Inside The Mind of a Cheater

[Devil Inside]

Ladies...breaks my heart to read of your abusive pasts...but also makes me admire the women you have become despite the pain.

 

Also, makes me sad that I am just another man...taking advantage of the trust that both my wife and xOW gave me.

[Devil Inside]

Yes, I've read this too.

 

There is a specific type of marriage counseling called IMAGO, that deals with this issue in both partners.

 

Actually I remember reading Harville Hendrix's first book on this a long time ago. It made sense from what I remember and there are exercises in the book to do as a couple...maybe it;s time to dust ot off and work the exercises with my wife.

[Devil Inside]

So insight for the day. Time to let mom off the hook. In typical Freudian fashion time to look at the other parent...dear old dad.

 

My father was my male role model for romance, love, and sex. He had at least three affairs that I know of. Looking back I think he had a sex addiction.

 

He raised my sister and I as a single dad from the age of twelve on. I remember a revolving door of women. He is pretty good looking and suave. The kind of guy where you would go to breakfast, he would hit on the waitress, and the next morning you would see her slipping out the back door early in the morning.

 

The women he chose were usually very good looking. and younger. I think I saw that women were to be chosen for physical or sexual characteristics. Also that there were many women out there...and if it didn't work out with one...there was always another. Also that much value as a man was derived from "success" with women.

 

Ahh looking at this, and my mommy issues....makes sense I am such a freaking mess.

[MistyK]

I remember a revolving door of women. He is pretty good looking and suave. The kind of guy where you would go to breakfast, he would hit on the waitress, and the next morning you would see her slipping out the back door early in the morning.

 

 

So how did this make you feel about your dad? My xSM's father cheated too. He recalls the experience of his dad temporarily moving out and his mom freaking about the A as very traumatic. He lost a lot of respect for his father. Yet, he repeated the same behavior. I can think of other posters - like Notsure7 - who said they had similar experiences of hating their father's cheating behaviors, but doing it anyway.

 

Is this a case of trying to recreate the past and change the ending? (for you: My dad cheated unashamedly, and although I cheated too, I will make it right, unlike him).

 

My xSM was emotionally walled off at times, and in many ways he reminded me of my father, for whom I felt I always had to fight for affection. It's possible that I picked SM to recreate my father and try to finally "win" his affection.

 

Likewise, SM's W is histrionic, addicted to drama, and seeking to be taken care of - just like his mother. He never felt close to his parents, they were not affectionate and maybe in picking the W like his mother he hoped to finally gain the affection he never got from his actual mother.

[MistyK]

Ahh looking at this, and my mommy issues....makes sense I am such a freaking mess.

 

Still with my junior anlyst hat on: Do you suppose that your reluctance to leave your M even though a big part of you wanted to is the result of the abandonment issues you have with your mom, and less about the M itself?

 

M is "safe" and when you have a fear of abandonment (particularly centering on women), I can see where it would feel almost impossible to throw away that security blanket. And, since you felt needed by your W, you could feel secure that she would not dispose of you. Yet, this OW, being more independent was maybe scary to you because she was more independent and therfore you might have thought you were more disposable to her.

 

When I married my xH, I really married security. It wasn't about him - I didn't have passion for him and it was really not for the right reasons. In xSM, I got everything I had been missing except the security. And in the span of time as an OW, I came to realize how important that security really is to me. What good is love and passion when you live in constant fear of losing it, or in some ways, never fully having it? Either way, something is missing for me....I wonder if I will be able to find both within one person someday.

[drmcdreamy]

We both fulfilled plenty of roles for each other.

 

She needed me. She admired my intellect. She admired my sensitivity. She wanted my body. She loved and accepted me. She allowed me to be vulnerable with her. She fulfilled all my sexual desires and then some.

 

I was a new kind of man for her. She grew up in a small town that was very old fashioned. Men are men, women are women, and everyone plays their role. Then I come along. I'm a man that speaks about my emotions. I listen to her. I tell her how I feel about her. I write her poems. I am an active parent. I clean house. I am different from any man she's been with...even down to the fact that I am not Caucasian. I grew up in an urban environment...I like art. At the same time I am a guy...I like football, I lift weights, I make her feel safe. I also allow her to tell me what she wants in bed, and don't let my ego get bruised when she tells me what she wants. So I fulfilled several roles for her.

