My Husband is friends with a married woman

[zilgurl]

You know H was angry as i shared these posts and said Id only given a snapshot of information. H has stated that OW is "just a good friend" and Im being "controlling" for being upset and trying to put boundaries in. I closed my business down 12 months ago and I lost my way and I think I became less stimulating to H so OW turned up and was supportive of H. H says both OW and her H are friends of his but I dont hear as much about him as her although my H completely not saying anything anymore about OW. Not saying if hes heard from her or anything. Shes supposedly in another country now. Who would know ???

My H is still looking for somewhere to live and things are very amicable at the mo. We are actually getting on better than ever but he says he doesnt love me enough to stay in th marriage- so sad. Found some great quotes recently

 

-When we are no longer able to change a situation – just think of an incurable disease such as inoperable cancer – we are challenged to change ourselves

• Woe to him, when the day of his dreams finally came, found it to be so different from all that he had longed for!"
  

• "We were not hoping for happiness – And yet we were not prepared for unhappiness."
  

• "Live as if you were living already for the second time and as if you had acted the first time as wrongly as you are about to act now!"
  

I find these very apt for the situation Im in. Im keeping strong in myself. Hard yes but I have ahealthy love of self.

[bentnotbroken]

He's a liar. I would bet money her H doesn't know as much as he says he does. I would inform him and the proper licensing authorities about their "friendship". You seem relieved.

[zilgurl]

Her H now shares the same email address. Im not going to stoop to hairpulling and eye gouging. Thats not constructive or usefulo.

What Ive done is lodged a formal complaint about her actions to the professional body she belongs to in this country. At some stage whether now or when she comes back she will have to deal witha formal complaoint against her. She has clearly and foolishly crossed boundaries between her professional capacity and her private capacity.

No Im not resigned to it- I still hope for an outcome where we can work it out but the reason I sound like Im resigned is because Im not into controlling him and trying to make him love me more if he doesnt. Once hes gone then he may or may not feel like hes made a mistake. Who knows what will happen. Im not prepared to close the door just yet but Im just not going to act like a control freak- Ive had enough of being accused of this when I see it as boundary setting.I dont think that throwing away 31 years can be that easy. Maytbe he can do that but I find it hard.

[blueintheface]

That's the Kirk Cameron movie. It has the worst acting I have ever seen.

 

I guess i don't want to see the movie anymore.

 

 

You know H was angry as i shared these posts and said Id only given a snapshot of information. H has stated that OW is "just a good friend" and Im being "controlling" for being upset and trying to put boundaries in.

 

I think it is the culture we are in. Boundaries are a personal decision and where we put them up is dependent upon the individual. I've been taught by my family where to put up boundaries but a lot of people i believe have not. I think your husband does see only a friendship with OW and technically there is no real tangible evidence of wrongdoing. However, i have seen people who undermine others and based on what you have said this is definitely the case. It is a fairly simple psychology that when you validate a person's negative views it's like a green light for a landslide of negativity. What i think you should talk to your H about is that if this OW were a friend or therapist you and H would be working out your problems amicably or separating amicably and not having additional issues thrown in. Actually maybe you shouldn't mention OW at all since she really iss inconsequential in the scheme of things.

 

Also, as his partner, you should be the number 1 priority in your H life. It doesn't matter if you are being controlling. You needed the reassurance and your H should have put up those boundaries. I'm assuming your problem is with this couple only and not with your H other friends. I'm also assuming you don't constantly demand him give up friendships. I also wonder about the feelings you H had and didn't tell you about. If your relationship is worth saving then maybe you need to start showing him he is worth chasing. Maybe he needs the validation that he is desirable. Because right now i think you are asking him to give up things he sees as important (which in reality are not) without any giving. Ask him out on a date (so you would pay) where you don't talk about any of the problems. Just get to know him again. Does he still like the same things. Do you? If your relationship is worth even a nickel, you would fight for him.

 

And just as a sidenote, even if he doesn't see anything wrong with OW relationship right now, it might take 10 years before he sees the situation clearly. I have found on average it takes at least a decade before a boy admits he's wrong.

