by. He's a brilliant man, IQ and success-wise. Of course, no success is large enough for him.

 

He is one of the strangest people I ever met.

 

Very unpredictable. VERY.

[Starshine Black]

What you are describing is NOT in line with narcissism. How often did he go to a psychologist before diagnosed? As in, how many appointments?

 

Because a narcissist isn't ever down and out. And they don't EVER say they hate themselves. This guy was misdiagnosed, BIG time..

 

The neglect of his parents, backstabbing, rage of his rather, etc. definitely line him up for the worst of the worst disorders. (Cluster B disorders).

 

And what you have described to me is not narcissism.

 

What you're describing is worse.

 

You're describing Antisocial Personality Disorder. Believe me, if I had to pick, I'd marry a narcissist over someone with APD.

 

APD people are categorized by their manipulation, lack of empathy, difficulty with impulsiveness, just no conscience. Many people take the term "Antisocial" from the cluster B disorder literally, and think people with APD are antisocial. It's actually quite the opposite.

 

They're brilliant manipulators.

 

They can destroy you emotionally, eat your soul.

 

But they aren't necessarily physically dangerous.

 

You find someone with the combination of:

 

Axis 1 disorder: Paranoid Schizophrenia

Axis 2 disorder: Antisocial Personality Disorder

 

And you have Jeffery Dahmer, Charles Manson, etc.

[Trialbyfire]

deux ex machina, according to him, was everything everyone else's fault, when he failed at anything?

 

Btw, be careful about diagnosing someone with a disorder. It's not just how many occurrences, it's also the level.

 

You'll find narcissists everywhere. What you won't necessarily find in abundance, are people with Narcissistic Personality Disorder.

 

Someone with NPD is like an emotional vampire. They sap everything out of you.

[Starshine Black]

Read that article, like 60% of that stuff applies directly to me, especially the fantasies of grandiose and the static images .

 

 

Oh, by the way. If you're worried you're a narcissist, you aren't a narcissist.

 

I don't mean you personally, but in general. Narcissists don't ever worry they're narcissists.

[deux ex machina]

^

The guy I am talking about knows there's something wrong with him. He goes through bouts of depression/self-hatred.

 

6 hours later...something bright and shiny comes along and he doesn't hate himself anymore?

 

WTF?

 

 

 

What you are describing is NOT in line with narcissism. How often did he go to a psychologist before diagnosed? As in, how many appointments?

 

I don't know.

 

Because a narcissist isn't ever down and out. And they don't EVER say they hate themselves. This guy was misdiagnosed, BIG time..

 

I think at the time, he really did hate himself. But I've been burned so much by him, I honestly don't know which way is up with this man. So...did he say it to play upon my (well-known) empathic nature? I can't say.

 

The neglect of his parents, backstabbing, rage of his rather, etc. definitely line him up for the worst of the worst disorders. (Cluster B disorders).

 

And what you have described to me is not narcissism.

 

What you're describing is worse.

 

You're describing Antisocial Personality Disorder. Believe me, if I had to pick, I'd marry a narcissist over someone with APD.

 

APD people are categorized by their manipulation, lack of empathy, difficulty with impulsiveness,

 

He's very impulsive. I never could tell what he was going to do next. Still can't. Thus the original questions. I want to know what to expect. For so damn long, I haven't known.

 

I am absolutely exhausted. Seriously. I feel like he turned me into him, almost...I feel like an empty shell of a person at the moment.

 

just no conscience. Many people take the term "Antisocial" from the cluster B disorder literally, and think people with APD are antisocial. It's actually quite the opposite.

 

They're brilliant manipulators.

 

They can destroy you emotionally, eat your soul.

 

How?

 

That's what I want to figure out. The process. I feel as if I can figure out how he did it, I can get past this much easier.

 

But they aren't necessarily physically dangerous.

 

You find someone with the combination of:

 

Axis 1 disorder: Paranoid Schizophrenia

Axis 2 disorder: Antisocial Personality Disorder

 

And you have Jeffery Dahmer, Charles Manson, etc.

 

Thanks for taking the time to help.

[deux ex machina]

deux ex machina, according to him, was everything everyone else's fault, when he failed at anything?

 

Good question. He'll *say* he's taking responsiblity, that it's his fault. But somehow...I never bought it. Just this undercurrent of antagonism toward...whatever. If you get me.

 

Btw, be careful about diagnosing someone with a disorder. It's not just how many occurrences, it's also the level.

 

You'll find narcissists everywhere. What you won't necessarily find in abundance, are people with Narcissistic Personality Disorder.

 

Someone with NPD is like an emotional vampire. They sap everything out of you.

 

I often thought of him as a vampire.

 

I wish I would've never bared my neck in the first place...

 

How long did it take for you to heal from your ex? You sound (and look!) so great today. A testament to your strength.

 

You rock, lady.

[Starshine Black]

It's very difficult to describe their thought process or what stages they enact, because it's relative to the individual and, after all, they are unpredictable by nature. That's one of the symptoms itself.

 

We can throw labels around for another 10 pages... But what's more important is you getting out for your own good. It's important you stop the cycle.

