Question of my own..

[jmargel]

I've been helping others out here which has been doing me some good, but just wanted your feedback on something.

 

Back in November of 2002 I met this beautiful, fun loving girl 'Brandy' that I just completely adored (I'm 29 & she's 26). We first went to a club & basically started going out almost every weekend. She came over to my families last xmas and it was the best ever. At this time she had a bf for the past 8 years. However he never treated her right. Always neglected her, treated her like a trophy, etc.. She was used to this treatment and it was a huge shock to her the way I was treating her.

 

Anyway, in March of 2003 she went back to school & moved an hour away from me. We would still see each other at least twice a week (nothing sexual went on) but I noticed as we gotten closer she would then back away. In the 6 months she lived there, her bf who was only an hour away visited her twice. One only lasting 30 mins. In April we finally kissed and it just brought me head over heals. During March though I did date someone for a month, but it felt so weird cause I had feelings for 'Brandy'. Needless to say Michelle & me didn't work out, and I could tell Brandy was upset since I did tell her I slept with Michelle. But I told her that she was still with her bf so what difference did it make?

 

Well, I fell in love with Brandy, told her in July. I told her that I didnt expect her to say it back which she didnt, but she was kinda shocked. As we were to go out every weekend, one weekend she told me she was going out w/ her female friend. When she called me the next day, she probably expected me to say I just stayed at home, etc.. I didn't. I told her I went out w/ a female friend to a club. At this point she knew I was frustrated in that her & me do everything like a couple does, yet she still stays w/ a bf that treats her bad. That following week I got quite a few questions from her regarding this outing I had with this other girl.

 

Anyway, towards the end of September, we were going to goto a fair. She told me not to show affection towards her because her dad was going to be with, and I guess him & her bf got along really well. That really upset me and resigned myself to the fact this wasn't going to work out. I met her at her dad's place and didnt show her much attention whatsoever. Paid more attention to their dog actually. On the way to the fair she put her head on my shoulder & says 'I wish you were my bf', and im like 'Whats stopping you? We talk about this so much, etc..' Well during the time at the fair she was extremely affectionate and when we met up with her dad she had her arms all around me, hugging me, etc.. I knew something was different.. Could it be??

 

She spent the night at my place (no sex), and when she left in the morning she finally told me that she 'loved' me. i was on cloud nine, and she finally opened up to me saying she has had feelings for quite awhile towards me but was scared.

 

She broke it off with him that weekend, and its going to be 3 months on xmas day. Things between us have been going great. Really haven't had any arguements, fights, etc.. We are very affectionate, tell each other we love each other all the time, etc..

 

The only thing that has bothered me, is that first: He still keeps contact with her family. Her parents are divorced but he still calls her dad & tries to go out w/ him. Funny how he didnt want anything to do w/ them while he was with her. Its his way to trying to get back in & she realizes it and told me so. But told me that she'll never go back to him. She plans on moving in with me in march, and has told her mom that she wants to marry me. Back in october she did get me very upset when she told me she 'missed' him, and then one night she did meet him to talk. She told me she didnt tell me before (she told me the day after) because she didnt want me to worry. She needed closure and to talk about somethings. Well he continued to show up at places that she was going to be at, etc.. But as far as I can tell that has stopped. However what is still bothering me is that she continues to talk to him. That she calls him on her cell every now & then. We went out Saturday night & she was drinking quite a bit when she told me she called him to wish him a merry xmas. And that he didnt say much so she hung up. She then said 'Ya know he's really mad at me'. Im like, he's the one that put you into a depression, treated you like crap, etc.. Then I asked, how often do you call him? And she's like 'Weekly' Im like, are you serious? And she's like yes. She then noticed I got pissed and then she said 'Im only joking'. I let it drop since everything else between us is going great. Only other thing that bothered me was she told me that he asked her if she was gonna marry me, and she said 'I dont know' I got upset about this, and she mentioned the only reason why she said it was because he was going through a rough time (his mom died like 3 weeks ago).

