The Martyr Syndrom

[tami-chan]

I'm not so sure anyone could ensure that their MW/MM were in martyr mode until they refuse to see them any more and see if they pick up another OW/OM.

 

ahmmm...huh???

 

Anyway.....

 

People use the martyr thing simply to justify their cheating. A WS always justifies it somehow - to themselves to make them feel entitled.

To OW/OM so they dont look like complete crap. And eventually to the BS - to say I didnt get this, so this is what I did.

 

In my relationships with Married Men - they all felt entitled, they all implied that they were the one making sacrifices at home. In fact, the bigger the hero their ego needed them to be - the more abused or neglected they depicted themselves at home.

 

Once again, I have to say that I have recently decided that Infidelity is passive aggressiveness in its most pathetic form and to me, that characteristic in a man is ...emasculating.

 

2sure, you are, of course, on to something. For some people to appear as though they are suffering and sacrificing a lot for the sake of a "just cause" is appealing. Our society has more tolerance and empathy for someone "suffering" albeit it is all very self-serving. Somehow it makes them look more human, more humane and thus more sympathetic....it's bs...a person is where he/she is in his/her life because for some seemingly inexplicable reason that is where he/she has decided he belongs....some temporary, some permanently....

 

Yes, people stay for the children-happens a lot. I know that was one of the the key reasons I did in my marriage. I had a myriad of other reasons, none of which included delving into the whys of my H's adultery and thus "fixing" the marriage. I stayed for my own reasons---all calculated to benefit me-at least, that was my hope/goal.

 

Would anyone consider 2Sure a martyr for staying in her marriage? I sure don't. While finding these things about her H is painful and devastating to her...she is not dying within herself and surrendering to her pain...she is doing something to alleviate the pain, to make her life meaningful even amidst this turmoil.....At least, that is what I gleaned from her posts. Of course, in this medium I could very well be wrong.....!

 

Martyrs succumbed and surrender to the persecution and pain. They do not actively seek out how to make their lives "better".

[tami-chan]

I just wanted to quote this, because I found it interesting. You have been on these boards far longer than I and I was surprised by your thoughts here.

 

I don't think I got why you find my thoughts about this interesting and surprising....why is that?

 

**as for the man in your example.... not a martyr .... an arrogant ass! lol

 

Well, in my opinion, martyrs do have a certain arrogance about them....this feeling that "my good is higher than your good..."--might be true...but then again, it might not...it IS a matter of perspective, isn't it?

[GorillaTheater]

People use the martyr thing simply to justify their cheating. A WS always justifies it somehow - to themselves to make them feel entitled.

To OW/OM so they dont look like complete crap. And eventually to the BS - to say I didnt get this, so this is what I did.

 

In my relationships with Married Men - they all felt entitled, they all implied that they were the one making sacrifices at home. In fact, the bigger the hero their ego needed them to be - the more abused or neglected they depicted themselves at home.

 

Once again, I have to say that I have recently decided that Infidelity is passive aggressiveness in its most pathetic form and to me, that characteristic in a man is ...emasculating.

 

I have to give this some thought. I've been feeling a bit abused lately, but I need to determine the role my ego is playing in all this. I've been feeling disrespected more than usual, but am I being reasonable as far as what I expect? I don't know.

[tami-chan]

I have to give this some thought. I've been feeling a bit abused lately, but I need to determine the role my ego is playing in all this. I've been feeling disrespected more than usual, but am I being reasonable as far as what I expect? I don't know.

 

If you are afflicted by the "martyr syndrome", you have to accept and succumbed to the abuse and disrespect...... No whining and complaining about it, either.

[2sure]

I have to give this some thought. I've been feeling a bit abused lately, but I need to determine the role my ego is playing in all this. I've been feeling disrespected more than usual, but am I being reasonable as far as what I expect? I don't know.

 

We ALL feel that way sometimes. At work. At home. In any familiar environment. I mean there is always the potential to take those we love, those who we count on every day for granted.

 

Maybe you ARE being put upon. Maybe unfairly, maybe you are getting what you give. I mean, you're the Dad, part of being put upon is your role...but what are you going to do with your resentment??

 

Are you going to speak up, are you going to be grumpy and not say anything OR are you going to do something that will hurt your family BUT not tell them about it until its too late?

 

See, No.

[donnamaybe]

ahmmm...huh???

 

Anyway.....

 

Seriously, is cognitive thinking that difficult?

 

If your MM/MW picks up yet ANOTHER OP after you dump them, chances are this whole "martyr" thing was BS from the get go; a mere play for sympathy and an attempt to feel like they deserve to cheat.

[GorillaTheater]

 

We ALL feel that way sometimes. At work. At home. In any familiar environment. I mean there is always the potential to take those we love, those who we count on every day for granted.

 

Maybe you ARE being put upon. Maybe unfairly, maybe you are getting what you give. I mean, you're the Dad, part of being put upon is your role...but what are you going to do with your resentment??

 

Are you going to speak up, are you going to be grumpy and not say anything OR are you going to do something that will hurt your family BUT not tell them about it until its too late?

 

See, No.

