Predictably, MM is back and full of regret

[Alpha Female]

Has he replied back to what you've said?

 

You did the right thing and now you need to back off and see what happens.

 

Not yet. But, I also know he's in an appointment right now. Also, I'm sure hes got to churning that over a bit. But now the ball is in his court.

 

I'm a big believer in putting it out there upfront and honest. I don't see how else any R can be sustainable and healthy for both parties.

 

Let's hope he can rise to the challenge. If not, he's no great loss.

 

Yes, I agree.

 

I hope he rises not so much for "us", but moreso because Id really like to see him make some positive changes for himself.

 

Ill keep everyone posted.

 

Thanks again to all for the support.

[whichwayisup]

Don't believe him when he says he's "going to do X,Y or Z". Tell him to show you in ACTIONS. Again, his words are meaningless unless he backs it up with action.

[Alpha Female]

Don't believe him when he says he's "going to do X,Y or Z". Tell him to show you in ACTIONS. Again, his words are meaningless unless he backs it up with action.

 

Oh, I know that. He wont see me again until he shows up at my door with filed divorce papers and gives me his new address.

[IfWishesWereHorses]

Words mean NOTHING at this point. He can cry the blues all he wants - But until you see action, this is all meaningless. And, it's ALL about HIM.

 

By the same token words me nothing TO him. You'll have to make yourself heard using actions as well.

 

Sounds like he had an even bigger falling out with his wife.

[Alpha Female]

Sounds like he had an even bigger falling out with his wife.

 

What do you mean?

[IfWishesWereHorses]

AF, I think its important to keep in mind that both you and his wife are part of the SAME equation in HIS world. He's the common denominator. So while you might see all of his actions (good or bad) as being about AF + MM, and his wife might see them all as W + H, that isn't the case. Many of his actions are simply reactions to the variables that are HIS life.

 

So where did he go when you had the fight. Did he try to diffuse by making nice to his wife? Did his wife also give him grief because of her own issues with his actions? Is everyone in his miserable life just asking too much from him. Aren't you supposed to be making his transition easier??? He NEEDS something, but everyone just wants to take from him.

 

Don't question his motives, don't think it to death, give him a little time to learn to deal with his own issues ON HIS OWN. Its the only way he'll ever grow up enough so that even his actions can actually MEAN something to you or about YOUR relationship and not just his "life".

[Alpha Female]

AF, I think its important to keep in mind that both you and his wife are part of the SAME equation in HIS world. He's the common denominator. So while you might see all of his actions (good or bad) as being about AF + MM, and his wife might see them all as W + H, that isn't the case. Many of his actions are simply reactions to the variables that are HIS life.

 

So where did he go when you had the fight. Did he try to diffuse by making nice to his wife? Did his wife also give him grief because of her own issues with his actions? Is everyone in his miserable life just asking too much from him. Aren't you supposed to be making his transition easier??? He NEEDS something, but everyone just wants to take from him.

 

Don't question his motives, don't think it to death, give him a little time to learn to deal with his own issues ON HIS OWN. Its the only way he'll ever grow up enough so that even his actions can actually MEAN something to you or about YOUR relationship and not just his "life".

 

Well put.

 

I think he needs the time to deal with his own issues primarily for his own life. Secondary is the relationships he choses. I think until he puts himself and his own true personal needs first, hes always going to struggle, as then he will just be pandering to other people, rather than making himself happy first and foremost.

 

I would like to see him grow to the point that he can acknowledge truths in his life and then act on them. Whether that means he realizes his M and W make him happy, or being single, or being with me or someone new. Same for whatever he choses to do with his career, or how he treats his family, daughter, etc.

 

Hes at a major crossroads in his life, and what he choses to do next, I feel will define the rest of his life.

[learnfrommymistakes]

Alpha

OMG that is ballsy of him hah? I think you need to take care of you and stay strong on your path, commit to it. I would not see him in person, that is too hard. I would not respond right away nor rush to answer him. He really needs to figure out what and who he wants and end his M for good if he claims all the things he says to you.