 

Anyway I trust her with all of my heart, but it still bothers me. I know if she really wanted to be with him, she could be. That nothing is stopping her from ending it with me to be with him. And she spends all her free time with me. I don't want to give her an ultamatium, but should I approach this subject with her? 8 years is a long time to be with someone, and she told me she would still like to be friends with him and cares for him as a person but that she's in complete love with me. I was with my ex-fiancee for 5 years and I do care about her, so I can understand where she is coming from. However our communication is only sporatic by email. But we've been apart for four years. Do I give it a little more time? Part of me thinks this is healthy for her to talk to him to see he'll never change & for her to appreciate me more, the other part of me is still kinda insecure & jealous (I had a bad past w/ my ex.. she was verbally abusive & left me for my best friend of 15 years).

 

Anyone who's had a long term relationship please give me your thoughts.. Sorry this is such a long post.

[mjk]

Well... I think I feel like you do in a way. If it were me I'd want her to pretty much drop the "I called him" stuff.

 

Who knows why? 8 years is a long time but...I didn't read in your thread that she has any kids with him, he's a jerk! And he treated her like s*&t.

 

You would do your very best to allow a little time/space here. you are wise not to get weird about it right now.

Also with the ex hounding her Dad that's not helping anything either.

 

Your feelings of jealousy and insecurity are sometimes a normal reaction but remember that these emotions are "fear based emotions" one's that uyou don't need and quite possibly control.

 

Good Luck!

[jmargel]

Thanks for your reply. She doesn't have any kids with him, but during the year I known her, he would neglect her to a point & then reel her back in. Almost like he knew how much to mistreat her without her leaving. I didn't try to 'convince' her to leave him for me, because I knew in the end it would backfire on me. I wanted her to make that decision on her own.

 

I know some of this is based on my 'fear', and I need to find a better way of coping with it. I've caught myself checking her cell phone while she's in the shower. I know that's not right, but it gets the best of me. My ex lied to me for the past 4 months of our relationship. She had feelings for my now ex-friend while we were still living together. I know my ex & my current gf are two different people, but once that happens to you, you always kinda expect the worst to happen.

 

When I asked her why she called him, it was because she said he was concerned because he was taking this so hard & then the fact that his mom died recently. She does have a huge heart, and i'm 99.9% its in the right place when she tells me the reason why she called him. Its just that when will it end?? And how long should I let it continue?

 

Also, any suggestions on how I can fix my own problems?

[mjk]

Whoa there. Don't be checking her cell phone. I swear to GOD that is exactly how I found out about my former wife's affair.

 

Who knows how long my girl had been lying to me. Don't check the phone. You are not married to her, (I was to my girl) and the level of "Relationship Responsibility To Each Other" is lower than in a marriage.

 

Don't "sniff" around too much 'cause she will sense that you are acting weird. Don't act weird. Be proud and take control. YOU CAN'T STOP IT ANYWAY no more than you can change a leopard's spots.

 

Work on yourself, control the fear and try to relax around her and just "feel" it out a little more.

 

Hang-on...It won't be easy!

[jmargel]

Thanks, I knew it was wrong. But when I did check it like 3 weeks ago I did see she tried calling him. I did then mention it to her, and then apologized for looking at her phone. She didnt make any big deal out of it, and just said that she has 'nothing to hide'. I haven't checked it since then, but SO tempted to when she's in the shower. But yes you are right, there is nothing I could if she decided to back with him, I would just like to know now then later. Her mom was hard on her for leaving him, I think partly because she is in a bad relationship (this guy would actually walk around naked while Brandy was living there). She came to me about it before, and told me s he would just lock herself in her room. He doesnt work much, and did this when her mom wasn't around. She loves & adores her mom so much that she didnt have the heart to tell her what he did. Apparently her mom is in complete love w/ this guy.

