California Posted August 17, 2009 Share Posted August 17, 2009 Greetings to All.... First time poster, long time reader. I hope you can help. Apologies in advance if this thread should have been posted in the "Getting Married" section, but based on what I have read over here, I believe this is the more appropriate category... My question has to do with the importance of a wonderful sex life in a marriage, versus having "everything" in a marriage...except sex... I am currently engaged to a man who is across the board a dream come true...He is brilliant, elegant, tall, dashing, great manners, wonderful humor, supports me in my career dreams/goals, gives me space, gives me time, is a sportsman, highly cultivated, and shares my outlook on life. We met over the course of work... The problem is, the sexual dynamic is almost zero. He is more attracted to me than vice versa. This does not mean that I do not find him attractive ( I very much do), but I am not feeling that want-to-rip-your-clothes-off feeling that I have known and love. And need....I am beginning to think that the sexual relationship between two people in love is numero uno in a relationship. It is the essence of the male-female dynamic, it is the thrill of life to have that and be head over heels about someone. Yes, you must have the proper companionship aspect, but why should these be contradictory? I am deeply worried that I will end up with a "best friend", one who adores me, but I deeply crave that spark... Yes, I have tried to get things going with him over and over again. I am in beautiful shape, I am in my late thirties, look mid twenties, great body, I take wonderful care of myself. No, no issues of infidelity on his part. He just has a very low sex drive. He reassures me this will come back as he has "stresses" from work. Fair enough, but it has been this way for a very long time. We have known each other five years, then became romantically involved. Now we are engaged with plans to marry in the fall. Meanwhile, an ex of mine has floated back into the scene, from afar. Here too is a man with fantastic things going for him. At the time of our break up, it was because I had moved very far away and, then, we were just at different points in our lives (career). Over the past few years, however, through writing to each other (no affair) and the occasional friendship meet-up, we have become much more mentally, psychologically aligned. A maturation in the same direction let us say. I know he is very fond of me. And to top it off, yes--my sexual memory of him is the most powerful I have known. This is starting to drive me crazy. Furthermore, in the time that I have been with fiance, I have been faithful. Also, I have had a relatively conservative sexual life even as a single, sex and love or at "least" sex and having a long-time bond with a man, are de rigeur for me. So please do not write me off here as simply "bored" or "flakey". My frustrations are acute, and I find myself thinking about my other friend all the time. Any thoughts? Thank you so much for reading,.... California Link to post Share on other sites
RA1 Posted August 17, 2009 Share Posted August 17, 2009 This is an easy one, up to a point. You aren't ever going to be happy with the man you are currently with, your fiance. That is clear from what you said. The hard part is, your sexy ex isn't necessarily the right person either though probably worth a try. It worries me that you and your sexy ex passed each other over way back then because you were at "different points" in your lives/careers. It doesn't seem to me to be love if stage of life/career makes a difference. But as I said, I think it's worth a try. Link to post Share on other sites
Author California Posted August 17, 2009 Author Share Posted August 17, 2009 This is an easy one, up to a point. You aren't ever going to be happy with the man you are currently with, your fiance. That is clear from what you said. The hard part is, your sexy ex isn't necessarily the right person either though probably worth a try. It worries me that you and your sexy ex passed each other over way back then because you were at "different points" in your lives/careers. It doesn't seem to me to be love if stage of life/career makes a difference. But as I said, I think it's worth a try. Thank you very much for your thoughtful response, RA1. I really appreciate it. You make a good point about "life/career" being an excuse, as I have always thought in general. It was more a case, I should have stressed, of our simply "growing on" each other over the years. Seeing each other in a new light, I guess one might say. This remains difficult because life with fiance is adventurous and kind and a new and different world for me. But it is terrible that I pine physically for someone else (who is a highly intelligent, mature man. This is not "sexy" without substance...) This is a new unhappiness for me... California Link to post Share on other sites
redtail Posted August 17, 2009 Share Posted August 17, 2009 etc... This remains difficult because life with fiance is adventurous and kind and a new and different world for me. But it is terrible that I pine physically for someone else (who is a highly intelligent, mature man. This is not "sexy" without substance...) This is a new unhappiness for me... California California, you are not trapped, except by your thinking. You have agreed that you want to marry, but you are not yet married so therefor can make a choice that, in the long run, will benefit you both. Marriage will not ever, ever make a problem "go away". This issue will only compound itself if it is not addressed now, before you take the vows. Personally, I think a candid conversation is in order, one where your "dream come true" knows about your sexual feelings and that you are discontent. He may or may not be able to be there for you. That could be the deal breaker. Honesty going into, and during a marriage is a must, so before you take the leap, make sure. Best of luck to you! Link to post Share on other sites
