clatan Posted November 28, 2003 Share Posted November 28, 2003 Being totally honest, I'd like to get the opinions of women. Does a guy that doesn't make a lot of money have a chance with you? My question is a little complex so I'll elaborate... I'm not talking about Donald Trump or any man that's rich per se. I also am not talking about a total bum or a guy who flips burgers at McDonalds that has no educational or career goals other than flipping burgers for life. I'm talking about a nice looking, independent, nice guy that works a respectable job but and is otherwise a great catch but only takes home say around $250 a week. This guy doesn't make a lot of money at the moment nor does he have the appearance of making a lot of money, ie he doesn't drive a new SUV or wear Tommy Hilfiger so he'll look successful, possibly spending his money frivilously or even above his means. I'm also not talking about a guy who is for the moment dirt poor, but presently earning his law degree or in line to inherit a successful family business. I guess I could use myself as an example. I'm thirty-three. I have about a year and a half of college. I have plenty of academic interests including history, religion, and politics. Plenty of hobbies like sketching, web design, painting, travel, fishing and martial arts. I have a respectable job in radio although it's a job I'm not really interested in and, unfortunately, I don't make a lot of money. I only take home about 14,500 a year. My real goal is music. I've played in bands and sang solo and sell music that I record at home from a website. So it's 'up in the air' as to whether or not I'll ever be really wealthy. I'm asking because I have managed to get dates and phone numbers but NEVER girlfriends. I can get the attention of nice, attractive women easily but I can't seem to keep their attention very long at all. That loss of their attention always seem to coincide with the first time they see what I drive or when they see where I live or what job I do> I'll also note that this is has been the case my ENTIRE LIFE with EVERY GIRL I'VE MET regardless of what kind of woman they are or where I meet them, whether the girl is a barfly, a girl I met in college or a girl I met in church. Now I have taken my job in radio, where I make a lot less than I even did before. At the same time I did that, I moved back to my family's home town to take a little college. As a result of my lower income I've had to move back in with my folks for the moment. I've noticed, since I've been at this lower payscale and in this present position, that I can't even get that intitial attention from women. I've been saying that the vast majority of women seem to just be interested in money for the most part. Everyone is quick to deny that and they think I'm ridiculous. They'll claim "It's the women you're meeting" even though all of these women are like that regardless of their vastly differing backgrounds and the places or situations where I meet them. When I look at the signs that's the impression I get. I see a lot of people around me, including my friends, in relationships- most of them with really nice looking women. The only difference in me and them that I can see is the income level. In fact there are a lot of guys that are real jerks but they have girlfriends and I don't. What do you think? Honestly, would you possibly be interested in me knowing my status or income level at the moment or would you rather go for a guy that's otherwise about the same as me but made an extra 10K a year and drove a brand new Yukon and owned his own house? Link to post Share on other sites
Tony T Posted November 28, 2003 Share Posted November 28, 2003 I'm sure the ladies will chime in but meanwhile I'll make a few comments. A male with a low income won't mean much if he's very young. A 33-year-old male who makes $14,500 per year may be in for some problems....if he let's the women he dates know what his income is or tells them he lives with his parents. Women your age or even five or six years younger are usually looking for a male who is financially stable or upwardly bound. They seek a male who can provide for them well if the relationship proceeds to marriage. Unfortunately, income has become one of the measuring sticks many females use to evaluate the potential of a future mate. Many have criteria which includes a man having his own car, his own home and a good job...or at least two out of those three. I think if you're looking for a cool relationship, you should concentrate on improving your income situation. At the same time, date around and enjoy companionship of ladies but don't expect things to go too far. Your income is currently near poverty level (not to be insulting or disrespectful). This will not impress most women. Even the very nice ones are looking to maintain or improve their lot in life. Please don't be discouraged. Work hard and your ship will come in, I promise. I just had to get this message to you because you're young and this is the time to become agressive about getting or creating work that will produce a good income. If you have to move home because of your income level now, can you imagine yourself struggling to support a family. Ladies aren't stupid. It's also not cruel in any way for them to look for a male who makes sufficient funds to show them a good time and who has the potential to support a family in the future. Independent women are especially tuned to a man's income. They want someone who will contribute equally to the relationship. You can do it, though. The economy is tight now but you can still go to school, get a real estate license, learn a trade or take other means to increase your income to a level where you can appear financially sufficient to potential mates. Link to post Share on other sites
