I hope she isn't in love with her ex

[Flying Goose]

I'm getting emotionally burnt by a peculiar situation I've found myself in.

 

Essentially, I have a female friend whom I've liked (a little more than I should) over a period of time (5-6 years), but early on I wasn't sure what I wanted, and in the latter 2.5-3 years she has had a boyfriend. I managed to distract myself with other things and wasn't especially concerned. We'd get close, she'd withdraw a bit and that would be the pattern of behaviour. We were good friends but not especially close.

 

Due to a new work situation, we've essentially been working together and living in the same premises for the past 4 months. I realised I was getting into emotional difficulties (falling for her), so I tried to fix it by amusing her by getting her to try and set me up with one of our colleagues(keeping myself & her distracted). She failed miserably in this attempt and the target even suggested she leave her boyfriend and date me :-s.

 

Out of the blue and (thankfully) nothing to do with me, her boyfriend left her and said their relationship wasn't worth fixing. Apparently they had been running into difficuties for a year in terms of falling 'out of love' with each other. She tried to fix it and he made no effort. I thought long and hard and decided to take the opportunity to make her feel a little better and take her out. She was delighted by the idea and we've dated for a while now... I took her out for dinner on many occasions and took her on holiday for a week - which she seemed to thoroughly enjoy. However, in the past 9 days she started behaving very peculiarly - she argued with me at every opportunity and pushed me away both physically and emotionally. I travelled away as I had a break, thinking the main problem was her emotional issues relating to her being 7 weeks post-breakup. However, it appears something more ugly is rearing its head in her psyche - she misses what she had before and wishes her exboyfriend would take her back.

 

She talked to me about this (well, actually, I sort of figured it out and she agreed) and I initially tried to be helpful. Then I realised just how much it hurt me to be altruistic about this. My mind is messed up by this as when I first took her out, I was sure to stress to her the importance of resolving any unresolved issues with her exboyfriend as they would only lead to future doubts.

 

Now I'm in a complex mess wherein I don't know how to be have. I have no choice but to respect the distancing behaviour, but I also had to stress to her that unfortunately this is a situation best resolved quickly, as it really isn't fair to expect me to sit around whilst she decides whether to ask her exboyfriend whether he wants to fix things.

 

There are so many issues here I could write for pages, but I'll stop here.

 

Please help me take control of my mind and this is really getting to me - mostly because I've always taken such care of other people's feelings and I did my best to pre-empt this. I didn't want to wait 6/7weeks-months to ask her out as I've seen how badly that can end in other situations (the girl finds someone else in the meantime and it's all rather more messy) and I didn't want to lose her. I feel what I did was ultimately right, but nonetheless I'm suffering the price of following my heart.

 

Thank you for any advice.

[doomage]

Leave her be man atleast for now do your own thing handle your priorities meet other women, be open to women who are willing to appreciate you in the same way you will appreciate them because getting deeper with this friend of yours will lead you to more hurt than you want to be involved in trust me. I just wrote a post about a female friend of mine that i lost for doing a couple of foolish things, but she treated me bad at atimes also when i was nothing but sweet and nice to her.

 

But she has a ex that she still isn't over, their not together but they act as if their a couple still and thats what sucks that nomatter how bad things were they have still a strong connection. so if you were to get with your friend while her ex is not wanting to fix things with her what about if one day out of the blue he says he wants to work things out with her, she might drop you like a sack of potatoes so it's best to give her time to sort out her life and just don't be on her so much. i know that's what would have fixed my situation but it's too late now for me and her, but not for you and your friend.... take care

[ADF]

It is normal for people to have remorse following a break up. What you need to do is protect yourself. You've been plenty patient waiting for your chance with this woman. But she's making you miserable. Waiting around to see if she decides you are worthy of her makes you seem weak, needy and pathetic. Don't go there.

[Flying Goose]

It is normal for people to have remorse following a break up. What you need to do is protect yourself. You've been plenty patient waiting for your chance with this woman. But she's making you miserable. Waiting around to see if she decides you are worthy of her makes you seem weak, needy and pathetic. Don't go there.

 

Indeed, I already made it clear to her that unfortunately she can only have 1 person, and I have no interest in being second best or a fall back person. So she should decide as quickly as possible what she wants to do and let me know.

[Flying Goose]

A bit of time to think and a bit of sensibility on my part - I've managed to make some mini internal steps towards not being affected much by this. After some distancing on my part, I tried to broach the subject a little a few days after my first message - to be greeted with an emotionally unstable girl, shutting down and with a desire for space.

 

This space she will have! The thing is there was always something a little magical about our interaction - she has told me things in the short space of being with her, that she has never told a soul. I've similarly been open, though I have no true secrets. I played a part in this mess with the intensity and romance I brought to the relationship (something she's not really experienced before), which I think explains the pushing away response, but I do not regret this for that is just the way I am.