dunstable Posted August 17, 2009 Share Posted August 17, 2009 I am beginning to think that the sexual relationship between two people in love is numero uno in a relationship. It is the essence of the male-female dynamic, ... You are not alone in thinking that way. It is my view too, and I suspect a lot of people would agree. The problem is, the sexual dynamic is almost zero. ..... This does not mean that I do not find him attractive ( I very much do), but I am not feeling that want-to-rip-your-clothes-off feeling that I have known and love. ... Yes, I have tried to get things going with him over and over again. ... He just has a very low sex drive. Given the fundamental importance of sex to you, and his very low sex drive, it seems clear to me that you are incompatible in that area. This is starting to drive me crazy. ... My frustrations are acute, .... Think how frustrated you would feel over the next decades of married life! Marriage isn't going to make the sex better. It is clear that this marriage if it takes place will be a disaster. The sexual frustration will eat away at you, you will become resentful, little issues that could be easily resolved normally will become big issues because of the underlying resentment, and sooner or later you will divorce over this. I'm speaking from personal experience -- I was with a woman for 23 years (20 of them married) with whom I was sexually incompatible. It was torture for me. It lasted so long only because of children. Link to post Share on other sites
Author California Posted August 18, 2009 Author Share Posted August 18, 2009 Dear Dunstable, Thank you very much for your insights. I suspect your are right. I am sorry to hear that you had lived this very situation. I take your words seriously What is awful is that he is absolutely ideal in so many other ways. But I feel it would be like a "magnificent friendship", lacking this passion. This is very difficult Calif Link to post Share on other sites
WalkInThePark Posted August 24, 2009 Share Posted August 24, 2009 This is an easy one, up to a point. You aren't ever going to be happy with the man you are currently with, your fiance. That is clear from what you said. The hard part is, your sexy ex isn't necessarily the right person either though probably worth a try. It worries me that you and your sexy ex passed each other over way back then because you were at "different points" in your lives/careers. It doesn't seem to me to be love if stage of life/career makes a difference. But as I said, I think it's worth a try. I completely agree. Do NOT get married to a guy who does not satisfy you sexually. It will be a disaster. As far as the ex is concerned, no guarantee that he is the man for you either. Breaking the engagement will be hard; you will have to start all over again. But don't you think it is better to cancel the whole thing now than to go trough a divorce in 2 years time? Link to post Share on other sites
mem11363 Posted August 26, 2009 Share Posted August 26, 2009 Your question was well framed. For background - I am 46, married 20 years and still "actively in love" with my wife. I believe that those who write that marriage is about a deep friendship are half right. A great marriage is about a deep friendship with someone who you physically crave. And my wife and I BOTH crave each other - which is a beautiful thing. We were both committed to keeping the passion alive from the beginning and we have stuck to it. - Stay really fit for each other (she truly has the same body that she did at 26 - very fit/toned) - I am still fit and lift - Manage finances really well to live nicely - but below our income - financial stress kills passion - Be playful with each other - we do this all the time - we banter - we "wrestle" - we delight in correcting each other in an amusing fashion This last piece was a key part of the spark from the start and it has never changed. It is about power and conflict. - We have a healthy amount of respect/fear of each other - so the balance of power is never totally clear cut. On any given day if either party feels sufficiently injured they are able to assert themselves effectively. I cannot have sparks with someone I do not fear at least a little - and I think my wife concurs (fyi: no physical violence is ever used - just emotional violence). Though I would not hesitate to physically rip someones head off if they were threatening my wife. Greetings to All.... First time poster, long time reader. I hope you can help. Apologies in advance if this thread should have been posted in the "Getting Married" section, but based on what I have read over here, I believe this is the more appropriate category... My question has to do with the importance of a wonderful sex life in a marriage, versus having "everything" in a marriage...except sex... I am currently engaged to a man who is across the board a dream come true...He is brilliant, elegant, tall, dashing, great manners, wonderful humor, supports me in my career dreams/goals, gives me space, gives me time, is a sportsman, highly cultivated, and shares