 

So far I've opted for "grumpy", so maybe I'm at the point now where I'm getting what I give.

 

Maybe I'll try speaking up, if I can pull it off without sounding whiny.

 

Sorry for the threadjack, as usual.

[tami-chan]

Seriously, is cognitive thinking that difficult?

 

LOL...sorry, English is not my first language. I suppose I need more ESL classes.... Your presentation was too profound .

 

If your MM/MW picks up yet ANOTHER OP after you dump them, chances are this whole "martyr" thing was BS from the get go; a mere play for sympathy and an attempt to feel like they deserve to cheat.

 

ah.. ok...

[donnamaybe]

Here - I'll 'splain it one more time.

 

A TRUE martyr is someone who is undergoing something awful that they have to endure and make sure everyone knows it.

 

A cheater who would hop straight to another OP once dumped by the first is simply a cheater with no integrity whose marriage is probably just fine. They just WANT the OP to THINK they have a lousy marriage so they can get sexual variety and undeserved sympathy which translates to more attention.

[2sure]

Remember - being a Martyr is also a conscious choice, its a decision.

[tami-chan]

Here - I'll 'splain it one more time.

 

A TRUE martyr is someone who is undergoing something awful that they have to endure and make sure everyone knows it.

 

A cheater who would hop straight to another OP once dumped by the first is simply a cheater with no integrity whose marriage is probably just fine. They just WANT the OP to THINK they have a lousy marriage so they can get sexual variety and undeserved sympathy which translates to more attention.

 

 

I think I have expounded on it...obviously you didnt read my posts...which is ok. The above is unnecessary....<yawn>...but nice try...

[donnamaybe]

Remember - being a Martyr is also a conscious choice, its a decision.

 

But in order to be a martyr, doesn't something negative have to be endured by someone? Or are you, perhaps, saying that someone the likes of which is being discussed in this thread creates their own negative situation so they'll have something to bitch about?

[donnamaybe]

I think I have expounded on it...obviously you didnt read my posts...which is ok. The above is unnecessary....<yawn>...but nice try...

 

All I can do is try. Most posters on LS don't need so many explanations. Perhaps it was the in your post which I quoted which led me to believe you were clueless. Or maybe it was something else.

[tami-chan]

But in order to be a martyr, doesn't something negative have to be endured by someone?

 

uh, yeah ...LOL...it's the perception of suffering and the embracing of it...you are asking a question that has been thoroughly discussed by previous posts...how about you take time to read, eh?

[tami-chan]

All I can do is try. Most posters on LS don't need so many explanations. Perhaps it was the in your post which I quoted which led me to believe you were clueless. Or maybe it was something else.

 

Funny, it was something else...you WERE clueless...obviously, but it's ok...catch up.

[Devil Inside]

People use the martyr thing simply to justify their cheating. A WS always justifies it somehow - to themselves to make them feel entitled.

To OW/OM so they dont look like complete crap. And eventually to the BS - to say I didnt get this, so this is what I did.

 

In my relationships with Married Men - they all felt entitled, they all implied that they were the one making sacrifices at home. In fact, the bigger the hero their ego needed them to be - the more abused or neglected they depicted themselves at home.

 

Once again, I have to say that I have recently decided that Infidelity is passive aggressiveness in its most pathetic form and to me, that characteristic in a man is ...emasculating.

 

Good post. I agree with most of it. Gaining insight into why an affair happened can be very helpful. It can help someone to figure out what made them more susceptible to step outside their marriage. However this must not be used as an excuse...but as a starting point for where to work on things. In the end...I did what I did...I have to be accountable for my actions...regardless of why I did it...I did it...and I so not feel that I was entitled to cheat...I should have spoken up about being unhappy or left...cheating is always the cowardly way to deal with an unhappy marriage.

[Devil Inside]

Remember - being a Martyr is also a conscious choice, its a decision.

 

It is a decision...however it is probably motivated by unconscious motives. Doesn't make it right...it just should not be looked at as malicious or evil unless the person is truly Anti-Social.

 

Another conscious decision is whether or not to stay with someone like this.

[2sure]

If I were to stay with my H, who is a serial cheater:

 

I would be making a decision to be a martyr. No question.

A martyr for ...him. No. My daughter, my lifestyle? More likely.

 

But its just not me. Even if I wanted to...I just dont have that skill set.

I would explode.

[tami-chan]

If I were to stay with my H, who is a serial cheater:

 

I would be making a decision to be a martyr. No question.

A martyr for ...him. No. My daughter, my lifestyle? More likely.

 

But its just not me. Even if I wanted to...I just dont have that skill set.

I would explode.

 

Have you left husband? If you haven't, do you consider yourself a martyr, as we speak?

[OWoman]

I certainly agree that many' date=' most, MM suffer from Martyr Syndrome - hearing a former OP say it makes it sound like they are just mad that the MP chose the M and not them.[/quote']

 

I think my H did this too. He stayed so long "for the kids", and because the years of abuse had made him feel that that was what he was worth. It took the A, and hard work in IC, for him to shift that view.

