23 Days No Contact...And I Get A Note...

[JimmyB26]

So, I come home on the 23rd day of not responding to anything that she's tried, the calling, the texting, and I find a card in my mail. I open it, and it's got pictures of us together, and a long note not only thanking me for her birthday gifts, but going on about how much I've taught her and how much I've contributed to her life, and how unique I am, and all that I've meant to her over the past year that we've known each other, and that she hopes we have many more years together. I noticed that she started the note on September 1st, but it was postmarked September 8th, and I got it on the 9th. We live a couple zip codes apart, within 2 miles.

 

This is the 22 year old former student I was with while I was separated/getting divorced. I couldn't be there for her entirely and she got unhappy and split to be with someone she met over spring break. She had told me at the time that she thought we'd be engaged in a couple years if she stuck around and she just wasn't ready. So first she downgraded us to FWB, and then after a while, split entirely. Since then I've tried NC twice, but she's always pulled me back, gotten panicked, nervous, and upset that I was leaving her life as if she had some right to me.

 

Now I've been doing my best to move on, but she's always tried to pull me back, and this is another attempt to do so. I'm kind of getting the sense that she knows how different I am than the boys her age, and she's hoping that she can keep me around as Mr. Right, but have her fun with her Mr. Right-Nows. In other words, she considers me marriage material for when she's ready for that kind of commitment. But the fact of the matter is, that when we're around each other, both of us sense the continuing attraction, and if I were her current or any boyfriend, I wouldn't want to know about the existence of someone in my capacity.

 

She only has the most vague sense of my life right now and who I'm seeing, what I'm doing - but it just seems like she doesn't want me right now but doesn't want anyone else to have me. The card and all these attempts, all this chasing, it isn't something that she would do for someone who she considers just a friend. But it's clearly not what she would do for someone who she wants.

 

I sent a single text message telling her that I got the note and thanking her for all that she said and the sentiment she conveyed. That's all I said. Came from a place of control. I didn't ask her any questions, didn't communicate anything about my life, but I didn't want to be a total jerk and not respond at all.

 

The next time she gets in touch, I will explain to her the options. She can try and stake her claim to me right now, or step aside. And if she steps aside, she risks the possibiity that she will lose me forever to some other woman. She apparently isn't all too comfortable with that possibility. If she's considering me for "down-the-line" then there's no reason for us to communicate in the present and she runs the same risk as stepping aside.

 

The one thing that I think she's waking up to is that I don't need her in my life, and if she wants to be in my life, it's on my terms.

 

Any advice?

[silic0ntoad]

I would reply to her. Simply say, if you want to be with me, then be with me. Otherwise, let me go. It's all or nothing.

 

Sometimes it's meant to be man. You just have to figure out if it is or not.

[JimmyB26]

I replied last night with a single text informing her that I got the card and thanking her for it. I was going to wait for the next time she got in touch with me to say anything further.

[CaliGuy]

What more do you need to say?

 

Remember, it's ACTIONS that speak from the heart, not words. The pictures, the note -- those are just words.

 

ACTIONS would be her showing up at your door, saying she is sorry, saying she wants to fix things. She isn't doing that. And until she does, her words and actions are not in harmony.

 

Why do you need to tell her anything?! I wouldn't -- unless you feel you need to tell her that you're not interested in her "words" anymore. That is what NC does, really. I mean, yes it's meant to help you heal but it also sends a clear message to your ex: "Your words are meaningless..."

 

Actions are entirely different. And so far, I don't see any ACTION on her part.

 

Just meaningless, trifle words.

[alexxx]

First you need to ask yourself: "What do I want?".

 

I am not sure you know what you want and therefore nobody here can help you much.

 

So, tell us, what do you really want from this girl?

 

If you want to heal, then you need to implement a complete (and I'll say again - complete!) NC. Because, sooner or later, you WILL go complete NC (but, the sooner the better for you).

 

If, on the other hand, you would like to get her back, then implementing a complete NC will send her a message that you don't want her back, and she will slowly lose any remaining interest in you.

 

Now, to be complete honest, I don't believe you have an option, because she clearly doesn't want you back. You acted weird by showing her a lot of attention but then you suddenly you shut up. Silence. She is completely puzzled, everybody would be.

 

I believe she just wants some validation, that's it.

[mimiminx]

I would reply to her. Simply say, if you want to be with me, then be with me. Otherwise, let me go. It's all or nothing.

 

totally agree.

