Do you feel you're better than the wife?

[jj33]

No I dont. I wonder why he wont leave me alone and why he wont process his feelings for me. Not that those feelings should cause him to leave.

 

I dont see it as a competition between the W and the OW. Its not. Some people try to make it a competition or view it as a competition but its not in my view. People marry for all kinds of reasons and they divorce for all kinds of reasons. And its almost NEVER about who is "better" on an objective scale.

 

xMM has been in love with me for 5 years and hes making it a problem for both of us. The A has been over for several years. If they divorce for their own reasons, that is up to them. He wouldnt leave "for me" nor would I want him to. He is a man who is used to having things his way but in this case he cant have it "his way" unless he clones himself. And that is frustrating for him. He cant have a real relationship with me unless he leaves and he doesnt want to leave. The A grew beyond the time available for it. So there was nowhere for it to go.

 

He needs to come to terms with the choices he has made and leave me alone and do whatever it is he wants to do with his life.

 

Mistys situation is different.

[jasminetea]

No I dont. I wonder why he wont leave me alone and why he wont process his feelings for me. Not that those feelings should cause him to leave.

 

I dont see it as a competition between the W and the OW. Its not. Some people try to make it a competition or view it as a competition but its not in my view. People marry for all kinds of reasons and they divorce for all kinds of reasons. And its almost NEVER about who is "better" on an objective scale.

 

xMM has been in love with me for 5 years and hes making it a problem for both of us. The A has been over for several years. If they divorce for their own reasons, that is up to them. He wouldnt leave "for me" nor would I want him to.

 

But he needs to come to terms with the choices he has made and leave me alone and do whatever it is he wants to do with his life.

 

Mistys situation is different.

I think you're responding to a question I haven't asked. I was referring to how you felt at the time of your affair, not your situation now. Although it seems from the way you're writing your affair isn't over emotionally, even if physically.

 

jj33, you have a lot on your plate at the moment and it seems that its influenced your thinking about this thread, which is of course entirely understandable.

[jj33]

No at the time I never felt that way. I never felt in competition with her. I never wondered what was wrong with me vis a vis MM. We had a parallel life and I was the primary person in his life. He spoke to me more than anyone else and saw me more than anyone else. (which explains in part why he lapses back into that twitter thing with me)

 

I never wondered if she were "better" and thats why he wasnt leaving because I never saw it as a competition. I used to insist he do certain family things and make sure that he made the right choices to put them first when it was appropriate (like showing up for certain things when he thought he could blow them off with excuses).

 

Maybe that is not responsive either. Sorry Jas I will have to think about it when my head is clearer.

[jennie-jennie]

I don't know most of my MMs W... I've seen a few..

 

I don't think any OWs can answer this question objectively.

 

From what my MMs tell me, I'm very good in bed.. so I suppose I am better in that department..

 

For the rest.. I don't think I'm better but I can be just as good (ex. I am a good mother)... but I'm sure they are better cooks... (I hate cooking)..

 

LOL I am certain MM's wife is a better cook than me as well! I hate cooking too. Luckily he irons his shirts himself. Both W and I hate ironing.

[jasminetea]

No at the time I never felt that way. I never felt in competition with her. I never wondered what was wrong with me vis a vis MM. We had a parallel life and I was the primary person in his life. He spoke to me more than anyone else and saw me more than anyone else. (which explains in part why he lapses back into that twitter thing with me)

 

I never wondered if she were "better" and thats why he wasnt leaving because I never saw it as a competition. I used to insist he do certain family things and make sure that he made the right choices to put them first when it was appropriate (like showing up for certain things when he thought he could blow them off with excuses).

 

Maybe that is not responsive either. Sorry Jas I will have to think about it when my head is clearer.

 

No, no, that's a great explanation. I understand much better, I really should've 'got it' before now. This really demonstrates how diverse affairs/MM are and although many affairs have common traits, I guess this shows its always best to explore each one as unique before making an assessment.

 

Thanks jj33

[jj33]

Thanks. I must admit I used to worry that she has the time to do all sorts of things for them that I dont with my schedule and the access to certain things that he might have missed if he left her. And in all honesty I think that is a lot of why he stays. So if that is her being better, then she is. I never thought why am I not worthy. I simply accepted that being with her had certain distinct advantages.

[jasminetea]

Thanks. I must admit I used to worry that she has the time to do all sorts of things for them that I dont with my schedule and the access to certain things that he might have missed if he left her. And in all honesty I think that is a lot of why he stays. So if that is her being better, then she is. I never thought why am I not worthy. I simply accepted that being with her had certain distinct advantages.