 

I am so sorry, I am sure this is painful and messing with your mind...gosh, my heart goes out to you. He needs to sh** or get off the pot, for real

 

He is toying with too many lives

lfmm

[RedDevil66]

personally, I don't think you're healed enough and will go back into this insanity.

 

Any man who would say stuff like this guy did would be a total turn off.....I mean "You're the dream I dream"

What manipulation and what a wimp!

[RedDevil66]

Well put.

 

I think he needs the time to deal with his own issues primarily for his own life. Secondary is the relationships he choses. I think until he puts himself and his own true personal needs first, hes always going to struggle, as then he will just be pandering to other people, rather than making himself happy first and foremost.

 

I would like to see him grow to the point that he can acknowledge truths in his life and then act on them. Whether that means he realizes his M and W make him happy, or being single, or being with me or someone new. Same for whatever he choses to do with his career, or how he treats his family, daughter, etc.

 

Hes at a major crossroads in his life, and what he choses to do next, I feel will define the rest of his life.

 

This is very codependent behavior.

What about you? Would you like to see yourself grow?

Would you like to get to the point that you're strong enough that you don't need a married guy who plays you?

 

Focus on you and what you need to change and not him and what he should change to make his life better.

 

And I'm not saying this with mean intent, I mean it. This is the only way you will be able to heal from this madness

[jj33]

Good for you for telling him what you need.

 

Until then there is nothing to say to him.

 

And Red Devil makes a good point. You are not his mother and not his therapist. he needs to figure this out for himself and take action himself, like a "big boy" not like some little wuss.

 

If he isnt sure if he deserves you, then he doesnt. Unless you are drawn to the wounded type which is fine you just have to know if you are, then you need to let him man up. THAT would be really good for him. Let him prove to himself and to you that he is capable of standing on his own two feet.

[learnfrommymistakes]

Alpha

WAY TO GO GIRL, you are strong and smart, you did the right thing, just stick with this and don't waffle, let him know you mean busines...SNAP!

lfmm

[Alpha Female]

I am so sorry, I am sure this is painful and messing with your mind...gosh, my heart goes out to you. He needs to sh** or get off the pot, for real

 

He is toying with too many lives

lfmm

 

Actually it really isnt. I went through all the anger and rage last week, and this week Im just in a mindset where I am moving on, and if he gets his crap together, fine, otherwise, Im still moving on. Im just not recommitting any part of myself to this unless he steps up. And Im not waiting around for that to happen, either.

 

I told him today I was not going to be his OW again, so he knows the only way he can be with me again is to file, move out, and start getting some therapy. Thats a lot to ask of someone, I know, so I think its 50/50 hell do these things. He did ask me today for the divorce papers, as I had printed them out for him a few weeks ago, but I told him I threw them out, and if its important to him, hell figure it out. Im not going to enable him on this one. Its all on him now.

 

Im not putting energy towards this anymore. Until and if he does the 3 things he needs to do, we are nothing. Were not a couple, were not involved, and we are not friends. We are not intimate, we are not getting together in person.

 

He has an opportunity to mend things between us and work towards a future, but its a very small window and if he blows it, then Im lost to him forever.

 

Well see.

[Alpha Female]

Good for you for telling him what you need.

 

Until then there is nothing to say to him.

 

If he isnt sure if he deserves you, then he doesnt. Unless you are drawn to the wounded type which is fine you just have to know if you are, then you need to let him man up. THAT would be really good for him. Let him prove to himself and to you that he is capable of standing on his own two feet.

 

I think we all have our own issues and insecurities, and I know what his are. He has to deal with mine, and I will have to deal with his. We work around it, manage to it, and help each other where we can. I think the intensity of his emotions for me coupled with the thought of leaving a 20 year relationship has him reeling a bit more than usual. In the beginning of our affair, him having insecurities was unheard of. Its just become more real, and therefore more scary. For both of us.

 

Hes on his own now and is responsible for what happens next. Im not helping him file for D, and he is no longer invited to move into my home. I am open to dating someone new right now, so Im not waiting around for MM anymore.

[NoIDidn't]

Wow. I'm surprised at the change in your tone from last night, Alpha. It sounds like you are willing to have him back in your life after all that stuff you said in other threads. I'm more than surprised, really.

