Over or not over?

[northstar1]

3 weeks NC.... is NC at its worst.....Please give it a little more time....

 

It hasn't been 3 weeks NC, we had NC for almost 2 weeks immediately after he left, then some contact for 2 weeks, now after me ignoring all his persistent efforts to contact me for a week, I broke it tonight.

 

You deserve better. You seem like a cool, smart, and from your picture, attractive girl, why are you waiting around for this clown?

[mimiminx]

Thanks for your responses... I know I deserve better than this. I do love him very much though, and I feel that now that the communication has dramatically increased it's a good thing. We did talk about meeting in person, he is open to that. We talked again for a long time today. He called me and we talked for about 2 hours.

He said that he wants to make this work, but he's not sure if it can. We were together for over 2 years. If we talk about and and BOTH, not just me address the issues that were making us both unhappy by ACTIONS then there is a chance that we can do this. He didn't say that, I am saying it. He said that he can't tell me one way or the other right now, he doesn't know. (referring to us getting back together) He said he loves me and wants to be with me, but if we were to get back together nothing would really have changed. Time and distance I guess....

He said he doesn't have the money to send me for a plane ticket or vice versa, he would love to see me and I could stay with him if I did. If we do see eachother, it really wouldn't solve anything, we'd probably end up in bed. It is impossible financially for us to see eachother right now, and i don't think that would change much except fulfill the 'need' to have eachother's presence or something. Sometimes lately when we talk, he's talking about sexual things,not disrespectful. But it's pretty clear we both feel the same way towards eachother. When we said goodbye, he said "I love you". He was calling me pet names too.

Anyway, now I don't know what to think. It's like him talking to me is his way if gauging if we can work through the issues. Me too, actually. It is helping me to see more clearly. He's made some changes for the better since he's been gone, the things that were making me unhappy towards the end.

I'm not going to wait around for him but I do know that we love eachother and we both want this to work. So now what?

What is the best course of action I wonder? What would help me the most. I certainly don't want to give up on us, and he's really not either. Is this just a matter of time? I know that I want and need more than he's giving me but I still love him and I think there is hope. But I do know that he's going to have to be the one to come back on his own. I can't make him. He knows how I feel. I think it's best for us to be honest with eachother like we are. We are openly communicating.

Why would he go to all the effort of talking to me, talking about the relationship, etc. if he was done with it? He's holding out hope or something. He wants it to work, he does.

What now?

[mimiminx]

For some reason something just came over me, and I truly believe it: I deserve more than this. I sent him an email earlier today after our hour long phone conversation in which we talked about the relationship, he inquired all about my life, even flirted with me. The email said basically that I want and deserve more than this. If he wants to work this out, he has to be the one to make that move. I'm getting a lot of mixed signals from him and this has become so tiring. I really do want to put an end to this limbo. Something has got to give... and maybe it's in me.

I love this man with all my heart and soul. He has so many, so many if not all the qualities I want in a boyfriend and a husband. There are some things about him that I am not crazy about, but nothing major, really. I've had over a month to think about this, so I know. When we were together, we were madly, passionately, deeply in love. And I think we still are. He's on the fence, he isn't sure if it can work, but he still loves me and is not moving on, and is not getting over me, and misses me, etc. He's pining over pictures of us, memories, flirting with me now, and just jumping at the chance to talk to me, keeps persisting. He's even talking about us meeting in person.

But, as much as I love him and we love eachother, this state of limbo we're in is not enough for me. We are no longer together for whatever reasons he decided. He isn't against the idea of getting back together again at some point, but for now, nothing is happening.

I need to put this in motion. I want more. I want it from him but I can't have that right now, at least physically. I'm tired of agonizing over it. It helped for a little while to ignore his repeated attempts to contact me, but then I just had to cave in. I'm glad I did actually, we ended the conversation with him saying "I love you". !!!!

My heart cannot withstand much more. I love him so much and I want more than anything to spend the rest of my life with him (as we were planning) but I just may not have that. I've been through the worst of the heartbreak... it makes me feel better to hear from him. I was so afraid that I would never hear from him again. But I have and much more frequently lately.

NC worked for me but only for a little while. It worked in my favor that he called and didn't stop trying to get a hold of me, but it worked against me too that while initially it was empowering, it ultimately seemed like I was being dishonest with myself.

