"If you want sex, then you will have to get it somewhere else."

[JackJack]

Other than staying for the kids James, what are the other benefits of staying that outweigh leaving the marriage?

[JamesM]

It sounds like you've made up your mind to stay regardless. So with that being said, I do not know what else to tell you James, since right many people here have already offered you some advice/suggestions.

 

I wish you well in whatever happens. Because right now, it looks as if whats been happening, is what is going to keep happening.

 

Thank you. Unfortunately, I don't see a change coming either. While it is hopeless, I think yet until we no longer communicate and no longer are friends, then I still see a tiny light of hope. I just do not see ho I can get there,

 

James, I hope you're not looking for validation to seek or have engaged in, sex outside the marriage.

 

No, I don't need it. I know my options and will make my choice(s). I wanted to know what reactions people would have. I wanted to see if I could gains some different perspectives that would help me move forward. I wanted to get some ideas from others who have been in a similar situation.

 

My posts as usual tend to ask question or counteract others to get further explanations.

 

Even if everyone who posted said, have an affair, I am the one who lives with my choice. On the other side, even if one person posts and idea that might make a difference, then this thread was worth every minute I "wasted" putting my feelings out for everyone to see and analyze.

 

I know that in this (and all situations) situation I have three options:

 

Live with it.

Fix it.

Leave it.

 

It is up to me to make a choice and plan a path.

[2sure]

I'm just going to throw this out there.

 

She is 40ish. A time when any person , a woman especially, can start to feel age and gravity and all that creeping up. An age when you might start to feel less visible to the opposite sex than you used to. You might just not like what you see in the mirror physically. How a woman is viewed by herself can affect her more than how she is viewed by her H. Also, there is nothing like being checked out by a stranger to make you feel hot as hell for your H.

 

I mean, and this IS shallow...but not. Listen. When a woman feels good, when a woman feels like she looks HOT, it makes her a sexual being. When we dont feel that way, we may still feel loving and affectionate...but that hot, that passion...just fades away. You become a being that is not sexual.

 

I felt a lot more self confidence , and self confidence is always a good thing but especially regarding sex...when I got new boobs at age 38.

Now, today, at this point ...I wouldnt say to anyone that they need something like this...but it did give my confidence and sexual being a boost at a time in my life that I needed it. And you can replace boobs with anything that enhances her own self image. Its not a sin you know.

 

Just saying.

[Thaddeus]

James, I understand your concern over your kids. But may I gently suggest that the above is your greatest fear over seeking a divorce? Don't get me wrong, for the sake of you and your marriage I dearly hope this gets resolved, but I also believe that divorce is a better option than going outside the marriage for sex.

 

You can't control your wife. You can't control what she'll say about the reasons for a divorce, regardless of what the reasons truly are. I would recommend not allowing your reputation to be as big of a factor in your decision-making process as it apparently is. I believe that you're a good man, and that's just from reading your posts. I have no doubt that those who really know you would think less of you based on the reasons for a divorce. I think they would be disappointed and sad to see the marriage end, but you would not become the villain.

I agree with my friend GT here, though there's one caveat I think is important to add:

 

It's no secret that divorce judgements are generally heavily biased against the male in the proceedings, so James' reluctance to go down that road is entirely understandable. Not only will he likely lose a minimum of 50% of his assets, plus be responsible for paying spousal support plus child support, he may also have his access to his kids severely restricted.

 

His fear is real, because it's based in reality. He's in a no-win situation. His wife gets all the positives of being in a relationship without any of the responsibilities. She could sue for divorce as well and he'd still be on the hook for all the financial and family repercussions.

 

It's no wonder that more and more men are thinking twice before getting married.

[Thornton]

I can only speak from personal experience - I've been in relationships where everything was fine apart from the sex, and the lack of sex was my choice not my partner's. The reason I didn't want sex was because I just wasn't attracted to the guy in question - I still felt sexual desire but not for my partner. Yet despite that I stayed in those relationships for 2-3 years each time, because the guy let me get away with refusing sex and so everything was pretty comfortable for me. He paid half of the rent and bills, took me to the movies and out for dinner, kept me company when we stayed at home watching tv, provided emotional support and friendship, and didn't pressure me to do anything physical such as sex.

 

The main point is this: I wanted to keep my partner as a friend and for financial support etc, I didn't want him as a lover. He was willing to put up with not getting sex, hoping that things would change, but I was adamant that they never would because I didn't have those sort of feelings for him. It sounds to me like your wife has put her foot down and simly refuses to have sex with you - she'll let you hang around as long as you want because you're a convenient source of financial and emotional support, but she probably has no intention of ever having sex with you gain, even if it results in divorce.

 

The way I see it, you have three options: 1) Accept you will never have sex again, 2) Divorce her, or 3) Have an affair (which your wife seems to approve of, since it allows her to keep all the benefits of your relationship without ever having to have sex with you).