 

I doubt very seriously that he is going to offer you anything more than an affair. If he was interested in divorcing his W and being with you, his text messages would have said so. But they didn't. They only mentioned him being sad that he broke up with you and wanting you back in his life.

 

In my mind, that means he wants things back the way they were.

 

You certainly don't have to hate him and can be friendly towards him. But I don't think he wants anything that will ultimately benefit you out of this contact. He wants what he wants. Your needs are an after thought.

 

The proof is in the pudding. A man ready to make moves towards you would have responded to that text by now. IMNSHO.

[Alpha Female]

Wow. I'm surprised at the change in your tone from last night, Alpha. It sounds like you are willing to have him back in your life after all that stuff you said in other threads. I'm more than surprised, really.

 

I doubt very seriously that he is going to offer you anything more than an affair. If he was interested in divorcing his W and being with you, his text messages would have said so. But they didn't. They only mentioned him being sad that he broke up with you and wanting you back in his life.

 

In my mind, that means he wants things back the way they were.

 

You certainly don't have to hate him and can be friendly towards him. But I don't think he wants anything that will ultimately benefit you out of this contact. He wants what he wants. Your needs are an after thought.

 

The proof is in the pudding. A man ready to make moves towards you would have responded to that text by now. IMNSHO.

 

Wowie! So much negativity on here sometimes. Its funny and both sad.

 

Why do you assume he hasnt contacted me since the text this morning? He has, as a matter of fact. Quite a few times, actually.

 

And it was very positive, but with posts like this, its rather pointless to share updates that are positive as I really think most people seem to want to see failures and misery on here and like to draw their own conclusions that arent based in fact anyway. ha ha.

 

So, youve made your assumptions on his feelings and actions, not based on whats really going on, mind you, so I guess Ill let you continue to write the script as you would like.

[NoIDidn't]

Wowie! So much negativity on here sometimes. Its funny and both sad.

 

Why do you assume he hasnt contacted me since the text this morning? He has, as a matter of fact. Quite a few times, actually.

 

And it was very positive, but with posts like this, its rather pointless to share updates that are positive as I really think most people seem to want to see failures and misery on here and like to draw their own conclusions that arent based in fact anyway. ha ha.

 

So, youve made your assumptions on his feelings and actions, not based on whats really going on, mind you, so I guess Ill let you continue to write the script as you would like.

 

Seriously, Alpha. You are jumping to conclusions about whatever you perceive my intentions to be.

 

I expressed my feelings over the change in your tone. First it was, I'm done with him. Then it softened. Which is fine, it is certainly your right - this is your life. But I fail to see him offering you anything.

 

You can call it negativity if you want. I call it being honest about what I see and feel about what is being said. If you only want people to agree with you, you are posting in the wrong place.

 

I posted a FULL THREE HOURS after your latest post and you hadn't mentioned anything about him responding. I was going with the information that was available at the time. If he has contacted you since then, fine. But acting like I wish ill for you concerning him because you failed to put that out there (which also is your right, but doesn't allow other posters accurate info in posting with you), is on YOU not me.

 

(Save the for someone else, please. So disingenuous. )

[MizzBlue72]

Alpha -

Don't DON'T see him in person .... even if he is regretting.

His loss - HUGE loss.

If you see him in person, it may be harder to stay strong.

I couldn't do it in person - if I had to, I couldn't.

I wouldn't be able to say no. I would let him do whatever .. I know- that's me, not you ...

But please -- don't see him in person again.

[MizzBlue72]

And Alpha -

We are all just here to support you ... whatever your decisions.

I read that he texted multiple times and it is positive.

I've had ups in downs in my A also - so I know how this feels.

 

Just do yourself a favor and DON'T forget the way he made you feel today. It is NOT that I don't want to see things work out for you ... not at all. I just don't want to see you in limbo ... the waiting limbo. I AM LIVING in the waiting limbo!!! If you aren't there - PLEASE don't get there!!!

 

I don't know what you guys talked about (you didn't elaborate) but if he is again promising leaving his wife ... take it at face value.

 

I KNOW how it feels to have the arguments, to wonder if what he is saying is really true, to wonder if he is stringing me along --- AS WELL as the great things too - knowing deep inside that he loves me, knowing that he is going to be here with me some day... etc. ad naseum ....