[TaraMaiden]

(. . .)Im not into controlling him and trying to make him love me more if he doesnt. Once hes gone then he may or may not feel like hes made a mistake. Who knows what will happen. Im not prepared to close the door just yet but Im just not going to act like a control freak- Ive had enough of being accused of this when I see it as boundary setting.I dont think that throwing away 31 years can be that easy. Maytbe he can do that but I find it hard.

 

 

(. . .) as his partner, you should be the number 1 priority in your H life. It doesn't matter if you are being controlling. You needed the reassurance and your H should have put up those boundaries.

 

Zilgurl, you really need to take note of this and see the common sense and logic in this.

If anyone is being controlling, it's him.

 

This is a conclusion I have had to come to terms with, in my own relationship.

My partener - whom I absolutely crushingly love - is passive-aggressively controlling, and I realise that he bullies his way through accessing my 'guilt', "anything for the quiet life" triggers.

This is something I have to regain control of for me, because otherwise I'm going to find myself taking it all on the chin, to just put up with it.

Can't be done.

Shouldn't be done.

He has no right to expect that simply because he says it's like it is, that it is like it is.

It ain't.

It takes two to establish boundaries, compromise and to come to an agreement.

Otherwise, the person who states that 'you're being controlling' - is in control.

[freestyle]

I wonder if this would get through your H`s fog:

 

"Honey, how would YOU feel if I developed a close friendship with a man

and you found out that we were discussing all of your shortcomings in your absence?"

 

"How would YOU like being put on trial when you`re not present to speak in your own defense?"

 

How would YOU feel if you saw emails written by me to my friend that

bashed you...........and that I signed,..."love, from............" ?

 

Sometimes people can`t comprehend the pain they`re causing until they

can imagine having the experience themselves.

[freestyle]

((((((((((zilgurl))))))))))................just a cyberhug........I know your heart is breaking right now, and my heart goes out to you. We`re here when you need us.

[zilgurl]

I cried when I saw you hugs. I dont have anyone that I can rush of to easily and get physical hugs. We havent told our kids yet and I know that one of them suspects something because he rings me every day to see how I am. H want us to be together when we tell our kids and Im really struggling to keep it together. I switch from being angry to sad, then analytical, then back again- round and round it goes.

 

Yes I still love him heaps but the heartache is that he says he doessnt love me the same as I love him. How can you switch off love after 31 years.. I feel so confused. he still says he loves me, still kisses me goodbye, Still kisses me hello, still gives me voluntary, hugs, still rings me or emails me every day when hes away and closes with I love you too, still makes love to me, still connects and talks with me, which makes me love him even more. I just don't understand it. I get mixed messages. We are having more sex than ever which seems bizarre for a man who says he doesnt love me. as much as I love him. I believe that when he has a lot to do with OW he is distant but since shes left hes being more attentive toward me. I'm still confused.

[zilgurl]

I wonder if this would get through your H`s fog:

 

"Honey, how would YOU feel if I developed a close friendship with a man

and you found out that we were discussing all of your shortcomings in your absence?"

 

"How would YOU like being put on trial when you`re not present to speak in your own defense?"

 

How would YOU feel if you saw emails written by me to my friend that

bashed you...........and that I signed,..."love, from............" ?

 

Sometimes people can`t comprehend the pain they`re causing until they

can imagine having the experience themselves.

 

I have done this and he says he'd be fine with it. Of course as it justifies him doing this. They weren't just-"love from" they were - "Stay in close touch", "Lots of love" "Of course I will miss you"...... "Won't be the same coming to....if your not going to be there....." The only person thats lying to themselves is H.

Im not stupid. All emotional contact was withdrawn at the peak of their daily emails.I knew something was wrong but didnt know at the time until I discovered the intimate nature of their close emails to each other. Not sexual but none the less intimate. Daily sharing of their days, their dreams, their fears, their ideas- stuff that I never had the privilege of discussing with my H.

 

Im in contact with a male online counsellor on a regular basis and Im sharing his responses with H and sometimes he doesnt like what he says but Im determined to be totally honest and open. I never want to put him through the pain and agony Ive had to go through.