my outlook on life. We met over the course of work... The problem is, the sexual dynamic is almost zero. He is more attracted to me than vice versa. This does not mean that I do not find him attractive ( I very much do), but I am not feeling that want-to-rip-your-clothes-off feeling that I have known and love. And need....I am beginning to think that the sexual relationship between two people in love is numero uno in a relationship. It is the essence of the male-female dynamic, it is the thrill of life to have that and be head over heels about someone. Yes, you must have the proper companionship aspect, but why should these be contradictory? I am deeply worried that I will end up with a "best friend", one who adores me, but I deeply crave that spark... Yes, I have tried to get things going with him over and over again. I am in beautiful shape, I am in my late thirties, look mid twenties, great body, I take wonderful care of myself. No, no issues of infidelity on his part. He just has a very low sex drive. He reassures me this will come back as he has "stresses" from work. Fair enough, but it has been this way for a very long time. We have known each other five years, then became romantically involved. Now we are engaged with plans to marry in the fall. Meanwhile, an ex of mine has floated back into the scene, from afar. Here too is a man with fantastic things going for him. At the time of our break up, it was because I had moved very far away and, then, we were just at different points in our lives (career). Over the past few years, however, through writing to each other (no affair) and the occasional friendship meet-up, we have become much more mentally, psychologically aligned. A maturation in the same direction let us say. I know he is very fond of me. And to top it off, yes--my sexual memory of him is the most powerful I have known. This is starting to drive me crazy. Furthermore, in the time that I have been with fiance, I have been faithful. Also, I have had a relatively conservative sexual life even as a single, sex and love or at "least" sex and having a long-time bond with a man, are de rigeur for me. So please do not write me off here as simply "bored" or "flakey". My frustrations are acute, and I find myself thinking about my other friend all the time. Any thoughts? Thank you so much for reading,.... California Link to post Share on other sites
Mr. Lucky Posted August 26, 2009 Share Posted August 26, 2009 The problem is, the sexual dynamic is almost zero. He is more attracted to me than vice versa. This does not mean that I do not find him attractive ( I very much do), but I am not feeling that want-to-rip-your-clothes-off feeling that I have known and love. And need....I am beginning to think that the sexual relationship between two people in love is numero uno in a relationship. It is the essence of the male-female dynamic, it is the thrill of life to have that and be head over heels about someone. Yes, you must have the proper companionship aspect, but why should these be contradictory? I am deeply worried that I will end up with a "best friend", one who adores me, but I deeply crave that spark... Cal, I think your problem is easily solved. Simply tell him what you've posted here, that you care about him and your planned life together but that you're missing that connection. I'd guess that, at the minimum, he'd propose that you postpone the nuptials until you have time to work through this. And he may have to accept that it wasn't meant to be. I'll leave any interaction with your Ex to fate. I just think that you'd be treating your fiance unfairly were you to marry him feeling as you do... Mr. Lucky Link to post Share on other sites
Devil Inside Posted August 26, 2009 Share Posted August 26, 2009 Cali As a man that is married to a women with which we are sexually incompatible let me tell you...don't do it. If you don't have the spark over five years it probably isn't going to happen. Once you are married...you would eventually figure out you wanted more and then you would be in a situation where ending the relationship is really difficult. I feel for you...it is a hard place to be. Link to post Share on other sites
Mr. Lucky Posted August 26, 2009 Share Posted August 26, 2009 As a man that is married to a women with which we are sexually incompatible let me tell you...don't do it. How many women are you married to? ... Mr. Lucky Link to post Share on other sites
Toodamnpragmatic Posted August 27, 2009 Share Posted August 27, 2009 You say you are not sexually excited with your husband, even though he is wonderful in all ways, incredibly attracted to you, then mention how attractive you are (good for you), then the big change-up, you blithely mention that his sex drive is very low (the old blame it on stress)..... The fact that you too worked together for 5 years before getting together is also a red flag and you need to ask why it took so long. I am lost, what is it???? If he has no (or little sex drive) after so little time together, it will only get worse. The fact that you too are not excited, even though he is perfect in every way, tells me the two of you are best friends, are incompatible or need counseling right now..... A clarification is needed as you are coming from a number of directions and none are leading to a happy ending...... Link to post Share on other sites