 

Anyway, her ex played on her mom's heart strings and Brandy said her mom tried making her feel guilty. I got upset when one day, she was going to visit her mom. I guess her mom told her ex that she was coming & he was waiting for her! She said nothing happened but he wouldnt leave for the longest time. When he finally did, her mom told Brandy 'Oh, I should have taken the picture of you & jeff (thats me) down, since he was going to be here'. Im like wtf? Brandy actually told me she agreed! This was a couple of weeks after she left him. Brandy did then apologize to me. But its just those little things that bother me. I talked to her about it and when we do talk she reassures me that she loves me, etc.. However it still sits in the back of my mind about some of the little things that has happened. I guess I need to look at this is a learning experience for her too. She's broken up with him in the past & gotten back together with him, but she told me its never lasted this long. And she tells me that she does want to be with me forever, and shows it alot of the time as well.

[mjk]

Leave the Cell phone alone! You gotta know she was told by YOU that you looked at her phone.

 

Now...do you think she's EVER going to be around you with her phone, with his numbers, pictures, etc on it? NO WAY! she'll delete it before she ever sees you.

 

You have to trust her, completely! Already a little seed has been planted that you invaded her privacy by loking at her phone. Oh My God, don't you know that a girl's purse is a sanctuary? I learned that one a long time ago.

 

Oh Yeah, don't worry about the mom and picture thing. I had to take the old pictures down of my old girl and I myself at my Mom's house even after the new girl and I had been going out for awhile. Moms are sweethearts but sometimes a little slower to react then we are!

[jmargel]

Well the phone was on the table when I looked at it. I told her I was playing a game on it, and then looked. At least I was honest about it.

 

Though I noticed when I was at the bar saturday night, I glanced over at her and she was looking at her phone. She went to the bathroom to put some perfume on, and then said she was gonna call a female friend to join us. My first thoughts when I saw her look at her phone was that maybe he called or she was gonna call him. That's how paranoid I am at times.

 

He only lives 15 mins from me, and she stayed tues. night w/ me through wednesday. I had to work but I told her I would call her near lunch so that maybe we could go out for a bite then. She said ok. Well, calling my house & her cell a couple of times got no answer. So I got the sickiest feeling in my stomache. You know that feeling you get that you know something is wrong but you are afraid to find out what it is?

 

Well I forced myself to drive to my house expecting her not to be there & probably with him during the day. When I got there she was in my bed half-asleep. She did quite a bit around my house during the morning & had a long day at work before. She said she felt too tired to answer the phone. It just has me freaked out. Yea I was kinda disappointed that she wouldnt even answer the phone but least she wasn't with him.

 

I try not to show my insecurity around her, cause I know that'll chase her away. Thats why I talk about this stuff on here. At least its a way to vent my frustrations and get advice before I do or say something stupid.

[sstarski]

Chill, dude

Facts

You love her

She loves you, SHE HAS CHOSSEN YOU!!!!!!

 

He was a big part of her life, let her be. Let her do what she has gotta do, but subtley, make it known that your doin it cause you love her. Eventually, when he is aware of how happy she is with you he will P*&S OFF, and you can both get on with your lives.

Problem solved

 

Ohh and for my sanity, please, no looking at the phone, no hassling, no phone calls, no popping round on the off chance, it will eat you up and drive her away. Welcome it as a challange, meet it with compassion, grace and understanding, and what ever happens in the future, you will be a better man for it.

[AllyKat]

Eight years is a long time. Something does bother me though, she cheated on him with you. What would stop her from doing that to you? Just a thought.

 

So now Im thinking, why does she call him? If I were calling a guy I dated before, its because Im not over him! Weekly? There is NO reason for that.

 

If anything Brandy needs some time alone. She went from an 8year relationship to you. Does she really know what she wants? Or did the grass look greener on your side?

