too embarrassed to sleep with him

[thegreatmoose]

Yes.

But my own experience and that of my friends' shows that a lot of the people in this thread are indeed sugar coating, like some posters have said previously.

I assume your friends are about 20. Maybe it's an age thing. Way back when I was in my high school and my early undergrad years, I do remember a good number of the guys made a huge deal about physical appearance in very immature ways. Not everyone was this immature back then, only some of the people.

 

I'm well into my 30s now and the people I know would never say such junk. I'd be happy to date a woman with bresats like yours, especially one with a nice face. I think just about all my single male freinds would be too. What I'm saying is as people get older, they usually mature.

Edited January 3, 2010 by thegreatmoose

[paddington bear]

But the thing is I'm NOT sugarcoating. I had large breasts at your age, that sagged, I tried everything to hide them, minimising bras whatever. I hated them, but despite my feelings about them, no guys ever had a problem with them and if they did none of them were rude enough to say that to my face. That is not sugar-coating, that is the truth. And you are ignorning the post made by Peitho "Many men probably prefer perky boobs.

Huge percentage of those men still love women with saggy ones. Not because they don’t have a choice – but because there is more to a woman than her boobs. " which I think sums it up.

 

Would I prefer a guy who is not bald, yes, without a big belly, yes, who looks like this that and the other, yes that is what I would prefer, but this is the real world, I'm only going to meet someone who looks like my preference every now and then, so what am I supposed to ignore all other guys, that's just stupid.

 

It is one thing to tell someone they need a haircut, which can be changed easily and cheaply and will grow back if it doesn't look good, but quite another to imply that a young woman pay for a serious operation i.e. breast surgery because she doesn't live up to some ideal that they have in their head. It's like saying 'I don't like small men, yeah small men should get taller'. Some things are unalterable, you take it or leave it and stop bloody moaning about it, guys whinging about wanting perfection and women whinging about not being perfect. Do what you can to make the best of yourself and accept what you cannot change and toss anyone to the curb who dares insult how you look.

 

I know there are endless threads about nice guys vs jerks, but some of the attitudes and behaviour I've seen in men sickens me, this mean, blunt, rudeness regarding women's bodies being one. Body fascism. It makes me sick and it breeds generations of women obsessed with trying to attain an unobtainable ideal and then men complaining women are always asking if their asses look big or whatever.

 

I read an interesting article once, talking to an older lady about men and sex and she said something like 'In my day some guys liked skinny girls, some liked bigger girls, some liked small girls, that was just the way it was, no one questioned it. Now every woman is trying to look like the same person and have the same shape'.

 

And I would add to that many young men feel like they should only admit to liking one body type, otherwise they'll get laughed at by their contemporaries for stepping outside the standard zone of what is found attractive.

 

Ella did you dump this poor guy yet?

[ella23]

But the thing is I'm NOT sugarcoating. I had large breasts at your age, that sagged, I tried everything to hide them, minimising bras whatever. I hated them, but despite my feelings about them, no guys ever had a problem with them and if they did none of them were rude enough to say that to my face. That is not sugar-coating, that is the truth. And you are ignorning the post made by Peitho "Many men probably prefer perky boobs.

Huge percentage of those men still love women with saggy ones. Not because they don’t have a choice – but because there is more to a woman than her boobs. " which I think sums it up.

 

Would I prefer a guy who is not bald, yes, without a big belly, yes, who looks like this that and the other, yes that is what I would prefer, but this is the real world, I'm only going to meet someone who looks like my preference every now and then, so what am I supposed to ignore all other guys, that's just stupid.

 

It is one thing to tell someone they need a haircut, which can be changed easily and cheaply and will grow back if it doesn't look good, but quite another to imply that a young woman pay for a serious operation i.e. breast surgery because she doesn't live up to some ideal that they have in their head. It's like saying 'I don't like small men, yeah small men should get taller'. Some things are unalterable, you take it or leave it and stop bloody moaning about it, guys whinging about wanting perfection and women whinging about not being perfect. Do what you can to make the best of yourself and accept what you cannot change and toss anyone to the curb who dares insult how you look.