Now... I will be hearing from him again, and frequently, persistently. I am thinking about telling him AGAIN that I can't do this anymore, I want more, I deserve more. Please leave me alone if you can't give me that. And in my mind, I am starting to truly believe that.

Yes, as much as I want this to work, I will not wait around for him. I want more than what he's giving me. I deserve better. I believe that.

[TaraMaiden]

good.

Good, good, good, good and bloody good.

At last.

The penny has dropped.

 

You DO deserve more, and he's witholding.

 

And you've realised this.

You can't wait for ever, and there's no reason at all why he should have the right or impression to think he can ask you to.

 

I know you love him, we see that. we feel it, and it's obvious it's a deep, intense, honest and genuine love.

But put it this way: he's not loving you the way you need to be loved, so unfortunately, for all his great qualities, he's not being the man you need.

 

I really do wish you well: Strength, resolve, dignity and happiness.

 

Be tough.

But be you.

For you.

[georgia girl]

Mimiminx,

 

While this hurts and you are certainly disappointed, you are in the best position possible. YOU have determined what it is that you need and YOU are setting the parameters based on what is best for you. This is healthy. Good job.

 

It's so hard when we still love someone to let go of that love and to love ourselves more. But, it's the most important thing you can do for yourself, regardless of your relationship.

 

For you, it gives you back your self-esteem and your self worth. I am so happy for you.

 

The other thing this does is it resets the balance of power in your relationship. As you know, your ex will continue to contact you. But now (back to what I said in earlier posts), you will be able to evaluate how you respond by if he's meeting your parameters or not. In this way, you will meet as equals - with both parties having something to gain and something to lose guiding their behavior.

 

The key now is to not back down and not reverse yourself in a weak moment. I genuinely believe that for any reconciliation to work long term, both parties must be equals and there must be a mutually agreed upon standard of behavior that recognizes and respects both individuals in the relationship.

 

Good luck in your continued healing. Stay strong and know that if he doesn't meet your standards, you can easily move on. It's all about you now!

[9Lives]

Just to clarify, it is a cell phone account. I will take the advice on the letter, not sending it although I don't really understand why i shouldn't eventually. Am I supposed to just forget about everything? Why should I act like our relationship meant nothing?

Here's another question... if he contacts me, would you agree the best thing is to ignore it? I don't want to shut him out of my life. I want the opportunity for a second chance.

Yes, I'm still holding on. I am not ready to move on.

 

STOP playing games or his game. Tell him that hey you did break up with me and I really didnt want this to happen. If you have decided to move on, then I am going to do the same. Whatever you do,dont let him keep you dangling on a string. men love to do this alll the time. nice or not nice.

[9Lives]

Mimiminx,

 

While this hurts and you are certainly disappointed, you are in the best position possible. YOU have determined what it is that you need and YOU are setting the parameters based on what is best for you. This is healthy. Good job.

 

It's so hard when we still love someone to let go of that love and to love ourselves more. But, it's the most important thing you can do for yourself, regardless of your relationship.

 

For you, it gives you back your self-esteem and your self worth. I am so happy for you.

 

The other thing this does is it resets the balance of power in your relationship. As you know, your ex will continue to contact you. But now (back to what I said in earlier posts), you will be able to evaluate how you respond by if he's meeting your parameters or not. In this way, you will meet as equals - with both parties having something to gain and something to lose guiding their behavior.

 

The key now is to not back down and not reverse yourself in a weak moment. I genuinely believe that for any reconciliation to work long term, both parties must be equals and there must be a mutually agreed upon standard of behavior that recognizes and respects both individuals in the relationship.

 

Good luck in your continued healing. Stay strong and know that if he doesn't meet your standards, you can easily move on. It's all about you now!

 

This is powerful....I hope she listens

[mimiminx]

Thank you so much everyone. I really appreciate your support. Last night, I felt this feeling of almost indifference. I saw him in a different light, not up on the pedestal as much anymore. Of course when I woke up today my heart still hurt and my stomach still is turning. I'll be alright. I'm just not sure what to do now and what to say to him. I have to think about it. Sometimes one little thing can set me in the right direction, like a post here or something I hear somewhere.

I want love, intimacy, respect, and commitment. I truly do. He gave that completely to me while we were together. I wish it could be him, but I don't know if it can be. I can't go on like this much longer, I have to be the one to put a stop to it. I don't know what the future holds, but I do have to love myself more right now and continue to do so. I want to protect my heart.

