Are single male friends appropriate for a married woman?

[zenith138]

I'm just not sure what the general thought on this is. I thought I knew what the social norm was for this sort of thing, but I'm being told I am wrong.

 

My wife has never had male friends since we've been married. She's never given me any reason to think she has ever done anything innapropriate or has any interest in straying outside of our marriage either. Recently she has reconnected with a couple of men that she was friends with in high school, but hasn't spoken to in 12-15 years. One friend in particular, she has been texting, e-mailing, private messaging, etc really bothers me. She met him at the bar for a very short time near closing a few weeks ago without my knowledge. Again, I have no reason to believe it is anything but innocent, but it is a relationship with a man that I have never met, and a relationship that I am not a part of. Prior to the last couple of weeks it has always been my thought that everyone would think that making new friends of the opposite sex is innapropriate for married people. I've never met this guy, and not knowing him makes me even more unconfortable with the situation.

 

Am I being obsessive and controlling here? Should I let it go and get with the 2000's?

 

Thanks for your input!

[luckyme99]

nooooooooooooooooooo!!!! you are not being obsessive, she is being VERY disrespectful - especially if she is sending "private" messages - why do they need to be private if she isn't hiding anything? I am not saying she is doing anything - but it almost like she is engaged emotionally with him. going for drinks? inappropriate. My hubby is best friends with his ex girl friend of five years - i said the only way i would be comfortable with it is if we all met for drinks and we could all be friends. I could determine for myself how the relationship is and am now ok with it.

I would ask to meet this person - there is no way she should be spending quality time with another male if it's making you uncomfortable.

talk to her - if she gets defensive, then she is being childish - ask her to put on your shoes.

Good luck!

[angie2443]

It doesn't matter what decade or century it is, if your partner is secretly meeting someone at a bar, sending him private messages, etc., it can only mean trouble. Keep your eyes open and protect yourself. Good luck.

[zenith138]

Thanks for the replies here, I appreciate it.

 

I do want to clarify one thing about the bar, I didn't know about it at the time, but she did tell me about it in an offhanded way about 2 weeks after the fact. Once I processed what she told me I was upset about it, and made it clear that I was not comfortable with it.

[quankanne]

are they communicating on a fairly regular basis and she's being secretive about it? If so, that's potential trouble.

 

I've got guy friends – married and single. And I make it a point to let my husband know when I've heard from them, or about the guys I've caught up with after several years. Because I do that, he seems to be cool with the fact that I stay in touch with these friends. However, I make it a POINT to include my husband if I'm meeting these folks or if I'm visiting them ... it's a very open/transparent relationship because I do NOT want him feeling threatened by these friendships, but included.

[angie2443]

Thanks for the replies here, I appreciate it.

 

I do want to clarify one thing about the bar, I didn't know about it at the time, but she did tell me about it in an offhanded way about 2 weeks after the fact. Once I processed what she told me I was upset about it, and made it clear that I was not comfortable with it.

 

She did this for a reason. She sensed/knew it crossed a boundry and didn't want you to put your foot down, or become angry. If she told you before hand, you might have had more power in the situation. By waiting two weeks after the fact, what could you have done? This way, she was able to meet the guy and not feel guilty about keeping it from you.

[looking4 green grass]

What does your own gut REALLY say? Listen to it. Secrecy is unacceptable on any level, and I've managed to convince myself I'm still in the "young and hip" generation and I still feel that way.

[Devil Inside]

I think that you have every right to feel uncomfortable. The main thing to hold on to is that you feel uncomfortable with the lack of boundaries. Seems like you were cool with her having male friends...but it's the extent of conversation, the fact that you haven't met them, and the secrecy of the whole thing that seems off. Tell her that.

 

If she gets defensive or can't respect the boundaries that make you comfortable then it might be time to get worried.

[seibert253]

I'm just not sure what the general thought on this is. I thought I knew what the social norm was for this sort of thing, but I'm being told I am wrong.

 

My wife has never had male friends since we've been married. She's never given me any reason to think she has ever done anything innapropriate or has any interest in straying outside of our marriage either. Recently she has reconnected with a couple of men that she was friends with in high school, but hasn't spoken to in 12-15 years. One friend in particular, she has been texting, e-mailing, private messaging, etc really bothers me. She met him at the bar for a very short time near closing a few weeks ago without my knowledge. Again, I have no reason to believe it is anything but innocent, but it is a relationship with a man that I have never met, and a relationship that I am not a part of. Prior to the last couple of weeks it has always been my thought that everyone would think that making new friends of the opposite sex is innapropriate for married people. I've never met this guy, and not knowing him makes me even more unconfortable with the situation.

