Seperated with kids

[tnttim]

Update

Everything still going great, I think. She cleaned our room completely, which made room for me to have my old spaces back in our room. It seems that she is really welcoming the new/old me back completely, and really wants this to work. She told me that she messed up really bad, and she promised it would never happen again. She said she seeked solice in another man and she realized that I'm the only one that understood her. Sounds great to me but, yea that f*cking but again. I'm sleeping on the couch, and my girls woke me up fairly soon after I fell asleep. Wife thought I was out cold, well I wasn't. I went into the room and I saw a myspace message window, couldn't see any details, but I knew it was myspace. She exited out as soon as she heard me, and said why'd you scare me. I ignored her, grabbed my smokes and went into the living room. Now pay attention Homer advocates because this is important. She said "is there anything wrong?" I said "yea..........I'm tired." She said "well he just sent a message from facebook and apologized for talking sh*t about me." I said nothing. She said "are you mad I'm talking to him." I said "I don't care what you do in your personnal life." She said "Things are going great between us and I don't want to ruin that." I said "I have to start cooking dinner." I got up and she stood in my way, and said "I really love you." She looked me in the eyes and I could see the worry. She grabbed my head and started kissing me. I went upstairs to cook, and she of course, followed me up there. She said "what do I need to do?" I said "that's already been discussed." She tried to help me cook, but I went on my way like she wasn't even there. She went downstairs, and then I heard my phone ring. I went to answer it, it was a number I didn't recognize. When I answered it was her, she said "I changed my cell number and he won't be able to get it." Again I had no response. We spent the night watching movies and talking, the incident never got brought up again since. Honestly it ate me up the rest of the night, when I woke up this morning the feeling was gone. So newbies remember this: The quicker you start the race the quicker you finish. Since I took the time and healed myself I was able to get past this road bump a lot easier. I wanted to confront her and tell her I want to see the message, I didn't. I wanted to tell her to stop talking to him, I didn't. I wanted to go out and get drunk, I didn't. I manned up, and took it in stride, never skipping the right left right I had going. I think it was the right choice, I know others will disagree, and say I should have confronted her further. I say would that have drawn her closer or further away?

[PWSX3]

Update

Everything still going great, I think. I wanted to tell her to stop talking to him, I didn't.

I do not know your situation in full, but I would have to disagree with you here. If "SHE" wants to get back with you then she MUST drop ALL contact with the other person, no exceptions.

 

Changing here phone number so he doesn't have it shows she is trying, but unless she gets help it will be very hard for her. I also had an affair & it's something you just don't stop, you don't see a Drugi just drop drugs without help & that is exactly what this other person is to her, a drug.

 

If she really wants back in then she needs to show you she wants to & that's not just by being nice, that is by going to classes, reading books, joining a healthy woman's group so she can understand the root of the problem.

[curiou]

tnttim,

 

I'm glad things seem to be better for you, but I would caution you against proclaiming success so prematurely. She's saying all the right things, but you have to gauge it more objectively.

 

Why is she still messaging over myspace with this guy? Any communication, in my view, is either continued affair or at least the attempt at "closure" which suggests there is still some emotional investment.

 

You are far from being out of the woods. Take at a look at a thread by floridapad--I forget which one. He thought that things indeed were going great, that his wife had shown uber remorse, had realized how scumbaggy the other man was. But . . . the marriage is still struggling.

 

Good luck.

[tnttim]

I do not know your situation in full, but I would have to disagree with you here. If "SHE" wants to get back with you then she MUST drop ALL contact with the other person, no exceptions.

 

Changing here phone number so he doesn't have it shows she is trying, but unless she gets help it will be very hard for her. I also had an affair & it's something you just don't stop, you don't see a Drugi just drop drugs without help & that is exactly what this other person is to her, a drug.

 

If she really wants back in then she needs to show you she wants to & that's not just by being nice, that is by going to classes, reading books, joining a healthy woman's group so she can understand the root of the problem.

NC w/ OM is what I meant when I said "we already discussed this." She knows the rule, so I immediately pulled back. It's called the rubberband effect. She pulls away and you think you should come closer, but that's not the case. You instead also pull away, this causes tension in the imaginary rubberband wrapped around you two. She has no choice but to come back to you to get your attention. I witnessed it work flawlessly yesterday. She followed me around pleading her case, and begging me to listen. But I didn't want to hear the promises, I wanted to see them. That's why she changed her number, and was up my butt the rest of the night. I pulled away. I think most LS residents would have handled this in the wrong way, I can tell from your responses, but you don't fully understand what I am doing, and how I'm doing it. Only time will tell if my technique lives up to it's name, but all is well so far.