[alexxx]

I would reply to her. Simply say, if you want to be with me, then be with me. Otherwise, let me go. It's all or nothing.

 

totally agree.

 

 

Miniminix,

 

Yes, he can ask that, but what does he get? Another round of pain and humiliation.

 

Don't we all know answer, pretty much:

 

"Oh, I love you, I care about you, but, right now I can't be with you. I am confused, I don't know what I want, I am just not ready now... blah blah..."

 

Keeping him on a short leash.

 

So why would he repeatedly humiliate himself by asking her about their relationship, while, at the same time, she has never mentioned their relationship ONCE after they broke up.

[alexxx]

Just to add...

 

The possible response from her that I wrote in the previous post is the "best case scenario". More likely she will not go that far. But it really doesn't matter, these are just words and not her ACTIONS.

 

ACTIONS are, as Caliguy writes, the only things that count.

[CaliGuy]

ACTIONS are, as Caliguy writes, the only things that count.

 

Bingo. Unless they are literally beating down your front door, their words are meaningless.

[JimmyB26]

She's obviously saving me for marriage material, because she makes references when we're together to naming children and what type of diamond she wants, and what type of wedding she wants, but it's something she's just not ready for, apparently. But in her mind, she thinks that she can keep her hooks in me until she's made a decision about who she wants to fill that role. And it's flattering in a way.

 

Deep down, if she's working hard to secure a safety net of anyone, be it me or someone else if I'm not going to be there, then she knows already in some way that she doesn't want the guy she's with. She may not want to admit it to anyone, even herself, but if there's emotional adultery, it's not going to be the relationship she wants. It's not fulfilling completely, and she's just going to stick with it because she can and because she's got a guy under her spell, and it's easy, and she's in college.

 

So what I'll say to her is that both of us know what kind of role she wants me to play in her life. And both of us know that she's not ready for that. So I'm going to go live my life, and see other women, and she knows how to get in touch with me if and when she's ready, but not before. And we will not be in touch until that time. At that time, I'll be as open to the possibility as I can given my status, but I'll look for significant change, and her actions, and not her words to dictate her intent. I'll also say that fundamentally, if she wants any future with me, I don't want to know that she regularly keeps a backup, because it only shows me the kind of insecurity that she has in a relationship, and I'd never be able to fully trust her. So I want to see her relationships live and die on their own without any net to catch her fall. I don't want to "experience" her relationships as a backup because I'd always be wondering myself.

 

Now of course, when I bolt, she'll find some other sad sack to assume the role of backup guy. But I hope that she takes it to heart enough or grows up enough during the interim that I see that it's something she doesn't do anymore when she comes back around.

[dianna]

Jimmy I trust you will do the right thing.Keep us posted

 

 

CaliGuy can I bring you home?

[JimmyB26]

Is that a solid, fair statement? Anyone see any problems with that?

[Beeotch]

What more do you need to say?

 

Remember, it's ACTIONS that speak from the heart, not words. The pictures, the note -- those are just words.

 

ACTIONS would be her showing up at your door, saying she is sorry, saying she wants to fix things. She isn't doing that. And until she does, her words and actions are not in harmony.

 

Why do you need to tell her anything?! I wouldn't -- unless you feel you need to tell her that you're not interested in her "words" anymore. That is what NC does, really. I mean, yes it's meant to help you heal but it also sends a clear message to your ex: "Your words are meaningless..."

 

Actions are entirely different. And so far, I don't see any ACTION on her part.

 

Just meaningless, trifle words.

 

Sending someone a card....going out to buy it, write it, mail it etc are ALL actions.

 

No matter what you do words are going to be involved....

 

So even showing up at someone's door and talking...that can still be just words....

 

 

It is OVERTIME through actions: sending cards, showing up at the door, sticking to your word etc that means something.

 

 

What is an action in your opinion? Outlandish stunts from the movies?

[JimmyB26]

I think both Beotch and Caliguy have valid arguments. It was an action full of words.

 

I'm fairly certain that she flew out to the city where the LDR bf lives this weekend. That's a bigger action. So she put the card in the mail on Tuesday and flew out on Thursday.

 

Now, as far as her relationship with him goes, with what the card says, best case scenario, she's secretly emotionally cheating on him with me. Worst case scenario for her relationship, she's going down there because she had no idea that I would put her in NC when she bought the ticket, but now is having serious doubts. She does have other friends down there who she can see and stay with. Actually, quite a few. I'm not really too concerned with the details, and ultimately, I can't control them so I have to not care. It's Miami and it's a getaway, so why not enjoy it if you can't refund the ticket?

