Update . . . .

[OWoman]

I hope I'm ok posting this-

In the type of suit you described, if the CS spent any joint marital funds on the OP, then the BS is entitled under AOA to recoup half of those funds from the OP. The OP will then have a judgement placed against them (if BS wins suit).

 

Also, it matters not if it were one or many OP's, she would have to file a separate suit for each. And she can.

 

I'd be wanting those spent funds back myself if I were in her shoes, too. After all, it was half hers.

 

Says who? Only if they were married inc community of property. Default in many countries is not. My $ and my H's $ are completely separate. Also in his previous M. His money was his, and hers hers - they had a joint account into which each paid an agreed sum each month for joint expenses, and for the rest, it was each for themselves. Any money he spend on the A was his to spend, not hers.

 

OTOH, I could sue HER for the cost of reading my books that I'd loaned him, especially the one she ruined by bending the pages backwards and dropping crumbs in between the pages

[georgia girl]

I should also not jump into this because responses are somewhat emotional. However, I wanted to confirm what the other person said. This may be considered a property/breach of contract issue.

 

Two people in a marriage are in effect under contract to each other, regardless of how they "separate" their assets in a marriage. Once married, most property becomes joint (depends on laws of the state) unless somehow protected via prenuptial agreement or disclosure of protected asset prior to marriage (which may or may not be available in the state you're in). If one partner, abetted by a third party, conspire to use assets that are essentially joined through the marriage contract to harm the other partner, then that can be considered fraud and would be a breach of contract. The legal theory is that then the partner and the third party can be held liable for the breach and resulting property (read: financial) loss.

 

As the other person stated, it may not matter how many other times it has happened or who those other third parties are, regardless of if this is selective enforcement (meaning the wife chose you to sue vs. any other prior partners).

 

The only reason to jump into this was to clarify how this could be possible. FYI: these are pretty messy and most attorneys won't accept the case (for the plaintiff) so I'm surprised that she found one, but that may explain why her attorney hasn't moved forward with it yet.

 

FYI: this is not intended to be legal advice. Please respond to this issue how you see fit.

[NoIDidn't]

Owoman, I think you miss the point. This isn't about your country or any other countries laws regarding property. This is in the US. And it is a valid lawsuit.

 

There really isn't anything that SH can do, even if she tried any of jj33's suggestions. The suit is against her. So its up to her to prove that she is innocent. But she's not innocent. She's still with him! And the state will act based on that. And if the woman finds out that SH posts here, she can kiss her assets goodbye.

 

I could sue for something like this in my state. The only thing that the BW has against her suit is the fact that she wants to work on the marriage. These suits only go well if there is a pending divorce. You can't sue to get your man back. LOL.

 

I hate to sound snarky, but SH has been dealing with this BullSh*t with this Loser for forever. I just hope this latest BS is worth it to her. He just doesn't sound like he's worth holding on to for another millisecond.

[tami-chan]

BS will have to prove OW sought H out and used her feminine wiles to hook him in....with the numerous past affairs, will the jury believe that all those women sought her H? and not because H is really just a scumbag? Waste of time and money....if I were the W I would cut my losses, NID is right, can't sue to take your H back....or make them love you enough to stay faithful in the marriage.

[georgia girl]

Be careful. There are two different types of lawsuits being described here. One seeks damages for actions which the injured spouse will claim destroyed his/her marriage. The other seeks only to recover assets that were "improperly discharged" during the marriage contract to a third party through conspiracy with one spouse.

 

The difference? That first lawsuit requires that the injured spouse prove that the marriage was survivable and that the third party caused irreperable harm to the marriage, causing divorce. Those are the really, really messy ones (and ones where prior affairs may have some bearing on the outcome). Attorneys hate them, judges aren't particularly found of them and they're hard to prove.

 

The other lawsuit doesn't seek damages for harm. It simply seeks recovery of assets. Therefore, there is a) usually no jury trial - most parties agree to either a trial by judge or it gets settled out of court and b) the survivability question is not raised. To win this type of lawsuit, the injured party only needs to prove the CS and AP knew each other, that the assets were discharged to the AP without her consent (conspiracy), and the value of the assets. No one in this type of lawsuit cares what has happened in the marriage now or before. It is simply the recovery of assets. The issue of previous affairs would not be allowed to be introduced.