 

Devil Inside,

 

(saw your post to a question on mine. Now my turn to write on your post ...)

 

Are you ME!? My God. I didn't make it to the end of the thread because everything sounded so similar, and then I got to what you wrote above, and I just couldn't stand it anymore! (except I'm Caucasian).

 

Why did I have an affair? I don't know for sure, but I can throw out a lot of suggestions ...

• I had never been with any woman besides my wife (of 20 years) and wondered if I had missed out on something
  
• I was jealous of all the surveys in magazines saying the average guys has been with x women, and x isn't 1!
  
• Boredom with the routine of daily life, long marriage
  
• Selfishness
  
• Mid-life crisis, feeling no sense of self worth, looking for it through another relationship
  
• Along comes a really nice, really attractive co-worker (10-years-younger) who is going through her 2nd divorce from the 2nd jerk she married - turns to me for comfort - says she wishes she could meet a guy like me (smart, attractive, cares for his family, 'perfect' husband and father (other than the affair that followed))
  
• Excitement, exhilaration
  
• Etc, etc.
  

It's all the same things you've been writing. She said she thought she could never trust a man again after how she had been hurt. Even before her divorce, all the guys in the building would hit on her to the point that she had to turn two over to H.R.! I was the guy who (although I lusted her) always treated her with respect and dignity. She trusted me, she turned to me when she couldn't trust any other man, she admitted that she cared for me and thought I was attractive, and we were off to the races! We both said it wouldn't last forever, and then she met another man (a good man this time), and moved on. She thanked me for making her feel like all men weren't scum and for making her comfortable dating again. I guess I did a good thing (for her), but it hurts like hell that she moved on.

 

What did I get (besides the things listed above, incuding wonderful passionate love and sex?) I felt good, I felt worth, because I was making her feel good. In my profession I sacrifice myself to care for others, but that makes me feel fulfilled. The same thing happened here. In fact, sometimes the physical (and emotional) was tilted her way (she was getting more than I was), but I told her (honestly) that what gave me the greatest satisfaction was making her feel satisfied emotionally and physically - it's true. (o.k. - I did like the reciprocation too, I admit). My wife supports me, but it's different when a new person puts you up on the pedestal and tells you that "you saved them". It's hard to beat that rush.

 

I still love her, I still lust her, and I wish she still needed me, but she doesn't. And now I'm back to my mid-life crisis again, still trying to figure out what I'm doing in this world.

 

I've been thinking about what you posted on my post (about going no contact). I guess the more I think about it, the more I realize you are right (99% of people can't be wrong, and that's the only advice I get - NC), but I'm in so much pain, so much pain.

[Devil Inside]

So how did this make you feel about your dad? My xSM's father cheated too. He recalls the experience of his dad temporarily moving out and his mom freaking about the A as very traumatic. He lost a lot of respect for his father. Yet, he repeated the same behavior. I can think of other posters - like Notsure7 - who said they had similar experiences of hating their father's cheating behaviors, but doing it anyway.

 

Is this a case of trying to recreate the past and change the ending? (for you: My dad cheated unashamedly, and although I cheated too, I will make it right, unlike him).

 

My xSM was emotionally walled off at times, and in many ways he reminded me of my father, for whom I felt I always had to fight for affection. It's possible that I picked SM to recreate my father and try to finally "win" his affection.

 

Likewise, SM's W is histrionic, addicted to drama, and seeking to be taken care of - just like his mother. He never felt close to his parents, they were not affectionate and maybe in picking the W like his mother he hoped to finally gain the affection he never got from his actual mother.

 

How did I feel about my dad cheating...well just like you described. I hated it. I lost respect for him. I thought he was a hypocrite whenever he tried to tell me about not lying and honesty. I was very critical of anyone who cheated all through high school, college, and up until my wife did it. The I did too.

 

I probably am trying to recreate the past with a new ending. I guess the only thing that has been different is I didn't divorce my wife. When he left my mom, he moved out of state...which set up the situation where we ended up with my dad, and lost the chance at a close relationship with mom. My wife would move to be with her parents out of state if we divorce...so I didn't want my kids to be put through the same thing.

[MistyK]

How did I feel about my dad cheating...well just like you described. I hated it. I lost respect for him. I thought he was a hypocrite whenever he tried to tell me about not lying and honesty. I was very critical of anyone who cheated all through high school, college, and up until my wife did it. The I did too.