 

Just dont let her play you. She is already, dont let her go too far...no one is worth that. If she were worthy of your love, she would TRY to understand.

[jmargel]

Cheated on me? Well kissing that could be considered that, but we didnt have sex. I talked to her about that already, and she told me the reason why she did that (the kissing, but I initiated it) was because she was very unhappy. What I noticed before when she was with him, she would drink ALOT, she hardly ever drinks anymore. Everyone in her family has told me that they see a side of her now that they never have. A good side.

 

I know eight years is a long time thats why when we became a couple I told her that i'm not gonna interfere with the ex, and let her deal with it the way she sees best. I didnt want to tell her you can't talk to him at all, and then her 'missing' him to the point where the truth gets distorted in her mind & she goes back.

 

Your right, that I won't check her cell again. I had the perfect opportunity last night to do it, but I resisted. I figured if I can't trust her then we shouldnt be together. I'm gonna bring up the situation about the calling this weekend somehow & see what she says. Saturday night was the first time she saw me upset about this situation. Maybe she didnt think it was a big thing, and it didnt bother me. I don't know.

 

I don't think she is playing me, since there really isnt anything about me to play. We've known (been close to each other) for over a year, so its not like I came outta thin air three months ago. We were best friend before we became a couple.

 

When I talked to her previously about calling him, all she told me was that she cares about him as a person and hoped to remain friends. I really don't think she wants him back, since he would probably take her back in a heartbeat if she wanted him too. She's admitted to me before that at times she can be insensitive, which is because it was the way she was treated in the past. She has improved quite a bit, its just I dont know if I should set some ground rules, or the better way would be to just tell her how I feel about it?

[AllyKat]

You need to tell her how you feel, no one wants ground rules.

 

I do consider kissing cheating...I mean would you want her kissing another guy?

[mjk]

You are doing GREAT!

 

didn't check the phone. Do you feel better about that?

 

What will be will be. I think Ally's advice is good. When the time is right, no stress, just chat about it. Remember that you must accept her POV even if it differs from your own, that's called "validation". Give her that and you will both feel better about it.

 

At least you two are working on it!

[Mary3]

May I offer my six cents of advice ?

 

Forgive me for saying so but you appear to be ( and have been ) totally * consumed * with this girl going wayyyyy back to when she wasn't even your real gf ....It seems you were hurt in a previous relationship and you have not healed totally because you now have this girl ( somewhat ) and spend half your time worrying about -what she says...where she goes...what she does....who called her....who might have called her....who will call her....in other words : There is no Trust !

And without trust your relationship is doomed...Trust and respect are the foundations ...the glue......

 

Before you make one more call....one more thought of her....one more sigh.,....step back and take a total break from her.....go take a drive into the mountains for a couple of days with NO contact....when you get back tell her you are thinking about everything..... and either feel more secure about yourself and retry...or step out of this relationship until you are healed from your last one....

 

[jmargel]

I have done that & I know I have issues. Its just because of the past I had & the current situation at hand. It always seems like something pops up & throws me for a loop.

 

Now for the past week things have been goin great, until last night..

 

We were on the topic of sex, and I just asked an innocent question, which was 'What do you think about when we are having sex, or your fantasies, etc..' She then asked me what I think during those times & I told her. She was very relucant to tell me hers, and it eventually got me worried when 15 mins went by and she still wouldn't say. Needless to say she's always been honest to me, even when it hurts.

 

Well she told me the first one that sometimes she thinks about being w/ another woman, since she is bi-curious but never experimented yet with it. Which is fine w/ me, then she paused & I asked her what else is there?

 

She refused to tell me, until I finally got it out of her. I knew something was wrong when she told me 'I love you' a couple of times before she said it. WELL, she told me that sometimes I 'remind' her of a guy she slept with in the past. That some of the things we do are alike. This totally pissed me off. She told me it's not her recent ex, but from a number of years ago. She then told me she doesn't 'think' about him while we have sex, but just that I remind her of him. How can this be possible? I'm still confused. She really didnt want to tell me this, but it was getting to the point that I was thinking she was possibily thinking of her recent ex-bf. If she were to have told me that, I would've left for good.