[GorillaTheater]

I have no doubt that those who really know you would think less of you based on the reasons for a divorce.

 

Yikes, a significant blunder on my part. I meant to say that "I have no doubt that those who really know you would NOT think less of you based on the reasons for a divorce."

[sxyNYCcpl]

For me, it's simple. For a woman to expect to have any say about where and with whom I use my genitals I must be in a long-term romantic relationship with them, and we must be having sex on a regular basis. Both conditions must be fulfilled, otherwise I will have whatever kind of sex I like, with whomever I like. If that results in the termination of the relationship, so be it.

[Lizzie60]

My parents never disagreed in front of me. That was a great life lesson they taught me. Their marriage (and how they negotiated parenting me) was their private business. I still sensed things, as I'm doing right now. IMO, James has himself talked into this and he's going with it. I'll support that, but am advising him of a different path. His choice.

 

James, if you filed for divorce today, how would your life change? I've done it, so I know for me. What do you think?

 

I'm thinking that your thinking, if you did, you still wouldn't get any sexual intimacy and you'd also have all the other negative things that go along with divorce and a family. Painful things. And still no sex. Interesting, isn't it?

 

Car.. I usually agree with all your posts.. I don't know how old are your kids.. I read that you are going through a divorce.. sorry about that.. but if you don,t mind me asking.. how old are your kids?

[Adunaphel]

If my partner told me something like that, I'd probably start a huge argument... and I'd need to know as soon as possible whether he meant it or not. If he meant it, I'd need to know where we stand...and he'd have a very hard time convincing me that he loves me, if he can bear the thought of me having sex with someone else.

[GorillaTheater]

I agree with my friend GT here, though there's one caveat I think is important to add:

 

It's no secret that divorce judgements are generally heavily biased against the male in the proceedings, so James' reluctance to go down that road is entirely understandable. Not only will he likely lose a minimum of 50% of his assets, plus be responsible for paying spousal support plus child support, he may also have his access to his kids severely restricted.

 

His fear is real, because it's based in reality. He's in a no-win situation. His wife gets all the positives of being in a relationship without any of the responsibilities. She could sue for divorce as well and he'd still be on the hook for all the financial and family repercussions.

 

This is indeed a very real possibility. Maybe it comes down to choice of which pain you want to have in your life. Truly awful.

[Trialbyfire]

No, I don't need it. I know my options and will make my choice(s). I wanted to know what reactions people would have. I wanted to see if I could gains some different perspectives that would help me move forward. I wanted to get some ideas from others who have been in a similar situation.

 

My posts as usual tend to ask question or counteract others to get further explanations.

 

Even if everyone who posted said, have an affair, I am the one who lives with my choice. On the other side, even if one person posts and idea that might make a difference, then this thread was worth every minute I "wasted" putting my feelings out for everyone to see and analyze.

 

I know that in this (and all situations) situation I have three options:

 

Live with it.

Fix it.

Leave it.

 

It is up to me to make a choice and plan a path.

Okay, then plse respond to my question about your marriage dynamics. Who's the dominant one within your relationship, beyond sex?

[Toodamnpragmatic]

I just find it so sad.... I don't know the answer, but I do agree with many that it is time to be blunt with her.

 

You have to insist on MC and IC for her. I don't give a darn, but you tell the MC everything you have done and go ballistic on her through that third party.

 

If she needs to see a Dr. for her physical problems you go with her and discuss it with the doctor.

 

You tell the MC in front of her that you are seriously thinking of an affair, because you are at your wits end. You are not an ogre and from your posts, frankly sound like someone who needs little to be happy (2-3 X's a month?).

 

And you also insist she be happy (since you claims she "seems" to enjoy it). That is what a marriage, relationship is all about.

 

If she is that unhappy, then yep a divorce is the only solution.

 

Time to put the ball in her court.

[2sure]

I guess I cannot wrap my head around the idea that it is even possible to truly love someone yet not have sex with them. Unless there is a medical condition or the spouse "uninterested" is having a personal physical self esteem issue. I mean, I have to have it. Even right now, while I for the most part hate my H - if he could shut up for ten minutes...with a drink or two I would do him.

[JamesM]

since I am probably the main stable parental figure in their life, a divorce would do incredible damage. Irreversible.

 

I find this statement a little disturbing I will admit.

 

I do not mean that she is not emotionally stable. Far from it with regard to the children. Inside her maybe. I know that she relies on me tremendously, and she sees me as a great father. I also know that she sees me as a good husband, and her best friend. What I am saying is that in every home, there is a person that is the most reliable to keep everything going. In this case, it is me. I say that not in arrogancy but from experience.