A quick side note, I quit smoking crack without help, and I stopped drinking everyday with no help. My W quit doing coke to be with me, and she didn't get help either. She quit pills(opiates) without help during our marriage. The most important person in the change process is yourself, support is a rubber crutch, the more you lean on it the more it bends.

[2sunny]

i still think she's hiding things... what if you hadn't walked in at THAT moment, would she have told you he messaged? probably not - and therein lies the problem... she's not willing to be totally honest unless she has to.

 

why was she still in touch, still on facebook with him, still reading the message? she could have deleted it without reading it - but she did read it. she does want contact or she would have completely eliminated him from EVERY aspect of her life. how much will she disrespect you, how much will you allow?

 

any contact with her OM is a violation of the healing that needs to occur in your M - she is road blocking the progress. she wants his attention. i'd kick her out until she becomes a lot more willing to show by her actions that she no longer wants contact with her OM.

[tnttim]

tnttim,

 

I'm glad things seem to be better for you, but I would caution you against proclaiming success so prematurely. She's saying all the right things, but you have to gauge it more objectively.

 

Why is she still messaging over myspace with this guy? Any communication, in my view, is either continued affair or at least the attempt at "closure" which suggests there is still some emotional investment.

 

You are far from being out of the woods. Take at a look at a thread by floridapad--I forget which one. He thought that things indeed were going great, that his wife had shown uber remorse, had realized how scumbaggy the other man was. But . . . the marriage is still struggling.

 

Good luck.

Yes it is success for this step, reconciliation with W. Now I'm in the next step, rebuilding the tattered bridge between us. I never claimed total success, I don't even think about it that way. I do agree 100% that she has to be NC forever w/ this guy, but when I push, I'm really just pushing her closer to him. Most will never understand the last part of that sentence. My stance has been, let her do what she wants, I can't change it, I can only make it worse, I can only push her away with forced change, and I can only change how I react to the situation. This stance reinforces the actions speak louder than words. So if it happens again, I just pull further away, it's up to her to follow. If she doesn't than I move on with life without her. A new life doesn't scare me anymore, a divorce is not the worst thing anymore. I have no fear, and here's another saying, the person that wants the least has the most power. I have all that need and that's all that matters.

[2sunny]

Yes it is success for this step, reconciliation with W. Now I'm in the next step, rebuilding the tattered bridge between us. I never claimed total success, I don't even think about it that way. I do agree 100% that she has to be NC forever w/ this guy, but when I push, I'm really just pushing her closer to him. Most will never understand the last part of that sentence. My stance has been, let her do what she wants, I can't change it, I can only make it worse, I can only push her away with forced change, and I can only change how I react to the situation. This stance reinforces the actions speak louder than words. So if it happens again, I just pull further away, it's up to her to follow. If she doesn't than I move on with life without her. A new life doesn't scare me anymore, a divorce is not the worst thing anymore. I have no fear, and here's another saying, the person that wants the least has the most power. I have all that need and that's all that matters.

 

even if you're in the next step and SHE isn't - it will never move forward for the M.

 

next bolded part - sure - but that only goes so far if you don't have a firm boundary and tell her what that is... what that looks like FOR YOU!

 

wants the least = most power? geez, how can she know that you want the least if you don't show her what you do and don't want...what you are and aren't willing to put up with?

 

this is not supposed to be a guessing game... either she behaves like a woman that wants to be married or she doesn't. right now - her actions still show she wants both sides of the fence.

 

where's your boundary and why haven't you shown her where you draw the line?

 

from where i can see - you are just neutral - but neutral gets blown around in the wind a lot... stand firm - make her uncomfortable enough to either $hit or get off the pot. you doing nothing allows her to do things whatever way she pleases at that moment... which includes corresponding with OM as long as you don't find out. or - if you do find out, she just appeases you so you won't kick her out. it's not working... she still holds WAY more power through manipulation than you are willing to admit.

 

when nothing changes - nothing changes. she's still doing the same thing, just a bit more cover up so you will put up with it meanwhile making you think this is good enough - it's not.

[tnttim]

She knows she crossed the boundary and I didn't have to tell her, I showed her by being unavailable to her. She changed her number, and pretty much set herself up if she now communicates w/ him. I know what she's up to, if one thing I've become a way better detective, and I wait till I have a case built before I present the evidence. It's on her still to prove to me it's over.