 

 

Again, I'm not dispensing legal advice, simply outlining the types of actions which can be brought for informational purposes only.

[jj33]

"You cant sue to get your man back" that is priceless! :laugh:

 

And Georgia and NID I agree, very very difficult to defend against that suit or attempt to have it dismissed while you are still seeing MM. And I know that my suggestions arent sure winners but a very aggressive defense can go a long way in scaring off a plaintiff. Its a standard litigation tactic.

 

If Spinning has the muscle to show her that pursuing the suit will be messy and expensive, the woman might go away and stop focusing on Spinning.

 

 

As you you Spinning. Take off the ruby slippers. You arent in Kansas anymore.

 

This guy is still with his W and being with you is putting you in harms way.

 

What if she did prosecute the suit? The publicity that could surround it would be devastating and no matter whether you were with this guy or not would make the whole situation even more painful.

 

Maybe you should view this as a sign - not that you are "giving in" to the W. But that you should step away for now.

 

Once he is divorced and the dust has settled, see whats going on. If you are still interested in him, you can review the situation then.

 

Also you mention that he lied to W and to you. Maybe you are already backing away? We hope so for your sake.

 

Big hugs

[Spinning Head]

I had to take a few days to sort through this lawsuit. And, I do take the lawsuit very very seriously. I have retained an attorney but W's attorney is not aware of that fact - yet. I did contact W's attorney myself about how he intends to proceed with the lawsuit because I have not been served but it is out there and depostions and discovery need to be pursued as I believe there is no merit to the alienation of affection claim in light of MM's previous affairs and behaviors. It's been a week since I contacted the attorney and he's not responded. I'm not sure how to take the attorney's lack of response at this point.

 

I don't want the lawsuit to move forward because of various reasons - costs, humiliation, embarrassment, etc. However, I'm not going to lie still and do nothing about it.

 

I think W has a valid claim for criminal conversation which is having sex with someone who is married to someone else. I don't know how you put a value on it. I think her claims for alienation of affection and infliction of emotional distress can be attacked and, hopefully, dismissed.

 

The pending lawsuit is a huge source of stress. MM's reaction to it is a huge disappointment. I've decided that I'm on my own in defending it. I told MM that as far as I was concerned, if his W chose to move forward with the lawsuit, the gloves are off.

[Lucky_One]

MM and his W have not resolved their marital issues but are working on doing so. I have continued to see MM.

 

They are working on their marriage, and you are still seeing him? Any particular reason WHY you are still with him?

[NoIDidn't]

The pending lawsuit is a huge source of stress. MM's reaction to it is a huge disappointment. I've decided that I'm on my own in defending it. I told MM that as far as I was concerned, if his W chose to move forward with the lawsuit, the gloves are off.

 

I promise you that taking the gloves off makes her case EASY to prove.

 

Just what do you mean "the gloves are off"? Are you going to give details of your A? The kind of details that will hurt her emotionally? Bad idea. After something like that, the judge/jury will conclude that you intended to alienate his affections towards her and successfully did so since he left and is divorcing.

 

The only thing that I can think of to help your case, is the fact that she wants him back and is not going through with a divorce at this moment. If she is basically suing to get you out of the picture, it generally doesn't work.

[Spinning Head]

MM and his W are not working on his marriage. They are working on resolving issues via a separation agreement. This process started before MM moved out and still continues.

 

I extended an offer to Wife's attorney to settle the case. I don't believe Wife's attorney informed her of my willingness to settle things. My attorney contacted Wife's attorney last week. No response.

 

My comment that 'the gloves are off' means that if Wife intends to pursue the case, then I have no choice but to ask intimate questions about her relationship with MM.

 

MM has spoken to his W about the lawsuit. Wife stated she didn't know about my interest in settling the case.

[IfWishesWereHorses]

Settle in what way??? If he is a serial cheater, which as far as I can remember she has admitted to, then how the heck can she have a case?

 

If you intend to settle by monetary compensation are you doing this to protect your MM??? I don't get this at all SH?

