What did your ap say or imply about their spouse and marriage?

[Brokenlady]

I can understand why you say heartless but after being in that situation, I can promise you that is not the case. I do not want to play down the harm and pain I caused but I was also in a mess emotionally.

 

I hated lying and knew that I was being unfair and selfish. Some of it was done to protect me and some to protect others. I was well and truly in the affair fog. I had got myself into a situation which I really did not know how to handle - no excuse, I know - but affairs are messy.

 

I hope you know I mean no offense personally, I'm just really hurting right now, and I don't know if I can make sense of until this stuff I feel better. I hope you have found your peace.

[skywriter]

anne and John,

 

As difficult as it is to hear the truth, I appreciate it, because it gives us "others", an honest perspective, from the other side.

 

For those with so many questions, brought on by the rollercoaster of emotions, it is beneficial, although it is painful. As for myself, I've always said, I'd love to be a fly on the wall inside the MM's house. At least this way, I could free myself, from this "fog", by actually getting to the truth, first hand, and stop deluding myself with fantasies.

[Spark1111]

BL, not to undermine the pain you are feeling now, but what Annie says rings really true to my own sitch.

 

He was an emotional mess. He blamed me for our lives falling apart. He crashed into her, rather than get the therapy he desperately needed.

 

He had to convince himself she had the halo; I had the devil horns.

 

It was they only way it worked for him to ease his already guilty conscience and also to divert himself from the very hard work of self-introspection.

 

I feel terrible for her too! He, in his confusion, lied to her too! All to keep that feel-great drug, serotonin, flowing....

 

But he lied to himself most of all. And all the shyte he spewed or implied about me is something he will have to live with for the rest of his life.

 

Even if he did not say or imply one bad word about me, he/they had to pretend I didn't exist, or didn't care.

 

I was the heartless invisible woman. It's the only way it could work for them.

[anne1707]

No offence taken

 

The reason I post here is because I hope I can provide some help to others and that means I have to be honest about what I have done which will not always make me flavour of the month. As for finding my peace, well he is sitting beside me now. My H and I are very much together and happy too. We have both learnt from this experience.

[Spark1111]

anne and John,

 

As difficult as it is to hear the truth, I appreciate it, because it gives us "others", an honest perspective, from the other side.

 

For those with so many questions, brought on by the rollercoaster of emotions, it is beneficial, although it is painful. As for myself, I've always said, I'd love to be a fly on the wall inside the MM's house. At least this way, I could free myself, from this "fog", by actually getting to the truth, first hand, and stop deluding myself with fantasies.

 

skywriter, how I wish you had been the OW in my own triangle.

 

Two years post DDAY, we finally spoke and she had NOT ONE question for me. Not one.

[Brokenlady]

Well what do any of us do then? We can feel sorry for the WS who has some emotional/mental health issues (presuming we aren't talking abot sex-addict/serial cheater which is another can of worms), we can feel sorry for the OM/OW (who probably has their share of issues too), and we can feel sorry for the BS (who has to deal with all the crap and will have issues a the end, whether or not they did before). Where does that leave us? Of course everyone has to take responsibility for their own actions, but it just seems very sad, people cycling pain on each other, and endless - based on the sheer volume of stories here and how often this stuff happend IRL. Ugh. I'm in total despair-mode today.

[Angel1111]

As for myself, I've always said, I'd love to be a fly on the wall inside the MM's house. At least this way, I could free myself, from this "fog", by actually getting to the truth, first hand, and stop deluding myself with fantasies.

 

I used to think this way, too, but the bottom line is he probably is very unhappy in his marriage, although it may have its good days, but he has chosen to stay in it for whatever reason. I decided that was all I needed to know.

[OWoman]

after all she was competing with a women I went home to every night,and whether you OW admit it or not you do compete or atleast try to compete with the W.

 

Nope, there was absolutely no competition in any of my As. I did not want their lives, so why should I compete? I figured that what I had was vastly superior to what they had, so what would I be competing for?

 

Now, back on topic:

 

What are some of the things your AP has said, implied, alluded to regarding their spouse?

 

Spark, my H said nothing at all unflattering about his xW. But I did hear a lot about her from others - friends, family, colleagues, neighbours... which he didn't deny if I asked him outright, but he didn't volunteer any of it. I guess it would have made him feel like a bit of a wuss, 'fessing up to how badly he allowed her to treat him, and that it would show him up to be a complete idiot for staying so long with someone so awful. She really did have nothing going for her.

