Rebeccafare Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 Hey, I have been reading posts here for a while But have a question. What if a MM and MW who are not married to each other BOTH agree that they are not looking for the other to leave their SO. An agreement exists that includes having no expectations beyond what they have now. AND they are not interested in sex with each other(or anyone much) anyway. BUT they do engage in a lot of other practices. They both love each other's company , they have deep comversations and feel very comfortable with each other, often engaging in relaxing massage and sometimes in masturbation. They have both been very clear with each other about these expectations and even agreed ahead of time that they would back off if either party feels the need to. What if both parties agree that this relationship has helped their relationship with their SO? Such as, making it tolerable to have sex with their spouse and allowing them to like their spouses more because they are not looking for the spouses to supply something that they just arent able to do. --- a type of mental and physical connection that is very intense. Fare Link to post Share on other sites
skywriter Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 "Making it tolerable to have sex with your spouse", wow....Rebecca! Link to post Share on other sites
whichwayisup Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 It's called cake-eating and it's selfish, cruel and unfair to do to the unknowing betrayed spouses. Let me ask you - since I assume this is about you and your MM - Would you be OK if your husband got involved sexually with another woman, married or not? TO have someone on the side too? Why not just have an open marriage instead of lying, cheating, betraying, living in a fantasy world. They have both been very clear with each other about these expectations and even agreed ahead of time that they would back off if either party feels the need to. Read more threads, then come back and ask this question again. Seems you're in the early stages of an affair.. Basically, you're USING another man, getting turned on by him so you can have sex with your own husband! Do you know how awful that sounds? Does your husband make you that ill to your stomach that you have to "tolerate" sex with him? Imagine how your HUSBAND would feel if he knew how you truly felt about him.. What you're doing to him is unfair. HE deserves to be married to a woman who is going to love only him, and appreciate him. Link to post Share on other sites
donnamaybe Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 How's about you bring the BS's in on this little arrangement and see what they think? There ARE, after all, FOUR people - not two - involved in this little scenario, despite what you might like to believe. Link to post Share on other sites
torranceshipman Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 It's absolutely fine, if the world revolves only around the MM and the MW, then things are ok. But y'know, if the feelings of other people, the welfare of children, etc, come into the equation as consideration then yea...there is a lot wrong with it. Link to post Share on other sites
Author Rebeccafare Posted September 1, 2009 Author Share Posted September 1, 2009 You know, this has been going on for a long time. we talked about it and both agree that it has been over a year now since the lines were crossed. It probably took two years to get to that point. Please dont think this is too strange, what I say is true. Neither of is are interested in sex at all. I dont think you got it right. Really do NOT enjoy the act of having sex (intercourse). Both of us have spouses that are distant and really only want to touch us when they want to have sex. Both of us really do enjoy physical pleasures (other than intercourse) AND it is not always touch, but when it is , it is more of a caring touch. You know the ones that someone gives you when you are sitting at the computer and your shoulders look all tight...the other person comes up behind and gives you nice, breif shoulder rub as they talk with you. YOU are right. I dont think that either of our spouses would be too happy about it. But, truth be told, I dont think mine really genuinely cares about me anyway. He would be angry mostly as a "show" so that the world would somehow think that he did care. I know MM wife enough to know that she would be mad, but I would be shocked if she left him over it. Fare Link to post Share on other sites
donnamaybe Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 YOU are right. I dont think that either of our spouses would be too happy about it. Then there's the answer to your question. THAT is what's wrong with it. Now stop the rationalizing, and if your marriage is THAT bad, get a divorce. Link to post Share on other sites
foreal Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 If your H is okay with knowing you are masturbating in front of the MM, and your MM's W is okay with you masturbating in front her H, and all 4 of you agree this helps your Ms, then hey, no worries... ... next time your MM starts to jerk off in front of you, give your H a call and let him know what you're watching...since it is so good for your M you should have no problem letting him in on this secret. forealdough Link to post Share on other sites