 

Yeah, but as you (and others have) said before, its not about 'better', even though a few of us have felt that way at some point. What do you think about the power thing that Trialbyfire mentioned before? Does that ring true for your exMM?

[jj33]

I dont know. I dont know enough about his relationship with his W to know whether he has control there. Word on the street is that he does not but I suspect he does and exercises it in a passive agressive manner.

 

i think its more the ego thing and wanting to feel good. If you find something that makes you feel good about yourself, you want more of it. And in his case he wasnt "cheating" on his W. I was cheating myself. So he didnt have the same issues as a lot of MM.

[Adunaphel]

Straight up Adunaphel, I don't know how you can trust this man. What he's done to his wife, he can easily do to you too.

 

Thank you a lot for expressing this in a very straightforward way... it sounds like I am not listening... but I do listen, and appreciate the thought, even if I am currently trusting him.

 

My (current) perspective is that I do know that he can cheat, but I also know that he is not much of a cake eater.

A MM telling he wants to get separated does no necessarily mean anything, but seeing his separation papers does, IMO. It makes easier to believe that he really was not happy in the marriage.

[twistedmind]

Hiya,

 

I dont think I am better than her. I am different than her. My MM sent me a text one day, saying, if I had met you back then when I was in Germany, I would have never left Germany. I smiled, but later on I thought about it. Back then, I wasnt as far in my life, espescially emotionally, as I am now. Nor was he at the place where he is now. I would be lying if I said I dont have angry thoughts about her at times. Sometimes I shake my head at her behavior. I found out many things before him and I ever became involved. But I quickly have to calm myself down and say, look girly, she is who she is, and you are who you are. Just because she isnt like you, doesnt make her any less of a good woman. I dont hate her, sometimes I am angry at her, when I review all my info and see a leading behavior that he accepted. But my anger is really towards him, for accepting and tolerating everything. I want to shake him and say, grow some...well you know....cause with accepting and not standing up for himself, thats how he slid into this situation in the first place. Then again, he wouldnt have met me then.....

All twisted....like me!

I read a post on a board, a letter from the OW to the wife. That letter was tough to read and I thought, well dangit, it might be true, but why hurt someone like that. It had in it, while you are married to him and have his paycheck, I have his heart. While you get a good morning and a good night kiss, I get his passionate kisses......on and on and on. Was strange to read! Tough to read.

So......back to subject....

I dont think I am better, I just think her husband and I fit together better....

I am so twisted!

[Spoiled]

My A brought many mixed emotions. I was a close friend of my xMM and his W for 12years prior to the A. I was in contact with both throughout the A making it very difficult for him to lie about certain aspects of their relationship. His W and I had many similar qualities so I understood why he was attracted to me. Over the past few years, I noticed certain qualities changing within her for various reasons, which later to my surprise, he also mentioned. His desire to spend countless hours communicating with me, how he would spend his entire day off with me while she was home, risking the time with me, and feeling as if he were being more honest with me than her made me feel at times like I was better than her.

 

On the flip side, knowing he shared important aspects of life with her like holidays, sex, church, weekends, etc. also made me feel angry and used. In the end, I betrayed a friend and my spouse and took much of my attention from my H and children, therefore, I feel far less better than his W.

[ContemplatingTheEnd]

The bottom line is that no one in an affair really knows the other... you don't know the authenticity of their feelings, their thoughts, and the quality of life with their spouse. You know a compartmentalized segment of their life they have carved out with the precision of a surgeon's scalpel.

 

Fence sitting is a favorite past time of WS's and keeping the ball at play is the only thing keeping the affair alive.

 

Very good post. I couldn't agree more. I've been seeing a MM for six months and I am increasingly thinking he is really, really enjoying the place he is at (on the fence) and is quite content with it. Earlier on, he seemed more conflicted and uncomfortable with having sex with me, etc. But, he seems to have fallen into a comfortable place in our "relationship." And, of course, he has been comfortable in his marriage for the better part of the nine years.

 

I think trying to figure out whether the OP or BS is "better" is fruitless exercise that is based on foundations unable to come up with, like this post has said, any objective answer EVER. People's integrity, self-confidence, and moral compasses are all off when involved in an A, so -- especially as an OW -- I am constantly judging myself and thinking how horrible so many people would think of me if they knew I was involved with a MM. That would never, ever make me think I am BETTER than his wife. Like I said in an earlier post, it's the opposite. She is the one MM chose to marry and have his children. It's a constant battle for me to not feel exceedingly inferior -- not just to his wife, but to my self before this A and the people in my life.