 

James, I understand your concern over your kids. But may I gently suggest that the above is your greatest fear over seeking a divorce? Don't get me wrong, for the sake of you and your marriage I dearly hope this gets resolved, but I also believe that divorce is a better option than going outside the marriage for sex.

 

 

 

Maybe to a degree I mean it that way, but I also mean it from the angle that it will be their idea of what a father is. Leaving for a seemingly selfish reason does not show a good example.

 

My parents never disagreed in front of me.

 

IMO, James has himself talked into this and he's going with it. I'll support that, but am advising him of a different path. His choice.

 

James, if you filed for divorce today, how would your life change? I've done it, so I know for me. What do you think?

 

 

It would change in every way. I cannot explain them all. It would change my mostly happy and secure life into one of turmoil and indecision. I do not know of any part of my life that would be better off.

 

What decision do you see me convinced of?

 

As for fighting in front of the kids, we do it freely, maybe too freely. But what they see is a resolution for most every problem. They see PDA. They see friendly conversations. They see us working together. I see nothing wrong with a decent respectable fight if it ends with a resolution. This teaches children more than if they never see their parents fighting at all. I think when they see us fighting that they are not unduly concerned because they know it will end sometime quickly and we will be smiling again. We really do not hold grudges.

 

Sex is usually discussed when we are alone.

 

Other than staying for the kids James, what are the other benefits of staying that outweigh leaving the marriage?

 

Everything but sex.

 

I guess my purpose of this thread was to get reactions to such a comment. How serious would you take it? How hopeless would you feel? What would be your plan of action after such a comment?

 

And thankfully, I am getting many perspectives.

[carhill]

if you don,t mind me asking.. how old are your kids?

 

My wife and I were biologically unable to have children. She blamed me, but had none with either of her past husbands either.

 

If I would've had kids, I would have divorced sooner. There's no way I'd put a child through what went on in our house. I'd have taken the financial hit and made a healthier life for them. I love kids and still hope to enjoy at least one of my own, with a compatible partner.

[hotgurl]

I can only speak from personal experience - I've been in relationships where everything was fine apart from the sex, and the lack of sex was my choice not my partner's. The reason I didn't want sex was because I just wasn't attracted to the guy in question - I still felt sexual desire but not for my partner. Yet despite that I stayed in those relationships for 2-3 years each time, because the guy let me get away with refusing sex and so everything was pretty comfortable for me. He paid half of the rent and bills, took me to the movies and out for dinner, kept me company when we stayed at home watching tv, provided emotional support and friendship, and didn't pressure me to do anything physical such as sex.

 

The main point is this: I wanted to keep my partner as a friend and for financial support etc, I didn't want him as a lover. He was willing to put up with not getting sex, hoping that things would change, but I was adamant that they never would because I didn't have those sort of feelings for him. It sounds to me like your wife has put her foot down and simly refuses to have sex with you - she'll let you hang around as long as you want because you're a convenient source of financial and emotional support, but she probably has no intention of ever having sex with you gain, even if it results in divorce.

 

The way I see it, you have three options: 1) Accept you will never have sex again, 2) Divorce her, or 3) Have an affair (which your wife seems to approve of, since it allows her to keep all the benefits of your relationship without ever having to have sex with you).

 

I have a question if your BF in this situation had an affiar would you have cared? would you be jealous?

 

just curious

[JamesM]

Okay, then plse respond to my question about your marriage dynamics. Who's the dominant one within your relationship, beyond sex?

 

Sorry, I meant to add that to my multi-quote. I did not intend to forget it.

 

I guess it would depend on the situation, but honestly from my perspective, she carries alot of dominance. Is she always the dominant one? No. Who has the final decision in most cases? Me. Who has a huge influence in how I make that decision? Her.

 

Is she a strong personality? Yes. Does she consider me a pushover? No, and that is not based on her words alone but also by her actions and comments made to others.

 

Does she feel that she is controlled? In no way. This was one of her fears as her father was a dictator in every sense of the word. When we first were married, I did finances. After awhile I could see that this made her feel as if I controlled her buying. Since then, I said she should pay the bills. We make financial decisions together.

 

Side note about her father....One thing I can say she admires about me is that I am the one BIL who dares to stand up to him in a civil way. I have gone against his wishes a number of times but have done so respectfully. The other BILs either get mad or avoid confrontation altogether.

[carhill]

Even right now, while I for the most part hate my H - if he could shut up for ten minutes...with a drink or two I would do him.

 

LOL, thanks for that levity, especially the part about him shutting up. You and my stbx could be good friends...that was a common complaint of hers. We'd go to bed and she'd want to get busy and I'd want to talk to get into the mood. Sex from intimacy.

 

Maybe I should've kept a little fridge of beer next to the bed

[Angel1111]

If you're wanting to know what other people's reaction would be - mine would be extreme hurt from being rejected in such a manner.