 

Am I being obsessive and controlling here? Should I let it go and get with the 2000's?

 

Thanks for your input!

 

If you let it go, you are setting youself up for quite a fall. There are red flags waiving all over the place and it's good you see them. DO NOT IGNORE THEM. You have to lay down the groundwork and put a stop to this right now.

 

Now your wife will be mad, nothings going on, we're just friends, yada yada. Simple, put it to her like this:

Honey, if I did A, B, and C, (all of the above things you've described above), with a single women, are you telling you you wouldn't have a problem or be concerned about this. The meeting him at a bar without your knowledge is disrespectful at least, and you should tell her this. Let her know you feel disrespected by her actions, you are hurt, and you feel the time she's investing in this "friendship" is taking time away from your marriage. YOU NEED TO STAND TALL AND BE FIRM.

 

Man I'm telling you, if you allow this to continue she will cheat on you.

[zenith138]

Thanks again everybody who has posted a reply.

 

We have been talking the whole issue to death, and where it's been pretty much left at is a stalemate of "There's absolutely nothing wrong with having guy friends" vs "It's not appropriate and I feel uncomfortable with it." Having some insight as to what the "general" point of view is to this type of situation is very insightful.

 

I've left out some details of the situation as a whole in order to get responses to the basic question of appropriateness in general, but I have tried very hard to represent the facts accurately on both sides of the argument.

 

I showed my wife the initial post, and she thought it important to clarify the fact that when she met the guy at the bar she was not alone, and he also was accompanied by his friends.

[Thornton]

Married women having male friends is ok if:

 

1) She doesn't fancy him and has never slept with him

 

2) She doesn't spend too much time with him, especially not alone

 

3) The relationship isn't too intimate, nothing inappropriate is discussed

 

4) The guy knows she is married and is also friendly towards her husband, so the husband isn't excluded from the friendship

 

In your case I don't necessarily think your wife is cheating, but I think she should be open about her communication with this man and should introduce you to him.

[SpanksTheMonkey]

I reflect a few others opinions that while I don't think shes actually cheating with him she is disrespecting you by running behind your back. And seeing contacting him on the hush hush heres a idea why don't you offer to meet him you guys can go out to dinner or something and see how she reacts?

[SpanksTheMonkey]

Thanks again everybody who has posted a reply.

 

We have been talking the whole issue to death, and where it's been pretty much left at is a stalemate of "There's absolutely nothing wrong with having guy friends" vs "It's not appropriate and I feel uncomfortable with it." Having some insight as to what the "general" point of view is to this type of situation is very insightful.

 

I've left out some details of the situation as a whole in order to get responses to the basic question of appropriateness in general, but I have tried very hard to represent the facts accurately on both sides of the argument.

 

I showed my wife the initial post, and she thought it important to clarify the fact that when she met the guy at the bar she was not alone, and he also was accompanied by his friends.

Theres nothing wrong with her having guy friends the prob is when she hides the contact with them if its so Innocent why hide it? I have male friends and I wouldn't hesitate to invite my partner along to hang out with us at any given time!

I would never just wonder off and meet up with them with out him knowing epically at bar/club its called respecting your other half simple ask her how she would feel if you did something like that?

[seibert253]

Theres nothing wrong with her having guy friends the prob is when she hides the contact with them if its so Innocent why hide it? I have male friends and I wouldn't hesitate to invite my partner along to hang out with us at any given time!

I would never just wonder off and meet up with them with out him knowing epically at bar/club its called respecting your other half simple ask her how she would feel if you did something like that?

 

Exactly. If everything is up front and on the up and up, it's no problem IMO. But, if things are hidden, convieniently forgotten until 2 weeks later, (hint), then there's a problem.

 

My wife and I have friends of the opposite sex, as a matter of fact one of my best friends is a single female. But, my wife and I have set boundries on these friendships and we respect each other enough to maintain these.

[mrsZenith]

Hi everyone! Thanks for helping us out with our debate. I am "Mrs. Zenith". I would like to clear my name a little here by explaining or excusing what happened--depending on your point of view. I would like to point out some things that I have tried to make clear in our debate about the details of these friendships. These are two men with whom I was very good friends at one point, but lost touch with. The only conversations I have had with either of them were either small talk or catching up with old friends. I did meet one of them at a bar, but it was not premeditated, just something that came up while I was out with my sister. I was with my sister, and he was with his friends. In fact, after meeting him there, he has since begun dating my sister. And, the "private" messages that are being referred to are only text messages. I gave my husband the password to both my email and facebook accounts so that he could read all of our posts. Unfortunately, there is no way that he can go back and read the texts, or hear the words that we actually spoke. Since we married, I gave up all of my friends, and have had no relationships outside of our own. It has been more than 12 years since I spoke to any of my friends, and I really miss that. My husband certainly did not stop me from having friendships at any point. It was just inconvenient. Now, I think that the problem is not so much that I am friends with other men, but that coincidentally it happened to be two men rather than two women that I reconnected with.