Thank you again everyone, I will continue to post the progress.

[9Lives]

Thank you so much everyone. I really appreciate your support. Last night, I felt this feeling of almost indifference. I saw him in a different light, not up on the pedestal as much anymore. Of course when I woke up today my heart still hurt and my stomach still is turning. I'll be alright. I'm just not sure what to do now and what to say to him. I have to think about it. Sometimes one little thing can set me in the right direction, like a post here or something I hear somewhere.

I want love, intimacy, respect, and commitment. I truly do. He gave that completely to me while we were together. I wish it could be him, but I don't know if it can be. I can't go on like this much longer, I have to be the one to put a stop to it. I don't know what the future holds, but I do have to love myself more right now and continue to do so. I want to protect my heart.

Thank you again everyone, I will continue to post the progress.

 

Mimiminx, I know you are hurting but you are helping me be stronger believe it or not. YOU are going to get thru this..I am positive.

 

One thing I like about you is that you are CLEAR about what you want. That is very powerful. You know what you need and deserve. This guys lost a good woman. He cares but you dont come first anymore.

 

ITS SHOWTIME!! It is time to be your own best friend. You can make it without him. Be your own best friend

[mimiminx]

I can't do this anymore. I am nearing the end of my rope. I sent him an email last night saying that if he's already made up his mind, no discussion, then please let me go. If he's unsure, then please let me know. He seemed open to reconciling, and I have been getting clear signals of that, but he's still unsure. I told him that I want and deserve more than this. This was a part of the email: "Are you waiting for the situation to change? Is talking to me 'working on things'? (Please clarify) Or is it that are you just lonely and missing me, and therefore stringing me along. I can't let you do that. . If us talking is leading to a possible reconciliation, then I am fine with it. But if in your mind, that's out of the question, please understand that it is in MY best interest for you to let me go. YOU may not like it, but you have to understand that I don't like the fact at all that you aren't my boyfriend anymore but I have to respect your decision.

He responded exactly this: "I am lonely and I do miss you. I am not trying to string you along. You are just giving me another ultimatum, 'be with me or never talk to me again.' Like I said, I don't want to string you along at all because I can't commit to being with you or trying to reconcile things. Nor do I want to or think it's a good idea to not ever talk. I think that's immature. I hate to have to sit around and wonder how you're doing and not be able to talk with you. Just like it takes two people to be in a relationship, it takes two people to communicate. So it's up to you whether or not you keep the lines open. I hope you do."

I can't believe he took what I said as an ultimatum, seems like he feels I am pressuring him which I am not. Selfish, selfish, selfish. "I hate to have to sit around and wonder how you're doing" ??!!!! He chose that!!!! I hate this!!!

That really hurt me to read. He cannot commit... either to breaking up or getting back together. I gotta let this one go...

I sent him a text to call me tonight, I'm going to tell him that I can't do this anymore once and for all. I can't live like this. One day I'm hopeful, the next day I'm disappointed. It has become too tiring.

On one hand, I am scared to break it all off, knowing that this might be it and it's over. On the other hand, I just can't be in this limbo of hoping, then being crushed and disappointed. He's being so indecisive and so unclear sometimes, I just don't understand and it certainly is not fair to me.

I'm nervous about the conversation if we do have it tonight. This is going to be really hard for me.

What do you all think? Cut him out of my life and don't talk to him again or talk to him because... (why on earth would he want to continue being in communication with me if he can't commit to anything?!!) What's the point? What's the motive?

This makes me so tired....help!

[Exit]

You sound exactly like me. My ex wouldn't "let me go", I kept blaming my pain on her, but it needed to be my choice to finally move on. When I asked her to have a conversation with me and help me heal so I could move on and meet a new girl, she just started ignoring me.

 

He obviously sounds like he just wants to be friends, just wants to be able to know how you're doing. He doesn't sound interested in a relationship in any way.

 

He thinks you want to go no contact to play games, to be childish by not talking to him. You have to explain that you're not doing it out of spite, you just need to heal and that can't happen with him still in the picture.