 

I don't think this guy is suffering from Narcissistic P.D. itself, but I do think he has a very serious disorder. For now I'm going to go with Personality Disorder NOS. (Not otherwise Specified). He is showing signs of multiple disorders but not 100% of any single one.

 

But from what I do know, if I had to, I'd lean towards Antisocial P.D.

 

But I just can't look past how you say he's a good, attentive father. If he's really there for his child, and really loves his child, then... I don't know. I'd seriously be stumped. Unless he just broadcasts to the world he's a great father, and it's all really an act to gain leverage, praise, attention etc. which would technically explain why he would go to all the meetings for his child, etc. To appear a good father.

 

 

 

Can you tell me more about how he has stripped away your life? What does he do on a daily basis? How do you two interact? Do you argue often?

[Trialbyfire]

Good question. He'll *say* he's taking responsiblity, that it's his fault. But somehow...I never bought it. Just this undercurrent of antagonism toward...whatever. If you get me.

This is very unusual for someone with NPD to apologize or own up to anything, regardless if it's just lip service.

I often thought of him as a vampire.

 

I wish I would've never bared my neck in the first place...

Break up is painful, no matter what kind. Right afterwards, you wish you'd never gotten involved in the first place. But on the otherhand, how else will you be able to figure out what you really want and need in a partner? And, when you feel a little stronger, remember the good times. There are always good times, which makes most relationships worthwhile to experience, even for a short time.

 

How long did it take for you to heal from your ex? You sound (and look!) so great today. A testament to your strength.

 

You rock, lady.

Since discovery day of his infidelities, it's been 2 3/4 years. It took 6 months after D-day to get rid of 99% of the "him" related issues and another 6 months to completely shake him out of my system. It's taken another year to get rid of the residual trust issues but not all those trust issues can be put into my ex-Hs lap.

 

Thanks, I feel wonderful. Met a wonderful man around Christmas last year and we've been engaged since Feb, getting married next summer.

[deux ex machina]

It's very difficult to describe their thought process or what stages they enact, because it's relative to the individual and, after all, they are unpredictable by nature. That's one of the symptoms itself.

 

We can throw labels around for another 10 pages... But what's more important is you getting out for your own good. It's important you stop the cycle.

 

I don't think this guy is suffering from Narcissistic P.D. itself, but I do think he has a very serious disorder. For now I'm going to go with Personality Disorder NOS. (Not otherwise Specified). He is showing signs of multiple disorders but not 100% of any single one.

 

But from what I do know, if I had to, I'd lean towards Antisocial P.D.

 

But I just can't look past how you say he's a good, attentive father. If he's really there for his child, and really loves his child, then... I don't know. I'd seriously be stumped. Unless he just broadcasts to the world he's a great father, and it's all really an act to gain leverage, praise, attention etc. which would technically explain why he would go to all the meetings for his child, etc. To appear a good father.

 

That's puzzles me as well. He also appeared to really be devasted by his divorce as well...so...he must be capable of love.

 

 

Can you tell me more about how he has stripped away your life?

 

Oh so many ways.

 

The sheer and utter lack of care. If I had to pick one overarching thing that wounded me, I'd say his lack of discrimination (in other words, it wouldn't matter which woman he got attention from, just *anyone* almost. Sometimes. He couldn't seem to pick a spot and stand on it. He made me feel like nothing).

 

The contradictions. I never knew what to believe.

 

That he couldn't seem to mask the boredom. I would speak to him...and he would start to drift.

 

In so many ways, large and small...showing me that I was n-o-t-h-i-n-g.

 

Expendable, easily replaced. Forgotten.

 

Do you have any idea what that does to someone?

 

What does he do on a daily basis? How do you two interact? Do you argue often?

 

Works his ass off. He has a good work ethic, but I think he slacks a lot and feels bad about it. He "whips" himself re: that (self-hate)...so the long hours are partially because he's all over the place sometimes. Plus, his work is very brain-draining and intense. I can understand his tunnel-vision he had about that sometimes.

 

At the end? All we did was fight.

 

I was trying to get him to understand how much he hurt me, so it wouldn't happen again. He knew he was losing me. His reaction to that was to simultaneously go looking for a distraction (which made thing exponentially worse for me, I was a wreck enough, thank you), whilst trying to draw me in the odd occasion,

 

like I was doll he put on a shelf and played with me when he felt like it.

 

Again, it made things worse. Dramatic flameout. The end.

[moo]

Do narcissists react differently than most do when you break up/divorce them?

 

Do they react differently if you go NC on them?

 

If so, in what ways?

 

A narcissist will be completely wrapped up in his/herself. They don't care about how they go about ending the relationship. They may suddenly cut somone off completely. It's all about them. They don't care about the pain the ex partner is experiencing. They may not even break the relationship. They may just cheat and string the partner along, with NO GUILT or REMORSE. A narcissist will twist things around if they are at fault to make the partner feel that he or she is the one at fault.

[deux ex machina]

I HATED his glib b.s., too. I could totally tell he was lying. It made me so fed up.

 

The fact that he would act like bad things never happened. So bloody invalidating.