[LisaUk]

Yes it is success for this step, reconciliation with W. Now I'm in the next step, rebuilding the tattered bridge between us. I never claimed total success, I don't even think about it that way. I do agree 100% that she has to be NC forever w/ this guy, but when I push, I'm really just pushing her closer to him. Most will never understand the last part of that sentence. My stance has been, let her do what she wants, I can't change it, I can only make it worse, I can only push her away with forced change, and I can only change how I react to the situation. This stance reinforces the actions speak louder than words. So if it happens again, I just pull further away, it's up to her to follow. If she doesn't than I move on with life without her. A new life doesn't scare me anymore, a divorce is not the worst thing anymore. I have no fear, and here's another saying, the person that wants the least has the most power. I have all that need and that's all that matters.

 

I get what you're doing. I had read a similar method after my ex left and I implemented the first technique to get me back on track, minimize the stupid begging c**p I had been doing first off. The next time I spoke with him he was crying, apologizes to me and told me he still loved me and wasn't as certain in his decision anymore. Then I messed it up by begging him again! From there I had no way back and so the legal sep went through, I move 200 miles away and we have been NC over 8 months. I really hope it works for you.

[tnttim]

Okay I'll admit I have some great luck or I'm really smart, sorry for the narcissism. I just found some messages from last night from OM, they where in her trash folder. I can only see his responses but I can fill in the blanks. It's over and he's accepting the fact it's over, he understands she is done, he still wants her, but is honoring the NC. I hope to god he doesn't come here and read my sh*t. Tell me that wouldn't be the biggest kick in the face ever, helping this moron out. My take on him is this:

1. He's gonna keep breaking NC and you know the repricusions of that.

2. He's coming off as a whiny little girl that needs her. Pathetic.

Or they set it up to look that way to throw me off the scent. I bet he's willing to take her while she's back with me, I know how he feels I was just there.

I was going to erase this post, but I'm going to leave up to prove a point, I stumble too. I shouldn't care what she does by my own advice. I shouldn't have looked in the first place, but it happens. My trust is not totally back, obviously. But someone posted earlier, when she's honest give her an A+. I'll give her a C, she was honest to a point. I'll give myself an F for not practicing what I preach and -10 points for not trusting my gut, my gut said she is done with him, she was just felt sorry for him. Go ahead and bash that last part and say she should be 100% NC w/ him. I know she does too, so I drift away..................

[tnttim]

I get what you're doing. I had read a similar method after my ex left and I implemented the first technique to get me back on track, minimize the stupid begging c**p I had been doing first off. The next time I spoke with him he was crying, apologizes to me and told me he still loved me and wasn't as certain in his decision anymore. Then I messed it up by begging him again! From there I had no way back and so the legal sep went through, I move 200 miles away and we have been NC over 8 months. I really hope it works for you.

That's what OM is doing in my case. Thanks for your sediments, I'm gonna make mistakes, I know that, but you just keep moving forward. I was bummed today and my W saw right through my acting happy game. I was thinking about the OM talking to her and it brought back some old feelings. I wouldn't tell her, I just said I was worried about what to cook. When I went upstairs I self talked myself into a better mood. When I talked to her again she said "you feel better now?" She could see the smile had returned.

[WonderingWhy]

Isn't it normal to not trust her for some time. It seems as if the 180 has worked to bring her back, and feel guilty for her previous actions. But it seems as if now the couple should work together to regain trust. It shouldn't be just you anymore. While the seperation is in place I believe as if the 180 is 100% effective for 2 reasons, to regain yourself and to make her think twice about what she had lost. But now as a couple shouldn't it be about proving too each other the love that was once there? This would mean being honest about all feelings correct?

[2sunny]

so she is still in constant contact with him and you can never begin to repair what needs to be accomplished in your M while she is still soft stepping with him.

 

if he had several responses in her trash folder - that means she was corresponding to some extent.

 

why did she respond? why has she not deleted her email account? why still respond at all unless she still wants to keep him on the back burner in case it doesn't work out with you?

 

she's playing games with both of you. she deserves to be out! make her see what her actions get... which is no contact with you as long as she does that with him! make HER move out! that ought to make her see how hurtful her actions are when they don't match her words. she's still lying. minimizing things and omitting things is still a form of lying and manipulation. she can't have it both ways if she says she's going to be honest.

 

this is a very solid and reasonable boundary - given the situation at hand. she has created it and continues to create more drama.

 

i definitely think your being WAY too soft with her. what are you so afraid of in standing firm with her?

Edited January 11, 2010 by 2sunny

[2sunny]

She knows she crossed the boundary and I didn't have to tell her, I showed her by being unavailable to her. She changed her number, and pretty much set herself up if she now communicates w/ him. I know what she's up to, if one thing I've become a way better detective, and I wait till I have a case built before I present the evidence. It's on her still to prove to me it's over.

 

there is no firm boundary. and you haven't been unavailable... she's in the home, sleeping there and doing what she wants... corresponding with you when she wants... how is that unavailable?