mem11363 Posted August 27, 2009 Share Posted August 27, 2009 You mention he has a "low" sex drive. Huge red flag. I have done a LOT of reading on this subject. It is true that stress can lower a mans sex drive. However most men who like sex will want sex fairly often when with a partner such as you even if they have a higha amount of stress. I am sure he truly loves you, but if you marry him for SURE you will be sexually starved. And it will eat away at you. And when you ask him about it he will say "sorry it is just work stress", but if you push him on it, he will be thinking "what the heck, she KNEW I was like this before we married - why beat me up on it now". >>>>>>>>> for point of reference >>>>>>>>>>>> I am a 46 year old male in a happy 20 year marriage. In year one I wanted - and usually had - sex with my lovely wife daily. By year 10 we were at maybe 4-5 times a week. Now in year 20, two to three times a week is perfect for me and seems to make wife happy. But we talk about sex regularly - we joke and banter and talk seriously about it almost as much as we actually do it. And occassionally we have a mixed signal and hurt feelings - which get resolved fast and completely because we are so open. You say you are not sexually excited with your husband, even though he is wonderful in all ways, incredibly attracted to you, then mention how attractive you are (good for you), then the big change-up, you blithely mention that his sex drive is very low (the old blame it on stress)..... The fact that you too worked together for 5 years before getting together is also a red flag and you need to ask why it took so long. I am lost, what is it???? If he has no (or little sex drive) after so little time together, it will only get worse. The fact that you too are not excited, even though he is perfect in every way, tells me the two of you are best friends, are incompatible or need counseling right now..... A clarification is needed as you are coming from a number of directions and none are leading to a happy ending...... Link to post Share on other sites
Toodamnpragmatic Posted August 27, 2009 Share Posted August 27, 2009 You mention he has a "low" sex drive. Huge red flag. I have done a LOT of reading on this subject. It is true that stress can lower a mans sex drive. However most men who like sex will want sex fairly often when with a partner such as you even if they have a higha amount of stress. I am sure he truly loves you, but if you marry him for SURE you will be sexually starved. And it will eat away at you. And when you ask him about it he will say "sorry it is just work stress", but if you push him on it, he will be thinking "what the heck, she KNEW I was like this before we married - why beat me up on it now". >>>>>>>>> for point of reference >>>>>>>>>>>> I am a 46 year old male in a happy 20 year marriage. In year one I wanted - and usually had - sex with my lovely wife daily. By year 10 we were at maybe 4-5 times a week. Now in year 20, two to three times a week is perfect for me and seems to make wife happy. But we talk about sex regularly - we joke and banter and talk seriously about it almost as much as we actually do it. And occassionally we have a mixed signal and hurt feelings - which get resolved fast and completely because we are so open. I have to repeat it.... You are a lucky man.... Exactly the same age 46, together 23 years and could only wish it was 2-3 X's a week (and yes like you we do talk about it in a good natured way for the most part).... We never started out with the daily sex, but it has always been good (at leat I think so ), and spouse did often commetn that she couldn't wait 'til she hit that sexual peak (late 30's).... Somehow she skipped that (may be kids) and now it it the damn M word that scares me...... Link to post Share on other sites
mem11363 Posted August 28, 2009 Share Posted August 28, 2009 Let me ask you something. Did you ever ask her to let you play a little game on a night that she is "not" in the mood. The rules of the game are simple: 1. On that night you will not have sex 2. You can touch her anywhere you like except breasts/genitals 3. She has to answer your questions totally honestly 4. The game stops after either some agreed upon time limit or when she speaks the code phrase which is this "amazing - I truly physically desire you right now". The time limit has to be at least 60 minutes. Sometimes you play with 90 minutes. To play the game you dress in shorts and a t-shirt. She wears panties and a t-shirt. You play the game on a night where she is not "tired" - but it is a night where she is absolutely not at all aroused. The basic strategy is simple. First you give her a massage - usually a back massage - for 20 - 30 minutes. The goal of that is primarily for her to relax. After that you switch to her legs - and you gently gradually massage feet (if she likes that - my wife does not), calves, and then back of thighs, inner thighs, and butt. As you get higher up on the inner thighs, or closer to the butt, or on it, you keep asking this: - Pick a spot "further down" and say better 1 - The move higher up and say or better 2 Vary pressure, massage style and keep asking the questions better 1, or better 2. She has to simply honestly answer what feels "better" is more of a turn on. Playing this game will help you "map" her pleasure zones very thoroughly. It MAY - 50/50 also teach her that you are quite able to take her from totally not aroused to super turned on, in a delightful way. Because the key to our frequency is that one fact. My wife is willing to let me relax and then arouse her. I have to repeat it.... You are a lucky man.... Exactly the same age 46, together 23 years and could only wish it was 2-3 X's a week (and yes like you we do talk about it in a good natured way for the most part).... We never started out with the daily sex, but it has always been good (at leat I think so ), and spouse did often commetn that she couldn't wait 'til she hit that sexual peak (late 30's).... Somehow she skipped that (may be kids) and now it it the damn M word that scares me...... Link to post Share on other sites