 

I'm sorry but he does not seem interested and your best move is to move on and not wait for him to cut the string, cut it yourself. I know it's not easy. I'm only 3 or 4 days into NC finally. After she kept ignoring me I said "real mature way to get your point across, couldn't even work up the courage to have one conversation with me" and I said goodbye and that's been it.

 

My ex would say the same sort of things, "I'm not trying to string you along". That's what they claim, but they know what they're doing.

 

You are the one finding hope where there isn't any, you are the one clutching to the string that is barely there. Trust me, I was in your shoes for 4 months. Kept blaming her, kept wishing she would let me go, tell me that it's over and there's no chance ever again, but she refused to make it that easy for me. She'd read the letters that I wrote, she'd talk to me on the phone, she'd tell me that she didn't love her new BF, but she didn't understand how much hope that was giving me.

 

The fact that he'd be happy to stay in touch with you without any hope of a relationship shows how truly "over it" he is already. When I first heard my ex suggesting that we could be friends, that was the biggest knife in my heart, because I knew that meant the romance was completely gone.

 

I don't think he wants you, at least not right now. Go away, go no contact, let him miss you, when he wants to know how you're doing, don't answer.

[mimiminx]

Exit-

He TOLD me that he wants more than a friendship with me, but isn't sure if it could work. He is very clearly not over me. He also told me that. So, I really don't think what you said about him being so clearly over me that he wants just to be friends. Not the same situation. The romantic feelings are definitely still there for him, he told me so and I know so. He was flirting with me, sending me pictures of us in Hawaii last year. Thanks for your input, I just wanted to clarify.

[Exit]

Well I didn't read all 5 pages, I only read your most recent reply where you mentioned some of the things he said to you. He does not sound interested. He said he can't commit to a relationship, or even attempting to reconcile at that point. That does not "jive" with someone who wants more than a friendship. If he wanted it, what's stopping him? It's human nature to go after what you want. He obviously doesn't want it right now.

 

Regardless, I still say your best move is to just go away and cut contact. You're showing him that he can have you to a limited degree if that's what he chooses, and you need to show him that it's either a relationship or nothing. You know how much it's playing with your feelings to stay in contact with him. It's easy to fall into the line of thought that "if I keep talking to them eventually it will lead to us getting back together", but more often than not, staying in touch actually helps them get over you, like a smoker on a nicotine patch they can have a little bit of you until they are ready to live without you forever.

 

You know what needs to be done.

[mimiminx]

wow- like a smoker on a nicotene patch. Ouch, the idea of him doing that to me hurts so much!!!! I do know what needs to be done, but I am afraid. Afraid it will cut everything off.

[9Lives]

well wtf!!! This is not love to be having you dangling on a string. He needs to say YES or NO. No grey. This is ridiculous. I went thru this termoil and it got so bad. I hate that I let myself go thru the dumb thing.

 

IT IS CLEAR....He dont want a relationship with you right now or whatever

 

NOW WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO????This crap is just not fair

[mimiminx]

I know, if it could only be YES or NO. I am decisive that way. When I make a decision, it's very clear. My biggest pet peeve is people being indecisive and wishy washy. I'm going to go cold turkey. Cold turkey for him and for me. I can't and won't wait for someone who can't commit to being with me or reconciling with me. After over 2 years, planning on marriage and children, I even had a ring.... he's a fool. I'm cutting him off.

Now I'm angry, I'm really angry!!! I can't believe after all we've had it comes down to this!! I feel like it has gotten ugly, at least in my own head. It makes me so angry to think of him, us smiling and laughing, the memories. I feel like I even hate him right now for doing this to me! Strangely enough, the feeling of hate is fleeting. I don't hate him, I don't imagine I ever could. This is awful.

[TaraMaiden]

Actually, I hate to break it to you, but - you haven't been at all decisive in this. Hence 7 pages of up-and-down, yes-or-no....

 

I'm going to turn the tables here....

 

He's not stringing you along.

No, he's not.

 

His position has been clear all the way through.

 

"I have no idea what I want. I want you in my life, but I'm not committing to anything. I want you as a really good FWB... exclusively - but with no conditions."

That's what he said before, that's what he's saying now. His pattern hasn't changed.....

 

YOU have been stringing you along.

 

YOU are the one who hasn't been able to say:

"Yes, OK, I'll settle for this."

 

or -

 

"No way 'Jose'!! it's all or nothing buddy!"