 

The statement I outlined a few posts up doesn't have to change at all. It's still sound, it's still constructive, and in control. It's not cold, it's on my terms, and communicates my interest.

[alexxx]

Sending someone a card....going out to buy it, write it, mail it etc are ALL actions.

 

No matter what you do words are going to be involved....

 

So even showing up at someone's door and talking...that can still be just words....

 

 

It is OVERTIME through actions: sending cards, showing up at the door, sticking to your word etc that means something.

 

 

What is an action in your opinion? Outlandish stunts from the movies?

 

What is an action?

 

I hope Caliguy will not object if I try to answer your question, because I believe that he and I (and majority on this board) are on the same page in this regard.

 

"Action" is something PROACTIVE, leading to some progress. It does not have to be "physical".

 

For example, if she says: "I want you back"? That would be an action.

 

On the other hand, saying: "I miss you" is NOT an action. That is just a simple statement that maintains "status quo".

[Beeotch]

What is an action?

 

I hope Caliguy will not object if I try to answer your question, because I believe that he and I (and majority on this board) are on the same page in this regard.

 

"Action" is something PROACTIVE, leading to some progress. It does not have to be "physical".

 

For example, if she says: "I want you back"? That would be an action.

 

On the other hand, saying: "I miss you" is NOT an action. That is just a simple statement that maintains "status quo".

 

 

I feel as though saying "I want you back" is not an action...it is simply making a definitive statement. You can say you want someone, love someone, would kill for someone but those words can come up empty if you don't take the steps to show you actually would.

 

I think tetxing "I miss you" is lame and can barely be considered an action...but for example, sending me roses with a card attached spelling out that you miss me and want me is more of an action as it takes more work....but in the end....there still has to be some follow up.

 

I just think we have to be careful of how we categorize things as well as we have to look at people on an individual level.

 

There is a book called The Five Love Languages and basically the idea is that everyone expresses love/care and expects love/care to be expressed to them in a particular way. One major problem in relationships is that people do not know each other's "love language" i.e. what actions/deed/words their partner sees as a sign of love, care, appreciation. They may do something that THEY WOULD LIKE and think it is showing love/care but in their partner's eyes they do not perceive that action in the same way. Guess that is a communication barrier.

 

I'm saying that to say: this concept that beating down someone's door literally is the ONLY way to show you are genuine is not true and not the way in which everyone would go about things and it is also not what everyone would appreciate. So the key is finding out what means a lot to this individual and what they find to be a sign of care and doing it. That is positive, proactive action.

[alexxx]

I feel as though saying "I want you back" is not an action...it is simply making a definitive statement. You can say you want someone, love someone, would kill for someone but those words can come up empty if you don't take the steps to show you actually would.

 

You are mixing apples and oranges and putting words in my mouth. I explicitly said that saying "love someone, would kill for someone" is NOT AN ACTION.

 

I was also speaking in context of this particular (and similar) relationship. So let's stay focused. We all know that she misses him for various reasons: hurt feelings, validation, good time at the concert, ... etc. She can express that by saying "I miss you" or "You mean a lot to me". This happens all the time; just by reading the posts on this board you can see that this is a common pattern. But that (alone) does not mean that she wants to be romantically involved with him again. She isn't taking any ACTIONS to show him that she wants to change present situation.

 

"I want you back" is a totally different story, it is basically an offer on the table that he can chose to accept or not.

 

There is a book called The Five Love Languages and basically the idea is that everyone expresses love/care and expects love/care to be expressed to them in a particular way. One major problem in relationships is that people do not know each other's "love language" i.e. what actions/deed/words their partner sees as a sign of love, care, appreciation. They may do something that THEY WOULD LIKE and think it is showing love/care but in their partner's eyes they do not perceive that action in the same way. Guess that is a communication barrier.

 

Yes, I am sure that there are TONS of books in line with your way of thinking. Unlike some of those, the stories on this board are based on REAL experiences and told by REAL people. This is almost an empirical science, difficult to question.

 

I'm saying that to say: this concept that beating down someone's door literally is the ONLY way to show you are genuine is not true and not the way in which everyone would go about things and it is also not what everyone would appreciate.

 

It is a METAPHOR. I am sorry that you didn't get that.

[CaliGuy]

CaliGuy can I bring you home?

