2 years since I found out..

[eeyore1981]

I really believe (maybe want) just by my H's demeanor about the whole thing that what I highlighted is the truth. I still have doubts just b/c I DON"T know. He keeps saying over and over I never cheated on you. (I ignore the word and deal with the behavior. No sense arguing over that.)

 

I think guilt is playing a massive part b/c deep inside they are really good men who got off track.

 

I know, I know, it's so good to hear someone else feel this same way. Is it really possible that is the truth, or am I just so desperate for it to be the truth I am in massive denial?

I had the same exact thing, my husband denying for a long time he cheated or it was an affair.

I did argue about it. I used 'cheat' or 'affair' every chance I got. It felt to me like letting him slip by on this was just going to make the rest of it impossible. I wanted to work it out, and I wanted to forgive him, but I needed to be told the truth directly and honestly for that to be able to happen. For me, that still hasn't changed.

[Sanafa]

And I can't say I have come too much in the way of resolution.

I wanted to talk about this, so we were riding around, I was trying to get answers other than "I don't know". We pulled over and talked for a while. Mostly I talked, while he remained silent, or told me such illuminating things such as previous, or his other standby, "I don't remember." Hours later, which really was unnecessary timewise if he didn't pretend to not know what I was asking for, pretend to misunderstand what I was saying, etc., you guys probably have heard or experienced all these crafty little dialogue tricks employed by compulsive liars, he was finally in an uncomfortable position, at which point he decided, as he always does, after all the hard work and time I invest to even make it to this point, the conversation is over. I told him I wasn't finished. He started the truck and started to leave. I opened the door and threatened to jump out, so he stopped and I got out. This was 11:30pm, we were about half a mile from our house. He pretty much had the choice of deal with the unpleasantness he was feeling and deal with this, or let me walk home, because I am tired of him always getting to decide when I am done. I walked home. I wasn't in the least surprised, either.

Anyway, 2 years after finding out about his affair, and 25 years of putting up with all his other crap, and there has been so much of it I doubt I will ever get rid of the smell, I am done. I told him about 15 minutes ago, woke him up to tell him, because as usual he is sleeping like the dead while I am awake fighting massive stomach trauma, to find another place to live, the sooner the better.

I can honestly say I did not deserve this. I wasn't treating him very well for about a year leading up to his affair, but that came about because he did something to me that was inexcusible. At the time, it was just the latest of a long line of stuff he did to me, but this thing pushed me too far, so my crime was I began to treat him just exactly as he treated me. No better, and no worse, exactly the same. This was at year 21 of being his wife, of making excuses for how he treated me, blaming myself for how he treated me, trying to be a better wife, trying to fix, fix, fix our problems, even though he was the cause of most of them...His response was to treat me even worse than he had been.

The past 2 years he has actually treated me pretty well, except for that one pesky little thing, the affair. His attitude is he isn't having contact with her anymore, so I shouldn't have a problem. His attitude is it is ok to lie about it as long as he thinks I won't find out. His story makes little to no sense, and in spite of his opinion to the contrary, yes, it does matter to me if he slept with her or not, how strong his feelings were for her, and for him to stop lying to me, among other things. He says with his mouth he understands how I can't trust him with all the lies I actually caught him in, but his actions, attitudes, and the rest of the stuff he says strongly insinuates I should believe whatever he says, because he said it.

I could have been over the worst of my pain a long time ago had he chosen to come clean. We could have been in a lot better place in our marriage right now, or I could be 2 years down the road to a better life by now, but that's not what he wanted. I feel like if someone broke into our home with a gun and said he was going to shoot one of us, my oh so loving husband would point his finger at me and say, "Shoot her." How do I make a marriage out of that?

Sorry for the long, rambling rant. I am so depressed, and I feel so worthless right now, like, how did I let 25 YEARS of my life go by like this??? I never dreamed I was so effing stupid.

 

I actually had to come back to this thread when I read in another how you are trying to make it work.

 

I am so sorry you are going through pain.... but this is exactly what I am talking about... post after post supporting someone when they really need support to leave.

 

You deserve better... and you can excuse it away for another 25 years.

 

Sorry... this is where I wonder if anyone is here to help or just nod in agreement.

 

I'll get beaten for this one, but I was literally stunned when I read you are considering sticking it out... not so much what you said, but everything I bolded .... love isn't that painful and no one can tell me it is or suppose to be.

[eeyore1981]

I actually had to come back to this thread when I read in another how you are trying to make it work.

 

I am so sorry you are going through pain.... but this is exactly what I am talking about... post after post supporting someone when they really need support to leave.

 

You deserve better... and you can excuse it away for another 25 years.

 

Sorry... this is where I wonder if anyone is here to help or just nod in agreement.

 

I'll get beaten for this one, but I was literally stunned when I read you are considering sticking it out... not so much what you said, but everything I bolded .... love isn't that painful and no one can tell me it is or suppose to be.

 

BBM

 

I hope you don't. This is directed to me, and I understand exactly what you are saying.