LauraD Posted November 28, 2003 Share Posted November 28, 2003 Someone who is economically stable is ideal, not because you want to leech off someone else, but rather you feel confident that this person is self-sufficient and can carry their own weight in the relationship. Some women are very materialistic, very money-hungry. Not all. Actually, a lot of women probably have been with well-off men who are terrible partners....and are seeking a trustworthy and good lovin guy this time around (no salary specs needed). But I don't understand why you are having such hard times with the masses. Do you have an approachable personality? Are you putting yourself out there in places age-appropriate? What pool of women are you selecting from? Do you have a "type"? Have you been in a meaningful relationship, a longterm one? After the first date or two, does the woman seem to lose interest or is it the initial hooking of a woman wherein the problem lies?? I really don't think your income is going to make or break your potential for a good relationship. A good woman without dollar signs in her eyes will be attracted to a like-minded, kind, honest, overall good gentleman. Someone who is confident! Someone who makes her feel important and special. If you feel you've got these behaviors down, I really don't know what the deal is. Link to post Share on other sites
LauraD Posted November 28, 2003 Share Posted November 28, 2003 After reading Tony's post, I see that I may have a naive outlook. Yes, Clatan's income is on the meager side. As a woman in her mid-twenties, I suppose I am not as stringent on my requirements for a man's income. I dated someone who was not making a whole lot, but he was the best partner I could ask for--respectful, interested, funny, committed, affectionate, loving, etc. I saw potential for him to do well in the career market later in life, with more experience. But if a man lacks the tools to be loving and supportive to his woman, I could care less what he makes. Money isn't everything. With more money comes less anxiety about the logistics of living and leisure, but it doesn't buy happiness. Clatan, I'd listen to what Tony says. I think he's quite wise. Try to improve yourself, as I am sure you have been. Just don't give up or stop trying to open new doors for yourself. It seems to be a pretty empty goal: make more money to find a woman--but as Tony said, most women respect a man even more if he has the resourcefulness and responsibility and ability to provide sufficiently. We're not talking Ferraris, just a stable kind of life together and perhaps a family. Link to post Share on other sites
Author clatan Posted November 28, 2003 Author Share Posted November 28, 2003 Originally posted by LauraD It seems to be a pretty empty goal: make more money to find a woman--but as Tony said, most women respect a man even more if he has the resourcefulness and responsibility and ability to provide sufficiently. We're not talking Ferraris, just a stable kind of life together and perhaps a family. Thanks Smilies, That's kind of my problem. I'm not being argumentive or anything. Actually I agree with you, especially about the empty goal part. I hate the fact that most all women are about money. That is an empty goal. I don't know how to really word this but I guess an analogy would be best. I don't think I'm going to like the fact that the woman I'm dating is a golddigger any more if I'm the one who owns the mine. If I do make more money some day and suddenly have women all over me, I still wouldn't want them if that's the only reason they want me. If I wasn't good enough before, then they can get lost. See, it would be different if I was only trying to date only rich girls. But most of these girls that look down on me make the same or even much less than I do. Everyone makes the rationalization for this behavior in women by saying that "a woman wants a man who will contribute equally" or "carry their own weight" I have no problem with that. I wouldn't want to marry a woman who has no goals or ambitions who wants to work in a nursing home or in a fast food restuarant her whole life. Not that there's anything wrong with that if that's what makes you happy. But I want someone with similar goals. THey make exuses for these women saying that these "poor girls only want, like Tony said, a man that can provide sufficiently a stable income