[SpanksTheMonkey]

What's next? It just coincidentally that we developed feelings, and then kiss, and then spend some time at a local motel?

I agree I think instead of making excuses she should be respecting her husband a little more I dunno maybe I just have a different view point. Of course hes upset its 2 guys unless your a lesbian why would he be upset if they were women? that makes no sense lmao..

[seibert253]

Hi everyone! Thanks for helping us out with our debate. I am "Mrs. Zenith". I would like to clear my name a little here by explaining or excusing what happened--depending on your point of view. I would like to point out some things that I have tried to make clear in our debate about the details of these friendships. These are two men with whom I was very good friends at one point, but lost touch with. The only conversations I have had with either of them were either small talk or catching up with old friends. I did meet one of them at a bar, but it was not premeditated, just something that came up while I was out with my sister. I was with my sister, and he was with his friends. In fact, after meeting him there, he has since begun dating my sister. And, the "private" messages that are being referred to are only text messages. I gave my husband the password to both my email and facebook accounts so that he could read all of our posts. Unfortunately, there is no way that he can go back and read the texts, or hear the words that we actually spoke. Since we married, I gave up all of my friends, and have had no relationships outside of our own. It has been more than 12 years since I spoke to any of my friends, and I really miss that. My husband certainly did not stop me from having friendships at any point. It was just inconvenient. Now, I think that the problem is not so much that I am friends with other men, but that coincidentally it happened to be two men rather than two women that I reconnected with.

 

Mrs. There's nothing wrong with re connecting with old lost friends, even ones of the opposite sex. I think where your husband is concerned, and many of us here, is being burned by a spouse who's reconnection turned into something more. Before you say that would never happen to me, I suggest you read all the threads on this site where loving wives and mothers, threw away their husbands and families for their "long lost love". Many realizing later the mistake they made, but too late, the damage is done. Many of these marriages never recover.

 

No one here, including your husband is accusing you of having motives of anything more, at least right now. I think where you husband has an issue, and so would I, is the amount of contact. I guarrentee you if you mentioned your meeting up the your friend right after it happened, it wouldn't have been a big deal. But, since you never mentioned it for several weeks, now he feels suspicious.

Put yourself in his shoes. If he reconnected with an old close female friend. Spend time emailing, texting, IMing this friend. Met this friend out at a bar one evening. Then failed to say anything to you about it for several weeks, you CANNOT tell me you would not feel hurt and supicious about what's going on.

 

OK, now what can you do.

1. Set boundries on what's appropriate and what's not when it comes to contact with members of the opposite sex. (this applies to both of you equally)

2. You both need to realize that if you engage in activities that takes away time from your marriage, it's disrespectful to the other spouse and it needs to be curtailed or better yet, ended.

3. Complete transparency and access by both of you. If you are emailing or texting anything to your friends that you wouldn't show your husband, then it's wrong, inappropriate, and disrespectful to him. The same goes for him. He shouldn't be involved in anything like this either.

4. If at any time one of your male friends, starts flirting, becomes engauged in any conversations you would not want your husband to hear, then out of love and respect for your husband, this person need not be your friend. END OF STORY. Again, this goes equally for your husband. If he has a female friend who becomes flirtacious, comes onto him, he should tell you about it right away, and end that friendship right then and there.

 

From what I've read from both of you. I do not see that anything exceedingly inappropriate occurred. I think if you told your husband about you encounter with your friend right after it occurred, we would not be here communicating. Obviously he has concerns, and rightly so. But it's up to you to put these to rest. Then it's up to both of you to proceed slowly over this little bumb in your marriage, and enjoy many years to come.

 

Good Luck and God Bless

[mrsZenith]

Thanks, Spanks! You're not helping here, but we did both enjoy your post! You're right--I know that my husband would probably not be quite so upset if they were women. I guess that's the whole point. Your point has been conceded. And, yes, I do need to be respectful of my husband's feelings. In fact, I cut off all communication with this man (and looked like a total ass because of it ). I will do whatever it takes to make sure that no feelings are hurt. I think the debate is simply whether or not male friends are appropriate, and if it is appropriate for one spouse to "forbid" these types of relationships.