 

I probably am trying to recreate the past with a new ending. I guess the only thing that has been different is I didn't divorce my wife. When he left my mom, he moved out of state...which set up the situation where we ended up with my dad, and lost the chance at a close relationship with mom. My wife would move to be with her parents out of state if we divorce...so I didn't want my kids to be put through the same thing.

 

xSM was the same way, hypercritical of friends of his who cheated and railing against infidelity. Because he hated it so much, he seemed to completely unwilling to admit that his M was in trouble and he was at risk to do the same thing. Had he dealt with it instead of hiding from it, maybe the A wouldn't have happened. We'll never know.

 

It sounds like you may blame your dad for the loss of your mother. That's very powerful. I am sure though, that you are not the same person, nor is your W your mother (likely to abandon your kids). Your concern about what would happen to your kids might be largely projection of how you felt....just a thought.

[Devil Inside]

Still with my junior anlyst hat on: Do you suppose that your reluctance to leave your M even though a big part of you wanted to is the result of the abandonment issues you have with your mom, and less about the M itself?

 

M is "safe" and when you have a fear of abandonment (particularly centering on women), I can see where it would feel almost impossible to throw away that security blanket. And, since you felt needed by your W, you could feel secure that she would not dispose of you. Yet, this OW, being more independent was maybe scary to you because she was more independent and therfore you might have thought you were more disposable to her.

 

When I married my xH, I really married security. It wasn't about him - I didn't have passion for him and it was really not for the right reasons. In xSM, I got everything I had been missing except the security. And in the span of time as an OW, I came to realize how important that security really is to me. What good is love and passion when you live in constant fear of losing it, or in some ways, never fully having it? Either way, something is missing for me....I wonder if I will be able to find both within one person someday.

 

Not bad on the analysis. There are many reasons I never left my M. One of them is probably because I was already in my M, I knew that was secure...my xOW was single by the time it was over...and she was really attractive...a part of me felt that I would split up my family and she would find another guy rather than go through all the work of us moving, fighting custody battles, and making it work. So yeah...W was the safer way to go. However....my kids were definitely the main reason, but fear of abandonment definitely played in....maybe I was also afraid my kids would feel about me as I did of my dad...and in a sense emotionally abandon me as adults.

 

The ten month of my A I was like you...getting needs met form two people. Security form W, and love and affection from xOW. A aprt of me believes that I am too broken to ever have someone give me both...maybe that leave sme too vulnerable..who knows.

[Devil Inside]

xSM was the same way, hypercritical of friends of his who cheated and railing against infidelity. Because he hated it so much, he seemed to completely unwilling to admit that his M was in trouble and he was at risk to do the same thing. Had he dealt with it instead of hiding from it, maybe the A wouldn't have happened. We'll never know.

 

It sounds like you may blame your dad for the loss of your mother. That's very powerful. I am sure though, that you are not the same person, nor is your W your mother (likely to abandon your kids). Your concern about what would happen to your kids might be largely projection of how you felt....just a thought.

 

I blame my dad and my mom. For my dad it's more of an anger...that his infidelity led to the marriage dissolving...although in my ratinal mind I can see that the only thing they have in common is that they are my parents...their marriage shouldn't have happened...but she was pregnant young...like the way it happened with me and my wife.

 

I also feel abandoned by my mom. She essentially let my dad take us out of state because she didn't feel she could raise us alone. She remarried a few years later and raised my step siblings though.

 

The fear I have about my kids moving out of state is based on what she has told me, and logically it makes the most sense. She does not have the income to support them here...even with child support. They would be happy with their grandparents near. However, I do think I am projecting that I would lose them. I could move to be with them in that state...that way I could be close...but not in my M...so there are options.

[Devil Inside]

Devil Inside,

 

I still love her, I still lust her, and I wish she still needed me, but she doesn't. And now I'm back to my mid-life crisis again, still trying to figure out what I'm doing in this world.

 

I've been thinking about what you posted on my post (about going no contact). I guess the more I think about it, the more I realize you are right (99% of people can't be wrong, and that's the only advice I get - NC), but I'm in so much pain, so much pain.

 

 

I know how much it hurts. However, with some time you will realize, that as special as she was...only you can fill that hole in your soul. We are very vulnerable to falling for another "soulmate" and repeating history.