 

Its crap like this that has me so on edge. I told her that everytime we have sex from now on, im gonna be thinking this. She got upset by this and told me she never cared about this guy & that she loves me. Ya I know communication & honesty are important in a relationship and I did drag it out of her but is this even normal?

 

It does have me really pissed since it happened to me before, with my ex-fiancee. When I was with her she made a comparsion of me & her ex and I never forgave her for this. I never expected this kinda answer for her, and I said something that might have upset her. I was with another girl while being friends with brandy, and did sleep with her. It only lasted a month. I said 'Well Michelle was wild in bed, but you don't see me thinking about her while i'm with you'. She didnt say anything and felt bad after saying it. Its just these little things are really starting to get to me.

[FreeMe]

Oh boy, I would never have asked a question like that - it's just inviting trouble. Sometimes you can know TOO much about someone. Now you're going to be like the thought police. I know how that feels - to be worried about what someone else is thinking - and it's not pleasant. You have to try to get over that and put it out of your mind or your relationship is going to suffer for it. Also, since it was you who asked the question, you shouldn't be beating her up for it. Do everything you can to put that conversation behind you and take the emphasis off of it. It's not healthy for you to be obsessing about what she is thinking. Believe me, I know!

[jmargel]

Ugh.. I know. I had only good intentions. If I were to have known this I'd never ask about it. I'm not going to bring it up to her again. We talked about it for like 30 mins last night. She was getting upset that we talked about it so long, but I told her that unless its all out in the open ill be wondering and I dont want things to go bad. Now I have her concerned because she doesn't know is this is 'normal'. She's had a bad past, with guys using her, etc.. I'm the first person who's truly shown her love from what she tells me. We are going on a cruise in two days and the last thing I want is to feel sour about anything between us.

[FreeMe]

It's great that you've talked about it and you're trying to get past it. I think the cruise will be a perfect opportunity to put it behind you. Make it as romantic as possible for both of you. It sounds like she really does care about you. It's also very encouraging that you are aware that she hasn't had the best relationships in the past. Treat her like she's something precious - not only will it make her feel wonderful, but she'll appreciate you all the more for it, which can only be good for you as well. Good luck and have a great time!

[SLCJR]

Jmargel,

 

You have given me advice in the past, and it helped me with my particular situation. After reading your thread, you need to take some of your own advice!!

I have 2 issues that I’d like you to consider:

 

- You had an affair with a married woman (in an abusive relationship), and the woman you are with now already had a boyfriend when you started developing feelings for her. (Also in an abusive relationship) See a pattern??

 

- You want her to give up too much information. Remember when you told me you still kept in contact with the woman you had an affair with, and didn’t disclose that to your girlfriend?? You are being a touch hypocritical, and unfair.

 

Maybe you need some time to sort yourself out. Or at least find someone who doesn’t need saving from another man – you will probably get hurt being the rebound…. It’s a lot easier when they aren’t already attached to someone else. Just a thought.

[VivianLee]

All relationships come with baggage from prior relationships, surely you knew going in that an 8 yr relationship would be coming with this girl...

I'm not saying anyone is right or wrong here but you are so going to run her off if you don't chill out. I mean there is nothing more unattractive to a male or female is a "needy" acting lover. She is with you and wouldn't be if she didn't want to be. She says she loves you. You can't control her daily thoughts or mind, stop trying to. Let her be herself and handle things as she sees fit, you fell in love with this person let her remain "this person you fell in love with". Stop trying to control her and change her. Even though you aren't mean like the ex your questioning her and bringing up things all the time are going to make the grass in the exes' back yard alot greener. And stop mentioning the ex so much, that just makes her think about him...