 

I know there are endless threads about nice guys vs jerks, but some of the attitudes and behaviour I've seen in men sickens me, this mean, blunt, rudeness regarding women's bodies being one. Body fascism. It makes me sick and it breeds generations of women obsessed with trying to attain an unobtainable ideal and then men complaining women are always asking if their asses look big or whatever.

 

I read an interesting article once, talking to an older lady about men and sex and she said something like 'In my day some guys liked skinny girls, some liked bigger girls, some liked small girls, that was just the way it was, no one questioned it. Now every woman is trying to look like the same person and have the same shape'.

 

And I would add to that many young men feel like they should only admit to liking one body type, otherwise they'll get laughed at by their contemporaries for stepping outside the standard zone of what is found attractive.

 

Ella did you dump this poor guy yet?

I agree with all of the post. I was just saying that that what I've seen in real life has been very different.

I thought you were one of the people who said I should stay with him?

[paddington bear]

I agree with all of the post. I was just saying that that what I've seen in real life has been very different.

I thought you were one of the people who said I should stay with him?

 

I was one of the people who said you should stay with him, but you seemed determined not to, so was just wondering if the deed had been done or not.

[thegreatmoose]

Ella, aren't some of your friends with breasts similar to yours in happy relationships? You mention that some of had bad expereinces, but haven't some had good expereinces too? If the answer is no, I have to wonder what type of guys you are all hanging around. Even at 20, there should be some mature guys around.

[ella23]

Oh, ok.

I said on the previous page that I was only meeting him to apologise to him.

And I did. I apologized to him for the mess, the drama and the confusion.

He said it was okay because he knew that I had had a tough time when I was with my ex. (This was also probably because yesterday I wasn't in tears or all sad, I had just said calmly in a matter of fact way that it was best for us to end it, so even though he was angry on the phone, he wasn't all annoyed when he came here.)

I know more people irl and online who've been dumped for this that those who haven't.

I know that most guys would be hugely turned off, and many consider it a deal breaker.

And it is true that him being a guy who's probably never had any trouble with getting dates or girlfriends, he would ultimately think that he could do better even if he didn't dump me.

I was feeling a bit optimistic a couple of days ago, but the things many of my friends and some of the posters who've had their own share of similar problems said made me realise that I needed to be realistic.

The thing is, when he came yesterday, he said, "I thought we both decided to take a bit of a break so that you can get over your problems?", I told him it wasn't fair on him to have to wait.

He said I could take my time.

He obviously thinks it's something I can just get over.

I said I didn't think it was fair and that we should properly break up so that he can be with other women now.

He said a break up, on a break, are all similar things, and I could call it whatever I want but he hoped that we can be together again when I am doing better.

I hadn't posted all this because all of you would say tell him about your boobs something.

I even told him that it was highly unlikely that I'd want to be with anyone for a long, long time. He said that he knew that.

Moose, I got to know about some of these women through my friends, so I'm not sure about what's up with them now. As for my friends, a couple are dating but haven't met someone they want a relationship with, two are in situations like mine.

Edited January 3, 2010 by ella23

[CarrieT]

32D, used to be 32B and perky once.

Grew so much over just a year when I was 18.

I can't seem to reduce the size despite losing a lot of weight either. In fact, losing weight just made them sag more.

Carrie, I know other women like me with sagging boobs at my age, and they have all had terrible experiences with men either making fun of their breasts or dumping them.

And you're 45 now. Did you feel the same pressure when you were in your 20s?

 

For me it was a bit worse but in a different way; I got my D cup when I was 14 and my DDs when I hit 18 so I had to deal with them much earlier in life than you seem to have received them.

 

But, NO, I never had the same pressure or disgust that you seem to have received. I had ONE BOYFRIEND who suggested a reduction surgery and I broke up with him immediately, finding some body who appreciated me for who I am and what I had to offer.