 

I know too that I also go to bed every night alone without him.

I know too that I wake up every morning thinking of him first - before anything.

I know that I go to every holiday alone, every party, every work function without him.

I know that when he tells me he loves me, and the he WILL be here I fly for days.

I know that when Friday night comes I am sad because I don't hear from him - even though he is living in the 'spare bedroom' and they live separate lives.

I know that Monday mornings when I wake up and talk to him I'm not sure if I want to tell him how much I have undying love for him or enough jealousy that I could just end it ......

 

If you AREN'T here in the limbo already -- please PLEASE don't go here. It hurts -- WAY too much. And I see him - days here and there - but I want more, need more, deserve more. And you do too .....

 

We DO want to hear your updates ..... some of us really care that you take care of you too.

[learnfrommymistakes]

Alpha

I agree with NoI didnt, I did not see malice toward you but concern really. No one wants to see you hurt and it is a lot easier as an outsider to see things in a different light. I think NoIdidnt was concerned for your welfare and can feel your pain perhaps, I cant speak for her. I know that some people in my life, ALL of them who knew abt my relationship with a MM would certainly have the same fears and worries abt me getting hurt and caught up in another cycle of pain, because they saw what the A did to me, and how this man in my life drew me in, and avoided me, and drew me in, and etc etc and they cant stand to see me hurt, thats all.

 

I dont think they are nay sayers or negative, they are proective and see all the signs and hear my moan or cry abt my pain, and then I walk right into that same pain again.

 

So...we are here for support and love, but also to worry about you and not want you to get more hurt and suffer more pain from this man and relationship.

 

HUGS and HUGS

[Fallen Angel]

I refuse to be drawn into the "helpful or hurtful posts" debate. But Damnit, I want to know the latest!!! I forgot to look to see if you have private message capabilities yet, if so message me with the latest, if not, POST IT!!! (Drat it all, I want to KNOW!)

[NoIDidn't]

I refuse to be drawn into the "helpful or hurtful posts" debate. But Damnit, I want to know the latest!!! I forgot to look to see if you have private message capabilities yet, if so message me with the latest, if not, POST IT!!! (Drat it all, I want to KNOW!)

 

LOL. Well, at least someone saw that I was far from being negative.

[fooled once]

I totally agree with NiD.

 

Last week, there was nothing but rage.

 

Now, he sends a few text messages and you went from "I am woman here me roar" to "sure honey, whatever you want".

 

I have watched a very strong woman who was rightly pissed off and devestated when she was dumped to a woman now who is debating on having coffee with a weak willy man who treats her disrespectfully.

 

To say NiD wasn't being supportive and using the was uncalled for IMHO. She was calling it as (and several others) saw it. She has no hidden agenda against you

 

And the fact that you are now pulling the whole "I am just not going to post" stuff..... come on AF, this

 

And it was very positive, but with posts like this, its rather pointless to share updates that are positive as I really think most people seem to want to see failures and misery on here and like to draw their own conclusions that arent based in fact anyway. ha ha.

 

We all have to take the good and the bad at times. Sometimes, hearing a 'harder' side is HARD to take. Sometimes, the hardest words to hear are some of the truest.

 

I hope you can HEAR what others are saying. Do you think ANYONE wants you to get hurt? Do you thing ANYONE wants you to go through what you went through when he hurt you/broke up with you before???

 

*sigh*

[2sunny]

i think people have posted things to help her be strong, stay strong and to move forward. we can only work from the words she types. i hope she's not taking it personally but using the info to be smart in all this mess.

 

i personally can't see any benefit in her meeting with him or even communicating further... it ONLY gives him a chance to reel her back in to his manipulations and lies that are designed to look like promises.

 

his empty words mean nothing, so take it as just that - nothing.

 

it would be easier to heal and move forward without any further contact with him, but that is JMHO based on life experiences.

[Virgo1982]

I think that is a bit dramatic. I do see the change in her attitude because I believe her anger subsided. I haven't seen her change her mind about the strategy, but I guess the general consensus is that he is chipping away at her defenses.

 

Is that how you all feel?