 

unavailable means something different than what you portray.

 

why would she prove it's over when she still intends to keep it going and you allow that right under your nose? she figures there's nothing to prove because she's still comfy there at home with you... you haven't made her do a thing. she'll do it her way as long as you don't set a solid boundary.

 

let me guess... you still have sex right? oh yah, a woman's ultimate way to manipulate her man... you will do anything for the sex and she knows it.

[tigereyes1428]

i bet once she realises your over her she comes crawling back with tail between her legs

[Chrome Barracuda]

As long as she's in contact with the OM in any form or fashion, there is no reconciliation...

 

Period..

 

I dont care what she says, it's not right and it isnt fair, either she's in 100% or not at all..

[tnttim]

Ask gunny what he thinks? F*ck the OM, he is losing it on his own, why join him in pushing her away. Why would she want to be with someone that tells her what to do with her life. I can't stop him from going in her work, or contacting her. She said she is NC now, even changed her number. If she talks to him again, then yes I agree, time to give up and move on.

[Gunny376]

No you can't. all you can do is live your life for yourself.

 

You think you've got your life figured out or it it figured out?

 

Think a damn again!

 

The fact of the matter is?

 

Most of us simply didn't and don't have the knowledge, skill set, nor experience to make it work to begin with.

 

IMHO, most people aren't LTR material. Most people just aren't cut out to be in a LTR.

 

Most of first time marriages (close to 46 to 50%) end in divorce. Of the remaining 50% only 13 % report they are happily married, the other 37 % remain married for the children, the status quo, religious beliefs, finances ~ but they're anything but happily married.

 

The divorce rate for second and third time marriages? Are even higher Your best chance at sucess at marriage is with your first marriage.

[tnttim]

Thank you gunny I knew I listened to only you for a reason. If I'm happy why would I jeopardize that right now? To be right and lonely again. You guys need to read my earlier posts and see how well I was without her. My other point. You know how many woman want a man like me? Plenty. My current state: I'm understanding, supportive, loving, fun to be with, asks for very little, great father and I'm happy. What chick wouldn't want that? She's getting homered right now. I'm not calling her and if she calls I'm too busy to talk. I'm going out to bar as soon as I get home and again NCing her. The rubber band effect, I pull away and she comes closer. So the people that gave me their opinion, at what point are you at with your spouse? If you aint as far as me or never got this far then why should I follow your advice?

[floridapad]

WoW TNT you are quite confident. Actually that is good. I thought you said you reconciled with your wife though, but now you are NCing her. Are you still seperated in different locations? I think most people forget the true point of the Homer approach is indifference. It seems like you have reached that point. Very Nice.

[2sunny]

so what happened? did you look at her new phone bill? did you have her sleep with you? do you actually think that just not speaking to her is going to make her uncomfortable enough to want you over the thrill of her OM?

[WonderingWhy]

Correct me if I m wrong, but indifference shouldn't be a state as a couple. IMO. If everything is going good again and living together shouldn't it be about being in love and happiness again? I agree keeping your gaurd being up is only nataraul for some time, but if you don't love again won't she just leave again, because you are not showing her the affection so many women desire, and probably the reason for the EA in the first place? At least that was a contributing factor in my case.

[2sunny]

Correct me if I m wrong, but indifference shouldn't be a state as a couple. IMO. If everything is going good again and living together shouldn't it be about being in love and happiness again? I agree keeping your gaurd being up is only nataraul for some time, but if you don't love again won't she just leave again, because you are not showing her the affection so many women desire, and probably the reason for the EA in the first place? At least that was a contributing factor in my case.

 

read again WW, his W has still been in contact with her OM. she's also not being honest. honesty is critical if the marriage is to be moving in a direction of healing. full disclosure in every area of life helps - she's not been giving him either.

[floridapad]

Wondering why.

 

Indifference to the outcome is what I mean, not necessarily indifference to the person. Indifference to the outcome means you can interact with the spouse at a level that is more in line with your natural personality, rather than be needy or fake. Indifference to the person is not good if you still are open to reconciliation.

[tnttim]

so what happened? did you look at her new phone bill? did you have her sleep with you? do you actually think that just not speaking to her is going to make her uncomfortable enough to want you over the thrill of her OM?

I think you are getting me and flight level confused. She hasn't been in constant contact w OM. We have slept together but that was after 6 dates and she initiated the sex. The OM sent her a message and she responded to it. She changed her phone # so there is no reason for contact. As for my NC on her. She shouldn't be talking to him period so I'm pulling away. She will call and text but I'm keeping it business till I feel better. So I guess its LC instead but I won't be contacting her. I started last night and she rubbed my head as I fell asleep.