 

I am seriously wondering if much of this doesn't have to do with the internet and what younger guys are seeing online at a much earlier age. For me, 30 years ago, there was no internet and guys were lucky if they could occasionally see a Playboy. The amount of porn and naked bodies available to ogle at was much more limited AND definitely not surgically enhanced the way it is now.

 

That is why I am so appalled that this should have happened to you but moreso that you have taken the criticism to heart the way you have, Ella. I would like to know you a dozen or so years from now and see how you feel about where your life has progressed because you seem to be quite entrenched in this morose behavior that is not going to end for some time.

[thegreatmoose]

I know that most guys would be hugely turned off, and many consider it a deal breaker.

And it is true that him being a guy who's probably never had any trouble with getting dates or girlfriends, he would ultimately think that he could do better even if he didn't dump me.

 

I even told him that it was highly unlikely that I'd want to be with anyone for a long, long time. He said that he knew that.

Moose, I got to know about some of these women through my friends, so I'm not sure about what's up with them now. As for my friends, a couple are dating but haven't met someone they want a relationship with, two are in situations like mine.

It is mostly the most immature guys who would consider it a deal breaker. Do you even want to be around guys like that anyway? Many guys won't be turned off at all and are some find it a positive, including at least one in this thread. It's all about finding the right person for you and sometimes you have to go through a ton of losers to find the right one. That's the hard part of dating and it's tough whether you are a man or woman.

 

I really hope one day you can learn to love your body regardless of what some others might say. There are men out there who will love you for who you are and you just have to find one of them.

[ella23]

Unfortunately, I don't think that's true. My ex as quite mature and he was not a 20 year old inexperienced guy. I feel a bit relieved being single again, I didn't want to be judged and will to remain this way.

I'm hurting deeply about the break up, especially because he said that he hopes we'll be together again at some time in the future. As much as I want that, it isn't going to happen.

Edited January 3, 2010 by ella23

[thegreatmoose]

Well, I don't know. I feel a bit relieved being single again, I didn't want to be judged and will to remain this way.

I'm hurting deeply about the break up, especially because he said that he hopes we'll be together again at some time in the future. As much as I want that, it isn't going to happen.

I wonder if what you have gone through in the last month is worse than being rejected by him, which might not have even happened.

 

You've got to do something about all these conflicting thoughts such as "you want to get back toegther, but it's not going to happen". They will confuse and frustrate just about any man.

 

The best thing to do now is work on your self image and I still hope you talk with a professional to help you out with it. Most men like women who like themselves and that should be your goal. It may take some time before you are ready to date again, but you will be at some point. So what if it's a year or more. You are still very young and have plenty of time to work on things.

[ella23]

It's not a conflicting thought as such. I do want to be with him. That's how I feel, but I can't be with him.

I didn't say that to him, I'm only saying that here because I don't want to confuse him anymore.

He did say that he hopes we get back together, but I didn't say anything like that to him.

What will I achieve by taking professional help? I can't change how guys think. I can only feel comfortable with myself, but I don't hate my body in the first place. I used to till I found out that having saggy breasts at my age was normal.

Edited January 3, 2010 by ella23

[thegreatmoose]

It's not a conflicting thought as such. I do want to be with him. That's how I feel, but I can't get back with him.

I didn't say that to him, I'm only saying that here because I don't want to confuse him anymore.

He did say that he hopes we get back together, but I didn't say anything like that to him.

What will I achieve by taking professional help? I can't change how guys think. I can only feel comfortable with myself, but I don't hate my body in the first place. I used to till I found out that having saggy breasts at my age was normal.

He probably has a good idea that's whats going on in your head and he most definitely seems confused about the whole situation.

 

Saggy breasts are normal, but breaking up with a guy because you are afraid he will break up with you over the breasts is not normal.

 

You can't change how guys think, but your perception of how they think seems overly negative compared to reality. You seem to think almost all will have a negative reaction or even break up because of your breasts, which is simply not the case. Given that you are even thinking "you want to be with him, but you can't be with him" tells me that something is still wrong. He never rejected you.