 

We need to work on us...to feel that we are enough...so that we don't need the fix of an A. In the end...maybe we married the wrong person...more likely...we are seeing self esteem and codependency issues manifest at this developmental period of our life.

 

I am taking the opportunity that this crisis has given me to really work on me. It has been coming...and I can't live like this. The pain of ending the A and of feeling like scum of the earth for cheating on my family is not something I think I can do again.

[MistyK]

Not bad on the analysis. There are many reasons I never left my M. One of them is probably because I was already in my M, I knew that was secure...my xOW was single by the time it was over...and she was really attractive...a part of me felt that I would split up my family and she would find another guy rather than go through all the work of us moving, fighting custody battles, and making it work. So yeah...W was the safer way to go. However....my kids were definitely the main reason, but fear of abandonment definitely played in....maybe I was also afraid my kids would feel about me as I did of my dad...and in a sense emotionally abandon me as adults.

 

OMG. If I didn't know any better, I'd swear you were my xSM. His W used to play into this fear exactly by telling him - "she's going to leave you anyway", "she's young and pretty and can have anyone, she will leave you"; "what, you think you are going to play house and be daddy-figure to her two little kids?"; "your kids have lost all respect for you because of what you have done", etc. It's powerful for him because he'd rather feel safe and completely passionless than in love and worrying about me abandoning him all the time. I thought I had abandonment issues until I met him - his make mine look like nothing.

 

The ten month of my A I was like you...getting needs met form two people. Security form W, and love and affection from xOW. A aprt of me believes that I am too broken to ever have someone give me both...maybe that leave sme too vulnerable..who knows.

 

I hear ya there. But you have one major advantage right now, you're digging deep and trying to heal.

[MistyK]

I also feel abandoned by my mom. She essentially let my dad take us out of state because she didn't feel she could raise us alone. She remarried a few years later and raised my step siblings though.

 

Gosh, that's bound to make one feel resentful. It's interesting that you feel your W is in the same boat, unable to raise the kids alone (though it'd never really be alone I'm sure, because I am certain you'd be a good father no matter where you were).

 

The fear I have about my kids moving out of state is based on what she has told me, and logically it makes the most sense. She does not have the income to support them here...even with child support. They would be happy with their grandparents near. However, I do think I am projecting that I would lose them. I could move to be with them in that state...that way I could be close...but not in my M...so there are options.

 

xSM's wife told him the same thing - "if you ever cheated on me, I'd move near my parents" (1000 miles away). I think she said it in part because she believed it, but really it was more that she sensed something was wrong in the M and made the threat to keep him in line instead of discussing things. I think she was afraid to. In the end, she didn't move when he moved out. She has a job here and the kids are in school and settled here. She found a way to not uproot them.

[Devil Inside]

 

 

xSM's wife told him the same thing - "if you ever cheated on me, I'd move near my parents" (1000 miles away). I think she said it in part because she believed it, but really it was more that she sensed something was wrong in the M and made the threat to keep him in line instead of discussing things. I think she was afraid to. In the end, she didn't move when he moved out. She has a job here and the kids are in school and settled here. She found a way to not uproot them.

 

My xOW had this same sense. She really felt my W had a sense something was off, and she said this to keep me put...my xOW felt that I would never risk being away from that and she let me go.

 

It really doesn't feel good to see how easily I am manipulated by the women in my life...or should I say that it is sad to see what I do and allow when it comes to the women in my life.

[MistyK]

 

It really doesn't feel good to see how easily I am manipulated by the women in my life...or should I say that it is sad to see what I do and allow when it comes to the women in my life.

 

Does it make you feel any better to know you are not alone? I almost feel like I should put you in touch with xSM.

[Devil Inside]

Does it make you feel any better to know you are not alone? I almost feel like I should put you in touch with xSM.

 

Misery does love company.

 

I'lll tell you what does feel better...that everyday since the affair ended I have grown some spinal cord. I have started to respect myself again. I have started to love myself again. I have stopped hiding behind the patterns that made up the life I led.

 

I am by no means even 1% of the way there...I have a ways to go...but I am on the path and facing the right direction for the first time in 34 years...I can do this...and I will look back and be grateful that I had the opportunity to change myself before it was too late.

[PhoenixRise]

My xOW had this same sense. She really felt my W had a sense something was off, and she said this to keep me put...my xOW felt that I would never risk being away from that and she let me go.