The counsellor says that his agenda is different to H & OW agenda. OW & H were establishing a "friendship" and I ended up as the topic of their disscussion. My counsellor does not have that same agenda. He is there to support us both which is why I show H my emails from counsellor. Counsellor has a great philosophy. If I cant say it to the world about someone then dont say it all and other statements ( got it off here I think) if it cant be said as if spouse is sitting beside you then dont say it at all.

[zilgurl]

I guess i don't want to see the movie anymore.

 

 

 

 

I think it is the culture we are in. Boundaries are a personal decision and where we put them up is dependent upon the individual. I've been taught by my family where to put up boundaries but a lot of people i believe have not. I think your husband does see only a friendship with OW and technically there is no real tangible evidence of wrongdoing. However, i have seen people who undermine others and based on what you have said this is definitely the case. It is a fairly simple psychology that when you validate a person's negative views it's like a green light for a landslide of negativity. What i think you should talk to your H about is that if this OW were a friend or therapist you and H would be working out your problems amicably or separating amicably and not having additional issues thrown in. Actually maybe you shouldn't mention OW at all since she really iss inconsequential in the scheme of things.

 

Also, as his partner, you should be the number 1 priority in your H life. It doesn't matter if you are being controlling. You needed the reassurance and your H should have put up those boundaries. I'm assuming your problem is with this couple only and not with your H other friends. I'm also assuming you don't constantly demand him give up friendships. I also wonder about the feelings you H had and didn't tell you about. If your relationship is worth saving then maybe you need to start showing him he is worth chasing. Maybe he needs the validation that he is desirable. Because right now i think you are asking him to give up things he sees as important (which in reality are not) without any giving. Ask him out on a date (so you would pay) where you don't talk about any of the problems. Just get to know him again. Does he still like the same things. Do you? If your relationship is worth even a nickel, you would fight for him.

 

And just as a sidenote, even if he doesn't see anything wrong with OW relationship right now, it might take 10 years before he sees the situation clearly. I have found on average it takes at least a decade before a boy admits he's wrong.

 

Yes agree with your comments I'm assuming your problem is with this couple only and not with your H other friends. I'm also assuming you don't constantly demand him give up friendships. Not at all. I dont have a problem with other friendships. My problem is with the intimate nature, the isolation of me, the conversations about me without permission or knowledge, the daily sharing of their personal lives to the exlusion of me, the daily sharing of their secret fears, dreams thoughts, ideas etc ( & it is only OW not her H that had these intimate emails).

If your relationship is worth saving then maybe you need to start showing him he is worth chasing. Maybe he needs the validation that he is desirable. Im doing as much as I can. Keeping the connections & comunications up, welcoming physical intimacy and suggesting trips away. Looking nice etc. I cant make him love me any more though. That feels like Im giving up/ compromising my inner essence in order to make someone love me. Loving myself is first priority and from there other relstionships will flow. Ive acknowledged there was some lack in the relationship but neither of us knew what to do about it at the time and H maintains thats why he went to OW to discuss but it crossed boundaries beause she/he then turned it into something else. I think its interesting to note that when he began discussions about me it quickly turned from a collegial- friend relationship to something else far more intimate and I was nitpicked everytime he came back from her place. Wonder why that is... any thoughts on that?

[TaraMaiden]

Because he became emotionally involved, viewed her as a pseudo-wife and saw qualities in her he did not see in you. so when he obtained supportive and concurring feedback, his comparison put her in a better light - and illuminated you unfavourably.

Upon his return, he aired your failings because he perceived her to be the more favourable sidekick.

 

I would think.

[zilgurl]

I can only come to that same conclusion. Of course OW spoke favourably of him and he to her.