[GreenEyedLady]

Does having a MM pursue you and/or everything that entails being with an MM make you feel that you must be better than his wife? And if so, in what way(s) have you felt you were better than her? Do you know an OW like this?

 

If not now, have you ever felt you were better than his wife? Has it ever been an ego boost to know a MM wanted to be with you?

 

The funny thing is that you spend an in ordinate amount of time thinking you're not as good. Otherwise he would be with you, not her.

 

And what if the OW is "better?" The BS always trump that with well she's a horrible human being, she sleeps with MM so that makes them "better."

 

Better doesn't really matter and differs according to preference. It's the R that matters. Whichever R is the one that meets more of MP's needs is usually the one they choose.

 

GEL

[jasminetea]

I'm not interested in the actuality of who's better. Its of course, unfathomable and irrelevant. But it doesn't stop people from feeling they're better and that's what I was interested in.

[Trialbyfire]

Thank you a lot for expressing this in a very straightforward way... it sounds like I am not listening... but I do listen, and appreciate the thought, even if I am currently trusting him.

 

My (current) perspective is that I do know that he can cheat, but I also know that he is not much of a cake eater.

A MM telling he wants to get separated does no necessarily mean anything, but seeing his separation papers does, IMO. It makes easier to believe that he really was not happy in the marriage.

I wouldn't doubt that he wasn't happy in his marriage. The question is, where will he be with you, when the roller coaster hits the dips in the tracks? He's already shown you where he went, when his marriage hit that dip. Instead of focusing on his marriage and working on whatever his issues were, he wandered off to find external validation.

 

Edit - Anyways, you know all this but are convinced he has or can change and this time, will be different. Perhaps so, perhaps not. Your life, your gamble.

[OWoman]

I guess the fact that I was always glad to be me, and not her, did make me feel I was "better" than her. I certainly would not have wanted her life, or her situation - or any of her relationships, problems or anything else.

[Taramere]

I'm not interested in the actuality of who's better. Its of course, unfathomable and irrelevant. But it doesn't stop people from feeling they're better and that's what I was interested in.

 

I'm answering from a cheated on's perspective rather than that of the OW - but I'm not sure it's so very different. Whether it's the OW or the wife/partner, she's probably going to fall into that trap of comparing herself to her "rival" at some point. Asking "am I better?" or maintaining "Of course I'm better."

 

When I got cheated on (though not in a marital sense) my feeling was that the woman he cheated on me with was a far better fit for him. He denied that, and claimed that he was just confused about what he wanted, had been drunk when he slept with her etc etc. I'd seen them together though. Not having sex (it wasn't as bad as that!) Just seeing how they interacted with eachother in a social context, you could see there was a definite connection.

 

It was quite clear that she and he had more in common than he and I did - but because we'd lasted in a relationship for so long up until that point (and, of course, had lots of good times together), it was hard to see that and just let go without a fight.

 

I think "the fit" is what it probably comes down to in most cases. Trying to change yourself to be "better" (in his eyes) than the other woman might be of benefit to a woman if that involves making healthy changes that are long overdue. Losing weight, smartening her image up a bit. Unfortunately because of the negativity and stress surrounding a situation like that it might be more likely that a woman would lose weight in an unhealthy way, set impossible standards for herself in terms of improving her looks or looking younger etc. My heart sinks whenever I look at this section of the forum and see the "I'm younger, slimmer etc" cattiness set in. Do women really want to do that to eachother? I'm glad it doesn't seem to be the case on this thread.

 

Anyway, whether she's the wife or the OW, a woman in one of these triangle situations has to decide "never mind whether I'm prettier, younger, smarter, better in bed or whatever. Never mind his subjective opinion about who is 'better'. Do this bloke and I fit well together? Do we really have that much in common, or am I deluding myself?" If he's off developing close romantic and sexual bonds with someone else, then that suggests that the fit isn't as good as one might think, or hope.

 

But yes, to answer your question JT...I did think I was better than her. Cheating with my bf or not, she wasn't the kind of person I'd want to hang out and be friends with. I wouldn't trust her to give sound and objective advice to anyone. I thought she was a needy, annoying and whiny individual (but I'd seen the connection, so I was probably biased on that score). The fact that he'd bonded with her and cheated on me with her brought into sharp focus that he really wasn't my kind of a guy. Sounds so simple now, but obviously at the time it was really upsetting because he was someone who, at that point in my life, I cared a lot about.

[silverstalkings]

absolutely...

she was over 50lbs overweight and took third place in a porkchop eating contest recently..

they also had very little in common...