 

When I'm objective about this - I think the main (and probably only) reason for her current behaviour is that she walked out of something she cared about which ended nastily for her, and drifted into something, albeit nice, but something which may have meaning. Her mind isn't healed and it didn't help she fell seriously physically ill (and was admitted to hospital) just before all this distancing behaviour started.

 

My only outstanding issue, which I will resolve, is ensuring that two otherwise good honest people irrespective of whether they're going to go their separate ways don't do so with a wall of silence, not without ever really even discussing their concerns, etc. It is all too easy to run away for things and for me to be complicit in the act of running. If (worst case scenario) she has other more specific ideas and is definitely leaving me, I have no plans to be the one who does her job for her and gets himself another girlfriend just to show how much I don't need her (or whatever). I don't do people's work for them, so I will just take her honest word (and honesty is one of her greatest assets) and give her the space she wants, in a manner I'm happy doing. In the meanwhile, before the issues are properly addressed (which they will), I'm having my fun as best I can .

 

It's a peculiar world sometimes...

[Flying Goose]

We finally had an honest conversation after a lot of cold-shouldering and a lot of internal emotional distress on my part, and my simple attempts to non-confrontationally foster an environment in which we could talk. It took me three weeks to find a way, and eventually I decided to write her a letter (with card + flowers + chocolates included) explaining my wishes for her welfare, my apologies for anything I have done she felt warranted not talking through with me and my desire for her to be honest with me so that we could understand things. It worked.

 

She told me that what had been eating her up was that she felt used in our relationship, that I had swept her off her feet without much regard for how she felt. That I did not broach the difficult emotions she was feeling and then she felt guilty, that if she told me she would offend me - so she carried on. We both had coincident holidays and I asked if she wanted to do something fun, she agreed so we travelled a bit and stayed in a few hotels. Then she got frustrated and pushed me away both physically and emotionally; felt the need to emotionally attack me and kept running away because she was afraid of saying hurtful things to me (or telling me how she had felt incase I was hurt). She says all she really wanted to do was to watch movies and eat pizza with friends (and commiserate her break-up), but I took her from that and didn't seem to understand how she felt. I apologized for the inadvertent hurt - I simply didn't know things were that bad. I explained I only had the simple, albeit naive perspective that I did not like to see someone I cared about sad and I tried to help the simple ways I knew + deal with my feelings for her. She said she feels I may be deluding myself into saying it was for her when it was all for me to live out an idyllic fantasy with her present, but not important in. I felt sorry she felt that way, but I honestly had no such intentions and may just have been naive.

 

She asked me whether I thought I was good for her long-term - I gave the honest answer that I don't know, but my gut feeling (the only thing I have left when I'm uncertain) says that this is something I feel is worth working on because of how much I care about it and how much she also cared about me, and that my gut feeling is that this can have a very good outcome for both of us. She then explained that she felt that for the last 9 or so years she had been nursing/baby-sitting emotionally immature men. That they would be insensitive to her concerns and ignore them as I had done - she asked why I had suddenly become such an insensitive person since we started going out - that I never was that way, what had changed?

 

I explained that perhaps I am emotionally immature, that this is of itself probably secondary to this being my first relationship and secondary to other personal issues (I'm in the process of stopping taking antidepressants I had taken for a couple of years) and have only in the last few months have I felt involved in the world of emotion enough to risk starting a relationship with someone. I also added that I was learning things about her in terms of her character I hadn't known before - that for example I never really knew how betrayed/smothered/used she felt, or that she would choose not tell me when she felt this way. I explained that for the past 3 weeks we had simply failed to communicate. Ultimately, I said, these are not permanent issues - that these issues added to the colossal stresses she fell under understandably drove us apart and that despite normally being an objective person, I lost a bit of perspective. I restated that I do care and that all those issues are things which I feel will sort themselves out with due care on my part and time to think things through. (I am not sure maturity is the issue, or that it would have helped much) I felt this was just two good people acting on their emotions/feelings in an entirely unideal context wherein God himself had interjected to make things challenging. My baggage + her baggage + illness + her rejection by her ex + illness again + severe illness the third time + difficulty communicating was enough to crush any good thing. Were it not for the role circumstance played, I said, I would agree that immaturity may be the only issue therefore it is not worthwhile 'waiting for them (me) to grow up'.

 

She then said that she still feels angry at the situation and did not know what she would do, but we should keep in touch and see how things go from there (we're both moving away for 4 months in 5 days). I agreed, but added that in order to avoid repeating the difficulties with her desires for space and the practicalities of me avoiding feeling guilty/inappropriate in being myself and communicating from time to time (which summarizes the last 3 weeks), what did she want. She said she's call/contact me to make things easier.