Author Rebeccafare Posted September 1, 2009 Author Share Posted September 1, 2009 NOT as easy as that. Nice "catholic family" dont divorce.... They just live miserable lives! (according to the spouses) Link to post Share on other sites
confusedinkansas Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 How's about you bring the BS's in on this little arrangement and see what they think? There ARE, after all, FOUR people - not two - involved in this little scenario, despite what you might like to believe. There really aren't 4 people involved. There are 2. 2 selfish people. Does it affect the spouses if they find out - YEP! But in the interim - all parties agree, all parties are grown ups....No Harm - No Foul. AND....The secret is part of what makes the affair so very exciting in the first place. I'm not condining the behavior or agreeing it's the right thing to do - People DO .. DO IT. - I'm just saying.....IT IS WHAT IT IS! Link to post Share on other sites
torranceshipman Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 Of course your spouses would care. If you're that miserable get a divorce... Link to post Share on other sites
foreal Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 NOT as easy as that. Nice "catholic family" dont divorce.... They just live miserable lives! (according to the spouses) Okay then just keep betraying your nice Catholic vows and go to Confession- Link to post Share on other sites
donnamaybe Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 NOT as easy as that. Nice "catholic family" dont divorce.... They just live miserable lives! (according to the spouses) You aren't a "nice catholic family." Don't think for one second people won't find out. Which would be worse? Getting a divorce now, or everyone finding out you're f'ing around behind your H's back and THEN getting a divorce? Link to post Share on other sites
stampdaddy Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 Health Clinic Counselor: Is that a serious question? Andy Stitzer: No, it wasn't. Link to post Share on other sites
Author Rebeccafare Posted September 1, 2009 Author Share Posted September 1, 2009 foreal it isnt like that at all! confusedinkansas while I can understand the rationale for "selfish" in what you are saying, What is it when someone gives everything in their life to another (h or w) and feels lost and ignored emotionally AND they really have no where to turn? Why should they not have someone special, even for the time being? Support and energize each other? Both of us know that their will never be a US , that each of us must remain with our current spouses etc... SO, no expectations as far as that goes. Fare Link to post Share on other sites
torranceshipman Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 This is a cause and effect situation: you entered a M with your eyes open, you and your spouse were responsible for the M falling into a rut...so it is again your responsibility to fix a bad situation for yourself and your spouse. That either means you work on your M, or you D and give your spouse freedom to find someone who is not cheating on them. None of this stuff about your M being bad gives you the entitlement or the right to cheat on your partner. Link to post Share on other sites
Author Rebeccafare Posted September 1, 2009 Author Share Posted September 1, 2009 I AM not catholic, HE is not catholic. Family's are catholic, Spouses are catholic. Both of us know that there is no way other than to stay married. ------------------------------- I read somewhere that sometimes people just have to go on with life, co-habiting with their spouse. Keeping peace and just living their own lives for years. Sometimes it is best. Fare Link to post Share on other sites
anne1707 Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 I might be wrong but I just feel as if this is a troll. Too much justification. Too much can't do this/can't do that. And in just 5 posts. Link to post Share on other sites
confusedinkansas Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 foreal it isnt like that at all! confusedinkansas while I can understand the rationale for "selfish" in what you are saying, What is it when someone gives everything in their life to another (h or w) and feels lost and ignored emotionally AND they really have no where to turn? Why should they not have someone special, even for the time being? Support and energize each other? Both of us know that their will never be a US , that each of us must remain with our current spouses etc... SO, no expectations as far as that goes. Fare I totally 100% understand. You dont' get from your husband what you need & your affair partner gives you that. THIS IS MY LIFE 5 years ago!! I'm not saying that it's the right thing to do to go to someone else & get what a spouse SHOULD be giving you.......But sometimes it does help one cope. If you can't leave for whatever reason, & an affair keeps you from checking yourself into the funny farm....then so be it. My husband & I fell "out of love" for a long time. I turned to an affair & he turned to alcohol. Doesn't that make him just as bad as me? I think it does. Link to post Share on other sites