 

he's perfectly sure of what he doesn't want, and what he does want.

 

The one seeking a greater holding, is you.

And he's not going to give it, now, or ever.

 

So your struggle is not with him.

 

It's with your own indecision and prevarication.

 

You're decisive?

 

BE decisive, then.

[Exit]

Tara makes a good point. He says you're the one giving the ultimatum, get back together or stop talking, and you're trying to deny that and say "no that's not what I'm doing". That's what you SHOULD be doing. It IS an ultimatum. It needs to be, if you are not happy settling for what he is offering.

 

Tara echos what I was saying before, you are stringing yourself along, not him.

[mimiminx]

Tara M- you are right on everything, although the FWB part I have to disagree with. We are in different states, he cannot have the "benefit" part of the friendship. It's not FWB, regardless I get your point. I have to be the one making the decision. It makes me so sad and hurt that he was the one making the decision to leave the relationship, but now I am the one to end this... whatever it is.

 

Exit-you're also right, I need to be saying that. I'm going to sleep on this one.

[seoa]

Tara M- you are right on everything, although the FWB part I have to disagree with. We are in different states, he cannot have the "benefit" part of the friendship. It's not FWB

 

Yes it is... OK, the benefit isn't actual sex, but he's getting a lot of the other girlfriend benefits... he's getting validation - someone chasing after him, and making him their priority... he's getting someone to flirt with, with no worry about rejection (as it would be with a new girl) or responsibility (because he's already told you he won't commit or give you what you want), he has someone he can phone up to get 'girlfriend stuff' whenever he wants, but can ignore whenever he wants...

 

He's getting all the good stuff, and you are getting lots of pain and heartache...

 

Been there, done that... He doesn't want you *enough*, so you have to let him go...

 

Console yourself (as I did) with the thought that making him miss you (full NC) is your best chance for getting him off the fence and making an actual decision.

 

Stop telling him how much pain you're in... that just feeds his FWB scenario...

 

When I went NC with my ex (having done LC for the month after the split - my choice), he said (crossly) "so you're saying I can never call you again?"... I didn't want to leave it there, because (1) I still wanted him to sort out his issues and be ready for a relationship and want me back (yeah, I know), and (2) I felt that anything absolute would make the situation a bigger deal than it was (as in: would put the focus on the "not talking" rather than on the "I miss her and would do anything to get her back", which is what I wanted him to be thinking)...

 

So I went with: "Anything major - bereavement etc - then by all means call - but significant stuff only". That way, when well-meaning friends have said "But what if he's changed his mind, and wants to call you, but thinks he can't", then I can say with certainty that he knows it's OK to call for something important...

 

And it means if he calls for something a bit more FWB-ish, I can say "Sorry, this is significant, is it...?" (ha ha - I'm just recently - finally - discovering my anger at him rejecting me, when I was so !?&*$*!?!* wonderful for him)

 

[westrock]

When I went NC with my ex (having done LC for the month after the split - my choice), he said (crossly) "so you're saying I can never call you again?"... I didn't want to leave it there, because (1) I still wanted him to sort out his issues and be ready for a relationship and want me back (yeah, I know), and (2) I felt that anything absolute would make the situation a bigger deal than it was (as in: would put the focus on the "not talking" rather than on the "I miss her and would do anything to get her back", which is what I wanted him to be thinking)...

 

So I went with: "Anything major - bereavement etc - then by all means call - but significant stuff only". That way, when well-meaning friends have said "But what if he's changed his mind, and wants to call you, but thinks he can't", then I can say with certainty that he knows it's OK to call for something important...

 

And it means if he calls for something a bit more FWB-ish, I can say "Sorry, this is significant, is it...?"

 

This is a good example of setting a boundary, but not slamming the door shut.

[seoa]

This is a good example of setting a boundary, but not slamming the door shut.

 

yep... slamming doors is overly dramatic, and leads to mangled fingers...

[mimiminx]

Thanks Seoa, I may just take your tip. Me 'enabling' him as we mentioned before is not going to get him off the fence. I don't want to be cruel or slam the door at all. And I won't. Your way of handling it was good I think... what happened for you after you told him that? Did he leave you alone for the most part, did it drift off? (that's what I'm afraid of....)