 

Honestly, James, I don't know what I'd do if I were in your situation where kids are involved and you've been married awhile. After the things I've been through in my life, I can tell you that there are no guarantees that you'll meet anyone better so you might just actually be better off where you are. That's just a cold, realistic fact.

 

I can definitely see why you're more inclined to stay than to leave. I just don't know if I could do it. I would come to resent my spouse so much that I wouldn't be able to be around him. But I'm a female and if I leave with kids, then I still have the kids most of the time. I'm not sure I'd do it if it meant being away from my kids so much. She has really put you in a bad spot. I guess you can't fault her for honesty. Now, if she's cheating on you, that would truly be the cherry on top. Maybe when your kids are grown, you can re-evaluate your life.

 

I sometimes wonder if marriage can really live up to our expectations - ever. Maybe it's not about the things we actually think it is.

[Trialbyfire]

Sorry, I meant to add that to my multi-quote. I did not intend to forget it.

 

I guess it would depend on the situation, but honestly from my perspective, she carries alot of dominance. Is she always the dominant one? No. Who has the final decision in most cases? Me. Who has a huge influence in how I make that decision? Her.

 

Is she a strong personality? Yes. Does she consider me a pushover? No, and that is not based on her words alone but also by her actions and comments made to others.

 

Does she feel that she is controlled? In no way. This was one of her fears as her father was a dictator in every sense of the word. When we first were married, I did finances. After awhile I could see that this made her feel as if I controlled her buying. Since then, I said she should pay the bills. We make financial decisions together.

 

Side note about her father....One thing I can say she admires about me is that I am the one BIL who dares to stand up to him in a civil way. I have gone against his wishes a number of times but have done so respectfully. The other BILs either get mad or avoid confrontation altogether.

Have you considered having her make some final decisions?

[Thornton]

I have a question if your BF in this situation had an affiar would you have cared? would you be jealous?

 

just curious

 

I have to admit that I wouldn't have cared if my bf had an affair in that situation. As long as he hung around and continued being my friend, paying half the bills etc, then I wouldn't have cared who he had sex with. My main concern would have been that he might fall in love with his affair partner and leave, thus withdrawing the financial and emotional support I was receiving. If he was going to continue our relationship as normal but just have sex with someone else and thus stop pestering me for it, I wouldn't have cared. I guess I felt like that because I only saw my partner as a friend or roommate, not as a lover - your friend can have sex with anyone and still be your friend.

[hotgurl]

james,

if the situation goes unchanged would you consider divorce when the kids are in college.

 

They are around 7 and 13 right?

 

do you think if things continue on this way. Will you resent her and fall out of love with her?

 

Does she truly know how much this hurts you?

[Lizzie60]

My wife and I were biologically unable to have children. She blamed me, but had none with either of her past husbands either.

 

If I would've had kids, I would have divorced sooner. There's no way I'd put a child through what went on in our house. I'd have taken the financial hit and made a healthier life for them. I love kids and still hope to enjoy at least one of my own, with a compatible partner.

 

With all your respect Car... if you never had kids.. you absolutely cannot say what you would or wouldn't do...

 

Someone who never had kids CANNOT understand what it is to be a parent.. sorry about that..

[Untouchable_Fire]

Sorry, I meant to add that to my multi-quote. I did not intend to forget it.

I guess it would depend on the situation, but honestly from my perspective, she carries alot of dominance. Is she always the dominant one? No. Who has the final decision in most cases? Me. Who has a huge influence in how I make that decision? Her.

Is she a strong personality? Yes. Does she consider me a pushover? No, and that is not based on her words alone but also by her actions and comments made to others.

Does she feel that she is controlled? In no way. This was one of her fears as her father was a dictator in every sense of the word. When we first were married, I did finances. After awhile I could see that this made her feel as if I controlled her buying. Since then, I said she should pay the bills. We make financial decisions together.

Side note about her father....One thing I can say she admires about me is that I am the one BIL who dares to stand up to him in a civil way. I have gone against his wishes a number of times but have done so respectfully. The other BILs either get mad or avoid confrontation altogether.

 

James, it really sounds like your in a pickle.

 

I've read enough of your overall story to believe that this situation is primarily caused by past trauma. I don't think she is capable of experiencing sex in a normal way.

 

I also tend to agree that there is some kind of potential for a past affair. Though I would put this as fairly unlikely.

 

I think she made you this offer because she feels guilty for not providing for you physically... not because she stepped out on you previously. Also, I don't think she actually believes you are the kind of man that can take her up on it.

[carhill]

With all your respect Car... if you never had kids.. you absolutely cannot say what you would or wouldn't do...

 

Someone who never had kids CANNOT understand what it is to be a parent.. sorry about that..

I gave you that opening on purpose. I wanted to see if empathy was a part of your personality. Thanks for answering as I predicted