 

You say love isn't that painful, and I disagree. Sometimes it can be. I spent years struggling with my daughter when she was diagnosed as bipolar. She would scream at me, tell me she hated me, call me all kinds of names, etc. I can't describe the misery and pain and hurt we both went through. She is doing very well now, and we are extremely close.

 

There are a lot of differences between parent/child love vs. husband/wife love, and a lot of similarities.

 

I can only speak for myself. My thread starting post came from a place of deep anger and frustration, born of hurt. It is true there was a lot of hurt to get me to where I was the other day. I did try to leave, but I wasn't ready. Also, I'm talking about a time span of 2 years. I haven't been reeling from this every minute for the past 2 years. He hasn't been lying to me every minute for the last 2 years.

 

But again, I understand what you are saying. Maybe I am making excuses. I don't know. The funny thing about this is part of what made me change my mind was reading a story about a woman who left her husband after an affair. She was very happy with her decision, and was doing great. I realized I wasn't there yet. This isn't so much about being in this marriage as it is about doing what I think is best for myself. I hope people aren't going to blow me off because I am uncertain what that is right now.

[mnm]

I stopped using cheat b/c it was semantics. We would get off on a whole tangent, not deal with what was in front of us.

[eeyore1981]

I stopped using cheat b/c it was semantics. We would get off on a whole tangent, not deal with what was in front of us.

 

In my situation, this was just more of the same old, same old. I need this to stop. If it walks like a duck...

 

If we are going to have a marriage, he is going to have to cowboy up. This denial and refusal to deal with his actions has been at the root of almost every problem we have had, not just the affair. So, for me, this is something that has got to go.

[mnm]

I understand completely.

 

I am so stressed today for some reason. I want to talk to him so bad about this stuff, it just seems like the timing is not right. With all the extra stuff we're dealing with, this is at the bottom of the list, but its kinda eating me up a little.

 

I'm scared to bring it up and it not be the right time and things just go south. I really want him to read the letter seren told us about. I copied it and changed a couple things hopefully its not plagerism LOL.

 

I'm good for a while then I feel I'm ready to burst.

[eeyore1981]

I understand completely.

 

I am so stressed today for some reason. I want to talk to him so bad about this stuff, it just seems like the timing is not right. With all the extra stuff we're dealing with, this is at the bottom of the list, but its kinda eating me up a little.

 

I'm scared to bring it up and it not be the right time and things just go south. I really want him to read the letter seren told us about. I copied it and changed a couple things hopefully its not plagerism LOL.

 

I'm good for a while then I feel I'm ready to burst.

 

My first reaction is to say if it's eating you up, then it is the right time. However, that is up to you to decide.

 

If you aren't going to get some relief by talking about it, maybe you could try something to take your mind off of it. Read an interesting book, take a walk, go see a movie. I like to do logic problems, because they require concentration.

[mnm]

Took a xanax and it helped. I'm working right now too, so that keeps my mind off it.

 

I'll see how it goes today or tomorrow. He's not here right now and then its hard w/ the kids when they're home.

 

He doesn't know I'm on here and I don't like to keep it from him. I feel like I'm lying to him about it. That's not what I want. I want him to know how I feel and what I'm doing to heal. I want him to know I do research and what I've learned. I haven't said anything about it. Maybe this is partly my problem b/c I'm not opening up to him about my feelings.

[mnm]

He doesnt know the depth of my pain. I've never told him how I'm doing with all of it and that it's going to take me a long time to completely move past it. I think I need to do this too. I've done really well, there are just days that you know.....

[foreal]

 

I think guilt is playing a massive part b/c deep inside they are really good men who got off track.

I know, I know, it's so good to hear someone else feel this same way. Is it really possible that is the truth, or am I just so desperate for it to be the truth I am in massive denial?

I had the same exact thing, my husband denying for a long time he cheated or it was an affair.

 

I do think good people, MM and OW included, do at times get off track.

 

I think what is difficult when in the middle of all this is to sort out what our Rs have been, what our H's have actually been like in their entirety. We have so much emotional turmoil, everything is Fd up!

 

My H came clean quickly, sort of. He admitted the A, but did not give me the full story until about 3 weeks after Dday, in a MC session and I was pissed! He said he felt it was best to tell me in MC and in retrospect, I think he's an Ahole for not telling me on Dday....but I do understand he felt so guilty and saw just how much pain I had from learning it was a 2 month thing...that telling me it was a 9 month A would cause so much more pain. But since then, he's been forthcoming and answered all my questions, some of which made him squirm badly. I was brutal in my questioning, mostly to myself as I now look back b/c some of the answers I got (intimate sex questions especially) still stick in my head and it is difficult to let that go.

 

I guess what I am getting at, is YOU know what your H is capable of. YOU know if how he's treated you is acceptable to you- I am talking pre A. Was he kind, caring, sensitive to you and your needs etc? Or were there more than a few times when he treated you poorly, disrespectfully, embarrasingly, etc etc.

 

Sanafa makes a good point about pain and love. However, as you said, Love can be painful at times. But if pain is built into the foundation of a R, then there will be no escaping it unless you blow it up and start from scratch.

 

Only you can determine if the pain is built in, and only you can determine if you are willing to live with it if it is.