[mrsZenith]

1. Set boundries on what's appropriate and what's not when it comes to contact with members of the opposite sex. (this applies to both of you equally)

2. You both need to realize that if you engage in activities that takes away time from your marriage, it's disrespectful to the other spouse and it needs to be curtailed or better yet, ended.

3. Complete transparency and access by both of you. If you are emailing or texting anything to your friends that you wouldn't show your husband, then it's wrong, inappropriate, and disrespectful to him. The same goes for him. He shouldn't be involved in anything like this either.

4. If at any time one of your male friends, starts flirting, becomes engauged in any conversations you would not want your husband to hear, then out of love and respect for your husband, this person need not be your friend. END OF STORY. Again, this goes equally for your husband. If he has a female friend who becomes flirtacious, comes onto him, he should tell you about it right away, and end that friendship right then and there.

 

 

We both thought this was a very insightful post, and we both appreciate it along with all the messages that have been posted. Even though we don't totally agree with each other, we are going to compromise and attempt to behave in a manner that respects each others' feelings...

 

- Mr & Mrs Zenith

[SpanksTheMonkey]

What about my posts? Not insightful enough for you?

I enjoyed the boob part dose that make you feel better?

[zenith138]

What about my posts? Not insightful enough for you?

Oh Clarify, We are so sorry to have slighted you. We loved your post! --especially the boob sucking part. mmmmm....I think you may have rekindled our marriage!

 

Have a great night. We hope you are enjoying some boobage tonight too!

[Jennifer26]

Thanks, Spanks! You're not helping here, but we did both enjoy your post! You're right--I know that my husband would probably not be quite so upset if they were women. I guess that's the whole point. Your point has been conceded. And, yes, I do need to be respectful of my husband's feelings. In fact, I cut off all communication with this man (and looked like a total ass because of it ). I will do whatever it takes to make sure that no feelings are hurt. I think the debate is simply whether or not male friends are appropriate, and if it is appropriate for one spouse to "forbid" these types of relationships.

 

 

Your husband is entitled to have boundaries in this relationship, and I am sure you have your own as well. Of course neither of you have to abide by them, as you're free to act as you wish. But then you will have to suffer the consequences as well.

 

I'm glad to see you cut off the communication. Your husband's feelings should matter above all else, even if you deemed this rekindling as being harmless.

 

My husband had an emotional affair years back, and it started off innocently enough. Through that, I've learned that you have to be cautious when it comes to friendships with the opposite sex. I don't think it's impossible to have a friendship, but there have to be steps taken to ensure the friendship does not become too intimate.

 

For myself, I never meet up with a man one to one. I let my husband know of any male acquaintances. I also do not discuss my husband or our marriage to men. These are just a few things. And if my husband had any issues with a male friend, I would cut off contact out of respect to him - whether or not I felt it was truly a threat or not. My husband's feelings would matter more.

[Platypus10]

Its been good to read an up to date blog about this vexing question, and the only reason I'm here reading it all, is that I'm in a *similar* boat as Mr Zenith. I'm a new member, but would like to share my thoughts and hear your views in response.

 

My experience has rocked me to the core and left me in a dreadful state with regard to personal confidence, and trust in my wife. Its been a tough road since it happened back in May 2009, and as part of the process, I've had to fight an internal battle with some of the logic of my own feelings. Jealousy and lack of trust in my wife have been the casualties.

 

In searching for answers, I've come to realise that there maybe two basic issues in all of what I've read so far, and in what I've personally experienced. They are (1) that solid marriages are built on trust, and (2) the human feeling of jealousy can be destructive.

 

If you have the first one, then its because you truly trust your partner in all events, and in all circumstances, to be respectful of your feelings and to treat you as an equal partner in your marriage. You can go about your daily lives in the safe knowledge that all well.

 

If you have the second one, then life's a challenge at best, and probably a torment at worst, but of course, it also depends on what degree you're jealousy influences your life. Put another way, is it the type that smothers your spouse with feelings of claustrophobia, or is it there and in a manageable form? I guess a bit of jealousy goes a long way to keeping a marriage healthy, right?

 

The vexing question....Is it appropriate to have friends with the opposite sex? Jealousy may well influence our decision in saying to our spouse that it's not acceptable, but trust may well say it's OK. So how should we answer this in a logical way? Should logic enter into it at all?