 

If you can get rid of or at least control these fears, then everything is good. I get the impression you still have some of the fears, which is why I'm suggesting talking to a professional about them. It can't hurt and it might help a lot.

[ella23]

I don't know, but I tried my best to convince him that it's not going to happen.

I think you're an exception, because my experience shows otherwise and on this thread, barring a few, other women either knows someone who has been dumped for this reason or knows someone who was or has heard a very large number of men say they consider it a huge turnoff/dealbreaker.

[thegreatmoose]

I don't know, but I tried my best to convince him that it's not going to happen.

I think you're an exception, because my experience shows otherwise and on this thread, barring a few, other women either knows someone who has been dumped for this reason or knows someone who was or has heard a very large number of men say they consider it a huge turnoff/dealbreaker.

I was by no means the only one who feels this way in this thread. Several of us felt like that. The one you were just dating might have been that way too. There are so many good men out there and you just need to find one for you, but again you may have to go through several awful ones before you find the good one.

 

I think the best match for you might be a little older or someone very mature for their age. You may need to look ouside your current circle of freinds to find your ideal man.

[ella23]

My ex was 25, I'm not sure how mature that would be catergorised as though? I mean the one who dumped me, not this guy, who, sigh, is also an ex now. How old do you mean?

Go through several men? but being rejected again and again will be terrible?

[Phateless]

It's not a conflicting thought as such. I do want to be with him. That's how I feel, but I can't be with him.

I didn't say that to him, I'm only saying that here because I don't want to confuse him anymore.

He did say that he hopes we get back together, but I didn't say anything like that to him.

What will I achieve by taking professional help? I can't change how guys think. I can only feel comfortable with myself, but I don't hate my body in the first place. I used to till I found out that having saggy breasts at my age was normal.

 

YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHAT HE THINKS! You've never given him a chance to tell you. This is about WHAT YOU ASSUME HE THINKS, not about what he actually thinks!

 

Can you tell the difference?

 

Going to therapy will help you sort out your body image issues and realize the difference between your own thoughts and his. You have no idea what he wants because you haven't given him a chance to tell you.

 

As for "what most guys think," I DARE you to go back to post 1 and count the replies for "he will dump you over your breasts" and the replies for "he won't care at all" to see for yourself what the majority is.

[ella23]

There were several people who talked about others they knew who were dumped, etc, like I said in the last post.

And my friends' experiences have been awful too.

[CarrieT]

YOU HAVE NO IDEA WHAT HE THINKS! You've never given him a chance to tell you. This is about WHAT YOU ASSUME HE THINKS, not about what he actually thinks!

 

Can you tell the difference?

 

Going to therapy will help you sort out your body image issues and realize the difference between your own thoughts and his. You have no idea what he wants because you haven't given him a chance to tell you.

 

As for "what most guys think," I DARE you to go back to post 1 and count the replies for "he will dump you over your breasts" and the replies for "he won't care at all" to see for yourself what the majority is.

 

 

Amen. I wish Ella WOULD take the time to go through this entire thread and run a tally of the positive versus negative responses. But I doubt she will the same way I knew she wouldn't be honest with him about her reasons behind breaking up with him.

 

She has myopia about was the issue is and is playing the same broken record over and over in her brain, not willing to see that not only is there a flip-side to that record, but that there are a lot of other records to by played with different soundtracks to her life.

[Phateless]

There were several people who talked about others they knew who were dumped, etc, like I said in the last post.

And my friends' experiences?

 

Everybody gets dumped, but I'm willing to bet that YOU ARE ASSUMING it was about breasts when it actually wasn't. A shrink will help you realize the errors in your thinking so you can live with yourself and have a happy relationship.

 

You must hang out with a bunch of really immature people, because I have never met anyone in my entire life who would end a relationship over sagging boobs, or who has been dumped over sagging boobs.