 

 

Are you cute?!

[CaliGuy]

What is an action?

 

I hope Caliguy will not object if I try to answer your question, because I believe that he and I (and majority on this board) are on the same page in this regard.

 

"Action" is something PROACTIVE, leading to some progress. It does not have to be "physical".

 

For example, if she says: "I want you back"? That would be an action.

 

On the other hand, saying: "I miss you" is NOT an action. That is just a simple statement that maintains "status quo".

 

Not stepping on my toes, no, but I see actions as an ACT, not a statement.

 

Saying I love you isn't an action. It's a statement.

Proving you love someone is an action.

 

So if someone says "I love you and want to be with you" and they're not with you, perhaps even dating someone else, that would mean the words and actions are not in harmony.

 

It's not an action to me to say you love me. It's an action to BE with me, proving that you do. If you're with someone else, then you don't really love me the way you say you do.

[JimmyB26]

 

If, on the other hand, you would like to get her back, then implementing a complete NC will send her a message that you don't want her back, and she will slowly lose any remaining interest in you.

 

As we've seen on this forum, do you really think this is an accurate statement? People hear from ex's they've completely ignored ALL THE TIME on this forum. In fact, from all the threads I've read through, complete NC often works better to move on and produce second chances than incomplete NC.

 

The other thing I'm curious about that I've never heard addressed on this forum... when a woman slides you into the backup seat and tries to maintain you there while she's in a relationship, she has to know deep down that the relationship isn't ideal and isn't going to wind up being the one that she wants to stick with - because ultimately, if she was with the right person, she wouldn't need any backburner material. Or do women keep guys around like this anyway?

[alexxx]

Not stepping on my toes, no, but I see actions as an ACT, not a statement.

 

Saying I love you isn't an action. It's a statement.

Proving you love someone is an action.

 

So if someone says "I love you and want to be with you" and they're not with you, perhaps even dating someone else, that would mean the words and actions are not in harmony.

 

It's not an action to me to say you love me. It's an action to BE with me, proving that you do. If you're with someone else, then you don't really love me the way you say you do.

 

 

Then sorry for misinterpreting you From now on I will only speak for myself.

 

I do think "I want you back" is fundamentally different from "I love you" or "I care about you", because, even all of these are just words, the first one is likely to result in a reconciliation (down the road), whereas the last two rarely do. We have plenty of examples proving that the last two are only signaling a moment of "weakness" in a dumper.

[alexxx]

As we've seen on this forum, do you really think this is an accurate statement? People hear from ex's they've completely ignored ALL THE TIME on this forum. In fact, from all the threads I've read through, complete NC often works better to move on and produce second chances than incomplete NC.

 

Yes, they hear from them, but they don't get back with them. My personal opinion is that, once they write you off, without a good reason (and in particular if they are not mad at you), chances of reconciliation are virtually 0. I wish I was wrong, but this is my sincere opinion.

 

The other thing I'm curious about that I've never heard addressed on this forum... when a woman slides you into the backup seat and tries to maintain you there while she's in a relationship, she has to know deep down that the relationship isn't ideal and isn't going to wind up being the one that she wants to stick with - because ultimately, if she was with the right person, she wouldn't need any backburner material. Or do women keep guys around like this anyway?

 

I agree, I think that her relationship with the other guy isn't any better than the one with you.

[NopeNah]

Then sorry for misinterpreting you From now on I will only speak for myself.

 

I do think "I want you back" is fundamentally different from "I love you" or "I care about you", because, even all of these are just words, the first one is likely to result in a reconciliation (down the road), whereas the last two rarely do. We have plenty of examples proving that the last two are only signaling a moment of "weakness" in a dumper.

The first one can also be sent during a moment of weakness on the dumpers part. i.e. Their new "one's" not working out, lonely at that moment,ect.. When what they could really be saying is "at this exact moment in my life, I want you back." The next hour/day/week/month their feelings might not be the same. This is why actions, not words should be required.

[alexxx]

Let me just add, that the first part of my post applies only when a women is a dumper. We are so different in this regard.

[alexxx]

The first one can also be sent during a moment of weakness on the dumpers part. i.e. Their new "one's" not working out, lonely at that moment,ect.. When what they could really be saying is "at this exact moment in my life, I want you back." The next hour/day/week/month their feelings might not be the same. This is why actions, not words should be required.

 

I agree, everything is possible. What I had in mind is *in VAST MAJORITY of cases*.