 

It really doesn't feel good to see how easily I am manipulated by the women in my life...or should I say that it is sad to see what I do and allow when it comes to the women in my life.

 

 

Does your wife habitually play these kinds of games DI?

 

I didn't have to tell my H I would leave the state if our marriage couldn't be reconciled. He knew. I would need a support system. And I would need help to get back on my feet. After dday and after my H didn't do immediate NC with his FOW I left the state. Not to punish him. But because it was what I needed to do to rebuild my life without him.

 

If she has a history of being manipulative then there is a problem that needs to be addressed.

 

BUT

 

The way I see it.. you have 2 women who probaly wanted the same things from you. Your wife didn't know she was "competing" against OW for her future with you. Your OW DID know she was "competing" against you wife for her future with you.

[Devil Inside]

Does your wife habitually play these kinds of games DI?

 

I didn't have to tell my H I would leave the state if our marriage couldn't be reconciled. He knew. I would need a support system. And I would need help to get back on my feet. After dday and after my H didn't do immediate NC with his FOW I left the state. Not to punish him. But because it was what I needed to do to rebuild my life without him.

 

If she has a history of being manipulative then there is a problem that needs to be addressed.

 

BUT

 

The way I see it.. you have 2 women who probaly wanted the same things from you. Your wife didn't know she was "competing" against OW for her future with you. Your OW DID know she was "competing" against you wife for her future with you.

 

So I went back and read the email where my wife said she would move. To be fair she said that she would try as hard as she could to stay...but she would need a support system for finances, emotions, babysitting and her parents would provide that...only my family lives in this state.

 

So I think she was being genuine.

[drmcdreamy]

I know how much it hurts. However, with some time you will realize, that as special as she was...only you can fill that hole in your soul. We are very vulnerable to falling for another "soulmate" and repeating history.

 

We need to work on us...to feel that we are enough...so that we don't need the fix of an A. In the end...maybe we married the wrong person...more likely...we are seeing self esteem and codependency issues manifest at this developmental period of our life.

 

I am taking the opportunity that this crisis has given me to really work on me. It has been coming...and I can't live like this. The pain of ending the A and of feeling like scum of the earth for cheating on my family is not something I think I can do again.

 

I hear you. It's so good to read this thread and see someone who has gone through something so similar (and is a few steps ahead of me to lead the way). I've also appreciated all the things MistyK has been writing.

 

I don't know why I felt the need to have the A to feel that self worth. I don't know why it wasn't inside me already, or why I felt the need to get it elsewhere than my wife (who isn't bad). Admittedly we did go through a period where I felt very little appreciation for how hard I was working to be a great husband and father, and then when the OW said she wished she had a husband and father for her daughter like me, the void was filled. I know that my wife sensed something was wrong with the way I was feeling, and I told her I felt unappreciated (while the A was going on), and since then things have been a lot better between us (she never found out, and the A's been over for ~9 months now). So in many ways, I guess I'm lucky that some of the underlying things that led to the A are gone, and my family didn't get destroyed by it, but I still have so much healing to do.

 

Just writing here has been so helpful. After I wrote the earlier post, I was thinking about how sorry I felt for myself about the end of the A, and how hurt I was, but then I thought, well, if I said what makes me feel good is "being the White Knight," then wouldn't the noble thing to do to be to finally let go of her and let her have her wings and move on with this new man without me clinging desperately? Over the last 9 months I've gone back and forth so many times - first saying I can be "normal" friends with her, then to begging and pleading for more attention/emotional connection, then getting angry and saying I never want to see her again, and round and round. What I haven't done yet is REALLY go NC, but do it without laying a guilt trip on her - letting it happen while leaving her happy instead of bitter. What's that saying about if you love something, let it go? Can I really do that?

 

Again, I appreciate all your writing. I have a lot less Freudian things going on (came from an intact family with no affairs that I know of), but obviously have some insecurity/internal issues, as I guess everyone having an affair must have.

[ladydesigner]

What I haven't done yet is REALLY go NC, but do it without laying a guilt trip on her - letting it happen while leaving her happy instead of bitter. What's that saying about if you love something, let it go? Can I really do that?

 

I just went NC because I was tired of feeling the way I was, still emotionally attached. Even though me and my xOM had established the "friend" label it seemed he was able to move on and forget and maintain this "friend" status better than I. I finally realized I did not have it in me to be his friend, it hurt me too much. I just declared NC this past Friday and it hurts, but I feel I am letting go finally after all this time. I am no longer hoping he'll still have feelings for me. I really don't care anymore what he feels for me. it is time for me to start loving "me."