 

I think Ive put these somewhere on this post how they bolstered each others egos. eg "I think what I enjoy about the way you and I talk is that we both have some knowledge of communication and dynamics and we can talk and explore in a way that becomes powerful and creative.......You have an amazing sense of being present to people and of holding the space for presence to emerge. It is a beautiful quality and I enjoy it a lot. I still remember that 10 days we had and the conversations we shared. They were a very special 10 days for me.....I guess by the time Im back in ...... you will both be gone. It wont be quite the same and thats a bit sad........ Bye for now and Lots of Love .. " The email goes on but Im sure Ive put other bits on here somewhere. She replied in kind

[zilgurl]

Conversely in a couple of emails I found them discussing me and my mothers communication in a derogatory fashion. H called it prattle, then splashing around and told OW that he is "losing the will to live" ( in this environment) and she replies with "Oh how I laughed at your description of ? .. and her mother and the prattle and splashing around. I loved your line about drifting off and losing the will to live! I have to admit that being in the prattling environment you described..?.. in the middle of Winter, would have me thinking of the quickest way to do myself in....I am no good at prattle or splashing around at surface level stuff for any length of time so I really feel for you......Take good care of yourself and keep up the writing, Love..."

[TaraMaiden]

Keep these e-mails. they will support your complaint against her to the professional body.

This is about as far removed from the kind of discussion a counsellor should be having with anyone who approaches them for support.

 

Horrendous....

 

I cannot begin to imagine what effect this must have had on you living in the midst of it all.

[zilgurl]

Of course when you speak about your spouse in this fashion to another woman of course you going to hide it. Its nothing but sheer nastiness and gossip. He denies its nasty.

On the one hand bolstering each other and on the other finding fault with me- what else would one take from this, coupled with the nitpicking when he came home each time. I just wish he would own up and see how awful it has been and painful for me. I see it as- Ive been betrayed. He denies hes betrayed me as well. I feel that betrayal has come because of the way he has discussed me, laughed about me, picked on my weaknesses and done this with her all hidden and secretive, all the while each holding the other in high regard.

 

He justifies his comments and hers -re prattling by saying that it was just that and thats what "you were doing." Don't get that. So what if I was making small talk with my Mum. I was still connecting and being close with her. She was so happy for me to stay with her as it had been such a long time. So does that mean it gives him the right to gossip??? I havent visited my Mum at her place for about 3 years. He comes back with - "Well I paid for you to go there coz I knew you hadnt visited woth Mum for a long time....." If I were caught out on that one I would not only apologise to the offended party but Id go back to the other person colluding in the situation and take ownership and say that it was unacceptable Id feel guilty if I was pulled up on that. I would unreservedly apologise. That would be the mature thing to do but all I see is justifications, minimisations and denial. Im vacilating between sad and anger- this one is definitely anger. Wish H could understand this. He thinks Im out to "blame and shame him" because Im upset and angry still about all this. Its like I dont have a right to be upset about it all.

[zilgurl]

Sounds ominous but will have a look.

[TaraMaiden]

I'm sorry.

Forget plan B, dark or otherwise.

 

Just cut off all contact, tell him to go and stuff his head up a dark & smelly place and give him a taste of his own medicine.

Start being just a tiny bit harder, just a little bit meaner.....

 

Kick him to the kerb and discuss nothing more with him.

Don't keep going over stuff, analysing and re-living it.

Once was enough, surely!

The only effect it's having is to keep ripping the scab off and keep the wound bleeding.

[zilgurl]

It's nothing like that. It's you removing yourself from "harm" and not feeding him the emotional needs that he need.

 

A dark Plan B is probably the only way to safe your marriage and/or yourself.

I responded to your email but it bounced back twice.. Had problems registering

[zilgurl]

Yes inclined to agree. Im getting such mixed messages its so confusing.

[2sunny]

I cried when I saw you hugs. I dont have anyone that I can rush of to easily and get physical hugs. We havent told our kids yet and I know that one of them suspects something because he rings me every day to see how I am. H want us to be together when we tell our kids and Im really struggling to keep it together. I switch from being angry to sad, then analytical, then back again- round and round it goes.

 

Yes I still love him heaps but the heartache is that he says he doessnt love me the same as I love him. How can you switch off love after 31 years.. I feel so confused. he still says he loves me, still kisses me goodbye, Still kisses me hello, still gives me voluntary, hugs, still rings me or emails me every day when hes away and closes with I love you too, still makes love to me, still connects and talks with me, which makes me love him even more. I just don't understand it. I get mixed messages. We are having more sex than ever which seems bizarre for a man who says he doesnt love me. as much as I love him. I believe that when he has a lot to do with OW he is distant but since shes left hes being more attentive toward me. I'm still confused.