 

My friends are players and date a lot of women, so I would have heard about this by now. I'm 29 years old. I also know A LOT of women, because I swing and salsa dance.

 

I have never heard your situation in my entire life. To be honest, you are just being crazy. Let it go.

 

Talk to him and tell him the truth.

[ella23]

As for this guy, I would understand if he had been one who had trouble finding girlfriends. But that is not the case. Like I said, why would he settle for second best?

And I won't tell him now after our talk yesterday. That would be MAD. What will I say, "Oh I'm over my issues and I want to get back with you. And I want to tell you that my boobs sag"?!

[Phateless]

As for this guy, I would understand if he had been one who had trouble finding girlfriends. But that is not the case. Like I said, why would he settle for second best?

And I won't tell him now after our talk yesterday. That would be MAD. What will I say, "Oh I'm over my issues and I want to get back with you. And I want to tell you that my boobs sag"?!

 

You're not second best because he DOESN'T CARE if your boobs sag. You see what I'm saying?

 

Don't tell him you're over your issues - call and say "I'm ready to tell you what's really going on." This isn't about telling him that your boobs sag. This is about telling him your fear of being rejected because of your sagging boobs. Big difference.

[thegreatmoose]

My ex was 25, I'm not sure how mature that would be catergorised as though? I mean the one who dumped me, not this guy, who, sigh, is also an ex now. How old do you mean?

Go through several men? but being rejected again and again will be terrible?

The bad ex who is 25 who dumped you seems more like a 15 year old in terms of maturity. The current guy (well as of a day or two ago) seemed mature so far, but you will never know for sure.

 

You're 20 so you probably don't want a huge age gap. A 25 year old who's as mature as an average 30 year old would be great. Of course in a few years when you are 23 or 24, you'll be able to date men closer to 30 within having a big age gap.

 

Yeah, dating involves getting rejected many times. It absolutely stinks, but it's something that we get used to as we get older and more mature. It's going to hurt most for someone who is young or inexperienced, but it will gradually hurt less.

[ella23]

Phateless, how do you know that the people you know wouldn't end a relationship over sagging boobs?

 

Moose, this guy is 24.

[thegreatmoose]

As for this guy, I would understand if he had been one who had trouble finding girlfriends. But that is not the case. Like I said, why would he settle for second best?

And I won't tell him now after our talk yesterday. That would be MAD. What will I say, "Oh I'm over my issues and I want to get back with you. And I want to tell you that my boobs sag"?!

Why does that matter if he can get a girl easily or not? He wanted you and still wants you. I think he'd be RELIEVED, not mad to know what is going on.

[Phateless]

Phateless, how do you know that the people you know wouldn't end a relationship over sagging boobs?

 

Because I've known my 3 best guy friends for 15 years at least, and may other guy friends that I'm close with. We talk about almost everything. I'm not friends with anyone who is shallow enough to leave a girl they otherwise like because her boobs sag too much. That's ridiculous.

 

My ex was really hot but had a few physical imperfections. She had cellulite on her thighs and her teeth weren't perfect, but I never cared. They were all part of her and it never even crossed my mind to reject her over them.

 

My current gf is very cute but definitely a thicker body type than I usually go for, but I love her body because I love her. When we first got naked I was really surprised at how attracted to her I am. Her body isn't the type I usually go for but I love it anyway, because I love her.

 

I'm skinnier than guys she usually likes but she finds herself loving my body because she loves me. You should see my scrawny-ass chicken legs, but she's not about to reject me over that! If a girl rejected me over that I would laugh at her and thank her for showing me how shallow she is so that I can move on quickly.

 

A guy who would reject you over one body part being imperfect is shallow and a loser and isn't worth your time. Now yes, some guys might prefer perkier breasts, but any DECENT guy won't care enough to leave you over it.

 

You see what I'm saying? This guy might notice that your boobs sag, but because he likes you so much, HE WON'T CARE. You'll still be number 1 because of who you are and your breasts won't factor into that decision.

 

If he does leave you because of your breasts than he is an idiot.