[foreal]

He doesnt know the depth of my pain. I've never told him how I'm doing with all of it and that it's going to take me a long time to completely move past it. I think I need to do this too. I've done really well, there are just days that you know.....

 

MNM, are you in MC with your H?

[mnm]

No were not. I know, I know we should be. It's like this, he is so sorry and remorseful, I almost feel bad for having the need to talk about it. Mostly b/c I handled things horribly for awhile. I would be having a couple drinks and start raging. The emotions just erupted. It was not productive. So he shut down b/c he thought I was a nut case (which I was, who hasn't, who wouldn't)

 

I see things so much more clearly know. That why I have this need to express myself to him. There is more openmindness now that there has been time to process all of it.

 

I forgive him, love him, but there is something stuck in my throat at times. I want to put it behind me and be able to completely move forward.

[eeyore1981]

He doesnt know the depth of my pain. I've never told him how I'm doing with all of it and that it's going to take me a long time to completely move past it. I think I need to do this too. I've done really well, there are just days that you know.....

 

It sounds like you are not having much in the way of communication, on either side. I think this is something you need to work on. I know what you are talking about, and he needs to know, too. He might not get it when you tell him, but he probably won't get it if you don't.

[foreal]

No were not. I know, I know we should be. It's like this, he is so sorry and remorseful, I almost feel bad for having the need to talk about it. Mostly b/c I handled things horribly for awhile. I would be having a couple drinks and start raging. The emotions just erupted. It was not productive. So he shut down b/c he thought I was a nut case (which I was, who hasn't, who wouldn't)

 

I see things so much more clearly know. That why I have this need to express myself to him. There is more openmindness now that there has been time to process all of it.

 

I forgive him, love him, but there is something stuck in my throat at times. I want to put it behind me and be able to completely move forward.

 

Maybe instead of feeling bad for having a need to talk about it, you can look at it as more of a position of strength...if you did not feel a need to talk about it, how weak would your M really be? If you could just let it go, then maybe there is not that much you were holding onto in the first place.

But it sounds like you really love your H.

 

It is easier to NOT go to MC...hell the logistics just making the time to do it is sometimes overwhelming But you seem to want to fight for your M. So why not bring out all your weapons to win this fight? Why go into a fight with a knife when you have access to a gun (MC would be the gun..am I making sense??!)

 

and as far as you handling things horribly...says who??!! I too did some outrageous things, in fits of rage..more like hours-long-sustained rage rather than fits...but hey, who is to say what an appropriate reaction to infidelity is?

There is a good book, Transcending Post-infidelity Stress Disorder that helped me realize I was not going certifiably nuts. Our MC also told us right off the bat I had post traumatic stress disorder after I described my feelings, as well as physical symptoms- thank god I have moved on, but I was in that stage for about 2-3 months.

 

Please try MC!!! At least give it some thought!?

[eeyore1981]

Only you can determine if the pain is built in, and only you can determine if you are willing to live with it if it is.

 

Respectfully snipped.

 

I really am confused about I want.

 

I know I love him. I know he loves me. Is it enough? I don't know.

 

There has been a lot of being treated poorly by him. I am not willing to accept this anymore. Other than his crap over his affair, his attitude towards me, our marriage, how he treats me, it has been great. There were times in the past, a few years here, a few years there, that were also great. Not good, but so unbelievably wonderful and special. Some of the things that have come along and ruined this have been major things, but some of them have been so minor, something most people could talk about for a few days and work out, but for us they turn into these huge insumountable nightmares.

The solution seems so simple to me. Apparently not so to him. I have seen more effort from him in the last few days.

Also, on Sunday, when I came back and talked to him before I called on the house. I expected him to tell me to do what I had to do, that's his usual response, but he didn't. He started talking about the affair, and telling me the answers in a straight direct way. He has also initiated a few times just putting his arms around me and telling me he is sorry, something I would have practically killed for just 6 months ago.

All I can do is MC. If it can't be fixed there, I will accept it can't be fixed, and do whatever I need to to move on.

[mnm]

I'm replying to both eeyore and forreal:

 

You're right about the communication. We have a hard time w/ it. Called being afraid of vulnerability. We're getting better in some ways. H actually told me his feelings about losing his job.

 

Forreal:

 

You are right. If I didn't feel the need to talk, what kind of marriage did we have to begin with. We both want this to work out, it's ME having a hard time opening up, afraid I will be rejected (huge issue). It is a position of strength to say what I want and need.

 

I was ready to respond when he walked in and I clicked off really fast. I was about ready to have a talk, but he had to leave again.

 

It's really getting to me b/c of our son. There was a lot of things were said that not only applied to our son, but spoke directly to me. I also had to tell the counselor the whole history and what happened. Seems like the floodgates of understanding what I need and what has been happening as far as talking have been opened up. My H told the counselor that the bad times were for a few months and she said it doesn't matter, it happened and it's affected everyone.

 

He really truly loves me and I him. He tells me he's not going anywhere and neither am I.

 

I'm going to get him to read that letter. It's more effective than my personal words to get a conversation going.

 

I'm not trying to be negative nellie today, for some reason, its hard.