[jasminetea]

Taramere, I like that analysis. I think it takes a lot of bravey to admit that your WS and an OW can be more compatible. And what a great observation that it proves the WS wasn't your type of guy.

 

My heart sinks whenever I look at this section of the forum and see the "I'm younger, slimmer etc" cattiness set in. Do women really want to do that to eachother? I'm glad it doesn't seem to be the case on this thread.

 

You spoke too soon I laughed seeing the following immediately after your post.

 

absolutely...

she was over 50lbs overweight and took third place in a porkchop eating contest recently..

they also had very little in common...

[Taramere]

Taramere, I like that analysis. I think it takes a lot of bravey to admit that your WS and an OW can be more compatible. And what a great observation that it proves the WS wasn't your type of guy.

 

Not really brave. He was nerdy, but I found him interesting, funny and sweet. The friend he slept with was cute in a kind of geeky way. From a purely visual perspective they meshed well. Also he always liked to smoke a bit of dope, and she did too - so once he formed a friendship with her he was able to immerse himself a bit more in the scene that goes along with all of that. It was a culture gap, really,and it became far more obvious once he met her.

 

You spoke too soon I laughed seeing the following immediately after your post.

 

You have to admit....Getting your name in the paper for winning third place in a pork chop eating contest is a pretty novel way of showing an ex that you're getting on with your life and doing things.

[OWoman]

You have to admit....Getting your name in the paper for winning third place in a pork chop eating contest is a pretty novel way of showing an ex that you're getting on with your life and doing things.

 

or, back to "Business as usual"...?

[jasminetea]

Not really brave. He was nerdy, but I found him interesting, funny and sweet. The friend he slept with was cute in a kind of geeky way. From a purely visual perspective they meshed well. Also he always liked to smoke a bit of dope, and she did too - so once he formed a friendship with her he was able to immerse himself a bit more in the scene that goes along with all of that. It was a culture gap, really,and it became far more obvious once he met her.

Screw that, my ex matched his many OW pretty well, much better than he matched me, but it took me a very long while to stop feeling bitter about the fact. Go on, take the plaudits.

 

You have to admit....Getting your name in the paper for winning third place in a pork chop eating contest is a pretty novel way of showing an ex that you're getting on with your life and doing things.

LMAO! Great observation

[Taramere]

Screw that, my ex matched his many OW pretty well, much better than he matched me, but it took me a very long while to stop feeling bitter about the fact. Go on, take the plaudits.

 

Oh no - don't get me wrong, I didn't just accept it and move on with life. I was a confused and unhappy mess...but there were other things going on (eg an employment problem plus the death of three extended family members in close proximity to eachother) that clouded everything. Including my judgement at times.

 

At times like that it becomes really tricky to figure out what the source of which piece of pain is, and it's easy to lump it all onto one source. Once a difficult period is well in the past, it's easy to sound okay about it.

[Adunaphel]

I wouldn't doubt that he wasn't happy in his marriage. The question is, where will he be with you, when the roller coaster hits the dips in the tracks? He's already shown you where he went, when his marriage hit that dip. Instead of focusing on his marriage and working on whatever his issues were, he wandered off to find external validation.

Anyways, you know all this but are convinced he has or can change and this time, will be different. Perhaps so, perhaps not. Your life, your gamble.

 

The point is that I do not expect him to change...nor I want him to.

His marriage *did* hit a dip a number of times... and survived... it is mainly base incompatibility, bad communication and growing apart that it did not survive. How long can someone try to work on marriage issue? How long should they stay in a marriage and be unhappy?

It is bad he had an affair, and the right thing would certainly have been to get separated first and see someone else after, but at least he did not act like the average cake eating cheater.

I hope he never cheats on me, but if he ever does I hope the dynamics are the same as when he cheated on her with me: our relationship is basically over anyway, he *did* try to fix things first, he does not get intimate with me when he is having an affair, and I have access to as many signs that he is having an affair as his W had.

I *am* worried, sure. I am worried that his W's side of the story might differ a lot from his. Knowing that someone *can* cheat is unsettling... and you never really know someone...like you said it's a gamble, I just hope he is the kinf of guy I hope.

Thank you for your opinion and for the interest, really. I like talking about this subject, I am always interested in your point of view, and it's nice of you to take the time to reply to me.

[Impudent Oyster]

Does having a MM pursue you and/or everything that entails being with an MM make you feel that you must be better than his wife?

 

Oh how silly, MM hit on women all the time, if I had a nickle for every time one hit on me I'd be rich.

 

Personally I find it insulting that any married man would think I'm stupid or desperate enough to get involved with him. Because the fact is, no self-assured self respecting woman would take it any other way.