 

My mother was a Martyr. She hated being M, hated having kids, hated having to be a SAHM and made sure everybody knew just how much suffering we were all putting her through - but never made any moves to address any of her unhappiness, just to spread it around. It does no one any favours. None of us were grateful that she stayed in the M, or stayed home "for us kids", or any of the other million sacrifices she allegedly made. We would far rather she took the high road of her own fulfillment, and allowed us to find our own happiness, too.

 

My father finally met someone, but stayed M too - "for the kids" - until we had left home, and then D'd my mother and married his OW. We just wished that ONE of them had had the courage to pull the plug on the M years before, rather than the continued damage staying M wrought on both of them - but also on us, as kids. When I see how happy my dad and his wife are now, many decades on, I can't help feeling a little resentful, cheated, that we weren't party to this as kids - that our chance of having at least one "happy home" was denied us because of parents who felt that DUTY outweighed their own personal rights to fulfilment, love and happiness.

 

Sanafa - it's good you're so clear sighted on this, and that you're holding him to account. It's one of life's ultimate ironies that men who claim to prioritise "their responsibilities" are so unwilling to accept the most important responsibility of all - the responsibility for their own happiness and fulfillment. Good luck!

[NoIDidn't]

People use the martyr thing simply to justify their cheating. A WS always justifies it somehow - to themselves to make them feel entitled.

To OW/OM so they dont look like complete crap. And eventually to the BS - to say I didnt get this, so this is what I did.

 

In my relationships with Married Men - they all felt entitled, they all implied that they were the one making sacrifices at home. In fact, the bigger the hero their ego needed them to be - the more abused or neglected they depicted themselves at home.

 

Once again, I have to say that I have recently decided that Infidelity is passive aggressiveness in its most pathetic form and to me, that characteristic in a man is ...emasculating.

 

Exactly! I agree. It is not an attractive quality at all!

 

And they aren't really martyring themselves at all. They are just making it sound that way.

 

I wasn't saying that Sanafa was angry in the slightest. Since my comment was so short, it didn't include your point about the OP needing to believe that the MP is a martyr - and how its an act.

 

I certainly believe they suffer from MS. But it isn't because of some redeeming quality - its what they used to step out of the marriage to begin with. And then turn around and use it to the OP to remain in the marriage (like OWoman said too).

 

For the kids

For our business

For the in-laws

For public presentation

For financial reasons

 

Always an excuse, but not too much real action that represents a definitive choice on their part. And a definitive choice means they have to actually PICK something and LOSE something else.

[donnamaybe]

Exactly! I agree. It is not an attractive quality at all!

 

And they aren't really martyring themselves at all. They are just making it sound that way.

 

That's what I was trying to say earlier, but someone had a hard time grasping that concept.

[whattodonow12]

Just started reading this thread, and I will have to come back while I eat lunch to finish. But, I see so much here that is completely familiar to me. So, completely familiar to me. My MM once said to me "I don't know if I could sacrifice my wife to make myself happy, no matter how miserable I am at times with her." He equated her to a need woman that constantly needs reassurance.. he likened it to trying to constantly fill a large water pitcher with a small glass.

 

It does appear that I will get some insight from all of you. Thanks for that.

[2sure]

The MM/MW portraying themselves as a sacrificing and suffering Martyr is a KEY element in so many affairs. Without it you wouldnt hear most of the typical justifications. The kids, the unstable wife, the finances all on their shoulders....I love you, but MUST fulfill my duty. OW/OM feels not only sympathy for them...but now instead of seeing them for the selfish cheating passive aggressive liar they are....they are a HERO. And OW/OM gets to feel that now even they can play a part in this heroic drama of sacrifice for love.

 

KEY element. And you know, as far as affairs go - hey, they can be fun, they are a taboo luxury to some - I get it. Its when all this crap and drama and fiction enters it that...it becomes just so freaking cheezy. And its one thing to have the MM/MW entertain this, but BOTH??

[Sanafa]

Exactly! I agree. It is not an attractive quality at all!

 

And they aren't really martyring themselves at all. They are just making it sound that way.

 

I wasn't saying that Sanafa was angry in the slightest. Since my comment was so short, it didn't include your point about the OP needing to believe that the MP is a martyr - and how its an act.

 

I certainly believe they suffer from MS. But it isn't because of some redeeming quality - its what they used to step out of the marriage to begin with. And then turn around and use it to the OP to remain in the marriage (like OWoman said too).

 

For the kids

For our business

For the in-laws

For public presentation

For financial reasons

 

Always an excuse, but not too much real action that represents a definitive choice on their part. And a definitive choice means they have to actually PICK something and LOSE something else.

 

I too agreed with 2Sure, and sorry if i thought you were suggesting I was angry for bringing it up.

 

The positive thing that has come up is I wouldn't have even looked at him in that light before, or myself ---- so that is growth and if it appeared that I liked what I saw, I didn't

 

And think I said I am not a fan of the weak view.

 

AND, I truly agree with the last statement - And a definitive choice means they have to actually PICK something and LOSE something else.

 

At least in my situation, he still doesn't want to "say it out loud", but on a positive I am begin to see things exactly how they are and when I am comfortable with my choices - I will make them.

 

Thanks for an extremely interesting conversation