Calm down, you finally got the girl, now enjoy her and stop being paranoid and worried all the time. That's not attractive at all!!

[Arabess]

jmargel,

My feeling on the subject is that if you have to 'worry' about someone you are in a relationship with....the relationship is on very shakey ground. The foundation of a relationship has to be trust and respect. Once one of those two have been tampered with....it blows the other one to hell and back.

 

If you feel you guys can work it out by talking....wonderful! However, if you don't correct it soon, it will remain an endless 'dysfunctional relationship' problem. Alot of people chose to be in denial of these 'signs' early on and end up miserable because love can't grow into fruition without the basic foundation being in place.

 

She can't control her Dad's relationship with her 'ex'.....but she sure can control hers. The time they were together is of no importance. If she has chosen to be with you....she needs to respect you enough to give you a rightful place and tell him 'good-bye'. If she chooses NOT to do this....I would really re-asses the relationship.

 

I personally would NEVER share....

 

Good Luck Sweetie!!!

Arabess

[jmargel]

Thanks for the advice all. My intent was never to control her or her thoughts. I thought the question I asked the other night was an innocent one. It was my goof. I never mention her ex to her, the only time I did was when I asked her if he called on xmas at all. Last week I came to her place and she was on the phone with a friend, and I heard her say 'No he doesnt call, it just shows me..' So i'm assuming her friend was asking about her ex. Anyway, yea I need to trust her, its just I had a really bad past. I was with my ex-fiancee for 5 years, who towards the end was verbally abusive & played alot of head games. Then left me for my now ex-best friend of 15 years.

 

She left 4 years ago, so its been awhile. Its not like I jumped from one relationship to the next. As far as I know, she hasn't tried calling her ex but I haven't asked. I used to check her cell when she was in the shower but I've stopped that since. I figured if I can't trust her then I dont deserve to be with her. That doing this isn't going to stop her from leaving if she really wanted to. Its just my insecurities and the last thing I want that to do is to start changing or controlling her.

 

If it wasn't for these boards I doubt I would still be with her today. I probably would have done something stupid or said something wrong to scare her off. Its just in my whole life anytime my life is heading in a good direction, something bad happens. You start getting this mentality that you don't deserve to be happy, and just wait for the next problem to occur. Guess I can't worry too much about the future and just enjoy now. Sometimes I wish life came with an instruction book, and you knew what was ahead of you.

[FreeMe]

Head games can really mess you up. When I was 18 I was seeing a guy who was 32 and he really screwed me up. Many of my problems and insecurities to this day (20 years later) are what they are because of having my head twisted around by him. I have always been very self-analytical and have done a lot of work to undo the damage, but I still have problems. It's very difficult to repair damage like that. In a way, it's like having been brainwashed. You have to be aware of yourself and your actions and reactions and how they effect others all the time. It takes work and time.

 

You've won this girl's heart. Treat her the way you wish you had been treated. Of course, you're going to make mistakes. No one's perfect, but if you make a mistake, be honest and try to get it cleared up as quickly as possible. I'm kind of in the same boat. I've been in a lot of bad relationships and I'm finally in one that has potential. I've messed up by being jealous, for instance. Every day that I get through without being jealous, I pat myself on the back. It's so much work sometimes I wonder if it's worth it. Maybe it would be easier just to be alone. But then I think that eventually it won't be so much work. Eventually it will become normal for me to not have jealous thoughts - just like it became normal for me to react with jealousy over so many things before. I've already made progress. Your desire for this to work out will help you.

[Mary3]

May I say that according to experts its NEVER okay to ask someone about their sexual confessions : In other words : I confessed to my x boyfriend at time that I slept with my former lover...I thought it would be good to get it off my chest but all I did was upset him . SO best advice on that type of confession is : tell a friend but dont tell your boyfriend/girlfriend . I realize you werent going into this issue but its somewhat the same : If someone asks you what you are thinking about the only right answer is : You honey ! lol