I feel like I have to do this ASAP. I sent him a text last night that I got his email and to call me. He hasn't responded yet. Now I'm pulling away again. The next time I hear from him, I have to put my foot down AGAIN. It is really hard because like Exit mentioned, it's easy to get in the line of thinking "oh, if I talk to him maybe it's going to lead us back together" but the analogy of the smoker with the nicotene patch scares the hell out of me and I will not be that girl. This is about setting boundaries. I have to do it.

Since I responded to him last Friday after his week long persistence, it made me feel good initially to talk to him but ultimately worse because now, he's not hounding me anymore. I was so curious as to what he had to say to me I broke my ignoring streak. I kind of wish I hadn't. This is so heartbreaking... I woke up this morning again with that awful turning in my stomach and the pain in my heart. I just miss him.

I know I need to love myself more and let him go, put the love for him on the back burner. Any other tips as to what I can say to 'set the boundary' but not shut the door completely? Thank you!

[northstar1]

Thanks Seoa, I may just take your tip. Me 'enabling' him as we mentioned before is not going to get him off the fence. I don't want to be cruel or slam the door at all. And I won't. Your way of handling it was good I think... what happened for you after you told him that? Did he leave you alone for the most part, did it drift off? (that's what I'm afraid of....)

I feel like I have to do this ASAP. I sent him a text last night that I got his email and to call me. He hasn't responded yet. Now I'm pulling away again. The next time I hear from him, I have to put my foot down AGAIN. It is really hard because like Exit mentioned, it's easy to get in the line of thinking "oh, if I talk to him maybe it's going to lead us back together" but the analogy of the smoker with the nicotene patch scares the hell out of me and I will not be that girl. This is about setting boundaries. I have to do it.

Since I responded to him last Friday after his week long persistence, it made me feel good initially to talk to him but ultimately worse because now, he's not hounding me anymore. I was so curious as to what he had to say to me I broke my ignoring streak. I kind of wish I hadn't. This is so heartbreaking... I woke up this morning again with that awful turning in my stomach and the pain in my heart. I just miss him.

I know I need to love myself more and let him go, put the love for him on the back burner. Any other tips as to what I can say to 'set the boundary' but not shut the door completely? Thank you!

 

But not shutting the door completely, you are going to hang onto a thread of hope. That thread of hope is what binds to many on this board to months, even years of wishing thinking, suffering, and low self-esteem.

 

I see a theme meandering through this thread over the past 3 weeks. You are seeming to take a step forward, then one back, as you make excuses for his behaviour.

 

He is not a child is he? He is a grown man who suddenly decided to pull a "Into the Wild" routine and escape his reality. He is making enough effort to keep you in the background, but not enough to pull you into the spotlight.

 

I think it's time you started looking out what is good for YOU, not for him.

 

Shut the damn door, respect yourself and your own happiness. You deserve more than what you are getting, don't you?

[seoa]

I wrote him an email explaining it... then another one a few days later... then a 3rd... didn't send any of them, obviously... (and they got progressively less detailed, and less worried about his feelings, and more about me )

 

So when it came to the actual conversation, I had a whole set of finely crafted sentences I could have used...

 

Instead, I did it in about 2 sentences... mostly it was that I'd persuaded myself that NC was necessary for me (forget about him!), so when he started a long update about his work, he could tell I was bored, and I just said "yes, I think we're done winding down this relationship now" and the "significant only" as above... (I'd already told him as we broke up that it was all or nothing, friends was not an option... he didn't agree that we couldn't be friends, but really that wasn't my problem - you need 2 to have a relationship, and 2 to have a friendship - he didn't ask me to 'agree' with him about breaking up with me, so ditto the "just friends" thing!)

 

Short & sweet... the more you explain, the worse it will go for you... and this is ALL ABOUT YOU...

 

I got through the weeks since that moment, by believing that "he's just busy today, otherwise he'd be calling"... Then I got to the point of being open to letting him go, and it's happened - I've finally been able to write the list of reasons I wouldn't want him back (couldn't come up with any for the first coupla months since the break, coz we didn't break up for nasty reasons, just because his fear got too much for him to handle)...

 

And boy, does the guy have issues...

 

edit: oh, and I didn't call him specially to have this conversation... I did the LC thing of waiting for 3 reasonable attempts from him to contact me, before accepting a call... we did the conversation then... i would not have contacted him, to tell him i wouldn't be contacting him, coz why...??