[OWoman]

I wouldn't settle. I'd nail her for coming after me as if I was a soft target, when her REAL problems lie elsewhere. I'd show that there was no affection to alienate, as he'd been spreading it all over the place long before my arrival, and I'd demonstrate to the judge that either (1) she was quite happy with all the other As, including illegitimate kids, and so clearly had no expectations of sexual exclusivity and thus no claim on demanding it post hoc, or (2) she was clueless about all the other cases, thus so out of touch with her H's secret life over a sustained period, thus any "closeness" or affection she imagined was from one side only (hers) and thus the loss of it was not due to me but due to her own belated realisation of her naivete / ignorance. Either way, I'd be aggressive enough in my refutation of her claims to have her calling her attack dogs off and backing down.

 

But then, if I was involved with a MM who allowed his BW to go ahead with such a claim against me without taking her down a dark alley and sorting her out, I'd be a very different person to who I am!

[NoIDidn't]

But then, if I was involved with a MM who allowed his BW to go ahead with such a claim against me without taking her down a dark alley and sorting her out, I'd be a very different person to who I am!

 

Ba-da-BINGO!!

[Spinning Head]

UPDATED UPDATE - 2/15/2010

 

MM and his W signed separation agreement a couple of weeks ago. W filed a voluntary dismissal without prejudice of her civil lawsuit against me. The 'without prejudice' dismissal means that she can refile the lawsuit within one year. Basically, it gives her a one year extension on the statute of limitations bar.

 

I don't know if W will refile the lawsuit or not. I never saw the signed separation agreement. I do know that MM gave his W the house, the beach house, is paying the two mortgages owed against the house and the mortgages against the beach house, is paying the W's car debt (new car), W's credit card debts, all monthly expenses related to the house and beach house and alimony on top of those expenses. I honestly do not know how MM is paying all of these expenses each month.

 

In two months, MM will have been separated from his W for one year.

 

Over the weekend, MM and I were at a store and I was shopping for gifts for family members. MM saw his W and son (age 26) at the store. MM went over to talk to them and I went to the register (which was on the other side of the store). I had never seen MM's W or son. As I was in line placing my items to be scanned, MM's W came charging through the line of carts and yelled "I want to see whose been sleeping with my husband". I never turned around and kept unloading my cart. MM's W tried to ram my cart with her cart but MM placed his hand on her cart to stop her. MM W's said "She looks like what everyone said she looks like". People were turning to stare at her. The son came over and walked his mother away. They stood at the end of the aisles - MM's W talked on a cell phone the entire time it took me to complete my transactions. I never turned around or acknowledged her. If she walked up to me right now, I would not know who she is.

 

I was surprised at W's behavior at this late date, especially after the signing of a separation agreement and dismissing a lawsuit against me. She's known about me for over two years. She hired a PI to take photos of my home, business and to follow me for several months - all over a year ago.

[2sunny]

wow, i think i'd counter sue with verbal abuse in public. the store probably has it on film... she was out of line for a public forum. you did well to stay calm and quiet.

 

i hope you find this man worth all this drama and chaos...

[bentnotbroken]

He is such a winning prize. I hope she gets help and he gets what needs in return.

[jj33]

Not a bad idea to counter sue if you have any grounds at all. It could be that your settlement is both of you withdrawing your suits with prejudice subject to her not doing it again.

 

Its harsh. I can imagine that she simply lost it knowing that you were there, and with no disrespect that is understandable (to a degree).

 

But it will get you where YOU need to be which is outside the scope of her threats and abuse.

[GreenEyedLady]

OMG!

 

What a psycho! And she got a very unfair settlement of the marital assets in her favor.

 

He must have really wanted out and I see why...

 

GEL

[bittersweet memories]

 

I know a great deal about MM's history of previous affairs. I have no doubt there is more out there than I could fathom. MM lied to his W and to me.

 

He's had so many affairs in the past - even a child out of wedlock - that I find it amazing that I am the one who the W sues.

 

Are you sure this is what you want?

[LucreziaBorgia]

I'd suggest filling your lawyer in on what happened, just to have it on file. Each and every time she does something like that, document it. Even if it is a phone call or a voice message.

 

As for the W, now that she has seen you I suspect it is like ripping off a scab and she might redouble her efforts to take you into court.

 

As for you, take care of yourself and protect your heart. I have read enough about sMM that I can't help but to be suspicious of him in any relationship he happens to be in.

[Spark1111]

While it's true the BS should go after her WS, if they are divorcing, then she already is- that will be part of the case to determine the split of marital assets. If they are together, then it's a whole other ballgame.