[drmcdreamy]

I just went NC because I was tired of feeling the way I was, still emotionally attached. Even though me and my xOM had established the "friend" label it seemed he was able to move on and forget and maintain this "friend" status better than I. I finally realized I did not have it in me to be his friend, it hurt me too much. I just declared NC this past Friday and it hurts, but I feel I am letting go finally after all this time. I am no longer hoping he'll still have feelings for me. I really don't care anymore what he feels for me. it is time for me to start loving "me."

 

I hear you, too. As DI knows from my other thread - I'm married and she was in the process of getting divorced, and we decided to have a "summer fling" last summer - to have a great experience, share our love/lust, develop some special memories - and we both said that when the summer was over we'd both go back to being friends and move forward with our lives. Well, August came and went, as did Sept, Oct, and at the end of Nov she met a guy at a party and wanted to start dating him, so she finally called the end of the affair. Although I had agreed all along that it couldn't go on forever, and she deserved more than a MM, I really didn't "want" to end it, and so in some sense I was dumped for another man. I knew it would end, but it hurt then and it still hurts now 9 months later. I explain it like - if you really really wanted something in a store window but knew you could never ever have it, would you intentionally walk by that store every day? Isn't that torturing yourself? Trying to still be friends was that kind of torture. It's just selfish of me, others have pointed out, but it still hurts just the same. I do really love her.

 

What I feel worst about (and this fits back with the point of DI's thread here) is that I got self worth by doing this great thing for her - loving her, showing her that she deserved someone great even if it couldn't be me, and at some level I'm happy for her, despite my pain - but now I'm not able to keep my promise to her that I would still be her friend. I feel like not being able to 'get over' her and go back to our friendship means I've broken a promise to her (just like the promise I broke to my wife). I wish I were a stronger man for both of them.

 

I guess the odds that an affair is going to end with both parties able to separate at the same level is very very low. Seems one of the two is always going to be hurt when it ends.

 

Out of curiosity - how long did you try to maintain the friendship before last week when you decided you just couldn't do it anymore?

[MistyK]

 

When I met xOW it was the first time that I experienced falling in love with a woman in ten years. Being a different person this time it was a different experience. My xOW got to know me on deep levels in a very short amount of time...and I her. The emotional freedom we experienced with each other was very intoxicating.

 

One thing that my xOW did was help me tap into a deeper level of myself. She reawakened my heart. She gave me back a piece of myself that was buried. It makes me sad it came at the price of infidelity...but I need to take this experience and learn and grow from it.

 

I was just re-reading this and had another thought. In retrospect, I don't know what my relationship with xSM would have looked like if he was single. Because he had his safety blanket (his W) at home, it didn't matter as much if I rejected him, so he was much more free with me than I think he otherwise would have been. I hear that same theme coming from you.

 

He said it was like feeling dead inside (lack of true intimacy with his W) and then having passion burn from the ashes. He felt alive again, but unfortunately he found that happiness was only achievable by having it both ways - not having to give up anything. He couldn't bear to part with the security and stability that came with the M, nor the passion that came with the A. If you've read my threads, you know that he did eventually move out six months ago, but the A dynamic continued in many ways for lack of cutting the cord with his W. He is tortured because he doesn't know how to realize happiness for himself (and I am no better at this, unfortunately).

 

You said earlier that some of our unhappiness is with our refusal to accept the givens of life. I think that's very true. We like to operate thinking that life can and should go on without loss or change, and when it does it overwhelms us. I really believed I had finally found the total package with xSM - all the things I'd been missing with my xH and the potential for security.

 

Funny thing though - potential. There are many people who could be and do so much more if only - if only they weren't addicted, disabled, homeless, etc. What good is potential when it is never realized? I keep hearing Raisin in the Sun running through my head. It is so hard to let go when we mistake potential for reality that will always remain elusive.

[Devil Inside]

 

Admittedly we did go through a period where I felt very little appreciation for how hard I was working to be a great husband and father, and then when the OW said she wished she had a husband and father for her daughter like me, the void was filled.

 

"being the White Knight," then wouldn't the noble thing to do to be to finally let go of her and let her have her wings and move on with this new man without me clinging desperately?