 

At the end of the day, emailing and texting and phone calls when at work are all secretive between the parties. A jealous spouse might demand that it stop, but the one with the "friend" can continue without review of the content or the appropriateness of what is being said by the jealous spouse. Even if the jealous one can silently monitor what's going on between the two "friends", there's nothing to stop the friends from finding yet another means of communicating with one another if thats what they're determined to do.

 

So that seems to infer that trust would be the central key to all of this. Yes? Well why do I get the feeling that to leave a child in charge of a lolly shop is suicidal, no matter how much that child is law abiding, uses commonsense, has always been trustworthy with everything else in life?

 

When divorce statistics suggest there's a lot of unhappy people out there, and the rising rates of memberships on Web based dating sites is so huge, is there any room for trust anymore? My view is that the Web has made the whole process of being loyal to your married partner a farce. Its so easy to lead second or third lives without our spouses ever knowing! Not good, methinks.

 

Hmmmm. Any thoughts?

[zenith138]

Hey, I thought I'd follow up. After the initial problem was basically resolved, it turns out that there are other issues that have made the problem exponentially worse. I found out that she had cheated on me, not with the person we've been discussing on this thread, but with someone else completely. I found out when telling a friend about our current issues, when he let it slip about some other info he had. A confrontation has yielded a really ****ty tale. See the whole story here:

 

http://www.experienceproject.com/stories/Cheated-On-My-Husband/700653

 

Full post:

 

I have been married to the perfect husband for 12 years. He tells me he loves me every day. He helps me when I'm tired. He wants to buy me things and take me places to make me happy. He is an adoring and amazing father, and has the emotional strength of a super hero. On the outside our marriage has looked like a fairy tale. People are constantly oohing and ahing over us, and tell us that they only wish and dream about being like us. But the truth is, is that I am insecure, and scared and overbearing emotionally. My husband regularly takes an emotional thrashing from me for petty, ridiculous things. However, he has stood firm in the face of all of this, and tells me that he only wants to make sure that I am happy. His single most important job in life is to make me happy.

What is wrong with me? I love him so very much. I adore him, and know that I cannot live this life without him. How can I hurt him like I do? I hate that he puts me on a pedestal, and tells me that I am perfect. I can't look at myself in the mirror after he tells me he loves me, and that I am beautiful. It scares me so much how blind he is about me.

To make things worse, I habitually lie about nothing to him, just to hide that I am not the perfect woman he imagines. And, here's the clincher: Two years ago, I had a short affair with a man I work with. I didn't want him to love me. I wanted to see what I was missing outside of marriage. I wanted to see if I could be sexually satisfied by a man that I found physically attractive. I was proud of myself for being brave enough to do it, but I hated myself for hurting my one true love. So, I ended it immediately: We had sex twice. Once it was premeditated.

Now, something happened to make my husband aware of my lies. Actually, I lied about being friends with a man he did not want me to be friends with. This time, the friendship was truly platonic, but he told me it was inappropriate, and made him uncomfortable. Being the awful wife that I am, I was shocked and could not believe that he would think there was anything going on. But, when he found out that we had been talking-alot-after I told him we weren't, he could not be consoled.

I realized my grave error--that trust was the sole basis of our relationship, and I could not just lie to hide from who I really am. So, I told him about the affair. Actually, I had told my sister shortly after it happened, and then my sister told his best friend, who ultimately told him, when he said he couldn't trust me anymore. I could have lied, and my husband would have believed me, but I couldn't. Then I volunteered everything, and spilled my guts.

Obviously he is hurt beyond repair. I don't want to hurt him anymore. I love him so much, and cannot stand the thought of losing him. In fact, I still don't know what will happen from here. But I need help: How do I become that person on his pedestal? How can I be that without any lies, without any new hurt. With him or without him, all I want now is to fix his broken heart, and make him happy. What do I do?

[seibert253]

Wow Zenith,

Didn't see that coming, I know you didn't either.

 

What now my friend?

I can tell you this, right now you're in no state of mind to make any long term decisions about your marriage. It seems your wife is remorseful about what happened, and even though she hid this from you for several years, it's good she was truthful and didn't continue to lie about this.

 

For all her faults and mistakes, by reading her post I can tell she's hurting that she hurt you, but she also loves you and hopes this doesn't destroy your marriage.

 

As I said, take you time before you make any long termed decisions about your marriage. You and her need IC to begin the healing process. You should also consider MC to begin healing your marriage is that's what you want. MC will also give you a gauge if you really want to remain in this marriage and work on fixing it.

 

You will get alot of advise, both pro and con on staying with your wife. Take all of it into consideration but above all you need to do what's right for you.