fooled once Posted August 28, 2009 Share Posted August 28, 2009 Sex ebbs and flows. For ME - at the end of the day - what is more important to me... sex with just someone no sex with the love of my life. That is easy for me. I prefer to live my life with the man I love more than anything. WHEN the sex stops, and it more than likely will as we age and things start to break down, I will still have the love of my life by my side. Can't say that if you are just with a guy for sex. Anyone can have sex; not everyone can find true, sustaining, long lasting love and respect for each other. Link to post Share on other sites
Prarie Posted August 28, 2009 Share Posted August 28, 2009 Hi California, Oh boy, I can totally sympathize with what you are going through. The people that are talking about playing games to spice things up I think are missing the point. You are lacking a very basic physical attraction to your husband. That does not mean that you are not attracted to him in other ways, of course, but that element is so fundamental, I believe, that you will be fighting a losing battle. Doesn't matter how many games you play, or how much lingerie you buy, or how hard you try, you cannot manufacture sexual chemistry or enhance it if it wasn't there in the first place. Some people just won't understand what you are going through because they cannot fathom marrying someone that you aren't sexually attracted to. But I speak from experience. I married a man who I felt was completely wonderful in every other way, except that I wasn't sexually attracted to him. That does not mean that we didn't have sex or that we were unable to satisfy each other. Quite the contrary. But I went into it thinking that I was willing to sacrifice that element to have the rest, because "You can't have it all."... right? If I had to do it over again, I would rather be single/dating for the rest of my life than settle for less than 100%. I am now facing the prospect of divorce (for many reasons, but this is a huge contributing factor). I'm so sorry for what you are going through but I'm glad you are asking the hard questions before you get married. Link to post Share on other sites
violaaa Posted August 28, 2009 Share Posted August 28, 2009 I am 46 and my bf 50. I have strong sexual needs and hope to have it every day but he says that he is too old to have this frequency. I understand his point of concern. I really love him and want to keep our intimacy. What I can do is to masturbate to satisfy my needs whilst reducing the love making to the level that he desires, which is less than twice a week. I feel blue at times but dont know how to handle. What are your opinions Link to post Share on other sites
Toodamnpragmatic Posted August 28, 2009 Share Posted August 28, 2009 I am 46 and my bf 50. I have strong sexual needs and hope to have it every day but he says that he is too old to have this frequency. I understand his point of concern. I really love him and want to keep our intimacy. What I can do is to masturbate to satisfy my needs whilst reducing the love making to the level that he desires, which is less than twice a week. I feel blue at times but dont know how to handle. What are your opinions Again the question is what is normal..... He is 50..... 2 X's a week is not bad if that is consistent and good. Should I ask if you think it should be 5X's a week???? Link to post Share on other sites
violaaa Posted August 28, 2009 Share Posted August 28, 2009 Again the question is what is normal..... He is 50..... 2 X's a week is not bad if that is consistent and good. Should I ask if you think it should be 5X's a week???? I am not blaming him indeed but only needs are needs Link to post Share on other sites
Toodamnpragmatic Posted August 29, 2009 Share Posted August 29, 2009 I am not blaming him indeed but only needs are needs Good luck..... Finding a 45+ yo male who truly wants it daily is no easy feat..... Yes we may say we want it daily, but not sure if that is sustainable.... Would like to try though.... Link to post Share on other sites
mem11363 Posted August 29, 2009 Share Posted August 29, 2009 I am 46. I cannot sustain daily. Not joking either. I wish I could but I cannot. On vacay at the beach - wife hit me daily 4 in a row. Then she had to leave early - LOL - I was relieved to not have to perform a fifth day in a row. Two to three times a week is perfect for me. I can do 4-5 but don't want to. My desire builds for a couple / three days and then sex is really, really fun. Without the "buildup" it just does not feel as good. When I was 30 - even 35 I could go every day no problem. In fact I wanted to - and many, many weeks my loving wife was agreeable to doing the daily connection. But that was a long time ago Good luck..... Finding a 45+ yo male who truly wants it daily is no easy feat..... Yes we may say we want it daily, but not sure if that is sustainable.... Would like to try though.... Link to post Share on other sites
giotto Posted August 29, 2009 Share Posted August 29, 2009 I'm 46 as well... I could not have it daily... maybe twice a week, but not daily... Link to post Share on other sites
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