and secure environment. But that's not the case with most women and that's not what they really want. It might be best if I gave you an example... About three years back when I was 29, before I was in radio, I worked as a maintenance worker at a rock quarry. A dirty job, but it paid really good. I also had a band that I played in on weekends. One New Year's Eve we played a big New Year's bash. I noticed this really hot brunette and all the guys in my band told me that she'd been looking at me all night. After our band finished the next band took the stage. I walked off stage, went to the restroom and was walking towards my table and she came up asked to dance we talked and got to know each other and she was acting as if she was really into me. She even took me over to meet her mother and had her friends take several pictures of us together. SHe gave me her number and the whole nine yards. As the party ended I mentioned that I better go see if I could get a ride home with a friend or one of my bandmates because I'd rose with them and left my truck at home. She said she wouldn't hear of it and said I could ride with her and her friends. She then asked me where I lived. I told her East Kansas, which is the South Side of Saint Joseph, MO, the working-class end of town. It's not crack-alley, but I guess it wasn't the "burbs" like she'd hoped. That's when it fell apart. She first thing she said was "Oh no, you're a 'south-sider' "Oh my god". I said no, I'm not a "south-sider" I just moved to town and that's just where I live. She didn't even speak to me then, until we pulled up to my house. When we pulled up she saw my little S-15 and said "That's your truck?!?!" And I pointed to the house, a nice remodeled but not fancy, well-kept one bedroom home and she reacted just the same. Originally posted by Tony Women your age or even five or six years younger are usually looking for a male who is financially stable or upwardly bound. They seek a male who can provide for them well if the relationship proceeds to marriage. Many have criteria which includes a man having his own car, his own home and a good job...or at least two out of those three. It's also not cruel in any way for them to look for a male who makes sufficient funds to show them a good time and who has the potential to support a family in the future. Here's the really absurd thing. She was a 23-year-old school teacher. I know what school teachers make an I know they make even less starting out. Although my job isn't glamorous, neither is hers and I know for a fact that I make at least $6,000 more than she does! I owned a home. She lived with her parents! But I am below her?!?! If a woman really, truly wants only someone who will be on the same level as her and be able to provide a sufficient income that's perfectly understandable Then they should have no problem with me. I make $18,500 gross a year most women in this area I now live in don't make any more than that. If we were to get married that would be nearly $40,000 a year between us both just starting out. That would by a nice home in a nice neighborhood, two nice cars with plenty left to pay the bills. So that shouldn't be a problem. But women aren't interested in me still. They want the big prize. That's why I say most of them are golddiggers. Tony, thanks for your post. I appreciate you taking all that time to answer me. I agree with what you've said. I'm not arguing per se but this quote from your post kind of says what I'm trying to say. It was this line of your post... Originally posted by Tony Even the very nice ones are looking to maintain or improve their lot in life. It's also not cruel in any way for them to look for a male who makes sufficient funds to show them a good time and who has the potential to support a family in the future. Then later in the same post you said... Originally posted by Tony Independent women are especially tuned to a man's income. They want someone who will contribute equally to the relationship. The kind of woman that wants only a guy that will improve her lot in life or that has sufficient money to show her a good time isn't my idea of an independent woman. And this also.... Originally posted by Tony You can do it, though. The economy is tight now but you can still go to school, get a real estate license, learn a trade or take other means to increase your income to a level where you can appear financially sufficient to potential mates. It's not as if I'm some unskilled, high-school drop out with no work skills. That's not the case. I was a near straight 'A' student in both college and high school. I have a lot of computer skills. I have a lot of job experience in mechanics, computers, operating heavy equipment. My main interest is music. I sing, play guitar and harmonica and I am VERY GOOD AT IT and I have a lot of potential in both music and other fields and I am currently doing something about it. In the meantime, I have a low paying but respectable and sufficient job I drive a really nice newer Volkswagen. I'm not on skid row
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