 

I've seen her (but not MET her) subsequently, and of course had lots to do with her indirectly since the split, and none of it was untrue. She really is that awful.

 

In her defence, she does have mental health problems, though she denies that and refuses to accept any kind of treatment, which makes it all the more difficult.

[skywriter]

skywriter, how I wish you had been the OW in my own triangle.

 

 

Thanks spark,

 

I think....if you're wishing meant that "remorse" on her part would've provided you some resolution. However, my wish would've been to never, ever have gotten myself into this situation.

 

I'm hoping and praying to someday stop beating myself up and just carry on with life. For those of us filled with regrets after an A, I do hope we can not be haunted by it all for what seems indefinite.

[Heather1]

MM has said nothing neg about his W, & I don't say much about my H. Implied?? Well, when I looked at his photos (way before the PA) I asked if he was going to have more kids (he has one). He said no, that his W couldn't have kids & that they weren't even supposed to have the one. When they bought their huge house, her mother moved in. He supports her family.

 

If he started in on his W from the gate, I wouldn't have liked him at all. People who cry victim, when you're not getting both sides, are a total turn off. It's like people who bad mouth others, you know they're going to bad mouth you too. How happy are YOU right now?? Better with him, or without him? That's all that matters.

 

The lying? An A is all about lying, there's just no way around that. Trying not to cause too much hurt, trying to decide when I feel a different way every second but can't seem to end things. I'm just a lying machine lately, and I've never been like this in my life!! Not lying to spend time w/ OM, mostly so I can still make my H feel like the most important person in my life....when all I think about is the OM.

[skywriter]

used to think this way, too, but the bottom line is he probably is very unhappy in his marriage, although it may have its good days, but he has chosen to stay in it for whatever reason. I decided that was all I needed to know.

 

 

yes, angel1111, I feel that's all I need to know as well. Time to learn from it what I can, and move along.

[John Who]

You don't deserve your W if the above is true. It sounds like you're gloating, and that's nauseating.

 

I'm not gloating,im stating the truth,how else would you want me to write it?????? I am not one to sugar coat ask around.

 

Truth is most MM say the same as I did to my OW,and OW believe it,just read most of the response MM told OW pretty much the same thing.

 

You are right I don't deserve my xW,still does not change the fact that I love her.

[John Who]

Nope, there was absolutely no competition in any of my As. I did not want their lives, so why should I compete? I figured that what I had was vastly superior to what they had, so what would I be competing for?

 

Now, back on topic:

 

you were competing

[Spark1111]

Nope, there was absolutely no competition in any of my As. I did not want their lives, so why should I compete? I figured that what I had was vastly superior to what they had, so what would I be competing for?

 

Now, back on topic:

 

you were competing

 

John, how did you see competition? This is interesting to me, because in my particular sitch, I think she did become competitive, but I never knew any of it until after the fact....way after DDAY.

 

She hit the gym, lost a lot of weight and grew her very short business cut long and added extensions or something after the start of the affair. She was just a few years younger than me.

 

Her xH wound up marrying his last affair partner, a real exotic beauty. I think she needed to prove how desirable she was after her divorce and was, ahem, very sexually accomodating to my spouse.

 

On some level, I knew that she was empowered by doing to me exactly what had been done to her. She also convinced my husband I MUST have a lover. HA!

 

This is love? Or manipulation? Or empowerment at the expense of others?

 

By the way, I think my WS followed your script to a tee!:rolleyes::rolleyes:

[wheelwright]

Hi Spark

 

Um no bad mouthing of my H. Just that it had died and I didn't know how to cope.

 

He didn't bad mouth either, but did show bitterness at his lack of intimacy in the M. He always spoke of her respectfully. I wouldn't have liked him if it had been otherwise funny enough.

 

It's about integrity.

 

Bad mouthing is fun for some people, but I've never really got along with those types.

 

But my xMOMs BS did bad mouth him to me.

 

I think people complain more about their M than the spouse if they have any insight.

[White Flower]

Nope, there was absolutely no competition in any of my As. I did not want their lives, so why should I compete? I figured that what I had was vastly superior to what they had, so what would I be competing for?

 

Now, back on topic:

 

you were competing

Quantify that please John Who.

 

I'm suspecting you needed it to be about competition and so that is what you made it to be in your own mind. I never felt I was competing. He didn't seek out someone exactly like his W, he sought someone entirely different. There is no competition.