 

The BS can sue Spinning to recoup any $$ spent during the affair, as well as any other OW. If he spent money on dinners, hotels, gifts etc, even if he did it with a company CC to hide it from his BS, a good attorney can subpoena those financial records and produce them in court.

 

Spinning, if any of the above is true, then I would consult an attorney. If she is just stating emotional damages, and her state allows for that kind of suit, you may have a better outcome. But some have been successful at bringing suit for inflicting emotional damage. If she has email and/or phone and text evidence, she is well prepared.

 

Just posting this because I thought about doing the same after dday (for the financial aspect). But please consult an attorney.

 

This is correct in most states. You can no longer sue for alienation of affection, BUT you can sue to recoup joint marital assets spent on the AP, dinners, trips, cell phones bills, gifts, etc.

 

There have been a few successful judgements against OW/OM, rarely collectible or enforcible, nevertheless, it DOES receive a lot of media attention and holds the offending parties up to ahem, negative publicity.

 

Did you know he was married? Yes.

 

Did he take you to the islands? How did he pay for it?

 

Got you or got more from him in a divorce settlement, the wife is entitled to half of every penny, including those he spent to have an extra marital affair.

 

Get a lwayer.

[moaningmyrtle]

It sounds like the OP's situation might nearly be resolved.

 

Just as an aside there are some posters who have legal qualifications and experience and some who are just highly intelligent and know what the law "ought" to be.

 

Just be aware that the law is not always logical and some comparisons eg between crimes and torts while superficially similar are not good comparisons to make. Also different jurisdictions have different legislation and sometimes differing interpretations of the common law and case law. Some jurisdictions are "code" so the rules are different again.

 

Also the law doesn't always distinguish between "soft" and "hard" targets so try to evaluate any "posturing" that assumes it does.

 

Please note this is not legal advice - best to see a legal practitioner in your own jurisdiction to get good legal advice.

[NoIDidn't]

I don't think what the W did was all that bad, honestly. She was with her son, her family member. Someone affected by the separation and was likely emotionally overwhelmed.

 

Yeah, it was not good of her to supposedly try to hit you or your cart with hers, but based on what you said, you didn't even see that. So I tend to give her the benefit of the doubt that it likely didn't happen and he was telling you that it did to make it seem like he was saving you from something.

 

From what you posted about him over the years/months. He is not worth this level of aggravation, IMO.

 

You probably do want to do a legal consult, but stick to the facts that you know, not the ones that you didn't really see. As you yourself say you wouldn't be able to pick her out of a crowd, so you couldn't have seen her trying to hit you, if she even did according to Mr. Knight-In-Shining-Armor.

[Chrome Barracuda]

Hey you got the booby prize spinning heads. years down the line when MM gets bored being with you, you think he'll be faithful to you. I dont blame the ex-wife you was complicit in the destruction of her marriage, just like he was you need to share blame.

 

My only thing I'm trying to wrap my head around is that you know this MM did so many bad things while married to her, why are YOU still with him? Is he worth it???

 

NOT ONCE HAVE YOU ANSWERED THE QUESTION HERE ON THIS BOARD!

 

IS THIS MAN WORTH IT? AND WHY IS HE WORTH IT?

[Spinning Head]

Is MM worth it? Probably not. I think MM, his W and I were all responsible for the demise of MM's marriage. Bear in mind that MM had several affairs throughout his marriage, even fathering a child with another woman. That history and behavior is always in my mind.

 

Why did MM choose to leave his W for me? I don't know. Why did he literally give up everything he had - his homes, personal possessions, relationships with his family and friends - for a relationship with me? I don't know. It is something that I bring up with him often and his response is always "I love you and want a future with you". I have told him repeatedly that his past behavior and lies and the fact that his relationships with people in his married life have end - all those events - do bother me and that the liklihood is that he will act that way with me. His response is the same as above and that he realizes that it will take time for me to think otherwise.

 

Granted, MM's W's actions last week bothered me. But, I do understand that she is upset. I had no problem with MM going to his W and son and talking to them. I went to the other side of the store and did not interfere. I do know that MM's W comes to his office at least once a week to ask for more money (which he gives to her) and to talk about why he left the marriage. These conversations have been going on since May 2009.