theBrokenMuse Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 I AM not catholic, HE is not catholic. Family's are catholic, Spouses are catholic. Both of us know that there is no way other than to stay married. Bull. It's your life. Not your parent's lives or siblings, aunts or uncles... YOURS. You have complete control over what you do with that life, if you want to waste it with someone you don't love and who doesn't love you just so you won't create any waves in your family then that's your choice, albeit a rather poor one. I know what it's like - I had to tell my conservative, deeply religious family that I was a liberal atheist. Not exactly easy but you can ether be true to yourself or live a lie. My advice? Get a backbone when it comes to your family. You get one life and you are pissing it away on pleasing people that are more interested in their dogma than what's best for you. Link to post Share on other sites
Author Rebeccafare Posted September 1, 2009 Author Share Posted September 1, 2009 anne1707 Ever been in a situation that you have given hours/days worth of thought to? Tossing and turning every possible scenario around in your head? Trying to make sense out of it? confusedinkansas THANK YOU! You hit it on the head! I do often feel like I am going to the "funny farm". I almost went the alcohol route (my dad did do it) and stopped myself because I could see too much of my dad in me. BUT, I do really care about OM. We have mutual feelings, neither of us will allow them to be called anything other than "special friend" because of the possibility of having to drop it suddenly. WE do BOTH fully understand what we are doing and where we stand. thebrokenmuse Not so easy, as you know. very confusing to me. I guess I spent my whole life making others happy. I want to be happy, but CANNOT stand the idea of upsetting the status quo. Now, I know you will say that an A will do just that. Maybe I am truly naive in thinking that we can keep it on the down low. Maybe I KNOW in my heart that my H only cares when others are looking. Maybe it is nice to have a non-committal relationship with someone who has many of the same "issues" in life, relationships and physically as me. Maybe, just maybe I WANT to justify. Doesnt everyone? Possibly, I just dont see it as totally wrong and feel that circumstances affect everything in every way! Fare Link to post Share on other sites
anne1707 Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 anne1707 Ever been in a situation that you have given hours/days worth of thought to? Tossing and turning every possible scenario around in your head? Trying to make sense out of it? Yes I had an affair. Biggest mistake of my life. There is no justification, there is no sense and there is no escape from pain however you enter into it. How would you feel if your husband had an affair with another woman just so he could tolerate having sex with you? How would you feel if he shared those tender touches you describe with another woman? However you describe it, it is still an affair. As for using a religion that you do not practice as a reason for not getting a divorce. Well that is just ridiculous. Link to post Share on other sites
ladydesigner Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 When I began my affair one year ago I thought the same thing that xOM would just be my "special friend." Well it turned out to be much more than that. When xOM ended things with me I had not realized how deeply I had fallen in love with him until it had actually ended. You can rebuild your marriage, I am doing it. No it's not exactly the passion, excitement, and newness the affair had given me but my marriage also does not have the ups and downs that the affair dynamic had. How will you feel when your MM decides to put all this to an end because of guilt or because he wants to focus on his marriage with his W? Link to post Share on other sites
Author Rebeccafare Posted September 1, 2009 Author Share Posted September 1, 2009 Yes How would you feel if your husband had an affair with another woman just so he could tolerate having sex with you? How would you feel if he shared those tender touches you describe with another woman? However you describe it, it is still an affair.. Honestly, I cant say for sure. My H only touches me when he wants sex. As far as THAT touch goes, he can go for it! give it away, Cause it aint fun at all! It may well be a big mistake, but it may not be any bigger of a mistake than walking out on him either. Fare Link to post Share on other sites
anne1707 Posted September 1, 2009 Share Posted September 1, 2009 If your marriage is over then leave. Grow up and accept responsibility for yourself. You owe it to yourself and your husband. No more excuses for not divorcing. Either that or end the affair now and throw all your efforts into making your marriage work. Link to post Share on other sites
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