[White Flower]

Oh God.....she hates me, and I was very surprised by her level of hysteria and instability. Not what I expected at all WF!

 

Some affairs are less about turning towards the AP, and have more to do with revenge against the BS. I think my situation has a strong componenet of revenge.

 

So, while he never said anything mean about me, I'm sure much was IMPLIED.

 

I started a thread on it but am not savvy enough to post it here.

 

However, I have always appreciated your perspective. If you care to read it and let me know your thoughts, I'd be honored.

I will look for the thread; thanks!

[John Who]

Quantify that please John Who.

 

I'm suspecting you needed it to be about competition and so that is what you made it to be in your own mind. I never felt I was competing. He didn't seek out someone exactly like his W, he sought someone entirely different. There is no competition.

 

 

I never said the A was about competion,what I am saying is women are competitive and the OW does start to compete with the W,whether you want to admit it or not....attention,sex,etc,etc...

[OWoman]

I never said the A was about competion,what I am saying is women are competitive and the OW does start to compete with the W,whether you want to admit it or not....attention,sex,etc,etc...

 

Sorry to bust your bubble, but you're just plain WRONG on this where it concerns me!

 

I'm the first to admit I'm competitive in my professional life - I'm ambitious and successful, and that "competitive" drive is necessary. But off-duty, not. My kids have never been pushed to out-perform others; socially, my friends consider me supportive and fun rather than competitive, and my lovers have always been chosen for purely selfish reasons rather than social or competitive ones.

 

I have never needed to compete with a BW for the attention, sex or anything else from a MM. When I had As, I had several on the go at any time, and any MM who didn't come immediately when summoned knew I'd simply call someone else, and he'd be relegated to the bottom of the pile (or dumped entirely), so if there was any competition it was among THEM to remain at the top of my "to do" list by being the most "perfect" fit for me.

 

You forget, JohnWho, that not all situations are like yours, where (in your fantasy) both your W and your OW wanted you to pick them. In my As, I didn't want my MMs to pick me - I was the one doing the picking. I had all the power. So there really was no competition from my side. Sorry, nice try but no banana.

[OWoman]

Quantify that please John Who.

 

I'm suspecting you needed it to be about competition and so that is what you made it to be in your own mind. I never felt I was competing. He didn't seek out someone exactly like his W, he sought someone entirely different. There is no competition.

 

Agreed - I think this is the "typical" fantasy of a certain kind of MM whose fragile ego needs to prop itself up in this way. Hey, if TWO woman are busting a gut to get / keep me, I must be hot, right?!? But in reality, notsomuch.

[Spark1111]

Agreed - I think this is the "typical" fantasy of a certain kind of MM whose fragile ego needs to prop itself up in this way. Hey, if TWO woman are busting a gut to get / keep me, I must be hot, right?!? But in reality, notsomuch.

 

So true OWoman! If the purpose of the affair is to feed a fragile ego, then yes, two or more women fighting for you has to be the SUPREME EGO boost.

 

I often think these are the guys who weren't very popular in high school, or were so absorbed in their studies and goals that they did not do enough dating, breaking up, etc. during those first, and formative psychosexual years of puberty! Hell, Tiger is a prime example! (And I know you know something about adolescents):)

 

I also think these are the guys, that when the affairs are discovered, the general populace says "HIM? HE had an affair?"

 

But John does make a valid point. Insecure women can be extremely competitive with each other!

[skywriter]

It's interesting that competition would be brought into the thread.

 

Shortly after the A started, I was asked out by a single, very available man.

 

Granted the MM, is telling me that he won't hold me back, encourages me to seek out available men.(Not that I needed him too.)

 

So I enjoy the single guys company, and likewise does, he. We make it a regular thing, to see ,and talk to one another. The MM, meanwhile is asking questions, abt this guy. Coming to my house, waiting for me to arrive home, after going out with him.

 

His exact quote to me was, "Now I have some competition". Looking back I realise, the underlying ,meaning now. It was a game in his mind. To hell with a persons feelings, mine, his W's. It's a game.

Edited December 30, 2009 by skywriter

[John Who]

I suppose that would be another thread....

[skywriter]

I suppose that would be another thread....

 

OK, then......thanks for clearing that up JohnWho.

[OWoman]

But John does make a valid point. Insecure women can be extremely competitive with each other!

 

 

I guess that's the nub of it, Spark!

 

People who are secure within themselves don't need the validation of comparing themselves favorably against someone else, because they know they're OK.