 

What I haven't done yet is REALLY go NC, but do it without laying a guilt trip on her - letting it happen while leaving her happy instead of bitter. What's that saying about if you love something, let it go? Can I really do that?

 

 

I too felt unappreciated. Not sure if this is what was going on for you...but I think I contributed to this feeling more than my wife did. What I have found is that I tend to do things that I think people will like in order to get what I want from them. So, I bust my butt as dad and husband of the year...not because I want to...but because I am doing it to manipulate my wife into giving me the respect, admiration, and love I desire. So instead of saying no sometimes I say yes...but it comes with strings. So I only have myself to blame for being in that spot.

 

For me being a "White Knight" is also about me. See on the outside it looks like I'm a great guy. I do all these selfless acts for a very selfish reason...to get my needs met. See I didn't have the confidence to ask for what I wanted...I had to get it passive aggressively. So as I see the "white knight" syndrome...the last thing you would want to do is let her go. You only want to rescue her if she is indebted to you...and you alone. This is how it worked for me.

 

So you haven't gone full NC? From one white knight to another...it's time my man. Going full NC will release you from this emotional prison. A part of me was always holding on when we still emailed and talked on the phone. Once we had that final conversation and closed all doors...it was done...and I finally could let go....until then there was always a glimmer of hope. Don't get me wrong...I still wonder sometimes...but at least I know in all practical sense...it's done. I don't know how you could be her friend with her dating....ouch. Go NC. You don't have to give her a guilt trip...just be honest. Tell her that you have to do this for your emotional health and for your marriage. Tell her that you were wrong when you thought you could go back to friends, you fell for her, and that you have to do this for you. Then do it...full NC. It will help...really. I've only been NC for 28 days now...and I already feel a ton better....the initial week was like torture. Do it for you man...remember...we cannot always be the nice guy...be about yourself on this one....NC!

[drmcdreamy]

A part of me was always holding on when we still emailed and talked on the phone. Once we had that final conversation and closed all doors...it was done...and I finally could let go....until then there was always a glimmer of hope.

 

I don't know how you could be her friend with her dating....ouch.

 

You bet I've been holding on - knowing in my head I shouldn't but in my heart finding it so hard to really let go. I've been trying so hard to be happy for her, being able to watch her go on with her life and be happy, and at times I could do it, but eventually it always hurt because we weren't going on together as lovers. There's only really one way I could be completely happy and that's if there were two of me and one could stay in my current life and one could be with her. Given that we can't clone people yet ... I'm trying to figure out which would be the lesser of evils - being around her and being her friend (which is good), while that reminds me how the relationship is far short of what I would like it to be (which is bad), or not having any relationship at all. You've helped me so much so far, I guess I have to take your advice and swallow the bitter pill.

 

Thank you, DI, whoever you are.

[NOTSURE7]

hi all, i have been reading a little bit of this post..What it seems to me is that you(di and mcdreamy) are trying to convince yourselves of alot of things here,it seems that the steps you have taken to end your A and work on your marriage seem more forced than something you decided to do on your own and it sounds more as if you are now trying to make it work because its what you feel your supposed to do rather than what you really want to be doing but you really have no closure on the A or the ow.

 

I could be wrong but this is my observation, as most of you know i confessed to my w 2 months ago,in hindsight it was the hardest thing i ever had to do, the devastation i caused her and the pain in every tear were beyond description, but i felt i needed to break my cycle and i had to break it all down before i could rebuild it..I wanted a normal life, i wanted my w and family and i wanted to just be whole,some may say i took an extrodinary step and there are times i still question whether i should have told her,whether it was selfish of me to tell her and break her heart but in those times i also stop and i realize this was the only way for me to give my m a true,honest chance and to in the end give her the gift of the man she deserves.fortunately for me i have a wife who loves me and is willing to give me the chance i need.i have a long road ahead but my head is 100% and that makes a huge difference..

 

what we dont realize is how much we are hurting our spouse when we have an a, even when they dont know,we are hurting them,because we are not 100% theirs and we are not 100% devoted to our families..

 

my point is that you have to really be in this, you have to go nc and i mean real full nc, its the only way, for me it worked quickly and i was able to focus on what i have to do with a clear mind,i also am going to ic and mc whcih have both helped alot..

 

i am not saying confessing is for everyone but it has given my w and my marriage an honest and fresh start.