 

 

well no wonder! nothing has really changed. he may have moved or is getting ready to move - but you continue to reward his bad behavior.

 

sex? why? huge reward for him!

i love you? why? huge reward for him!

constant contact? why? he can take his energy love and whatever else he thinks he has to offer a woman and dump it all on the OW... just like he wanted...

 

if nothing changes - NOTHING CHANGES! at this juncture it cannot stay the same - it's not possible or you will go crazy!

 

you are acting like everything is perfectly happy and normal! CUT HIM OFF! all contact! THEN he may be a bit more motivated to change his ways or allow you to move forward. the way it is now - it just looks all the same as before - except you called him out on the cheating. big deal! NOW WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO ABOUT MOVING FORWARD... FOR YOU?

[TaraMaiden]

That's Plan FU, followed after Plan B. But, right now, she needs a short Plan A and then follow by a Plan B, for HERSELF.

 

I bet you don't even know how those plans work. If so, don't advice her to do something or not to something, okay?

:laugh:

 

fair enough!

I just think she needs to cut all the surplus shyte...

the two above posts just make me amazed...

I missed that they're still having sex!

Lordy, talk about having cake, eating it and getting away with murder - Ing the marriage, that is.....

 

Unbelieveable...

Zilgurl, you have to cut it all off from him, deprive him of this satisfaction - f**king you AND f**king you OVER....

 

Stop everything, and refuse to play his game any more....sheesh, there you were, all sorted having a spa bath and being pampered.... and suddenly, he's getting it all ways...??

oh please, come on.....!

[zilgurl]

in most areas - she has crossed the ethical line for her job. you couls slap her with a lawsuit before she leaves... that would alert her husband of a problem.

 

also, he is going to pick up the car? what a joke... who does he think he's kidding? and of course he didn't invite you - he wouldn't be able to do with her one last time what he wants to do.

 

i would tell him if he goes - don't bother coming home. have the locks changed... evidently this woman and a car are worth the risk of your marriage - from his perspective.

 

put your foot down. his actions say that he doesn't care about you at all.

 

he's willing to go without you knowing it puts your marriage at risk and hurts you as well... that's not how a loving husband acts - that's how a selfish, self centered boy acts when he wants his own way - and wants everyone to act like it's all ok. :sick:

 

throw him out.

yes I think it is unethical and I wrote a formal complaint to her professional association but they replied that it was a personal; situation and they could do nothing.

[zilgurl]

well no wonder! nothing has really changed. he may have moved or is getting ready to move - but you continue to reward his bad behavior.

 

sex? why? huge reward for him!

i love you? why? huge reward for him!

constant contact? why? he can take his energy love and whatever else he thinks he has to offer a woman and dump it all on the OW... just like he wanted...

 

if nothing changes - NOTHING CHANGES! at this juncture it cannot stay the same - it's not possible or you will go crazy!

 

you are acting like everything is perfectly happy and normal! CUT HIM OFF! all contact! THEN he may be a bit more motivated to change his ways or allow you to move forward. the way it is now - it just looks all the same as before - except you called him out on the cheating. big deal! NOW WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO ABOUT MOVING FORWARD... FOR YOU?

Totally agree now and at the moment hes staying in another city and emailing me and Im not answering. He moves out next Tuesday so Im making plans to not be here when that happens.

[TaraMaiden]

Well make sure somebody is... You never know just what he might try to get away with.

Not only destroying your marriage, but destroying your stuff and property.

And don't come back and say "Oh no, it's ok, I'm sure he'd never do that...."

 

You were sure he'd love and honour you until death did you part, when you got married, weren't you?

 

Protect yourself.

[MistyK]

yes I think it is unethical and I wrote a formal complaint to her professional association but they replied that it was a personal; situation and they could do nothing.

 

yeah, I'm not sure why anyone advised you to do this because it's ridiculous. Unless he was a client of hers (and based on what you worte, he was not), she is not bound by professional standards in terms of her conduct with him.