 

 

After some thought and emotional processing on my part, I took a little opportunity to add that the reasons for my apparent insensitivity were probably compounded by my concerns about bringing up a topic (her being dumped by her ex) with scary emotional depth and which may lead to utter misery for her in a time where I felt/hoped we were both trying to have positive experiences. I pointed out to her that not once during our entire time had she explained/expressed this issue to me before today; she said she felt nervous/guilty about bringing it up and didn't feel I'd cope well with it; I asked her - "did any of that happen when you brought it up today?" She said no and I could see the realisation in her eyes that her assumptions about me were inappropriate/invalid. She said (solemnly) that perhaps she could have said more and should be more assertive in future; I said that may be a good idea. I jokingly said to her that with me, no matter how silly I appear and non-understanding my behaviour may be - that all she ever has to do is tell me what the problem is and I will try and help. She justified herself by saying that the problem was that she was broken by her experiences; I said I understood.

 

I left the conversation there, finally feeling a little positive about myself. I honestly do not know how mature/immature I am, but I do try and when I care about something, I make the effort to see it through and change things if I think it is necessary/appropriate and worthwhile.

 

Please kindly support me with your thoughts/opinions/experiences so I can make sense of it all. I would be very grateful as, as you can see, this is all new to me and I'm trying to understand things as well as I can.

Edited November 28, 2009 by Flying Goose
Added something

[WTRanger]

It sounds as if you are appologizing for not being able to read her mind. The last few posts were a little hard to follow, but maybe that's how confusing this is in real life. I'm not sure where she gets the fact that she felt used. Where did that come from? Are you leaving out any details or is she just a crazy self-centered person? Because from what you posted, I can see where she could feel used but at the same time, she certainly wasn't used. How were you not making her feel important? Why would she think that way? I seems as if she knew your intentions with her, but she still accepted the situations.

 

It is almost as if this girl has martyr syndrome. She puts herself in situations she knows are bad, but so she can complain about them and make people feel sorry for her. Thus giving her attention. The only way she gets attention is by bitching about how great and giving of a person she is, and how much she gets f*cked over by life and people because of that.

 

You need to ask yourself. Are you really in need of a person like this in your life? She keeps pushing you away and you keep chasing. When will it end? Do you honestly think a relationship between the two of you will be at all successful? Do you think all of her baggage and yours will be cleaned away if the two of you are dating?

 

I say, give it a full 4 months extremely LC or NC while the two of you are moved away. Use that time to figure things out for yourselves. Then, in 4 months, with hopefully clear minds the two of you can really see where each other belongs in your respective lives.

[nittanylion]

Geez! She just got out of an intense relationship with her x-bf, and you want to take his place. FFS, give her some times to clear her mind, and process her feeling. The more you bother her, the more you will push her away. I guess you want to be the rebound guy.

[Flying Goose]

Geez! She just got out of an intense relationship with her x-bf, and you want to take his place. FFS, give her some times to clear her mind, and process her feeling. The more you bother her, the more you will push her away. I guess you want to be the rebound guy.

 

Dunno what the nature of her ex-bf relationship was, never took an interest in that so can't comment. I did what I did to avoid the issues of regret that arise when you do such nice things as giving people space and time to reflect after breakups, but end up screwing yourself over by not being brave enough to explore new opportunity. When you come back to the girl with a clear mind, she's cleared it and moved on and wonders why you didn't make a move if you cared. Damned if you do and further damned if you don't - all you achieve by waiting in many cases is finally succeed in having secured yourself as the interminably nice friend who might as well be a woman - aka a permanent resident of the friend-box - success! Been there, done that, not interested.

 

I've always tried not to play silly immature games like "I run away, you chase" or "I push you away because I'm scared/unable to deal with emotions, and your job is to take abuse and pretend nothing happened". I did not enter this thing as a game - had I known this emotional game-playing bs would crop up, I would not have bothered at all, or I'd have dated her with the intention of being the transient, meaningless lump of meat that's the rebound guy. Rebound guys gain transient satisfaction and lose nothing as they never wanted anything else. For those who care a little more, they get this.

 

Thank you for the insightful opinions, WTRanger. I guess my answer to them is that I am confused as to what I want/why I'm in this silly situation. I thought I had it figured out - things would be ok for a bit then we'd get a chance to take a natural break (both going away) and I'd be able to figure out what I want and why. Unfortunately, bs happened and she got buried in her emotions earlier than I had anticipated. My resolve is however simple, I wish in all respects to have no regrets. All my attempts to fix/explore things have been in that vain. Regret arises when you care but don't try, when you think something but do nothing about it. Regrets are permanent. The 4 months will happen as planned and as you have said, I should exit that period of time with some thorough perspective rather than the stupid issues I have now.

 

Thanks.

[nittanylion]

I am not telling you to seat around and moping for her. You got a life, do something to make yourself feel good, and happy.

 

Why do you pinning over her when she dont give a shi t about you?

 

You are wasting your energy, and time on this chick for nothing. Date someone else who is single, and emotionally available. Stop dating someone who is unavailable emotional and mentally.

 

Your theory said if you are absent from her, her heart will fade away from you. I think that's BS. Listen, if she really want you, she knows where to find you.

 

Poor girl, her emotion has not heal yet, and you want to feel her void. Give the girl some breathing room ffs.